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Sun Aug 18, 2019, 07:57 PM

Questions for DU gun owners - I don't understand your country- Please answer if possible

I seriously want to know because there are a considerable number of DU'ers that are gun owners and advocates.

As a preface: I have previously lived in the US and probably spend a month every year "in country". I love your country and people. I've lived in open carry states. As a resident, I experienced racism. Never experienced racism as an ongoing visitor for the past 40 years. But....

Questions:

1) if you live n the greatest democracy and strongest nation in the world why would you need to carry? (Why would you need to own even own a handgun or a non sport rifle?)

2) Do you believe the tissue of society is so thin that you think it's going to be Mad Max 15 minutes after the next power blackout? (If so, then how can you be living the greatest democracy in the world?)

3) maybe my premise wrong: you don't carry weapons to be free but you carry weapons because you are free?

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Reply Questions for DU gun owners - I don't understand your country- Please answer if possible (Original post)
Shaddox Aug 2019 OP
northoftheborder Aug 2019 #1
TEB Aug 2019 #2
ornotna Aug 2019 #3
captain queeg Aug 2019 #4
Chipper Chat Aug 2019 #5
Shaddox Aug 2019 #6
fleabiscuit Aug 2019 #7
Hoyt Aug 2019 #8
samir.g Aug 2019 #11
Amishman Aug 2019 #9
WhiskeyGrinder Aug 2019 #10
uppityperson Aug 2019 #12
Unrepentant Fenian Aug 2019 #13
GulfCoast66 Aug 2019 #14
RainCaster Aug 2019 #15
jmg257 Aug 2019 #16
Hekate Aug 2019 #17
Hermit-The-Prog Aug 2019 #18
Fla_Democrat Aug 2019 #19
bluecollar2 Aug 2019 #20

Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:01 PM

1. Good questions

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:06 PM

2. When you find answer

Let us know please

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:07 PM

3. For the most part it's because

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:09 PM

4. Can't really answer your question the way it's worded

The was it’s presented I say no to all those I grew up rurally and did some hunting and recreational shooting. I still have a couple guns in storage. Haven’t shot a gun in 25 years. I see no reason for anyone to have an assault rifle or handgun with large capacity magazine. I think the ones who say they need their guns for the coming apocalypse are out in left field. Would I turn my guns in? When presented with that question I’d say, yeah if everyone else did too.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:09 PM

5. Tough to answer without angering some on DU

But I believe I'm n the basic principal of the 2nd. I've owned rifles and shotguns. My father, uncles, and grandfathers taught us to hunt rabbits and squirrels. I dont remember any family members having a handgun although my brother was a city policeman and my grandfather was a constable. With that said like all of you i think AR15s and bump stocks should be abolished. Let sanity prevail.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:30 PM

6. To clarify: I am not anti-gun. I grew up on a farm and after lessons,would take out grandad's rifle

And 12 gauge Without supervision when I was about 12. Since then, I've had limited handgun training. The point is that, on some fundamental level, I don't understand the American gun fetish.

Is the point "if you can't keep up then fuck off"? Can American exceptionalism really come down to "if you can't keep up with the crazy then fuck off?"

How is that a viable democratic political ideology?

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:33 PM

7. I'd say it's mostly a fantasy thing.

There are still a few sport big game shooters that do depend on that bounty. But the vast majority of gun owners don't need to.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:40 PM

8. I'd ask it in what we fondly call the Gungeon, AKA Gun Control & RKBA Group. Tell em Hoyt sent you.

Hope you get a legitimate answer.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #8)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 09:12 PM

11. you'll get no legitimate answer there

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:46 PM

9. In rural areas, police response can be 30 minutes to an hour.

I bought a hand gun about a year back because of self defense concerns, though my focus is at home. I live in a rather rural area.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 08:54 PM

10. Here are some answers.

1. We are each our own first responders. For some people, that means carrying a weapon. For others, it doesn't. For many, it's not a thought that crosses their mind at all; they rely on the police, who do not have a duty to protect them.

2. No. When the power goes out, it doesn't get all Mad Max. That's not why people carry.

3. Correct. But I know people who carry concealed even where it's illegal, because they feel it is the best way to exercise the duty they feel to protect themselves.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 09:33 PM

12. I don't "live n the greatest democracy and strongest nation in the world"

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 09:36 PM

13. I own guns, but for the most part I despise gun owners...

I like to target shoot. It's a hobby. To be honest, I haven't shot any gun in 6 or 7 years. I figured that since I have guns to target shoot, I should have one in my night stand on the one in a million chance of a home invasion. But to be honest, I don't need them. I'll find a new hobby. I like pissing conservatards off, so I love to quote trump saying "I like going after the guns first and we'll worry about due process later". I also like pointing out that trump has sold them out and that President Obama protected their "rights" way more than trump has. This is a point we have to hammer home to the trumptards.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 09:51 PM

14. You ask lots of questions.

I am a liberal democrat and I own guns. Because I hunt. Where I’m from everyone hunts. I normally kill 2-3 deer a year and we enjoy eating the most low fat and healthiest meat on the planet. In a very regulated season that insures a healthy deer herd.

But I don’t own and will never own modern military style weapons. And believe no rifle magazine should legally be larger then 10 bullets. Well, actually, if I were king it would be 5, but we could actually get 10 done.

As to carrying, I can’t really answer. I have never carried and will never carry a gun daily.

But at one time, I had a concealed carry permit for one very specific reason. My wife and I used to fish off kayaks in often very remote locations on the Florida Gulf Coast. 15-20 years ago we put in at an extremely remote location where I expect no one else to be and cell phone coverage was a non-existent. . As we started paddling up to our truck I saw there was a total redneck looking van parked next to my truck. Told the wife to fish a couple of hundred yards off while I landed. And my suspicion was somewhat confirmed. The folks in that van had the potential to be bad news. Fortunately, I can do ‘redneck’ if needed and we were able to load up with no problem except for comments about our silly boats. Equally fortunate, we caught a bunch of fish and that impressed them some.

But I swore I would never be that helpless again with my wife depending on me. And under Florida law the only way I could legally have a firearm in a NWA was to have a concealed carry license. So I got one and and handgun and learned to use it safely and proficiently.

We now have a boat and I no longer will find myself in that very specific situation so I did not renew my Concealed license.

You talk about all mad max and stuff. I was not worried about silly stuff like that. But wilderness areas in the south can be dangerous. Way more dangerous than many big cities.

Read the last Democratic Party Platform. It supports the right to own a firearm for self protection. With lost of regulation including an AWB. I support the Democratic platform.

Unless you live in a rural area where government help is a long way off it is hard to understand. Even if that remote area had had cell service the police would have been a half hour or more away. Maybe an hour.





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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 10:05 PM

15. My answers

I live on acreage and share it with deer, bear, coyotes, red tail hawks, ospreys, and the occasional cougar.

1. I only use my rifle at home. It's to protect our home from the wildlife around us. The coyotes will eat our beagle if given the chance, and there are many birds who will eat our koi.

2. When the power goes out, I fire up the generator. That's all.

3. For me, it's all about reason 1. Nothing more. I will never join the NRA. My rifle is a single shot bolt action with a scope. I have no need for those semi-auto assault rifle penis extensions, because I can hit my target with the first shot.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 10:08 PM

16. Great democracy, good amount of violent crime.

No real worry of mad max, but people have died trying to save $10 on a TV on Black Friday.

Great country or not, People do come crazy shit.

But “need”? People get to choose.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 10:37 PM

17. Where are you from? What brings you here every year for 40 years?

Do you always go to the same big city/small town/state? Do you travel extensively while here, or do you stay put? Is your country of origin very diverse in beliefs and ethnicity, or is everyone pretty much the same?

Knowing the answer to these and other questions about you and your culture of origin would give me a handle on how to answer your questions about Americans and guns.

Part of what you are seeing when here (taking what you say at face value) is that America does not have one single culture, but instead has many cultures. We share a set of laws, a language, and a currency -- but one region can be as different from another as a neighboring country. We are not all one people -- America is not a single tribe or ethnicity; America is an idea. It's the reason White Nationalism is so problematic, rooted as it is in ancient ideas of "blood and soil" that kept Europe drenched in blood for century after century. We thought we had grown out of that and left it behind. For most of us, that is the case -- White Nationalism is still a fringe belief, drawing its power from resentment and hate.

Gun culture was never meant to be what it has become. For two centuries it was mostly the mark of being from the farm and countryside and wilds. A long rifle might come home from whatever war there was, like swords of old, but I haven't heard of anyone bringing home tommy-guns from WW I to store in their homes. As recently as the Great Depression, my mother's older brothers used the famly rifle to hunt jackrabbits for food for the family. Many men and boys in rural areas learned to hunt and the family ate what they hunted. Military style weapons of today were never meant for that: they just rip the meat to shreds.

In the past 40 years, though, a sickness has settled in. A minority of the country is causing this, but how they gained the power to terrorize the rest of us was a mystery until recently. The picture is becoming clearer all the time, however. As always in cases of inexplicable violence and corruption, ask "Who does it serve?" and then Follow the Money.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 10:49 PM

18. short answer: money

Some rich sociopaths discovered they could influence certain people to vote certain ways and gain great riches by doing so. A giant propaganda machine was developed to aid in this project. It was successful, but a side effect was unleashing some sick people with military grade weaponry.

Judges have been installed who are willing to ignore most of the 2nd Amendment to our Constitution in order to perpetuate the control, power, and money flow.

Amendment II, in its entirety:
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/second_amendment


The 2nd Amendment, as interpreted by RWNJ (Right Wing Nut Jobs), including judges selected for the purpose:
The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 11:01 PM

19. Oh, my





“A Winchester rifle should have a place of honor in every black home, and it should be used for that protection which the law refuses to give.”
― Ida B. Wells-Barnett






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Response to Shaddox (Original post)

Sun Aug 18, 2019, 11:05 PM

20. Quick answers

1) farming in south Florida means snakes, iguanas, and other critters in summer, vultures in winter. I need something to either dispose of them or make them leave.

2) Maybe not 15 minutes after the next blackout but for the standard 6 weeks it takes to get power back on after a hurricane in south Florida farm country gives reason to consider effective self-defence measures. Frankly, dialing 911 isn't going to help. Miami-Dade police/sheriff's dept. Aren't going to be of any help.

3) I own weapons because they are necessary in my current situation. If I lived in a community in a more controlled environment I might not.

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