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Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:38 PM

 

Which groups of people would be exempt from Medicare For All?

Team Sports/Pro athletes for one. There is no way Tom Brady or LeBron James is going to a Main St physician. If private insurance is illegal would private docs be illegal?

What if big companies followed suit and hired their own medical staffs? Would a Google clinic be illegal?

Would Congress be on MFA? I seriously doubt that.

Of course the military would not be on MFA.

Would medical tourism be illegal? Let's say the best specialists all relocated to the Caribbean to charge 10x the federal reimbursement rate for MFA?

The rich will never stand in the same line with the average Joe.

MFA needs to be discussed before it is adopted wholesale by the party.

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:43 PM

1. SS needs to be deducted from ALL incomes 1st

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:45 PM

2. Private insurance and private doctors will never be "illegal"

The rich and well to do will always be able to purchase supplemental policies that cover more than basic insurance provided by an all inclusive system. In addition, people will always be able to go to private doctors even if they do not accept that basic system.

Look at how Medicare works now - many people who can afford it buy supplemental plans at various price points. These cover all or some of the 20% that Medicare does not cover. People also pay for private doctors or for elective procedures out of pocket. None of that is "illegal" now or would be in the future if a Medicare like system is set up for everyone in the country.

Supplemental insurance is a huge business and would continue to be profitable for insurance companies.

The ideas you discuss in your OP seem to be right wing talking points against a national health insurance system - fueled by ignorance of how national health care systems work in most advance countries in the world. Please educate yourself before bringing up something you apparently know little about.

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Response to csziggy (Reply #2)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:56 PM

5. The ACA does all that without depriving me of my basic private health insurance.

 

You can't address one of the questions so instead you move to shut off debate by alleging "right wing talking points".

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Response to riverine (Reply #5)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 01:40 PM

9. Too much of the ACA has been overturned or left to individual states

For instance, in Florida, my home state, Medicaid expansion was not accepted by the Legislature, so a lot of people were left out of coverage - my brother in law, for one. Right now state attorneys in Republican controlled states are close to having their wet dream of completely overturning the ACA, and panicking about being responsible for removing coverage from millions without a replacement.

This is why alternatives are being discussed - the ACA was a compromise and will likely be killed because it is "Obamacare" and the right wingers hate anything to do with Obama.

Some people lost "their" doctors when the ACA went into effect, mostly because the doctors made the choice to not accept ACA policies. Many retirees are forced to change doctors who elect to not take Medicare. Even with private insurance, people have trouble keeping "their" doctors - when my husband had employer provided insurance we had to change providers when the company supplying the insurance changed and their approved providers changed.

Unless you are paying out of pocket for completely private insurance not underwritten by an employer, you are at the mercy of whatever they decide to provide - and even if you are paying for your own private insurance policy, you are at the mercy of what that insurance company decides to provide and to cover.

Your questions are absurd - as my post title said, private insurance and private doctors will never be "illegal" - there will be different systems in place to cover people, some of which can involve private insurance. The same way it works in nearly every other developed county.

This site: https://www.internations.org/go is aimed at people considering relocating to various countries around the world. In the discussion of each country they get into detailed descriptions of various aspects including healthcare. If you want to check on private healthcare insurance treatment in countries with nationalized healthcare, this is an excellent resource.

For instance:
The Swedish healthcare system is publicly funded and largely decentralized. The government has taken great measures to allow every resident access to heavily subsidized healthcare services, among the most affordable in Europe with services for under-20-year-olds being free of charge. The quality of these services is also reflected in the high life expectancy of Swedes, which is over 80. In fact, nearly 20% of the population is 65 or older.

Sweden reinvests approximately 9% of its GDP on healthcare every year. The central government, county councils and municipalities share the responsibility to provide people with good quality medical services. The Health and Medical Service Act (Hälso- och sjukvårdslagen, HSL) gives county councils and municipalities more freedom in this regard.

<SNIP>

Healthcare Improvements and Private Insurance

What has also proved effective is the healthcare guarantee, which was introduced in Sweden in 2005, promising to reduce waiting times for treatment or operations to a maximum of 90 days. If this time is exceeded, patients are offered care elsewhere, the cost for which, including travel costs, is covered by the patient’s county council. Due to this guarantee, 78% of patients felt they received the care they needed in 2013.

Despite this high level of satisfaction, one in ten Swedes have private health insurance, however this is largely provided by employers to attract high-level employees and is by no means necessary for living in Sweden. It is, however, important to remember to take out private health insurance if you are a non-EU citizen and to ensure that it is valid for your time living in Sweden.
https://www.internations.org/go/moving-to-sweden/living#healthcare-in-sweden


That, in the most "socialized" countries in the world at the moment.

I did respond to your questions - private health insurance and private doctors will never be illegal. The idea that they might be made illegal is a right wing talking point and is fucking ridiculous.

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:46 PM

3. I'm sure people would be able to purchase private insurance

if they wanted to go to a “better” doctor. The candidates who said they’ll abolish private insurance will walk that back, I think.

In any case, first we have to get a public option/Medicare buy-in passed and then when people see the results and like it, we can talk about a true single payer system

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:55 PM

4. medicare available for those who want it as one option. it is NOT free however nt

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Response to msongs (Reply #4)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 12:59 PM

6. I support Medicare For America

 

along with several of the candidates like Mayor Pete.

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 01:06 PM

7. The US Government will not get rid of private providers.

Medicare for all would be a tax payer funded health insurance plan. If a rich person wants to hire a doctor or use a private hospital they will be able to do it. The Federal government isn't going to take over hospitals or make doctors work for the government.

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 01:23 PM

8. There are private doctors in UK and Canada. I'm sure they will always exist here.

Agree completely that details of MFA need to be explained. Problem is, I don't think anyone has the answers, and if they do, they don't want to be too specific for fear of ticking certain groups off.

Until a detailed plan is available, I think we ought to focus on getting everyone covered -- whether using subsidies, premiums for those who can afford it, and/or taxes -- under Medicaid, Medicare, private insurance, or a Public Option along the lines of Medicare and Medicaid.

A candidate running on Medicare-for-All, or tough chit unless you are rich enough to afford something else, is not going to appeal to most people until they are comfortable with the idea. The poor, disabled, medically poor, people who like government programs (like me), etc., will probably think it's a great idea compared to what we have now. On the other hand, I've seen a number of people on Medicare -- even on DU -- express concern about M4A impacting their current Medicare.

Those with employer healthcare will likely be reluctant to give it up for a government plan that might get treated like the ACA -- improvements when Democrats are in control, deterioration when GOPers are in control.

A Public Option -- with defined coverage -- along the lines of Medicare/Medicaid will be attractive to many (assuming the final plan is as good as we think), but one could still fall back on private insurance if dissatisfied after a try. Don't think it's going to be as cheap as people think, though, but there should be some improvement in cost and subsidies/taxes to help afford cost.

I respect Sanders' efforts in promoting M4A, but I don't trust his assumptions, cost estimates, how providers will respond, or even if patients are ready to make the sacrifices required to make it work.

The usual response is that other countries made it work. True, but most did it when health care was not particularly costly -- providers weren't paid exorbitant amounts; there weren't a lot of treatments and drugs; testing was minimal; there was no Alzheimer's because it was just called old age dementia; when you were old, there wasn't a host of medical providers ready to keep you alive right up until your (or your insurer's) last dime; there weren't nursing homes, you died at home in most cases; etc.

In 1960, healthcare was about 5% of our economy. Now, it's 17+%. That's a big ship to move without making big waves, maybe some tsunamis.

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 01:53 PM

10. I do not want Medicare for all.

 

I want one payer healthcare for all. I have it, everyone should have it. And yes there would still be health insurance policies for anyone who wanted one.

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 02:03 PM

11. Republicans

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Response to riverine (Original post)

Sat Jul 6, 2019, 02:58 PM

12. With all due respect,

it sounds like you're thinking that the proposed comprehensive Medicare for All will make the govt. the employer of doctors; that's not what's being proposed. Please take a look at some of the documentation on the Physicians for a Nat'l Health Program website, including their FAQ page, and another general information page, to get more information.

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