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Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:01 PM

One reason Pelosi's "hold back" tactic is brilliant

For weeks, some people have urged Speaker Nancy Pelosi to hold off sending Articles of Impeachment over to the Senate for trial. But most, if not all, of these people offered few, if any details for how Pelosi should do that. Their advice was for her to simply not send the Articles to the Senate.

But Pelosi didn't merely refuse to refer the Articles to the Senate. She did it in a way that boxes in McConnell and the Senate Republicans and also frames a narrative to the Democrats' favor and to the Republicans' detriment.

Had Pelosi just held off sending the Articles, her refusal to move the process forward would have been THE story. The Republicans would have been all over her with a full and enthusiastic assist from the media, who would have spent 24/7 jumping up and down demanding to know when Pelosi would send the Articles to the Senate. Pelosi's "recalcitrance" would have been the ONLY story. In the meantime, Republicans would continue their plan to screw up the process once they got the Articles - and they would have done so with barely any attention because the focus would have been all on Pelosi.

But she was too smart for this. She didn't just hold on to the Articles. She tied her action tight as a knot to the Republican plans to screw up the process, making release of the Articles completely contingent upon the Republicans showing their hand. In the law, we call that a "condition precedent": an event that must occur before a party is required to perform. In this instance, Pelosi made the Republicans revealing the process they plan to use for the trial the condition precedent to her releasing the Articles because, she's explained, she can't refer the Articles until she appoints managers and she can't appoint managers until she knows how the trial will proceed.

By doing it this way, Pelosi ensured that, not only is she not "the bad guy" in this transaction and is not derelict in her duty - since she wants to do her duty but can't do it until the Republicans do theirs - but she also guaranteed that the Republicans can't do their dirt in the dark as they usually do. Every time anyone talks about Pelosi refusing to refer the Articles, they MUST talk about why she's refusing, report on the Republicans refusal to reveal the process they plan to use, and discuss the Republicans' efforts to rig the trial.

As a result, the story is not just about Pelosi holding the Articles, but - and probably moreso - about the Republicans trying to conduct a sham trial.

This was very strategic, intricate boss move.

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Arrow 60 replies Author Time Post
Reply One reason Pelosi's "hold back" tactic is brilliant (Original post)
StarfishSaver Dec 2019 OP
Phoenix61 Dec 2019 #1
pandr32 Dec 2019 #4
kiri Dec 2019 #17
Lexee Dec 2019 #2
empedocles Dec 2019 #3
Takket Dec 2019 #5
ismnotwasm Dec 2019 #6
CanonRay Dec 2019 #7
StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #8
CanonRay Dec 2019 #11
StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #15
LiberalFighter Dec 2019 #20
Ligyron Dec 2019 #49
RestoreAmerica2020 Dec 2019 #18
RockRaven Dec 2019 #9
malaise Dec 2019 #37
Mr.Bill Dec 2019 #10
aeromanKC Dec 2019 #12
mcar Dec 2019 #13
brer cat Dec 2019 #14
AllyCat Dec 2019 #16
2naSalit Dec 2019 #23
Baked Potato Dec 2019 #19
LiberalFighter Dec 2019 #21
eggplant Dec 2019 #22
Demonaut Dec 2019 #24
blakstoneranger Dec 2019 #25
tblue37 Dec 2019 #27
PJMcK Dec 2019 #35
h2ebits Dec 2019 #45
Nature Man Dec 2019 #48
Arkansas Granny Dec 2019 #26
True Blue American Dec 2019 #29
Talitha Dec 2019 #28
Yavin4 Dec 2019 #30
rusty quoin Dec 2019 #31
calimary Dec 2019 #32
lunatica Dec 2019 #33
cantfixstupid Dec 2019 #34
DeminPennswoods Dec 2019 #36
OnDoutside Dec 2019 #38
Hermit-The-Prog Dec 2019 #39
machoneman Dec 2019 #40
BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2019 #41
Nitram Dec 2019 #42
TheCowsCameHome Dec 2019 #43
ancianita Dec 2019 #44
StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #51
mudstump Dec 2019 #46
StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #47
mudstump Dec 2019 #57
StarfishSaver Dec 2019 #59
ZZenith Dec 2019 #50
mudstump Dec 2019 #58
stopbush Dec 2019 #52
Gothmog Dec 2019 #53
lordsummerisle Dec 2019 #54
PatrickforO Dec 2019 #55
Aussie105 Dec 2019 #56
Amera Dec 2019 #60

Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:04 PM

1. She didn't get where she is by being stupid

or impatient. She knows exactly what shes doing. I never understood why anyone thought we needed a different speaker.

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Response to Phoenix61 (Reply #1)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:11 PM

4. +1000000

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Response to Phoenix61 (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:07 AM

17. Pelosi retains control

Pelosi knows that when she sends the Articles over she loses all control. She now holds some control, which irritates McConnell and trump mightily.

I would have preferred that she send Moscow Mitch a note: Please deal with the 200 bills the House passed that you are deep-sixing and delaying. Then we will send over the Articles according to our timetable, not yours.

Call me when you're ready.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:05 PM

2. Pelosi has been awesome the last three years. I am just gonna trust she knows what she is doing.

 

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:07 PM

3. The Speaker's winter strategic options may prove even more brilliant.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:14 PM

5. i was worried.........

i thought the media/public would look at this and go "see, they acted like it was a big emergency, and their case is so stupid she won't even turn it over to the Senate."

well, Speaker Pelosi read the tea leaves better than me (please contain your shock). Latest poll has impeach/remove up to 55% now so it is only going up still.

and kudos to McConnell for coming out on national TV and admitting what we all knew, that the trial was going to be rigged and the Jury was going to work for the defense. I know he was just trying to throw some raw meat to the base but that was one of the DUMBEST things anyone has EVER said in the history of politics. He couldn't have strengthened Pelosi's position more if she had written him a script of exactly what she wanted him to say and had him read it on air.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:18 PM

6. K&R

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:25 PM

7. Yes, brilliant but lame brains McChinless and Lindsey the Spineless

presented her with the opening

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Response to CanonRay (Reply #7)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:30 PM

8. I think she's already figured out what she's going to do in response to any card they try to play

She's not making this up as she goes along.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #8)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:44 PM

11. Your right, but they really gave her a gift

She knows how stupid they are

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Response to CanonRay (Reply #11)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:55 PM

15. True

They just keep walking straight into her web.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #15)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:38 AM

20. Web or closed door?

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #8)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 04:15 PM

49. Contingency Management

That's what they termed it in the Psych 101 course I took more than 40 yrs ago.

Some things never change.

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Response to CanonRay (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:13 AM

18. Ha ha... lame brains McChinless and Lindsey the Spineless

made me laugh out loud, my dog looks at me like--wtf!

Speaker Pelosi is one saavy politician, knows the nuts and bolts of gop chicanery, has dealt with them for decades and she is 5 moves ahead of those sons of @#$# in almost any instance. As for odious oaf in WH, what was it that her daughter said about her--oh yes this...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D6Th4a9QhGng&ved=2ahUKEwjDi-eN_tnmAhXLJzQIHacsD2AQwqsBMAF6BAgFEAk&usg=AOvVaw3UXxsBaGg8hk-khiNuEFkY

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:32 PM

9. It also, if this goes on for a couple of weeks more, prevents Trump from using SOTU to dunk on Dems

for a "phony" or "bogus" impeachment which he was "totally exonerated" of, etc. with every-tv-and-radio-station-live-coverage.

No way in hell, no matter how much McTurtle caves on the specifics of the trial, should those articles be delivered to the Senate in time for the Senate to have it's predetermined theater/spectacle done and delivered before SOTU.

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Response to RockRaven (Reply #9)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 06:20 AM

37. And that was the plan

Speaker Pelosi and her team are way ahead of ReTHUGs and they are thugs.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:34 PM

10. The difference between Pelosi

and Trump, McConnell, Graham, etc. Is that I don't worry about waking up tomorrow morning to find out she did or said something incredibly stupid.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:47 PM

12. Pelosi was perfect for the times as Speaker

Just as Biden is perfect for the times in the White House.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:48 PM

13. She does nothing on impulse

She has a strategy.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:51 PM

14. K&R

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sat Dec 28, 2019, 11:56 PM

16. She's acting darn right presidential.

Smart, lawful, working for the people. I hope she gets to be our first female POTUS while we wait for the 2020 election to shake out.

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Response to AllyCat (Reply #16)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:09 AM

23. +1

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:14 AM

19. She's using her constitutional powers and is outmaneuvering them masterfully

The New Year is gonna be a doozy for the history books.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:39 AM

21. How a perfectly legitimate legal quid pro quo is suppose to work? :)

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:43 AM

22. Add to this her cordial SOTU invitation. A thing of beauty.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:14 AM

24. thank you for pointing that out, i had some idea but didn't quite grasp it

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:16 AM

25. A BUNCH OF PRO TRUMP ADS ON DU'S HOME PAGE!!!

I'm at the DU homepage and all I see is MAGA trump ads and anti Joe Biden Ads, what's going on here? Am I seeing this because I'm an unpaid subscriber?

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Response to blakstoneranger (Reply #25)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:41 AM

27. An algorithm selects ads based on what is on a page, so if the page discusses Trump

or his MAGATs, as DU often does, then that page will show ads related to Trump and MAGA.

If you donate even as little as $5 or $10 a year you won't see any ads.

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Response to blakstoneranger (Reply #25)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 05:45 AM

35. To answer your question:

Yes. Send DU a few bucks and all the ads will go away.

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Response to blakstoneranger (Reply #25)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 02:13 PM

45. Add on an ad blocker

I use Mozilla Firefox and added an ad blocker called uBlock Origin. I see very few ads anywhere I go on the Internet.

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Response to blakstoneranger (Reply #25)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 02:53 PM

48. Ad servers

serve ads that they think you would like based on your browsing habits.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:28 AM

26. She is playing Trump quite masterfully. It has to be eating him up.

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Response to Arkansas Granny (Reply #26)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:49 AM

29. Trump is going berserk.

Because Pelosi is enjoying a nice holiday break surrounded by her family, ignoring him while he tweets furiously, enraged that he is simply being laughed at now..

McConnell and Graham so full of ego and power tripped all over themselves.

I have to ask if anyone remembers Tip O Neil? That wily old bird knew how to run the House. Nancy is his match!

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:44 AM

28. One thing for sure... I'd hate to play chess with Nancy.

She'd have her winning strategy all figured out by the end of my second move. And she's probably quite a lethal poker player, too.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:55 AM

30. Another good reason is that more time allows more evidence to surface.

Since the initial whistleblower complaint, a mountain of evidence came forward in about two months. Imagine what more evidence will be unearthed in a few more weeks.

Well played, Madame Speaker.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 02:00 AM

31. Yeah, it's giving one enough rope to hang oneself. I was one for impeaching from the beginning,

because he should have been impeached from the beginning. That is just basic understanding of our government.

But what she did was masterful...lets us watch him do it again in real time, because he cannot help himself other than doing corrupt things. He did the same corrupt thing.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 03:01 AM

32. A "condition precedent."

An event that must occur before a party is required to perform.

Gotta remember that one!

She really is a world-class tactician. MAN am I glad shes on our side!

Thanks for this essay, StarfishSaver! Lots to think about.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 03:48 AM

33. I'm so glad she's on our side

Because if she were as self serving as the Republicans wed be toast!

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 04:48 AM

34. Pelosi Perfection

Pelosi created a win-win for the country
You go gal👏👏👏

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 06:03 AM

36. Yep, even Tim Ryan, leader

of the "not Pelosi" rebels, had to admit she is the master.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 06:38 AM

38. Great post, and she even sets herself up as the judge of what is fair, or not.

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Response to OnDoutside (Reply #38)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 07:20 AM

39. no, she avoids being seen as judging the process

She is simply waiting for the process to be revealed so that managers can be appointed. This keeps the focus on the Senate. If she had stated that she was waiting for a fair process, the focus of news, public and GOP would have been on her presumption to judge the Senate.

Speaker Pelosi is staying within the power of the House. The transition from House to Senate has to wait until the Senate reveals enough for her to appoint managers from the House. The Constitution doesn't give her power to judge the Senate, so she carefully avoids doing so, while nudging the spotlight onto the Senate.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 08:53 AM

40. In his last SOTU speech, he'll be advised to only talk of his success...but oh no!

Trump NEVER takes good advice and instead will spend most of his time berating every Democrat he can think of, blame them for any of his failures and tlak almost non-stop about how unfair his impeachment is. I love it as many will be turned off by his bleatings, and if anything, cause any doubters to also 'vote' to impeach him.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 10:46 AM

41. She is awesome! Brilliant and experienced!

I just bought a cool Nancy Pelosi tee shirt, by the way. 😊

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 12:33 PM

42. Yes, this is Pelosi's strategy, and it is perfect.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:36 PM

43. "In Nancy I Trust"



Yup. 100%

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 01:55 PM

44. Publicly crowing they'd set an acquittal trap, they set their own, and she had the last laugh.

"Trust in the law. "

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Response to ancianita (Reply #44)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 04:17 PM

51. Stupid is as stupid does

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 02:26 PM

46. I'm glad she took the advice of Lawrence Tribe.

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Response to mudstump (Reply #46)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 02:50 PM

47. She didn't necessarily "take his advice"

First, Pelosi has been miles ahead of everyone on this so it's not likely she's getting her ideas from pundits. And second, as I said in my OP, Tribe and others said she should never send the Articles over at all so that there can never be a Senate trial. She didn't take that advice.

I don't understand why some people just can't give Pelosi credit for being an excellent Speaker, politician and strategist and when they can't deny her effectiveness, try to give the credit to men instead of to her.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #47)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 07:52 PM

57. I'm giving her credit, but she didn't come up with the idea all by herself...

I don't think Nancy Pelosi would claim to be a constitutional scholar. Tribe has been meeting with the leaders and advising them. It's not a slight to Nancy to say that I'm glad she took his advice.

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Response to mudstump (Reply #57)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 08:33 PM

59. You think Prof. Tribe is the only constitutional scholar in the country?

Pelosi is surrounded by her own lawyers and constitutional experts - most of whom she hired. The fact that Pelosi took an action that is remotely similar to something Tribe said she should do doesn't mean she got the idea from him. And while in the last couple of weeks, House leaders have consulted with Tribe, they have been working in this for months under Pelosi's leadership and it's an insult to her to say she took a particular course of action because "she took Tribe's advice."

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Response to mudstump (Reply #46)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 04:16 PM

50. If you're going to misappropriate credit, at least spell the guy's name correctly.

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Response to ZZenith (Reply #50)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 07:53 PM

58. I'm very sorry that I spelled his name wrong. Will you forgive me?

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 04:38 PM

52. Pelosi's biggest challenge is deciding which spectacularly stupid Republican opening

to pursue and which to ignore. Its a daily challenge for her, because the R leadership is made up of ignorant, self-absorbed men who have no idea that everything they do and say can be easily turned around and used against them, at least when theyre up against Pelosi.

A lesser politician would grab at the low-hanging fruit. Pelosi isnt so compulsive. One need think back no further than to her comment that tRump would impeach himself.

She's one smart politician.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 04:53 PM

53. We are fortunate to have Speaker Pelosi as a leader of the Democratic Party

I really like how she is handling this issue and the fact that she has trump so upset

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 06:02 PM

54. k&r thanks n/t

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 07:23 PM

55. Okay. I can buy that to a point. The Republican noise machine will STILL

blame Pelosi for 'holding back,' though. You know they will, and as a result all those ignorant Trump supporters will STAY ignorant because that is how the financiers of the Republican party want them. Ignorant. Proudly stupid. Hate-filled. Racist. Under-educated. Poor. Working two jobs to make ends meet so they are too busy to engage in ANY politics at any level or even vote. In fear of each other and in fear of losing the little they have. That's how these oligarchs roll.

Check out George Carlin's routine about the American dream. True then, true now.

But the point you missed is a happy one: Pelosi is getting in Trump's head, big time. The idiot tweeted what, fifty-five times in one day? He's visibly going bonkers.

Here's Carlin:

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 07:30 PM

56. Dad and Son conversation:

Son (to self): Once I borrow Dad's car, me and my mates are gonna hoon around all night!

Son ( to dad): Can I borrow the car tonight? Just want to return some library books, honest, not going to do anything stupid.

Dad (to son): Judging from past experience, I don't trust you. You are probably going to pick up some mates and hoon around all night.

Son (to dad): No, honest, you can trust me!

Dad (to self): No I can't!

Dad (to son): prove I can trust you first!

Son looks perplexed.

STALEMATE!

<Names and situation changed to protect the guilty.>

I'm sure this sort of scenario has played out a few times in a few American homes, including the Pelosi household.
Nancy wasn't born yesterday.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Original post)

Sun Dec 29, 2019, 09:12 PM

60. McConnell admitted he's not a fair judge

 

He's determined to defend Donald Trump no matter what the facts are.

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