Finally the cards are on the table. Right there in your face. They cannot be denied.

[boston bean]

Roe v Wade is in peril.

They want women barefoot and pregnant. They want to control us via our wombs. Control our body. Control our economics. Control our destiny.

I hope every single person I have argued with on the internet who said people like me were being histrionic and Roe would always be the law of the land, have had their eyes open. Cause they were wrong. So fucking wrong.

This is what complacency gets us. The Republican Taliban is coming for women. Turning us into baby factories. Making us give birth to a molesters and/or rapists baby. Determining our essential being and value on our uteruses.

Watch out my lgbt friends. Your rights are next. Maybe not now. Maybe not in 5years. But your stare decisis rights are at risk and forever will be, until they are enshrined into federal law they will always be at risk.

Damn it!!!

Everyone better be ready to fight!

[MFM008]

1. They may be sorry

If this goes to the SC.
Roberts is not a given.
Does he want this to be his courts legacy?

[lark]

9. That may be exactly what he wants?

He my want to be known as the SCOTUS Chief Justice that ended abortions, only allowing the state to kill infants if they are brown and come from another country, then it's ok. How many young women will die for them to make sick old rich men whack off because they have taken back control of their dangerous women.

Next they will take away the right of education and end healthcare (Medicaid, Medicare) so we have a nation of poor ignorant people who will work for the oligarchs for next to nothing, get sick and die young. That is their ultimate goal and what they have been working for the last 40 years. I doubt Roberts will stand in their way having facilitated the start of this perfid with his Citizens United decision.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

29. I believe you.

My stomach lurches in a scary way, reading your post.

[Hortensis]

63. Far more at stake than abortion. What if they overset

the implied "right to privacy" that limits government's authority over our bodily decisions and far beyond, such as with the internet? There are many abortion and other maternal procedure cases headed to SCOTUS, and one of those decisions may not limit itself to the due process clause of the 14th.

Reuters: On Monday, liberal Justice Stephen Breyer dissented when the court overturned a 1979 precedent in an unrelated case and in doing so cited the 1992 abortion ruling that upheld Roe. “Today’s decision can only cause one to wonder which cases the court will overrule next,” he wrote.

Furthermore, the constitutional foundation for all the federal social programs is actually more like the stacks of concrete blocks -- implications taken from various parts of the constitution but nowhere stated.

[bitterross]

15. I hope you're correct. I feel the same way.

Roberts has shown he has some, small, amount of intelligence about these things. The ACA vote was certainly a surprise. I hope that what happened is he saw what the real effects of it would be if they struck it down and so, he decided to be a human and humane.

If he steps back from all the BS rhetoric about heartbeats, pain and life-at-conception and votes to keep in place Roe he will do the nation a favor. To do anything else and return the nation to more places (because the places are there again now) where back-ally abortions are the only way would be a horrible thing. A horrible legacy on which to have his name. Years from now, when the GOP dies out from actual dying out, then his name would be as bad as that of the justices who decided Dred Scott and Plessy vs. Ferguson.

I hope the GA law is stuck down soon. The idea of them exercising control of ANY person who travels outside their jurisdiction for ANY act is pretty insane. I don't think they'd be able to pass and successfully defend a law for anything else that happens outside their jurisdiction. Think of an outright murder. They're not going to be able to charge people in GA for a murder committed in FL. They're not going to be able to charge them with conspiracy because the murderer planned the murder in GA and then went to FL for it. It makes no legal sense.

To try to charge a person with a criminal offense for a completely legal act in another state is just not going to fly in the courts. That would disrupt all sorts of things.

[mr_lebowski]

28. I'm pretty sure the government can prosecute you for going to Thailand to have sex with 15 y.o.'s

Not sure if that's state gov's or federal.

But the general idea already exists, re:an even more remote 'place' like another country.

I'm not sure why/how that's actually 'legal' for them to do, but I'm pretty sure I've read they can. I know for SURE some countries can prosecute their citizens for doing so, pretty sure that includes the US.

[bitterross]

36. That is true. But that's another country, not a soverign state of the US

There's a huge difference in law with respect to traveling to another country vs traveling to another state in the union.

The states in the union are subject to federal law and the consistency it enforces.

Countries outside of the US are not. The courts can easily find it is in the interest of the US to prosecute people for actions taken outside the country that the federal government has specifically made illegal. Such as bribery of foreign officials.

Abortion is currently legal in the US. There are NO federal laws prohibiting it when it is consistent with Roe. To allow one state to say an action that is currently legal under US statutes may be prosecuted by that state where it is illegal, even when the action was legally taken in another state goes against the idea of federalism. Why shouldn't prosecutors in all states who are against abortion then begin to file cases in GA to prosecute. That makes no sense. Neither does the GA law.

Further, since a peculiar GA statute is not enforceable in another state, GA may not prosecute you if the action didn't take place in the GA jurisdiction. If GA passes a law that says houses may not be painted blue and you and Jimmy Carter sit in GA and plan to go to FL to paint a house blue for Habitat for Hummanity, GA cannot prosecute you for that when you actually do it. To allow states such capricious authority would be to tear down the whole idea of federalism. It would be a return to Articles of Confederacy.

[mr_lebowski]

39. The simple way around that for these assholes is to say that the act of TRAVELLING TO ...

'for the purpose of' ... is the illegal act. You started your trip/planning in GA, and that's where it's illegal to 'conspire' to do this.

Pretty sure they'll use basically the same legal argument they use to nab 'sex tourists' ... technically I believe the illegal act is conspiring to leave the US with intent to go to Thailand to screw minors. You don't even actually have to go do it to get busted for it (though of course, no super-rich person would ever be prosecuted under such laws).

I'm not saying it's going to stand up to court scrutiny, in fact it damn well better not, for most of the reasons you state.

[Freddie]

31. That part at least is clearly unconstitutional

They can’t prevent you from traveling to another state for something that is legal in that state. I live in PA, where recreational marijuana is still illegal. PA can not prevent me from flying to Denver and getting high there.
I predict a huge and completely legal business in “abortion tourism” to legal states and Canada. Complete with advertising, package rates, etc. Perfectly legal. And an underground of women helping women.

[mr_lebowski]

41. Maybe the rest of us sane people can make it into a big charity operation ...

Start up a foundation, etc.

[olegramps]

32. If the state forces women to have a child, then the state should be liable for all expenses.

This should include all cost associated with medical care, remuneration during the pregnancy, all cost for the education and care of the child including a salary for 24/7 care and a university education.

[Freddie]

43. Yup 100%

Every penny.
Women who have medical problems from pregnancies they were forced to endure should sue the state. Huge $$. Wrongful death suits from the family if her life wasn’t in “enough” danger to warrant the exemption.

[kentuck]

2. It's the ultimate political issue for Trump's base...

...and another divisive attack upon the cornerstones of our democracy.

[TNNurse]

4. It is the only real issue.

They are fine with rape, incest, police brutality and even murder. They support cheating, lying, adultery. Now maybe I am forgetting their passion for guns but it may be secondary to making sure women have no rights over their bodies.

[Pobeka]

8. ... and the only issue for many moderate swing voters

I think they'd be leaving him and the GOP in droves over gross, inhumane mismanagement of the government if not for this one single issue they believe so strongly in.

[Dave Starsky]

25. Which is a riot, because Trump has undoubtedly forced/paid for more abortions...

Then any president in history.

He wanted his second wife to abort their child, for crying out loud. We also know that he fucks porn models/actresses and that he refuses to wear a rubber.

[Cosmocat]

26. RIGHT?

does anyone really not believe that the over/under for abortions caused by this clown is not in double digits?

[CousinIT]

3. Republican indifference to the humanity of female homo sapiens: past and present

Reproductive Rights and the Long Hand of Slave Breeding

. . .

Yes, we have come to acknowledge, women were sexually exploited. Yes, many of the founders of this great nation prowled the slave quarters and fathered a nation in the literal as well as figurative sense. Yes, maybe rape was even rampant. That the slave system in the US depended on human beings not just as labor but as reproducible raw material is not part of the story America typically tells itself. That women had a particular currency in this system, prized for their sex or their wombs and often both, and that this uniquely female experience of slavery resonates through history to the present is not generally acknowledged. Even the left, in uncritically reiterating Malcolm X’s distinction between “the house Negro” and “the field Negro,” erases the female experience, the harrowing reality of the “favorite” that Harriet Jacobs describes in Incidents in the Life of a Slave Girl.

We don’t commonly recognize that American slaveholders supported closing the trans-Atlantic slave trade; that they did so to protect the domestic market, boosting their own nascent breeding operation. Women were the primary focus: their bodies, their “stock,” their reproductive capacity, their issue. Planters advertised for them in the same way as they did for breeding cows or mares, in farm magazines and catalogs. They shared tips with one another on how to get maximum value out of their breeders. They sold or lent enslaved men as studs and were known to lock teenage boys and girls together to mate in a kind of bullpen.They propagated new slaves themselves, and allowed their sons to, and had their physicians exploit female anatomy while working to suppress African midwives’ practice in areas of fertility, contraception and abortion.Reproduction and its control became the planters’ prerogative and profit source. Women could try to escape, ingest toxins or jump out a window—abortion by suicide, except it was hardly a sure thing.

This business was not hidden at the time, as Pamela details expansively. And, indeed, there it was, this open secret, embedded in a line from Uncle Tom’s Cabin that my eyes fell upon while we were preparing to arrange books on her new shelves: “’If we could get a breed of gals that didn’t care, now, for their young uns…would be ’bout the greatest mod’rn improvement I knows on,” says one slave hunter to another after Eliza makes her dramatic escape, carrying her child over the ice flows.

The foregoing is the merest scaffolding of one of the building blocks of Bridgewater’s argument, which continues thus. “If we integrate the lost chapter of slave breeding into those two traditional but separate stories, if we reconcile female slave resistance to coerced breeding as, in part, a struggle for emancipation and, in part, a struggle for reproductive freedom, the two tales become one: a comprehensive narrative that fuses the pursuit of reproductive freedom into the pursuit of civil freedom.”

Constitutionally, the fundamental civil freedom is enshrined in the Thirteenth Amendment. The amendment’s language is unadorned, so it was left to the political system to sort out what the abolition of slavery meant in all particulars. In a series of successive legal cases, the courts ruled that in prohibiting slavery the amendment also prohibits what the judiciary called its “badges and incidents,” and recognized Congress’s power “to pass all laws necessary and proper for abolishing all [of those] in the United States.”

Bridgewater argues that because slavery depended on the slaveholder’s right to control the bodies and reproductive capacities of enslaved women, coerced reproduction was as basic to the institution as forced labor. At the very least it qualifies among those badges and incidents, certainly as much as the inability to make contracts. Therefore, sexual and reproductive freedom is not simply a matter of privacy; it is fundamental to our and the law’s understanding of human autonomy and liberty. And so constraints on that freedom are not simply unconstitutional; they effectively reinstitute slavery.

[ancianita]

24. Is there a link or print attribution for this? I'd really like to read more of it. Thanks.

[CousinIT]

42. Sorry - here's the link

https://www.thenation.com/article/reproductive-rights-and-long-hand-slave-breeding/

[The Wizard]

5. Republicans are the enemy

not the opposition. The loonies are running the asylum and their control of the Court(s) will last for generations unless we make substantial gains in the Senate and hold the margin in the House. Bizarre Judges and Justices must be impeached and removed from the Bench. Anyone with a law license who takes the position that the president is beyond reproach must be summarily disbarred and required to take and pass five bar exams chosen randomly by the offenders.

[mercuryblues]

6. +1000

But women must vote for an anti abortion Democrat if one is running. Because you know an anti abortion Democrat is better than...

Funny how many people* who say that are not willing to put any of their rights on the chopping block when asked. But women, are supposed to vote for Democrats who are against their most basic right over their own body.

Once you take away a woman's most fundamental right, taking away the rest of them are easy.


If we are declared too stupid to make an informed healthcare decision with our DR. we will be declared too stupid to vote, to know what rape is, and so on.

[leftofcool]

7. Hillary warned us.

[sop]

21. Don't worry, Jill Stein will save us

n/t

[anarch]

10. this is one aspect; the GOP is unconcerned with any kind of human rights across the board

In fact, they do not seem to recognize any sort of inherent "natural rights" whatsoever. They need to be stopped. This is no longer a "political" situation; this is an existential crisis for democracy.

[Paladin]

11. "This is what complacency gets us." Truer words were never spoken.

And yes, I'm ready to fight.

[Trueblue Texan]

12. I'm not interested in starting an argument here...

...but the whole "complacency" notion annoys the hell out of me. We have not been complacent. We have complied with the laws, protested, written to our lawmakers, campaigned, donated, got out the vote, voted, and challenged the results when suspect. We have NOT violated the law, elected those willing to, or made end runs around the Constitution to get our way.

I know you're mad and disgusted. We all are. But the "complacency" idea plays into the theme that Democrats are weak, scared, even lazy. Bullshit. We respect the law and respect our fellow citizens. We don't cheat. There is nothing weak, scared or lazy about respecting norms and respecting laws and the rights of others.

But I agree, there is a lot of work to be done. Let's get women into every fucking office we can from dog catcher to POTUS.

[boston bean]

17. bologne. There has been complacency by rank and file democrats poo pooing the idea that roe would

ever be at risk. And they have done so for years.

[WhiskeyGrinder]

23. "Complacency" doesn't look like laziness. It looks like concern.

"I don't like the idea of litmus tests for [abortion, women's rights, equal pay] for candidates."

"That's too sensitive to pick up now; we'll have to wait until after the election."

"We certainly can't have free abortion on demand at any time -- we're not barbarians."

"Isolated incidents of people being prosecuted for home abortions or even miscarrying are the extreme, not the norm."

"Well I mean it's terrible that [that addicted person, this poor person] didn't get the care they needed. I'm just not comfortable advocating for free health care for [whatever marginalized identity makes me most uncomfortable, probably coded with race as well], you know?"

[Solly Mack]

52. Yep

[BarbD]

49. Couldn't agree more.

And, we will prevail.

[llmart]

13. I've posted this fact on DU several times in threads like this one and it bears repeating.

There are private law schools whose only mission is to turn out attorneys who will fight to repeal Roe v Wade. They offer a free ride to many students or reduced tuition to lure them to go to their law school. They're generally fourth tier law schools but they finagle ways to get them to graduate. The one I'm most familiar with is Ave Maria Law School in Florida. You can guess what their religious affiliation is from their name. They have their own lily white city too.

[Farmer-Rick]

14. So, this is going to go to the packed RepubliCON Supreme Court

The court filled with W, and Trump appointees are going to say that's ok. You know they will. They'll put in some mealy mouthed BS but it will just embolden the other religious crazies to do the same thing in their states. So, state by state the religious crazies will ensure we have no abortion rights, which pretty much is already happening with regulating abortion clinics out of existence.

Then what are you...the poor and middle class women who are impacted by these religious laws...going to do? I'm an old man and it really doesn't impact me much.

Those women of rich white capitalist kings are fine. The daughters and granddaughters of Bill Gates will still have access, if they want. The Walton girls will just go to another country when they need an abortion. The Bezos' girl will be fine if she needs that medical procedure. Warren Buffet's granddaughters will get any medical care they need. It's just the rest of American women hood who will suffer under these religious laws against women's bodies.

So, why are the American kings wanting to do this to us? Why are they allowing such 3rd world laws to destroy American women's lives? Why are they pushing this? You know the Waltons, the Wal Mart heirs, live in Alabama and if they didn't want such 3rd world nonsense passed as legislation, it wouldn't pass. The Waltons could stop this in a heartbeat.....hell Alice Walton got off scott free after drinking and running over a woman who died from the injuries. Alice was never charged. So, why does American capitalist royalty want to make American women suffer so?

[Eyeball_Kid]

16. The essential issue about abortion is NEVER discussed.

The big issue has always been the transformation of a fetus into a human life. It’s a theological and spiritual issue, and it should not be in the hands of craven politicians who don’t give a shit about this fundamental query. The fact is that humans are no closer to determining the infusion of a soul into a fetus than they were when Thomas Aquinas lived. The abortion issue has been corrupted into a political power war. It’s a total wreck, thanks to a whole army of ignorant goons intent on controlling women.

[AlexSFCA]

18. I wonder if SC will decide on the issue before 2020 election?

seems unlikely. Wouldn’t federal courts immediately strike down all these laws? It will probably take one circuit appeals court not striking it down to make it to SC.

[jmowreader]

40. And Georgia is in an extremist circuit

The 11th is the second most conservative circuit in America, and Trump has been packing it with his whack job judges.

[EffieBlack]

19. Duh

Which could have seen this coming?

[TygrBright]

20. The forced-birth advocates have been working a long time for this. n/t

[Wounded Bear]

22. It's been true for a while...

growing more and more obvious every year.

The Talibangelists must be stopped.

[ancianita]

27. I'm ready to fight, too. The majority must not be subordinate to any man. This was the first war

on the planet and it will be the last war.

We will know our male allies and misogynists by their words and deeds.

The jokes on the ACLU page of FB were a bunch of happy horseshit.

This brand of politics is no longer spectator sport.

[CaptainTruth]

30. Can we introduce bills that force pro-lifers to be living organ donors?

About 100,000 people in America are waiting for a kidney transplant. Without it they will die.

Since "pro-life" folks think it's ok for the government to control a person's body & force them to undergo a painful & potentially life-threatening process, against their will, for the sake of "saving a life," they should be willing to let the government control their body & take one of their kidneys, against their will, to save a life, right?

If "pro-lifers" believe abortion is murder, then not letting the government take one of their kidneys to save a life is murder too.

Call them PLOD (Pro-Life Organ Donor) laws. And note they would NOT apply to pro-choice folks.

[CaptainTruth]

33. It's all part of the rise of rich, white, male, "Christian" supremacy.

It's not just about white supremacy.

Look at every GOP policy. Every one is designed to assert the supremacy of the rich white "Christian" male.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

34. When this goes to the Supreme, will millions march for our lives?

Our literal lives.

[Firestorm49]

35. We should be in the streets already, but as you said....complacency. Now is no time to stall.

[lambchopp59]

37. An overwhelming majority of LGBT are pro-choice, in my experience

We stood in solidarity with NOW, coathangers in the air more than 40 years ago.
I groan that this argument has been re-kindled, and want so badly to inform the anti-choicers of the horrifically nauseating consequences of not having safe and legal options.
I couldn't find any statistics to support this, and was shockingly surprised there actually exists an LGBT anti-choice organization in the google search. Seems every bit as hypocritical as the Log Cabin Idiots to me... especially after recent legislation allowing religious wackjobs to deny us healthcare. We know our rights are already under attack, right now.
Rest assured a great majority of LGBT are extremely wary of religious wackjobbery, and fully support keeping the laws and unwelcome paws out of women's uteri.

[Bayard]

38. Wondering how, "they" know a woman has had an abortion in another country?

Or even another state? Does that mean they are looking over everyone's medical records?

[Amimnoch]

44. tRumpublicon Utopia

I've often wondered how many of the deplorables watch this series as some sort of nostalgic guide as the way things should be.

They want to control your womb, and hang me from the wall with a pink triangle sewn on. Hell, Cheetolini's even trying to build the wall from which they'd like to hang us.

This older gay male is with you, and your right to self-determination of what is and isn't right for your own body!

[kimbutgar]

45. You know the morning after pill and birth control are next on their outlawing list!

Women in those states should immediately refuse to vote repuke until those bills are repealed.

[sarabelle]

46. US birth rates are very low. They want more white babies but killing Roe v Wade will have opposite

results.

[Nitram]

47. Yes, The Handmaiden's Tale is not a wild fantasy.

[ismnotwasm]

48. Yeah

https://www.womenonwaves.org/en/page/493/abortion-on-our-ship

https://story.californiasunday.com/abortion-providers

Because

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/may/14/abortion-illegal-america-roe-v-wade

I won’t post the home remedies.

[forthemiddle]

50. I can't believe they want to make this an election issue!

In my mind it’s as stupid as the Dems making complete gun control an issue.
Both items have proven to bring out the voters in droves.

[BarbD]

51. This is a religious issue.

I can only speak about Roman Catholics. I was raised and educated through college by nuns and priests and I wanted very much to be a "good" Catholic girl. Then I had three c-sections in three years and began to seriously question the premises of the "one, true, faith." After careful thought, I left the Church and its rigid doctrines behind.

It wasn't easy to be rejected by my family, but I was tired of being manipulated by religious doctrine that had been dreamed up by men.

[SunSeeker]

54. That took courage. I admire you. nt

[SunSeeker]

53. Yup, we are losing our most basic liberty: control over our own body. nt

[atreides1]

55. The truth

The Christian Taliban, which is mostly white are really only concerned with white woman! They don't care about women of color, many of them would relish the idea of a black or brown woman dying in childbirth, or being killed during a sexual assault, because while it is true that these laws are meant to control women!


THE MAIN PURPOSE OF THOSE EVIL F**KS IS THE CONTINUED EXISTENCE OF A WHITE CONTROLLED SOCIETY!!!

[RedSpartan]

56. Fight all you want, but it's over; just a matter of time.

They have a far-right, anti-Roe majority on the SC. It. Is. Over. Fight and protest all you want, it will make no difference.

All this was at stake in 2016. We blew it.

[B Stieg]

61. Sadly, you're right

2016 looks more and more like the beginning of a slowly-moving cataclysm.
And now, we're knees-deep in it.
Vote 2020!

[rambler_american]

57. Invoke the Second amendment

If a uterus could shoot bullets and kill people the republicans would be falling over each other to protect them.

[11 Bravo]

58. I hope Susan Collins has her strongly worded expression of disappointment ...

all ready to go.

[kimbutgar]

59. Next lgbt rights, voting rights and then civil rights

If we don’t DESTROY the Republican Party I the next few years they will move over all our tights like steam rollers. They must be annihilated at the ballot box in every election going forward.

[pnwmom]

60. Worse than that. Griswold v. CT is in peril.

That was the decision that prevented states from banning contraception.

And all the decisions that were built on the Constitutional foundation of a right to privacy.

[Hestia]

62. When will everyone understand that Roe v Wade is MUCH MUCH MORE than abortion - which is

why I don't think it will be/can be overturned. It would have to be new precedent on the entire amendment.

Women's access to credit and access to her own money, usurping her father, then husband's say so over her paycheck and savings.
You really think Roberts is going to allow THAT nugget to be overturned?

Do you think it is an accident that there is no conversation on overturning the amendment will allow the nearest closest male relative to take over their womenfolk's money and their lady parts?

Oh hell no. You want to see a Real Pussy Riot™?

The only thing you hear about it - MSM, even our side of the political conversation - is abortion, i.e., right to privacy in healthcare matters for women. (Though Scalia said there is no right to privacy in the Constitution - okay, but we are now in 1973/2019. I think Ginsberg agrees with that argument.)

Our side needs to address the ENTIRE amendment. That will really be standing up for women.

Also, with these asshole state legislature trying to get the amendment overturned, why can't the Court System not fine the states that keep trying to pass these laws? Go after the particular representative/senator's pocketbook. Betcha they will stop these laws then