I LOST it with my doctor today.

[kag]

I'm fortunate to live in a very liberal/lefty/Democratic community. Both the town and county are very blue, politically speaking. The county to the south, however, are a bunch of gun-loving right wingers.

These are mountain communities, and we have only one doctor for twelve miles in any direction. He's a really good doctor, but he lives south of here, and is as Trump-loving as they get. I know that sounds contradictory (a good doctor who loves Trump), and it feels a bit surreal sometimes...like today.

I had to go by to pick up a prescription. I tend to not chat politics with him because he can be so maddening, but as I commented on the "strange times" we're in, he piped up with, "Well, Trump says it should only be two or three more weeks."

I lost it.

"Well, Trump is an idiot," I blurted.

I think it surprised him, because he stammered a little, "Well, yeah, he doesn't know about this stuff, so he has to rely on his experts."

"But he's NOT, Michael, that's the problem!" I was kind of feeling it. "He's saying stupid shit, and he's getting people killed!"

He quite literally mumbled something I couldn't hear, and I said my goodbyes and left.

I really don't like to make things awkward between him and me. He has been very good to my family, but for crying out loud! He's a fucking doctor, and he's still listening to the virus in chief for guidance!

Thanks for letting me vent.

[Phoenix61]

1. You would think as a doctor he would know

better. I swear people just don’t want this be what it is. They want things to be fine in a couple of weeks and are happy to agree when Twitler tells them it will be. I don’t blame you for getting annoyed with him.

[dchill]

45. "...people just don't want this be what it is."

That's it. That's it right there. But NONE of us want it to be what it is. But we know it IS what it is. And we're all afraid of what it's going to become.

[SammyWinstonJack]

48. That's it exactly. I sure wish it wasn't what it is. But as my Dad would say,

burying your head in the sand leaves your ass in the air to get kicked.

[Phoenix61]

49. I like your dad. nt

[rickyhall]

64. I'd find another doctor if possible because I won't use a doctor I can't trust.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

2. I worked with medical doctors at my university's...

... medical school years ago, helping to design and conduct statistical studies as a grad research assistant.

They all seemed to have above average skill at memorization, but I was not impressed by their ability to think logically (in general).

[gibraltar72]

6. Ben Carson for example.

[Buckeye_Democrat]

12. Yep.

I majored in math and physics, so I was a bit spoiled by their company at the time.

The medical professors, doctors and students were a joy compared to my recent factory coworkers.

[jrthin]

55. Ron Paul, another example. Unfortunately, we imbue

doctors and the like with wide knowledge and skill sets they do not have. Doctors and other professionals are trained in a certain skill sets. They maybe highly skilled in "that" particular training but those skills aren't necessarily transferrable to other areas of life or training; i.e, logical thinking, critical thinking, philosophy, etc.

[monmouth4]

59. Was just going to say that. It explains a lot..n/t

[demigoddess]

15. that is the kind of learners that I call regurgitators.

they memorize and throw it back to you but do not think very deeply, if at all. My son asked to be let out of a gifted class once because it was nothing but regurgitators and a bad teacher. He had a lot more fun in a class with a teacher who "teaches you how to think".

[Ilsa]

21. That's sad. I'd take a

Dr. House type of doctor with great critical thinking skills any day over these drs who memorize stuff.

[Poiuyt]

70. I was a chemistry major and used to tutor pre-meds

They didn't care about learning, just getting their A so they could get into med school. They didn't exactly instill confidence in the medical community.

I don't want to say that all doctors are that way. I've known some who were kind, caring, and brilliant.

[RVN VET71]

77. On the plus side

Last visit I had with my doctor we spent a good 20 minutes -- after the medical stuff -- talking about what a moron we have for a president. Doc really got emotional -- no tears and shouting, but the situation with the current orange faced are in the WH was clearly something that troubles him very deeply.

Maybe the last of the old times doctor: well read, caring, and thoughtful.

[LuvNewcastle]

82. I've noticed that a LOT of doctors are RWers.

You can often tell by the magazines in the waiting room and the tv choices. I saw a doctor a couple of times who had magazines from the John Birch Society and other ultra-conservative rags, especially economics magazines. He was what I call a 'cattle call' doctor, bringing people in and herding them through, spending about 10 minutes with each patient, so I didn't stick with him for long. A lot of them have Fox News or OAN blaring in the waiting room.

Then there are some who make comments about politics, totally unsolicited. I guess they think because I'm a white male in the South that I agree with their boneheaded bullshit. I've come to realize that doctors' opinions about most things are no more valuable than a guy who works at a shipyard. You'd think that they would be more liberal since they take care of people's needs, but it seems that most of them are just worried about how much they're allowed to keep after taxes. They're mostly in it for the money, and doing any good for other people is rather coincidental. Nurses, on the other hand, seem to be generally more caring and down-to earth.

[Ohiogal]

3. Did he take your blood pressure

Before or after your conversation? I’ll bet there would have been a big difference!

It’s upsetting that those who should know better believe whatever that asshole has to say. It’s just unexplainable.

[Aristus]

4. An age-old medical profession truism:

Somebody has to graduate last in their medical school class.

[kag]

5. That's a good one.

What surprises me is that he can be so good at medicine sometimes.

He diagnosed my daughter's very rare kidney disorder almost immediately. It's a diagnosis that other docs I've spoken to have never even heard of.

However, my daughter is now 21, and has her own nephrologist. She refuses to see Michael anymore. She recognizes that he probably saved her kidneys, but she hates him. I can't really argue with her.

[Aristus]

10. I had to pull hospital call during my clinical rotations with a right-wing doctor.

Nice guy. Friendly enough. Because we were on call, we had a lot of down time throughout the night. He found out my interest in history, and we had a long talk about the Nazis and World War II. He kept trying, subtly, to steer me toward an acknowledgement that the concentration camps and death camps were either a hoax or morally justified.

!

It was a long night...

[kag]

11. Yikes.

I'm not sure even Michael would go there. But I don't want to find out.

[smirkymonkey]

18. OMG! How could you tolerate him?

How could any educated, remotely decent person think that way? I would not have been able to stay in the same room with him.

[Aristus]

20. To get a good report sent to my hospitalist preceptor.

I at least managed to tell him that the first reports of the death camps were actually considered hoaxes, because no one could quite believe the horror of what was noted in the reports.

The subsequent newsreel footage of the liberated camps put an end to that round of 'hoax' accusations. He kind of nodded and didn't say anything else.

We got a call that we responded to, after which, I crashed in the on-call bedroom until my shift ended. I wasn't going to do that again...

[The Wizard]

29. There's a big difference

between educated and trained. The word education goes back to the ancient Greeks meaning to open the mind. Minds like parachutes work best when opened. Cardinal Newman's treatise "The Idea of a University" puts it all in perspective. Conceptional learning and rote learning are not even close when it comes to critical thinking skills.

[smirkymonkey]

33. True, I agree.

Still, you would think anyone who has been through at least four years of college would have developed at least enough critical thinking skills to realize that the Holocaust was not a hoax or in anyway justified.

But I guess not. I have become very disillusioned over these past three years. It amazes me how many seemingly "intelligent, educated" people have the views and opinions of Neanderthals.

[burrowowl]

50. Yes and analytical thinking hasn't been in vogue for a long time

[Ilsa]

24. Yeah, and all of those nazis concentration camp monsters escaped to

South America because they wanted a change of scenery!

[dchill]

47. "...either a hoax or morally justified."

Those two crap theories cannot fit together in any kind of logic.

[Aristus]

67. Yeah, that's what pissed me off.

Those options were the only two he would consider, so he was trying to force me to acknowledge either the one or the other.

[paleotn]

60. Too bad my dad isn't around anymore....

He could set the young doc straight in record time. Dad was one of the most happy go lucky people I've ever known, except when it came to nazis and the holocaust. Holocaust denial and nazis in Skokie ILL turned him white hot with anger. He saw Buchenwald hours after it was liberated. I cannot even imagine the horrors that young 20 something saw and he never talked about it much until he was very old. I guess the evil was so far away by that time he could open up just a bit. He did say that the lives of those SS SOBs weren't worth a plug nickle after that day. In April of '45 they sometimes just didn't take prisoners. He wasn't proud of the reprisals and there were a few when officers weren't around. Though he wasn't ashamed at all about the SS sniper they cornered in a barn. The war was damn near over....and everybody knew it...so he got what was coming to him. It did bring home for a young Tennessee farm boy exactly why they were there. My uncle was further south and saw Dachau. Neither were particularly "German friendly" for the entirety of their lives.

[LiberalFighter]

26. Never heard that before. And it being specific to medical school class.

[Vinnie From Indy]

28. You know what you call the person that graduates last in their medical school class?

Doctor!

[Aristus]

30. Yeah, but everybody else in the class knows who it is, and they are not impressed.

n/t

[jcgoldie]

39. What do they call the guy with the D average???

DOCTOR!

[BigDemVoter]

7. Goddamn.

I loathe republicans to a point now that I simply could NOT see a repig physician. I don't care if I had to drive 6 hours to see someone else. That may not be possible for you, but I just could NOT stand it.

[kag]

9. I won't see him for some things.

I have my own gyn in the nearest city, and my husband and I both have cardiologists, and some other stuff, but he's been our family doc since he took over the practice from the previous docs. Mostly we avoid talking politics with him, and can get by okay, but there are those moments that make me want to scream.

[The Wielding Truth]

8. There are many good doctors who were morally and politically ignorant. You got one.

[DENVERPOPS]

37. I have always

wanted to see a survey of how many Dr.'s are Repugs, and how many are Dems

I am extremely careful in saying anything around anyone these days.

I was talking to a Dr. years ago, he rolled off his admiration for what were basically all the talking points of Gore, and then said, "and that is why I'm voting for Bush he believes in all these things". I nearly burst out laughing......

At another dinner engagement I attended, there was one of the smartest and richest Dr's in America. It was early 2000 and he was ranting to everyone how if we voted for Gore, it was certain to be the end of Democracy in America......

I have been flabbergasted at the college educated people that are lock stock and barrel committed TrumpHumpers or are die hard republicans before him.......

When they try and engage me, I just tell them I think that ALL politicians are corrupt. They all, without exception, let me off with that by saying they agree, with no further divisive conversation.......

I have walked away, from those discussions for twenty years, (actually forty years, since the first month of Reagan) thinking: Oh.....My.....God,..... (and I am not the least bit religious.....) LOL

[Initech]

13. The even scarier thing is that the "experts" that he surrounds himself with...

Are only there to kiss his fat ass. Kind of like how televangelists surround themselves with guys who yell "amen" and "praise god" at everything he says. At least Dr. Fauci is being the adult in the room, but who knows how long before Trump fires him?

[WyattKansas]

14. That is the only way to change their views of tRUMP, epecially with his campaign tv rallies blocking

Real CDC advice, Health and Human Services advice, and the Federal Government implementing it's ability to rapidly mitigate shortages, the spread of the virus, and support for American Citizens.

Instead, tRUMP is only whining about Corporations and Wall Street being damaged as he tells all others to fend for themselves.

The only way to decimate his 40% base is to unload the truth and facts about their Dear Leader in action on them, making them feel like idiots still supporting the imbecile. Once a few of them snap out of their tRUMP alternate reality, they will create doubt in others continuing to support tRUMP. Eventually, this is going to spread to have a negative effect on the rest of them as well, so those remaining won't be able to hide their heads in the ass cheeks of Faux Newz without serious doubts about donnie giving a damn about them.

[warmfeet]

16. The world inches a bit more liberal each day.

Not fast enough for me, but I will take it.

[AlexSFCA]

17. I would change the doctor immediately

you cannot trust a trumper. You need a doctor you can trust. You don’t want a dumb dr.

[MLAA]

19. Maddening

I had to fire my dentist, he was a good dentist but an unrepentent trumpet therefore an awful human being. Found a good democratic one.

[smirkymonkey]

22. Your post made me feel very fortunate that I not only have access to a wide selection of

excellent physicians, but most of them are also liberal.

And almost all my doctors are women, with the exception of an orthopaedic surgeon (which is very occasional - when I break something or have structural issues) and a podiatrist (who I am planning to replace, because he's just not very good - almost clueless).

I don't think I could ever even let a right-winger touch my body. I couldn't go to someone I didn't trust.

[Baclava]

23. Damn, I hope you don't start political arguments with your dentist, sharp instruments, lol

[kag]

27. My dentist is amazing.

I don't know his politics, but my hygienist is also terrific, and a good Dem, so I have hopes for the dentist.

But I will heed your warning about sharp instruments.

[Beringia]

25. I worked in a dental school and at a hospital near Chicago

I think many of the doctors were not socially conscious at all. A few were narcissistic types, elitists. I doubt many of them would answer that they went into the medical or dental profession because they wanted to help people. I think it was an economic choice for many.

There were a few at the dental school who I would say had social consciences, but they were pretty rare.

[Old Curler]

35. Amen!

Well stated. It was a sad day in history when economics became more important than ethics in medicine. Do they even take a hippocratic oath?

[appalachiablue]

40. Got it, country club Republican doctors, business people and

professionals have been standard for years and years. Their hard conservative values and views don't change.

Why do so many Democrats and people on the left think the stereotypical far right person only looks and acts like this?

Satire and comedy from Brent Terhune, in the business since he was 16.

[DonaldsRump]

31. I had a similar conversation about an hour ago

I could not believe my friend, who I have known for 20 years, say that he was willing to risk old people to disease if it would allow us to return to a better quality of life economically. He spouted every piece of Fox News that you could imagine.

I went to town on him for 20 minutes, explaining how Trump FUBARed this, and that it didn't have to be this bad if the Idiot in the White House had done the things BHO had done. Yes, people were going to die, but not in the numbers that will happen because of Trump's failures, and the economy didn't have to abysmally tank if Trump were competent. Sacrificing "old people" to help Donald Trump gaslight us is insane. After this 20 minute passionate monologue by me, my friend changed his mind.

Trump's failures are so awesome that, if you have the inclination, there are SOME (not a lot, I guess) that can be persuaded. Just be passionate about it.

Or, just be passionate to GOTV on November 3 to get rid of this mofo.

[C Moon]

34. Good work!

[appalachiablue]

42. Terrific accomplishment but how many far rt. people never encounter

others that explain the truth or don't heed warnings? Scary. Maybe it's me, I have a couple that I've given facts and counter balance truths to and they won't budge. Without a doubt there are serious problems in the country.

[DonaldsRump]

43. I totally agree

My friend is someone with whom I literally trusted my life to 2 decades ago. I lost touch with him for 15 years, but reconnected about 5 years ago.

I was stunned at how much, hook/line/sinker, he had fallen for Fox News/Trump BS. However, what heartened me was than he folded in about 20 minutes about the "Trump Virus" when I assailed him with the indisputable facts.

We are surely on the precipice.

[ooky]

61. Not surprised. Fox News spent all day pushing this same talking point.

I tuned in to see what was going on with the "Trump virtual town hall" and then left it on the same channel in the background for a while. They went into full propaganda mode shovel feeding this shit to their viewers. Your friend was probably coming straight from this brainwashing session.

[BlueIdaho]

32. I would never trust a Dr. that was a Trump Supporter.

Sorry - but I could never trust his judgement.

[catsudon]

36. the country is divided

i would not be surprised if 1/2 of the doctors are conservative

[Joinfortmill]

38. It's mind boggling

And I haven't heard a theory yet that makes much sense about why folks still like him. But, I suspect it comes down to some selfish idea they hold, even docs.

[Duppers]

44. That's it: they are selfish people.

Have a neighbor, a retired dentist, the same way. Arrogant know-it-all too. Talks market, as if his 401k is the only one in the world. Can't tell him a damn thing about anything! My hubby lost it on him a couple of nights ago - he made me proud.

[not fooled]

63. Many of them are terrified of "Socialist Medicine"

they see their fat incomes endangered. Hence republicans.

[yellowdogintexas]

83. Oh yes. In my Medicare claims processing days I got a full load of that

we had this one doctor from down near Chattanooga who absolutely hated Medicare and the whole idea of it. He saw it as the beginning of communism! If we requested additional information to complete a claim his response was a terse note with an American flag as the letterhead in which he refused to comly with our socialist program. The patients had to get the information and send it to us.

Also he would hold all of the group's claims until the last minute before they reached the final filing date. He brought them up to our office in Nashville in huge boxes, delivered them himself just so he could excercise some more nastiness. It was usually about 5 or 6 large boxes - copy paper size maybe? It was a big medical group too.
We wouldn't receive another claim from that group until the last filing date for the next year

Miserable, petty little man

[KY_EnviroGuy]

41. Perhaps you could invite him to crawl out of the right-wing bubble.

He's likely not listening to anything outside of Rethug propaganda, especially with a doctor's limited time.

As a scientist, he should be open to other avenues of information, so maybe you could offer some suggestions for alternate media.

I agree, I wouldn't want to spoil a good relationship with a decent doctor. Politics be damned in that regard.

Just a thought.........

[kag]

51. Thanks, KY_EnviroGuy.

I was a little surprised that he seemed a little more sheepish than normal about quoting Trump, so there might be hope, but he's not a young guy, and his family is kind of evangelical. I will continue to nudge, but not expect too much. He's actually a pretty nice guy, and a very good doctor. Just wrong-headed about the rest of the world.

[magicarpet]

57. "VIRUS IN Chief"...

Do you have a copyright on that ?

I want to borrow it.

[bucolic_frolic]

46. I once got a lecture from a doctor

that Reagan was right that trees cause pollution, and a promo for nuclear power. It was a standing joke between friends and I that only Republicans got real medicine in this town.

[samnsara]

52. he should know better...

[TomSlick]

53. In my experience, many doctors (and lawyers) are incompetent outside their profession.

I have been amazed through the years with doctors in my law office as a result of really bad business decisions. Then again, lawyers are notorious for taking better care of their client's affairs than their own.

Really good doctors and lawyers are almost as capable of general idiocy as the rest of the population. Some doctors and lawyers who have done well financially are often Republicans as part of the "I got mine" syndrome.

[AdamGG]

54. At least you can still see your doctor now

I work at a hospital in Boston and all outpatient appointments have been suspended except for emergencies and switched to phone or video (via Zoom) appointments. The Mass. governor has issued an order that insurance companies have to pay for the virtual visits as if they were in person.

[Evolve Dammit]

56. Q) What do you call the guy that graduated last in their class in Med School?

A) Doctor

I have walked out of at least two Dr's offices that I can recall, both for aggressive, loutish, demeaning, arrogant behavior. As a paying customer, ie. "patient", sometimes you have to self-advocate and know when to walk.

[BadGimp]

58. Virus in Chief

solid reference!

I added it to my AltTrumpNames.com listicle - rec #202

Well Played kag!

[MisterProton]

62. From what he said, it sounds like he was referring to work stoppage - not the virus itself.

If those were his exact words, then those statements could be seen as not making any judgments on Trump's actions - good or bad. You probably caught him off guard if you took it differently than what he may have intended. He may indeed like Trump, but may not have intended to praise him in that moment. I usually try to give people the benefit of a doubt where can.

[RhodeIslandOne]

65. Fuck him

[marble falls]

66. Doctors are like anyone else, they walk on water one step at a time ...

[Webrider]

68. Professionals Should Know Better

Professionals should know better than to discuss politics and religion with their customers and patients. Not being able to get away from all the anger and divisions, even when paying to have professional services done, is only increasing the anger and divisions.

[Meowmee]

69. You did the right thing

He needs to wake up to reality. Just because someone is a doc does not make them smart or a genius.

[Cha]

71. Good on you, kag! I know that must have

been hard.. especially after the burst of the moment is over, and it's your Dr that you respect as your Doctor.

StaySafe

[kag]

79. Thanks, Cha.

You always seem to know the right thing to say to people, and you nailed it this time.

I do respect him as my doctor and even, sometimes, my friend. He's not a bad guy but I have a hard time understanding his politics. I think we'll be okay as doctor/patient. We just need to be more careful about steering the conversation away from current events.

Thanks for your perspective.

[subana]

72. I remember people said something similar about W

that he had to rely on advisors. Yesterday while talking to Joe Biden, Nicolle Wallace (who used to work in W's administration) said it is normal for presidents during a crisis to consult with former presidents. She said trump was asked on sunday if he had spoken to former presidents about this crisis. Disappointingly but not surprising donnie said, "no, because there's nothing they can teach me"! Nothing? Really? How about a historical perspective at least!

What I want to know is when did this country decide it was a good idea to choose a dummy to try to lead the country? Why should our leader rely so completely on the opinions of his advisors, without any experience or intelligence of his own?

JFK had advisors too. Some tried to arrange conditions that would make war the only option during the Cuban missile crisis but he could see what they were trying to do & fought against it. JFK was also a smart man who had an intellectual curiosity. He enjoyed reading about history & political leaders. This is one reason why it's such a good thing to have a President who reads! Because anyone who reads knows that he doesn't know everything & he wants to know more about things he hasn't yet learned!

To have a medical professional offer the excuse that the president has to rely on his advisors is a really feeble excuse! A professional man should know better!! If he were my doctor, I would be tempted to seek other opinions!

[sellitman]

73. Virus in chief

Yes I'm going to steal that. I've been calling him the orange anus but virus in Chief is much better. Sorry you had to deal with an idiot like that. I have one at work that I just refuse to talk to politically. At this point if they still support that piece of human excrement then I doubt what I could tell them would change their mind. The argument would just raise my blood pressure. I'm stressed out enough as it is. They are just not worth it.

[Trueblue Texan]

74. And he's parroting that dangerous stuff to patients...

EXTREMELY irresponsible!

[N_E_1 for Tennis]

75. Good for you...

Truth must be told

[Doodley]

76. Sounds like the doctor was being sarcastic.

[Generic Other]

78. The mumbling means he knows you are right

Just can't get the words out yet. Corona cat's got his tongue.

[Nitram]

80. I admire your tact. I'm afraid I might have been quite a bit more rude in that situation.

If a doctor took Trump's statement of 2 or 3 more weeks as fact, that would really worry me.

[BobTheSubgenius]

81. I swear, someone should be taking names.

Living in Canada, and a pretty liberal part of it, as well, I don't have to encounter too many MAGAts, and the two I know personally, although not at all well, I avoid the subject on the rare times I see them. In fact, I avoid them, not just their views.