General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThis reparations issue. Who started it and why?
I don't understand.
Maybe it has to be addressed. Maybe those should be paid, maybe not. It's a matter for honest debate.
But why now when even if the House passes reparations it's dead on arrival in the Senate? And especially under this atmosphere where the House is reluctant for an impeachment because "it will divide the country"?
Why not wait until we have the power to do something?
Dream Girl
(5,111 posts)with his deplorables and others. "Now they want to send free money to black people..."
riverine
(516 posts)1- reparations
2- taking away employer based insurance from 180 million Americans
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)DrToast
(6,414 posts)Most people aren't saying "it's not the right time." Most people are saying "it's a bad idea."
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)and the reason they think it's a bad idea is that it's either too early or too late to consider it.
Reparations?
No
Reparations?
Hell, no
Reparations?
Not now
Reparations?
Now's not the right time
Reparations?
Bad time to talk about it. Maybe later.
Reparations?
Now?! It's too late for that!
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Democrats because "it's the right thing to do."
But don't mention reparations because Trump will use it against us?
We've been told for 150 years that now isn't the right time to talk about reparations. When SHOULD we bring it up?
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)And who decides how long we're supposed to be quiet about it and when it's appropriate to bring it up?
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)When we have the power to do something.
Sorry, but it's not like the impeachment matter at all. Impeachment, itself, whether or not the Senate convicts, is a victory and it's bullshit that it would cause more trump voters.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Goodheart
(5,318 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,810 posts)Here's what I'm waiting for - in about 10/15 years. And that's why we have to - we must KEEP bringing it up.
Time is on our side - NOT on the side of the current Dominant Culture.
And I personally will not stop asking for this. I'm not going to do it.
We got that Confederate Flag ripped down from Liberty State Park in NJ - and that's just the beginning.
The Confederacy WILL be brought to heel.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)riverine
(516 posts)Make it THREE (3).
Turin_C3PO
(13,964 posts)Its the Republican bogeyman that they use to discredit all liberal ideas.
empedocles
(15,751 posts)counter attacks, etc.,
It's been an effective political weapon that works for the 'cons. Especially works well when the Dems have aggressive proponents, who are not the best leaders etc. [rw media will promote such useful types, make them high profile, with national name recognition - as they have so successfully done in the past].
Turin_C3PO
(13,964 posts)Socialism has an actual, textbook definition, and the media should ask every Republican who calls Democratic policies socialism if they actually know the definition of said word. And, as far as I know, theres only one prominent Democrat calling themselves a socialist.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)But to clarify, they are not calling for individuals to be given money. These bills create a Commission to Study and Develop Reparation Proposals for African-Americans." The state purpose of this legislation is to "address the fundamental injustice, cruelty, brutality, and inhumanity of slavery in the United States and the 13 American colonies between 1619 and 1865 and to establish a commission to study and consider a national apology and proposal for reparations for the institution of slavery, its subsequent de jure and de facto racial and economic discrimination against African-Americans, and the impact of these forces on living African-Americans, to make recommendations to the Congress on appropriate remedies, and for other purposes.
House Bill: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/40/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%22reparations%22%7D&r=3&s=1
Senate Version: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/1083/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%22reparations%22%7D&r=1&s=1
johnp3907
(3,730 posts)We need to at least know what were actually talking about.
Mike Nelson
(9,951 posts)
but I still don't understand how it would work. Almost anyone can say they had a slave as an ancestor. Will it be only African slaves? Will DNA be the judge?
also, I think it's a losing issue for Democrats. I'm willing to listen to advocates, but I don't think most people are...
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Please at least read the bills and find out what they actually do before critiquing them.
Senate version, sponsored by Cory Booker: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/1083/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%22reparations%22%7D&r=1&s=1
House version, sponsored by Sheila Jackson-Lee: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/40?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%22reparations%22%7D&s=1&r=3
riverine
(516 posts)which would:
A commission is usually Washington DC speak for "postpone and later forget about it".
Opponents have no issue with a commission.
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)A study to "develop reparation proposals" is not for the purpose of giving money?
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)I suggest you do some research about the topic before discussing it any further. It seems you have a lot to learn about it. Here are a couple of sources you can start with:
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/06/the-case-for-reparations/361631/
https://harvardpolitics.com/culture/beyondreparations/
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)The word "reparations" suggests money for the great majority of people.
JustAnotherGen
(31,810 posts)It's based in the word repair.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)I actually took time to find information for you.
If you're not interested in learning more a out this, that's on you. But don't assume that any effort to help you learn something is an attack.
NewJeffCT
(56,828 posts)it will be Republican/Trump sound bites on TV and on Twitter against Democratic sound bites and tweets.
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)Cary
(11,746 posts)This is a generalization and I am sorry if I offend black people. I don't intend any offense.
Black people, as I understand them, feel that they are present victims of past discrimination. I think the facts irrefutably support them. I am not sure the best remedy is reparations although I do appreciate the justice of reparations. I think we need to go back to affirmative action but then "conservatives" sadly have shit all over that successful concept.
"Conservatives" are racists? fueled by tons and tons of racial resentment for no rational reason. And too they love cutting off their own noses to spite their faces. Broad based prosperity benefits us all, in every way. But the racists will have none of that.
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)gratuitous
(82,849 posts)But the toxic effects of these discriminatory practices continue to worm their way through our society today. For example, a recent survey of foreclosures due to reverse mortgages showed that lenders disproportionately targeted Black communities and neighborhoods. People who thought they were going to leave the value of their homes to their children found out that they had nothing left after a lifetime of work and thrift, thanks to predatory banking practices.
As noted above, it always seems like the wrong time to talk reparations, but it's always a good time for another tax break for the wealthy. Nobody ever ponders whether the Republicans are overplaying their hand by another big transfer of wealth to the upper reaches of our society, but my oh my, the hand-wringing that accompanies even the most modest proposals that would serve the working poor have to be fly-specked out of existence, lest our society get too accustomed to governance that benefits the lower classes.
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)gratuitous
(82,849 posts)It's always a good time to let an injustice continue, because remedying it might cost votes. Odd how that consideration never seems to come up when Republicans open the Treasury for more looting by the overclass.
My position is that Democrats gain far more than they lose when they carry out popular policies that benefit large segments of the electorate.
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)By its very nature "reparations" will turn off a lot of white people who feel that they're unwarranted, thus risking an election. It would be counterproductive to actually getting them done. Better to wait.
And, no, I don't feel the same about impeachment. I believe it's bullshit that impeachment would gain trump any more voters.
JustAnotherGen
(31,810 posts)White Economic Anxiety
Opioids
Coal Miners
Is turning off a lot of black folks. We've put up with that since 2016 - and truthfully?
I want the black lung benefits pulled from the ACA in a year or two. It's a stupid job and no one should have to pay for it except the people stupid enough to do it. I don't see why I have to assist to the federal medicaid till when I'd prefer to give it to deserving high school seniors headed to HBCU's via the UNCF.
If we are gong to talk grievances and turn offs -
Can every ones be on the table?
Quite frankly - those heroin addicts don't look like me, it's not my problem, I didn't do it, and they have to take responsibility for themselves.
It's turning off black voters while black kids caught with a dime bag have their lives ruined forever.
StarfishSaver
(18,486 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,810 posts)I would be happy with stripping Confederate Soldiers names from our Military Forts.
If not - I want just hear in NJ - Fort Dix - changed to Fort Rommel just send another fuck you Mississippi.
Goodheart
(5,318 posts)DinahMoeHum
(21,783 posts)ismnotwasm
(41,976 posts)Start here
160 Years of Atlantic Stories
A year-by-year catalogue of some of the magazine's most momentous work.
Read more
Clyde Ross was a smart child. His teacher thought he should attend a more challenging school. There was very little support for educating black people in Mississippi. But Julius Rosenwald, a part owner of Sears, Roebuck, had begun an ambitious effort to build schools for black children throughout the South. Rosss teacher believed he should attend the local Rosenwald school. It was too far for Ross to walk and get back in time to work in the fields. Local white children had a school bus. Clyde Ross did not, and thus lost the chance to better his education.
Then, when Ross was 10 years old, a group of white men demanded his only childhood possessionthe horse with the red coat. You cant have this horse. We want it, one of the white men said. They gave Rosss father $17.
I did everything for that horse, Ross told me. Everything. And they took him. Put him on the racetrack. I never did know what happened to him after that, but I know they didnt bring him back. So thats just one of my losses.
Sharecropper boys in 1936 (Carly Mydans/Library of Congress)
The losses mounted. As sharecroppers, the Ross family saw their wages treated as the landlords slush fund. Landowners were supposed to split the profits from the cotton fields with sharecroppers. But bales would often disappear during the count, or the split might be altered on a whim. If cotton was selling for 50 cents a pound, the Ross family might get 15 cents, or only five. One year Rosss mother promised to buy him a $7 suit for a summer program at their church. She ordered the suit by mail. But that year Rosss family was paid only five cents a pound for cotton. The mailman arrived with the suit. The Rosses could not pay. The suit was sent back. Clyde Ross did not go to the church program.
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/06/the-case-for-reparations/361631/
LexVegas
(6,059 posts)stillcool
(32,626 posts)Happy Juneteenth to you too.....
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/19/us/juneteenth-reparations-history.html
Reparations Are Rare in America, but They Have Been Paid Before
With a renewed focus on reparations for slavery, what lessons can be drawn from payments to victims of other historical injustices in America?
By Adeel Hassan and Jack Healy
June 19, 2019
Ever since a Union Army general announced in Galveston, Tex., that all slaves are free on June 19, 1865 a day now commemorated as Juneteenth the question of how to compensate the countrys formerly enslaved people has hung over the United States.
Lawmakers in Washington addressed reparations for slavery for the first time in more than 10 years on Wednesday. A House Judiciary subcommittee discussed a bill to create a commission that would make recommendations concerning any form of apology and compensation to descendants of enslaved African-Americans.
got people all in a dither. OMG