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Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:00 AM

A case for impeachment

Article II, Section 2 states:

The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States; he may require the Opinion, in writing, of the principal Officer in each of the executive Departments, upon any Subject relating to the Duties of their respective Offices, and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offences against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.

This means that once impeached, a person cannot be pardoned. It doesn't say convicted by the senate, it just says impeached.

It is urgent that congress impeach the president and members of his corrupt government before they start dishing out pardons like candies.

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Response to Xipe Totec (Original post)

Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:06 AM

1. I am confused

 

Does this mean people going through the impeachment process can't be pardoned or does it mean the President can't pardon others if he is going through the impeachment process?

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Response to SHRED (Reply #1)

Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:13 AM

4. It says that the President cannot pardon anyone who has been impeached

Once a person is impeached (which requires a vote of the House, but not the Senate), a president cannot pardon away the offenses stated in the impeachment.

If the President is impeached for obstruction of Justice, then future presidents (Say Mike Pence, if Trump were to resign) cannot pardon him for obstruction of justice. Meaning once he leaves office he can be prosecuted for obstruction of justice even if the senate never convicts.

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Response to Xipe Totec (Original post)

Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:09 AM

2. Its significant that it says impeachment

Not conviction or removal. So anybody who is subject to impeachment cant be pardoned of that.


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Response to Xipe Totec (Original post)

Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:11 AM

3. Impeachment by the House is the indictment and by the Senate is the verdict ...

so I think your theory misses half the process he can't be pardoned from.

The only way a President can duck the verdict is to resign, ala Nixon. Ford's pardon of Nixon had nothing to with impeachment, it had to with "high crimes and misdemeanors" Nixon was exposed to as they were uncovered in the impeachment process.

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Response to marble falls (Reply #3)

Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:16 AM

5. You're talking about removal from office. I'm talking about Indictment after he leaves office.

This is not about conviction in the senate. This is about the limits of the pardon power. If you are impeached, even if you are not convicted in the senate, then the president can no longer pardon you and you are subject to indictment after you leave office.

This is why Nixon resigned before being impeached, and had Ford immediately pardon him. He knew that once he was impeached Ford could no longer pardon him.

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Response to Xipe Totec (Reply #5)

Sun Jul 21, 2019, 10:20 AM

6. Difference with no significance. Being impeached by the House didn't affect President ...

Clinton in any way at all except as a sideshow distraction.

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