HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Hey, America, vaccinate y...

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 05:43 PM

Hey, America, vaccinate your damn kids!

55 replies, 4620 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 55 replies Author Time Post
Reply Hey, America, vaccinate your damn kids! (Original post)
MrScorpio Dec 2018 OP
violetpastille Dec 2018 #1
BadgerKid Dec 2018 #10
violetpastille Dec 2018 #13
deurbano Dec 2018 #28
violetpastille Dec 2018 #35
dawg day Dec 2018 #32
violetpastille Dec 2018 #36
Hermit-The-Prog Dec 2018 #2
irisblue Dec 2018 #3
Name removed Dec 2018 #5
Cairycat Dec 2018 #4
Ilsa Dec 2018 #6
yellowdogintexas Dec 2018 #31
AllyCat Dec 2018 #23
Hulk Dec 2018 #7
Mr.Bill Dec 2018 #21
cureautismnow Dec 2018 #8
violetpastille Dec 2018 #17
TNNurse Dec 2018 #26
violetpastille Dec 2018 #37
TNNurse Dec 2018 #51
FreeState Dec 2018 #29
cureautismnow Dec 2018 #30
violetpastille Dec 2018 #44
Joe941 Dec 2018 #9
mcar Dec 2018 #11
Joe941 Dec 2018 #12
violetpastille Dec 2018 #15
AllyCat Dec 2018 #24
violetpastille Dec 2018 #39
mcar Dec 2018 #22
TNNurse Dec 2018 #27
Mariana Dec 2018 #34
erronis Dec 2018 #14
pnwmom Dec 2018 #16
StarryNite Jan 2019 #54
Rory McRory Fitzrory Dec 2018 #18
Codeine Dec 2018 #19
mnmoderatedem Dec 2018 #20
mahannah Dec 2018 #25
demigoddess Dec 2018 #33
KPN Dec 2018 #40
hunter Dec 2018 #46
Post removed Dec 2018 #38
KPN Dec 2018 #41
Docreed2003 Dec 2018 #42
GulfCoast66 Dec 2018 #48
Docreed2003 Jan 2019 #55
KPN Dec 2018 #43
StarryNite Jan 2019 #53
Gothmog Dec 2018 #45
GulfCoast66 Dec 2018 #47
Hekate Dec 2018 #49
ck4829 Dec 2018 #50
GoneOffShore Jan 2019 #52

Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 05:54 PM

1. I have done

and I have also listened to the anti-vaxxers.

They are afraid of auto-immune epidemic among children. We need to find an answer to that problem before we can get them on-board or we just legislate mandatory vaccinations.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:47 PM

10. Afraid based on real data? Nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to BadgerKid (Reply #10)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:11 PM

13. Data

While they have statistics and theorists I'm don't know if you'd call it "real data".

My data was my pediatricians telling me to do it.* I didn't read any white papers about the pros and cons. I just did as I was told. *Very old school and did not always fall in line with the AAP. "Peanut butter is fine and being Jewish we believe in circumcising boys." For instance.

(I'm certainly not going to pin medal on myself for critical thinking on that one.)

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #13)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:48 PM

28. Critical thinking is always good, and "best practices" change...

I wouldn't let my son have the live polio vaccine (he was born in 1998), and his doctor thought I was being a bit woo woo (especially since it it took more effort to get the alternative vaccine)... but the best practices changed right after that, and inactivated polio vaccine is the only polio vaccine used in the US since 2000. I also declined the rotavirus vaccine, and it was subsequently withdrawn. (And I also had to resist over-prescribing of antibiotics when my son got ear infections.) I firmly believe in vaccines, just not in the infallibility of doctors/medical science. I did think they might be loading my son up with up too many vaccinations at once (at such a young age), but that schedule was probably to prevent missed vaccinations in kids not brought into the doctor as regularly.

I let my husband decide on the circumcision! (My husband is circumcised, but we aren't Jewish...and he decided no.)

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to deurbano (Reply #28)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:00 PM

35. Critical thinking is always good, and "best practices" change...

I like the way you wrote that paragraph.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #13)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:52 PM

32. Well, if you did investigate, you'd learn that pre-vaccination,

thousands of children die or were very damaged by measles every year.

And many many millions missed weeks of school, and also ended up with scars.

It's better now.

(And, btw, I never got vaccinations -- too old-- and ended up with auto-immune diseases. Just saying. These diseases ARE vaccinations-- that is, if you get the measles, you got lifelong immunity from the measles. The diseases themselves have an effect on the immune system.)

Critical thinking includes deciding that the recommendations of experts are more likely to be right than the recommendation of Jenny McCarthy.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to dawg day (Reply #32)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:02 PM

36. Well, if you did investigate, you'd learn that pre-vaccination,

That I did know

And that was the terminus of my investigation.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 05:59 PM

2. best graphic illustration I've seen

Thanks for posting!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:05 PM

3. And someone recently came through NJ

source--https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2018/12/28/measles-outbreak-newark-airport/

Second source--https://www.northjersey.com/story/news/health/2018/12/28/newark-airport-measles-ewr-people-may-have-been-exposed-christmas-eve/2432334002/

People at Newark Liberty International Airport might have been exposed to measles because a passenger who was on a flight from Brussels on Christmas Eve had the disease.


I'm safe, I had both types in the past. Are your kids? Your grandkids?


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to irisblue (Reply #3)


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:07 PM

4. If you want more children vaccinated

make both the immunizations and any examinations required before the shots are given, totally free. Take a look at what countries who have a reasonable health care system, like Canada or Great Britain, do, what their schedules are.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Cairycat (Reply #4)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:16 PM

6. I think the ACA mandates no cost

for the public good for those who have insurance. I'm not certain how CHIPs or Medicaid handle it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Ilsa (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:51 PM

31. CHIP covered my daughter's vaccines when we needed it

She was past the Texas mandate age for vaccine coverage, and her doctor submitted them to CHIP.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Cairycat (Reply #4)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:33 PM

23. ACA mandates these are free.

This anti-vax stuff started way before ACA, but I sometimes wonder if the insurance companies are somehow behind this nonsense so they donít have to pay. Then again, there really are a lot of stupid people.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:30 PM

7. We seem to encourage "stupid" in this country...

Bad enough the repuKKKes and reich wing media propagandists have perpetuated the lie that "government IS the problem"...but today we have a large number of idiots who don't trust anyone.

Nice going ronnie, you g'damned 3rd rate actor/liar.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hulk (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:31 PM

21. I've always thought it was interesting

that he thought government was the problem, and he wanted to be in charge of it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:42 PM

8. We need to educate ourselves on the Cell Danger Response

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to cureautismnow (Reply #8)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:15 PM

17. What do you think of probiotic therapy as a cure for Autism?

I'm only just hearing about it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #17)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:44 PM

26. Not sure there is any real evidence.

My autistic great nephew has been on probiotics for digestive issues. He will soon be 10 and he has taken them for years.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TNNurse (Reply #26)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:05 PM

37. Any improvement

with his autism though?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #37)

Mon Dec 31, 2018, 09:03 AM

51. There have been changes but no proof of correlation.

He still is extremely sensitive to sound and too much stimuli. His speech is much improved but that has been seen in other autistic kids with age. So there has been no study and he is just one kid. Trust me I wish there was some proven treatment.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #17)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:48 PM

29. Junk science at this point n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #17)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:49 PM

30. I'm not sure, different strains through the years...

...didn't do much for my child. OTOH, saccharomyces boulardii is a godsend for keeping his bowels solid. He never had a solid stool until he was given diflucan at age 5. At age 6, we discovered he had (likely congenital) borrelia, bartonella, and babesia. So, we treated with different abx for years and the sach. b. kept his stools intact throughout, for the most part.

The cure will hopefully come out of Dr. Naviaux's work with suramin, but it will probably be years before it becomes available. The Cell Danger Response perfectly explains my son's descent into autism with the mmrv at 1 being the final nail driven into his ASD coffin.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to cureautismnow (Reply #30)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:39 PM

44. Thank you

I'll do some reading.





Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:46 PM

9. We should make a law requiring vaccination.

 

It is child abuse not to.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:48 PM

11. Anti vaxxers are threatening thousands,

if not millions. For woo.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to mcar (Reply #11)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 06:54 PM

12. Well it should only put those who didn't get the vaccine at risk.

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Joe941 (Reply #12)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:13 PM

15. Nah. You can still get stuff if you're vaccinated.

It protects the herd. Not the individual.

In the short term anti-vax worked on an individual level.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to violetpastille (Reply #15)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:37 PM

24. That is true, but the graphic shows the difference

Between vaccination and none. Iím not a gambler but I know good odds when I see them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to AllyCat (Reply #24)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:06 PM

39. Same n/t



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Joe941 (Reply #12)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:32 PM

22. Oh, well, that's OK then



You do realize that some cannot be vaccinated because they have some kind of illness, immune disorder, etc? IOW, they already are vulnerable and depend on the vaccinated here to protect them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Joe941 (Reply #12)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:45 PM

27. The kids too young or too sick to get the vaccines

are at huge risk.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Joe941 (Reply #12)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:54 PM

34. Wrong. Vaccines aren't 100% effective.

You know, just like literally every single medicine, treatment, or preventative. They don't work for everyone all the time. Plus there are people who can't take the vaccines for valid medical reasons.

I was vaccinated for measles and it didn't take for whatever reason - it wasn't a bad batch or anything like that, I just didn't get immunity from it. I got measles from an unvaccinated person. One of my classmates did as well, but because enough of the other kids were immune, our little epidemic stopped there. I got measles and it was supposedly a mild case (the vaccine did help some, most likely), but it still zonked my immune system so when I got chicken pox right afterward it took me weeks to get over it. It was a long time before I was healthy and strong again.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:11 PM

14. Two great sites about the anti-vax, disease purveyors

Almost all anti-vaxxers are in it for money and speaking fees. Many are failed doctors who promote "naturopathic" remedies.

https://respectfulinsolence.com/

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/category/vaccines/

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:14 PM

16. Your damn kids?

Isn't exactly a pro-kid way to refer to them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to pnwmom (Reply #16)

Tue Jan 1, 2019, 03:33 PM

54. I didn't like that either.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:21 PM

18. But, but if we can't trust Jenny McCarthy...

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:21 PM

19. Just hold onto their tax refunds until

they get it done. I imagine a sudden surge in vaccination rates in such a situation.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:28 PM

20. we live in an Alex Jones world

just throw out whatever crazy conspiracy theory you want. No need to support it factually, just scream and stomp your feet long enough and it magically becomes fact. In this case, it was the "MMR vaccine causes autism" that was the main culprit.


A happened. Then B happened. Therefore A caused B. This is what passes for sound analysis these days.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:42 PM

25. What's the source of this data?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 07:53 PM

33. yes, a few kids are going to have catastrophic results and that is tragic,

but a larger percentage of kids are going to be damaged if we don't immunize them. Just as with other diseases. My children have never had leukemia for example, and others have but that and bad reactions to shots are out of our hands. Catching measles, mumps, rubella, diptheria, polio, are much more likely and can be equally dangerous. The anti-vaxxers are just people who do not understand science or life.

I have been vaccinated against everything and a few more things than normal. So have my kids. So have a lot of military members and their families. Biggest danger in our world is from nuclear power and plastic in our oceans and streams.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to demigoddess (Reply #33)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:27 PM

40. The problem with the few kids vs the whole pack

argument is if one of the few is your kid, yourself or another family member. Better to not use that argument with non-vaccers.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to demigoddess (Reply #33)

Mon Dec 31, 2018, 01:26 AM

46. "Natural" gas is destroying the world we know and love...

... and kills more people every year than nuclear power ever has.

Fracked natural gas is every bit as awful as coal.

Gas scares me more than nuclear power.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)


Response to Post removed (Reply #38)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:29 PM

41. This is a problem for sure. Why should we trust

the pharmaceutical industry? Theyíve provided plenty of reason why not.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Post removed (Reply #38)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:34 PM

42. Please provide a single peer reviewed journal article

Which shows a link between autism and immunizations, because the one article that anti-vaxers have loved for nearly twenty years has been thoroughly debunked again and again.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Docreed2003 (Reply #42)

Mon Dec 31, 2018, 02:22 AM

48. But they read it one the internet! There is no convincing a woo believer. I have given up.

Itís like a religion.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to GulfCoast66 (Reply #48)

Wed Jan 2, 2019, 09:32 AM

55. You're exactly right

I usually steer clear of these threads because they tend to be infuriating.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:35 PM

43. My kids are adults. But when they were minors,

we declined to have flu shots as a result of a personal bad experience within our family. My oldest son came down with something called Guillain-Barre Syndrome which results in him being paralyzed for a few months and from which it took about 2 years to recover (and even then not 100%). GBS research has shown that it follows on the flu, flu shots and pregnancy. We have since known 3 other people in our town who contracted GBS following a flu shot. It is an auto/immune reaction that occurs in some people.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to KPN (Reply #43)

Tue Jan 1, 2019, 03:31 PM

53. A good example of how

One size does not fit all.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2018, 08:40 PM

45. The concept of herd immunity is an important concept

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2018, 02:20 AM

47. Both the far right and left love this woo!

I am now convinced that we will eventually have to return to the days of kids dying and being crippled before Americans of all political leanings learn that the internet is not always your friend and science is real.

Smallpox was the greatest killer of humans in the world. Way more than all wars combined. Vaccines eradicated it.

But now vaccines are bad! Your young kid is exposed to hundreds of new bugs a day and the immune system deals with them. Itís what our bodies do. A few added ones wonít harm them.

But this wonít change anyoneís opinion. Cause the internet said...

Hell, on this thread there are those still blaming vaccines for autism. Enough to make a believer in facts give up.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2018, 02:25 AM

49. Public health science should be required in middle school and high school, complete with graphic...

...photos. Pediatricians should be required to have informational brochures in their offices, likewise with graphic photos of victims of the diseases.

I am over 70, and my generation had personal experience with many of these deadly and crippling diseases, as did our mothers. We all had one smallpox vaccination scar on our arms instead of faces and bodies covered with terrible scars. When the Salk vaccine became available the parents in my town literally lined up around the block to drag their kids in for the vaccine, because absolutely everyone knew someone who had been crippled for life from polio.

We had an incredible public health victory in the 20th century, followed by the abysmal ignorance of two generations who believe fairy tales and not science, simply because they cannot see these things with their own eyes.

My personal experience is that I cannot get through this wall of wishful thinking backed up by intense disinformation on Facebook. There is a looming public health disaster in this country, and all I can think of for a solution is education, starting in 6th or 7th grade and reinforced through high school.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2018, 06:50 AM

50. K&R

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Tue Jan 1, 2019, 03:19 PM

52. Had there been a flu vaccine, I might have known my grandfather who died in 1918.

On the other hand, if there had been a polio vaccine there's a good chance that my dad would have been able to enlist just after Pearl Harbor, gone into the Navy, and would have never met my mother.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread