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(32,320 posts)While those figures were shocking to many Americans who view Los Angeles mainly as a city of glittering wealth, they came as less of a surprise to millions of Angelenos.
For several years now, the city's residents have watched tent encampments spring up far beyond the downtown area known as Skid Row -- where LA's homeless population and services have historically been concentrated -- to their neighborhood sidewalks, freeway embankments, city and county parks, along business corridors and into some of the most affluent neighborhoods of Los Angeles.
diva77
(7,604 posts)machines (ballot-marking-devices). The county doesn't have enough in its regular budget to fund the machines, and so it is seeking to get the money from somewhere else in the county(?) coffers.
K&R for exposure
stillcool
(32,626 posts)even the Brennan Center has high expectations for the new voting system.
The paper ballot then drops into a secure box, becoming the official record of the voter's selections as recorded using the interface on the Ballot Marking Device. Official ballots are counted independently on a separate tally system after the polls close on Election Day.
diva77
(7,604 posts)Be sure to read the linked files as well.
And even if they lived up to the rosy expectation, a hand marked paper ballot, hand counted at the precinct level with public oversight is STILL the GOLD STANDARD for transparent, accurate elections.
Why spend the hundreds of millions on hackable junk when you can spend it to help the homeless.
YOHABLO
(7,358 posts)Hortensis
(58,785 posts)in counties and states that refuse to care adequately for those who can't take care of themselves. Very complex situation. And of course the percentage who are not mentally dysfunctional but passed that "one step away from living in the car" stage, and then passed the car stage, is rising for various social and macroeconomic reasons.
In any case it's neither coincidence nor surprise that many end up where the climate allows them to live on the sidewalk instead of dying. They're not all finding their own way out of their home states either even if SCOTUS long ago ruled that states had to stop to putting them on buses west. The need to do far more because other states won't has always been a big reality for California.
Btw, look at a map and you'd wonder why on earth San Bernardino with its desert climate has always had such a huge homeless problem. Until you see the obvious: It's the first city reached after the long, long miles through empty plains and deserts, so that many who are stiff and tired of the trip get off there instead of continuing to Los Angeles.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)There needs to be a way to raise money by taxing everyone to solve the problem.
An increase in local sales tax would get everyone who spends involved with caring for homeless.
Fla_Democrat
(2,545 posts)Not sure you're going to garner much support for sales taxes though, people here tend to shy away from that topic. Now, if only the politicians in California in general, and LA in particular were not so opposed to raising taxes, they could find the money......
Hulk
(6,699 posts)It looks like a campground near freeways, under bridges, in neighborhoods. Its really sad and frightening. So much mental illness and addicted zombies in these tent communities. Many are irresponsible and create all sorts of problems for the neighborhoods they infest.
This is some scary shit. My son-in-laws mother was knocked down by some homeless tent dweller and broke her shoulder. Was hospitalized for weeks. No response from authorities. This is a real cancer in our more temperate climate cities. Petty crime is surging. Not my town any more. Really sad.
RoadMan
(48 posts)So you have the ability to view humanity in such atrocious terms?
Do you think homeless people are vermin?
SammyWinstonJack
(44,129 posts)Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)Conditions are horrible. Tent cities in alleyways. Poop on sidewalks. I used to live in SF now in the burbs. I don't even recognize parts of this beautiful city. Parts of it are like dystopian nightmare...
RoadMan
(48 posts)because they're homeless and they inconvenience you?
Hulk
(6,699 posts)I put up with your blind side sttack on me, but I see you make a habit of jumping on anyone posting about the awful conditions and the sickness that is rampant in these squatter settlements.
Nobody said anything about them being vermin. Get a grip. Maybe you have some personal experience and feel threatened?.. I have no idea and couldn't care less. Fact is it is a serious problem and not only unsanitary in many instances, but many, if not most, are sick, neglected and living in squalor type conditions.
So screw your vermin label. It should be addressed, but your attacks are just meant to insult.
Nobody attacked you, I just asked a question in response to your reprehensible commentary is all.
that's exactly where I get off, bud.
Hulk
(6,699 posts)Your "question to my 'reprehensible commentary' is bull shit. My comment stated a pretty obvious observation. Your digging into your bag a mud comes up with insinuating I refer to them as "vermin"..bud. That's exactly where you get off.
You get offended when someone states a blunt, unpleasant observation...maybe it isn't a direct lead to someone referring to them as trash. Never said that...never implied it or intended it. YOu, bud, are the want that lowered the debate to vermin staus.
Finished responding to your troll postings
Response to Hulk (Reply #79)
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wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)If you want to solve the problem you have to have empathy for homeless people.
Hulk
(6,699 posts)..and that will fix it? Get a grip. Yeah..I feel bad for them...now what? Bright ideas..
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)Last edited Sat Jun 8, 2019, 08:12 PM - Edit history (1)
For 9 1/2 years I worked for the county of Santa Barbara administering HUD and other homeless grants. I kept people in housing.
What the fuck did you do beside act like a know it all?
Dorian Gray
(13,469 posts)I have tons of empathy. I also work in a non-profit and we focus on issues of homelessness in the city.
But you need the local municipalities to be willing to work on this. There are some hard decisions. Financial equity, mental health help, drug abuse programs, social services, etc. need to be offered. Community taken care of. And, in some cases, you need laws that disperse people.
The tent cities ARE a problem. Not because the people living in them don't have human dignity. They do. But our society seems to be at a loss in dealing with the issues that lead to this. Why do thousands upon thousands of people end up living in those conditions. We need to address this. The West Coast cities, from LA to Vancouver, are all experiencing higher than normal homeless populations and all the problems that go along with that.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)Are you familiar with the Homeless Management Information system. HMIS?
Society as a whole has to have empathy for homeless people. If that existed we would have solutions.
Dorian Gray
(13,469 posts)And there are many people without empathy. (Which is why not looking for solutions becomes easy for those in charge.) Not overly familiar with the HMIS, but it is dependent on people who actually receive services, right? So those who live in tent cities and avoid public services wouldn't be included in any of the numbers.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)in contact with any agency. It is a requirement to receive federal money.
Each individual is given a record and a program. Every event is recorded. It is for congress to see how well money is being spent.
gldstwmn
(4,575 posts)for the homeless. There are too few homes but at least they're trying to address the problem. I was out and about yesterday and saw tents and campers everywhere. The city of Englewood last week evicted an entire homeless community from the banks of the South Platte River. I have no idea where those folks went.
Turin_C3PO
(13,649 posts)Hulk
(6,699 posts)You and yourilk seem to come out of the woodwork to attack. Infest? Did someone...besides YOU say anything about infest?
Turin_C3PO
(13,649 posts)WhiskeyGrinder
(22,145 posts)Aristus
(66,075 posts)What you refer to as irresponsibility may more likely be mental illness or the altered mental status that comes with drug use and addiction.
There is no question that some homeless people behave like that. But the vast majority are people who, if you didn't see them in a homeless encampment, might be surprised to learn are homeless.
Many of the homeless patients I see on a daily basis are well-groomed, lucid, sober, employed, and trying to get back in to mainstream life.
As for the others, the mentally ill and drug-addicted; they are the products of our failure as a society to provide a social infrastructure in which they can be cared for and treated. There used to be a large, and not always well-funded system of state-run hospitals for the mentally ill. At the very least, they were able to keep a roof over the heads of their patients, keep them fed, and make sure they have enough medication to keep them tethered to the planet.
When Ronald Reagan eliminated the Federal subsidy for these institutions, they had to let their patients go for lack of funds to treat them. Most of the patients had nowhere to go but the streets.
We see the homeless, and not the people. We see the dirt and soil, and not the suffering.
Stuart G
(38,357 posts)You wouldn't know they are homeless. ...These words are totally correct...................................
"Many of the homeless patients I see on a daily basis are well-groomed, lucid, sober, employed, and trying to get back in to mainstream life.
PLEASE READ POST 73...most homeless people are invisible to most of us....POST 73..
Most homeless people generally do not want their condition to be known
DashOneBravo
(2,679 posts)But I dont see the difference between anti-vaxers and politicians who allow people to shit in the streets.
With a $1.5 TRILLION deficit this year, the ranks of the homeless will swell exponentially after the government predictably states it will slash Medicare, Medicaid and SS to pay for the shortfall. I wonder how youll feel when your yuppie neighbors complain about your wiping your ass with their rhododendron leaves.
shanti
(21,670 posts)You don't see so much homelessness in the flyover states where the weather isn't great.
mnhtnbb
(31,315 posts)here in downtown Raleigh about 10 days ago while taking my dog for her 7 am walk. The woman was sitting at a metal table that was part of a sidewalk restaurant space. She got up, picked up another metal chair and started walking towards us. We weren't even close to her. Then all of a sudden she lifts the chair up over her head, starts running at us and throws the chair at us. I jumped out of the way, pulling my dog with me, but the chair did barely hit my dog when it came down. Fortunately, she wasn't hurt. Then the woman turns around, picks up another chair, and starts coming at us again. We took off. I yelled at a man crossing the street to call 911. We got around the corner and I phoned 911 from a coffee place. While waiting outside the cafe for the police , I saw 3 police cars going down towards where our encounter happened. Had to finish walking the dog, then walked back to the location of our encounter where a police car was parked. Talked to the officer. They had arrested her. She was known to them. I suspected she needed a 72 hour psych hold. The woman was totally off her meds, if she was ever on them. It was a very frightening experience. My dog and I walk this same route every morning and have never felt threatened by the few homeless people in the area. I really keep my eyes open now and I cross the street if I see any one resembling her long before we reach where the person is.
TeamPooka
(24,155 posts)Voltaire2
(12,610 posts)back that up?
Scroll down and youll find several surveys full of information about how the opioid crisis has affected homelessness across the nation .
Blues Heron
(5,898 posts)it's more systemic than people wanting to get high. It's impossibly expensive rent, lack of healthcare/mental health services, the great american sink or swim mentality, etc.
It's not really caused by opiates or "poor decisions"
Response to Blues Heron (Reply #10)
Chin music This message was self-deleted by its author.
RoadMan
(48 posts)and those who don't NEED to work.
Everyone else works for Uber or has more than 1 low paying job.
Response to RoadMan (Reply #36)
Chin music This message was self-deleted by its author.
Raine
(30,540 posts)take a walk around the area or even drive thru it. It's been getting worse and worse for years, all one has to do is open your eyes!
lindysalsagal
(20,433 posts)But since they don't vote.....politicians, as a group, ignore them. No one wants to make a speech with this reality darkening the story.
Achilleaze
(15,543 posts)oh, wait, I forgot. They are republicans. They don't do responsibility. They are blaming someone else for their fail, as usual.
former9thward
(31,798 posts)Homelessness is a local issue. What use is local and state government if they can't address a local problem?
Amishman
(5,538 posts)Take responsibility and make it a priority
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)Its a LOCALIZED problem, but it exists everywhere - at least on the west coast. Every city, every town, large and small, is affected.
In WA, I've seen homeless camps in Olympia, Tacoma, Seattle, & Everett. I've seen a homeless person pushing a shopping cart full of their possessions through North Cascades National Park, high above Diablo Lake. Were they crazy? I sure hope so.
Rising land values mean higher property taxes mean higher rents mean people on the margin wind up evicted and homeless. Often a $100 hike in rent can do it to people on fixed incomes. Or a $400 car repair puts them behind on rent.
They enter a cycle and a system that becomes almost inescapable. Were they mentally ill or drug users to start with, or did homelessness lead to it? Does it even matter once they're on the street?
We're beyond a city or state response. There needs to be federal money to address the crisis.
Republicans have consistently refused to address this at all, beyond blaming Librul Cities for causing, or being unable to "fix" a chronic problem. It's almost like they WANT to point to it as a failure of liberal policies.
SWBTATTReg
(21,856 posts)In STLMO we tried to be more aggressive in identifying the homeless and then the city authorities will try to place them into permanent homes instead of temporary shelters, and more, such as programs for dealing w/ addiction, development of job skills (My former company has actually hired some of these trained workers too, via programs at teaching job skills via Good Will, other entities), etc.
All cities should have some type of program(s) or such, to help these populations. Most of the time, it's not enough, as the numbers of homeless seem to grow by leaps and bounds, and cities are constantly struggling to stay ahead of the curve.
One problem that the city of STLMO had is that some of the smaller cities around the STLMO metro area will pick up the homeless and then dump them into the city of STLMO (just drop them off in the downtown area and leave). I wouldn't be surprised at other places in the country where these 'entitled cities' simply drop off their homeless in other cities and then claim they don't have a homeless population. This is disgusting and all of us/all of these cities need to work together to deal w/ each particular city's homeless.
+++++++++++++++++++++
St. Louis has become dumping ground for growing suburban homeless population
ST. LOUIS (AP) Sometimes the men emerge from out-of-town police cruisers that stop at homeless shelters and then quickly drive off. Others turn up still wearing gowns from suburban hospitals. Surrounding communities have long been accused of using downtown St. Louis as a dumping ground to dispose of homeless men with nowhere else to [
]
by Associated Press
shanti
(21,670 posts)They mostly camp out by the river though.
a la izquierda
(11,784 posts)I live in morgantown, wv. The homeless population is quite high for a small city. Opioids have something to do with this, at least for some of the homeless population.
But many are mentally ill and have little access to services. There are two big shelter and two free clinics in town, so there are small ways of tackling the problem that are supported by the community as a whole.
Vinca
(50,168 posts)You see ads for property in the LA area and a total fixer upper dump is listed for a million bucks. Where do average income people live??
former9thward
(31,798 posts)Average people are not becoming homeless. If that were true we would all be homeless. No one is required to live in LA or San Francisco or any other place where the housing is out of sight. If I wanted to live in SF (I don't) I would not move there because the housing is too high. Live where you can afford. This is probably the easiest country in the world to move from one place to another.
Vinca
(50,168 posts)at fast food restaurants or checking you out at the grocery store. Commuting costs a fortune. If you have the resources, you can move. I'd never live in SF or LA either, but I sure as hell wish I could transport my house there and sell it. I'd be rich.
Coventina
(26,844 posts)enough money to move a family, perhaps thousands of miles, with no place or job lined up at your magical, affordable destination?
former9thward
(31,798 posts)There is plenty of warning. Landlords don't jump rents from $500 to $1700 a month from one month to the next. What is your solution? Just remain until you are put on the street? Average people reject that. They move.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)No doubt, they'd look great on a t-shirt. I get it... I used to believe fortune cookies were real, too.
Response to Coventina (Reply #21)
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LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Average people are not becoming homeless..."
I get it... we like to pretend we know what average means, and further than with additional pretense we have absolute knowledge of how convenient it is is to move, regardless of means.
Except 15% of all homeless adults are identified as survivors of domestic violence (just move, right?). In addition, lack of affordable housing, unemployment, poverty, and low wages, in that order (again, just move-- it's allegedly easy). The same report found that the top four causes of homelessness among unaccompanied individuals were lack of affordable housing, unemployment, and the lack of needed services (but still... just live where you can afford, right?).
(National Law Center on Homelessness & Poverty (2016), U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (2015), The 2010 Annual Homeless Assessment Report, U.S. States Conference of Mayors, Hunger and Homelessness Survey (2014))
kcr
(15,300 posts)Here are some articles with studies showing the link between rising homelessness and the growing lack of affordable housing:
https://www.mckinsey.com/featured-insights/future-of-cities/the-economics-of-homelessness-in-seattle-and-king-county
https://www.fastcompany.com/40504605/americas-affordable-housing-crisis-is-driving-its-homelessness-crisis
https://nationalhomeless.org/issues/housing/
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/12/14/18131047/homelessness-rent-burden-study
These address your outdated notions of who homeless people are. More and more are have jobs. They simply don't pay enough to afford a home.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2019/03/22/feature/homeless-living-in-a-tent-blocks-from-the-u-s-capitol-and-working-full-time/?utm_term=.e1123251ecf0
https://www.timesgazette.com/news/33046/the-changing-face-of-the-homeless
https://parade.com/643064/beckyhughes/working-homeless-population-grows-in-cities-across-the-u-s/
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2018/jul/23/shelter-warns-of-leap-in-working-homeless-as-families-struggle
Initech
(99,909 posts)Republicans have done a good job of killing it the last 40 years. And now with retail disappearing and our money being funneled to the upper 1% more than ever, it may never come back. I would like to think it would but if there's a chance of a 2nd great Depression, we may never fully recover from it.
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)People of average means are not homeless
sarabelle
(453 posts)This is the danger for us of not fighting Trump to the bone. He will use this information to win over some reluctant voters who are actually this new reality. It's easy for us who are not confronted with this situation daily to say how awful it is for others to not want to be overrun with homelessness. We must fight for the social programs, an immigration policy, and economic policies that will erase and prevent homelessness across the country.
Part of that solution will necessarily be restoring and devoting more financial and economic aid to Central America and taking the necessary enforcement actions (which might even involve some military help) to ensure that there is a safe and viable environment in those places. Economic development and effective law and judicial enforcement is paramount. That also might mean helping the citizens of those countries change their governing regimes. Getting rid of corrupt, autocratic leaders right in our hemisphere is more necessary than helping the Saudis, Russians, and Israelis start a war with Iran.
TruckFump
(5,812 posts)Houses run well over $1-million -- and that's for nothing special. A nice big home? Easily over $2-million. (Note: I don't live in one of these McMansions!)
Across the street and down a two blocks from me is a homeless encampment. I regularly take things to them, often pet supplies for the animals there. My friend across the way from me does this when I cannot go. It's not just food they need -- there is a church food bank a block away from them -- and they take good care of these homeless people. The rains this spring were horrible for these poor people. I took blankets and dry clothing to them. I then went home and cried.
This is so fucking wrong -- no country with the wealth we have should allow people to go homeless. Yes, I know some prefer to live on the streets (supposedly), but there is no need to not care for them, feed them, send medical staff to them, and to treat them like they are human instead of human waste.
Initech
(99,909 posts)It really doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out. The out of control rent prices in California and the rest of the nation is becoming a crisis in and of itself.
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)50 degree winters in SF vs. 12 degrees in the heartland
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)not for fun
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)Truth is homeless people do move here because it's more liveable from a climate and benefits standpoint. In SF, they receive a small stipend from the city. Word gets around...
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)the exurbs, another state. they come for weather, they come for "benefits", they come with the hope they'll find subsidized housing.
some people fall into homelessness from inside the city.
there are many reasons the problem is worst in west coast cities.
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)It's actually become more difficult to recruit people to move here because of the cost of housing. People are moving away because of the cost of housing, yet people move here to live on the streets...
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)that's why you said they did it. for the climate.
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)I'd love to see a comprehensive survey of the homeless and understand the commonality of their stories, but I don't know of anything like that.
My current take is it is not "high rents", but eviction - for whatever reason. Once you've been evicted, who will rent to you?
the concentration in permissive, liberal cities who'll actually try to help rather than let you die on the street just makes sense at that point. Would you rather we didn't help and just gave them a 1-way bus ticket back to wherever they came from? we're burdened because we actually care.
I have a college acquaintance who's homeless in Port Townsend, WA. He got a "head injury" (unclear what actually happened, he tells long stories wherein he has no responsibility for anything), got fired from his job as a cook, got in medical debt, got evicted, now he's in an RV somewhere there. He has 2 teenage sons by 2 ex-wives. He's a fuck up, he drinks too much and smokes way too much weed, but he does have brain damage - probably CTE from football concussions.
How do I help him? Should I help him? He's just an acquaintance. shouldn't his family or his good friends help him? Is he on disability? Does he have SNAP? who knows.
shit is complicated.
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)Typically, I don't think it happens suddenly. In SF the city doesn't allow people to be thrown to the streets because the landlord can get more rent. In fact there are cases where people buy units and can't move into them (for like a year) because they are occupied by renters. There are workarounds where landlords must pay moving costs & transition costs to ease the blow...
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)it doesn't in the PNW.
there are some protections like moving costs, but not in all the surrounding municipalities.
MrsCoffee
(5,801 posts)They have some gall trying to escape freezing winters.
By the way...IT'S NEVER FUCKING EASY TO LIVE ON THE STREETS ANYWHERE.
I know from first hand experience and I'll leave it at that.
Try a little compassion for crying out loud.
SWBTATTReg
(21,856 posts)is another reason.
People are afraid that they won't be able to replace their home if they sell it with a comparable home, so more and more people are hanging onto their homes, not putting them on the market, so fewer homes get placed into the marketplace, thus driving up the remaining supply of homes up in prices, so a double whammy so to speak. High rent prices, high real estate prices.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSACSR
DBoon
(22,284 posts)First, last and security deposit means you need $4080 up front, plus you need to pass all the landlord's background checks including income verification.
With this threshold for market housing, it is no wonder so many are on the street.
Response to Lady Freedom Returns (Original post)
SamuelTwain This message was self-deleted by its author.
Lady Freedom Returns
(14,120 posts)SamuelTwain
(28 posts)Lady Freedom Returns
(14,120 posts)LeftinOH
(5,341 posts)The article doesn't seem to mention that. It would seem very unlikely that the local homeless population is entirely home-grown. Local people tend to have local family & contacts.
California -and LA in particular- has long been a magnet for uprooted/unrooted people. So is Florida. I live in the Great Lakes rust belt ..people don't come here; it's the kind of place from which people flee ..and California (or Florida) is where many of them seem to go. The false allure of dreamy **California, where livin' is easy** seems to appeal to lots of people, even when there's no plan about what to do once they get there. I've known people like this.
Kali
(54,990 posts)what does that have to do with anything?
Calculating
(2,954 posts)Large parts of downtown SLC can look like a refugee camp at times with tents/shopping carts/bankets/etc everywhere. It actually hurts some local businesses and restaurants because people become afraid to walk through the homeless filled areas downtown. Some of them can be pretty pushy, and will aggressively bother you for spare change(usually they claim they need money for a bus pass or something) or other freebies when you go by them.
Honestly I don't harbor any ill will towards them so much as I feel bad for them. It's not their fault that the mental institutions got shut down and now we have thousands of mentally ill people roaming the streets. Drug and Alcohol addictions are another major factor I'm sure, and we need some way to get these people off the streets and into treatment programs.
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)But elsewhere in the Wasatch Front where the Repubs have control (that would be everywhere else), I'm sure there's no homeless problem at all.
Regardless, didn't Utah SOLVE homelessness a couple years ago by just giving the homeless homes? I can't tell you the number of times I've had to shoot that assertion down.
dalton99a
(81,062 posts)tolerated - and where there is free food (soup kitchens, mobile feeding stations, etc.)
The phenomenon is not limited to Southern Calif.
Stuart G
(38,357 posts)Sadly this problem still exists in this country. You would have to read this, to understand Harrington's one most incredible point: The homeless are often invisible. Their clothes are ok, they often have jobs and families and often they do not live in tents, they live in cars, trailers, in places you would never believe. I met a homeless person for a moment sleeping in the hall of an apartment I lived in. He picked up his stuff, got it together and walked out. Yes, some have jobs. This country's social fabric is broken, torn, see through, and in some places non existent.
..The saddest thing about the picture in this post, is that by now, we could have found a way to solve most of the aspects of this problem. Indoor places for homeless people and other solutions. Some cities have taken this on, while others haven't. ...
...Again, This book about rampant poverty and the homeless was written 57 years ago.
I guess other problems have been solved, but not poverty.... Wait, ...computers like this did not exist in 1962. That one was solved. Actually a home computer or a hand held computer was really a dream, something on Star Trek....Oh wait, Star Trek didn't come on until 1966.........oh well
JCMach1
(27,544 posts)And largely it's upscale units that are being added by developers.
It's a major housing crisis in most parts of the country.
Housing should be a place to live, not investment income