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scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:44 PM May 2020

Please, PLEASE read this about the Mpls. protests - from Minnesota Public Radio!

I've seen too much misunderstanding and off-the-wall speculation about the whole "outside agitator" stuff in Minneapolis and St. Paul going around DU, that I really hope DUers will take the time to read this piece.

As a Minnesota resident who has been continuously glued to all the local TV coverage since Friday, as well as monitoring local Twitter feeds directly from the communities involved, this article is the most accurate accounting of the "outside agitator" phenomenon that I've come across, so far:

https://www.mprnews.org/story/2020/05/30/outsiders-extremists-are-among-those-fomenting-violence-in-twin-cities
The killing of George Floyd
Outsiders, extremists are among those fomenting violence in Twin Cities
Jon Collins and Elizabeth Shockman
May 30, 2020 3:17 p.m.
Updated: 8:34 a.m., May 31, 2020

On his way home from a protest Friday night in Minneapolis, Jonathan Turner Bargen encountered a white man in a red pickup truck. The man was carrying an assault rifle and a handgun, Turner Bargen said. Then he noticed a symbol from the far-right militia group Three Percenters affixed to the truck.

“I circled back and took pictures of the vehicle. I was concerned about why they were present at the downtown protest, and had no idea who to notify,” said Turner Bargen in an email to MPR News.

<snip>

Accounts of armed men

Protesters and onlookers have posted numerous videos and accounts of confrontations with white men on social media, sometimes including symbols associated with fringe groups that originated online.

Many people have also told MPR News reporters of witnessing armed men in Minneapolis.

Bridget Schumann was out for a run near Calhoun Square in south Minneapolis on Friday night when she saw a truck that was being driven aggressively, honking and intimidating other drivers. The truck had a big white sticker on the back of the cab with the OK sign symbol associated with white supremacists.

“There were two men in the driver and passenger seat and they were wearing camo bulletproof vests and they were armed,” she said.

<snip>

In the predawn hours of Friday, KJ Starr watched from her yard in the Seward neighborhood, which has been especially hard hit by arson, as nearby buildings were consumed by balls of fire and billowing smoke.

With police and firefighters nowhere in sight, Starr and friends have been trying to fight fires themselves. When a nearby pizza shop went up in flames, she and some friends walked over to see what they could do. She was terrified by what she saw.

“This pickup truck of a dozen armed men just pulls up next to us,” she said. “I just did a total pivot.”

Arson at a liquor store

Minneapolis resident Rishi Ragoonanan woke up early for work on Friday morning, and saw a man who appeared to be white walk up to boxes of cardboard in the middle of a liquor store parking lot. The man lit the boxes, pushed them up against the wall of the store, and walked away.

Ragoonanan and neighbors ran outside and dragged the flaming boxes away from the wall. The liquor store was set on fire again the next night.

“None of us got any sleep for the last four days, trying to save this liquor store,” Ragoonanan said. “If this liquor catches fire, this whole neighborhood will burn down.”

Many people say they are leery of confronting those they suspect of contributing to the violence.

<snip>

‘They’re setting these fires’

People attending protests against police brutality have had run-ins as well.

DeVario Bogenholm, a 23-year-old who’s lived in Minneapolis for most of his life, blames outsiders, who are mostly white, for turning peaceful protests violent Friday night. He turned to Facebook to post a video of him and a friend confronting a group of young, white men who were smashing out storefront windows.

“Who’s destroying these buildings? These white dudes and we’re stopping them,” his friend, Noah Saba, said to the camera, then waved the phone to show footage of a group of white men on bicycles in front of a group of vandalized and burning buildings, “They’re setting these fires.”

...Bogenholm said the video doesn’t fully capture the mob, with people of color largely at the back of the crowd and young white men initiating the damage to buildings.

<snip>

Hundreds of buildings across the Twin Cities have been damaged in the riots. A native youth cultural center, neighborhood bars and a building full of artist studios (my bold) are among the structures that have been set on fire.

Minneapolis City Council member Jeremiah Ellison spent Friday night driving around his ward to ensure people stayed safe. He said property destruction at protests, which he doesn’t support, normally is focused on symbols of power like police cars.

“When you see no protest, there’s no mob sweeping through the north side, yet you see these fires popping up the main business corridor, that’s the thing that rang odd to me,” Ellison said. “Burning down small black- and immigrant-owned businesses, that doesn’t seem in lockstep with the tone of the protests.”

<snip>

Alexia Kelsey went out to the protest site Friday to help clean. She said the hair on the back of her neck rose after she saw a vehicle carrying two armed white men that had a bumper sticker associated with neo-Nazis.

“As a white ally, it’s even more important to support the black community and provide a unified front,” Kelsey said. “It’s tough because it seems like they’re using the opportunity of the cover of night to really ignite the violence.”

<snip>

“This is no longer about protesting,” said {Minneapolis Mayor, Jacob} Frey. “This is no longer about verbal expression. This is about violence, and we need to make sure that it stops.”

{St. Paul Mayor, Melvin} Carter said that the outside agitators are using peaceful protesters as a “human shield,” committing acts of destruction and violence and then melting back into the crowd.

{Minnesota Governor, Tim} Walz urged Minnesotans to abide by curfews.

“If you’re out after 8 o’clock, you are aiding and abetting them and you are giving them the cover that they want,” Walz said.


Please go to the link to read the whole article! Thank you.
56 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Please, PLEASE read this about the Mpls. protests - from Minnesota Public Radio! (Original Post) scarletwoman May 2020 OP
So, we are terrorists now, ya know. Jamastiene May 2020 #1
Trump can go take a flying leap. (nt) scarletwoman May 2020 #3
What do you do when you are not welcome in your own country any more, Jamastiene May 2020 #9
It's been fucked for over 400 years. scarletwoman May 2020 #13
Yes this. AllyCat May 2020 #43
We are terrorists just as warmfeet May 2020 #48
Strong evidence that orders came from the top Generic Other May 2020 #2
Sorry, but I think that's conspiracy theory nonsense. scarletwoman May 2020 #5
I guess I meant they were encouraged from the top Generic Other May 2020 #11
I heard it too KT2000 May 2020 #17
This was AFTER the destructive shit had already gone on for 2 nights. scarletwoman May 2020 #19
This is an interesting post on Twitter Generic Other May 2020 #51
Remember Michael Cohen, trump doesn't give orders, he speaks in code Walleye May 2020 #16
Agreed Mercurian May 2020 #27
Exactly! You nailed it. wnylib May 2020 #30
So saying MAGANIGHT was just coincidence? Perhaps, but it was a LOUD signal. cayugafalls May 2020 #31
What Trump wants is a good excuse Kaiserguy May 2020 #49
I would expect to see many phone videos showing this. SharonClark May 2020 #4
I embedded one phone link in my OP, but didn't want to take the time to chase down more. scarletwoman May 2020 #12
I've seen four phone videos of white guys destroying while black people try to stop them. tblue37 May 2020 #18
Thank you! My ancient laptop won't play Twitter videos, so - although I can see they exist, scarletwoman May 2020 #20
Why Haven't These Videos been on National Media? MuchBetterThanThis May 2020 #26
I think it's a combo of complicit media outlets, intheflow May 2020 #53
Thanks for posting...info has been hazy. Karadeniz May 2020 #6
I've seen a few similar reports on my Nextdoor news feed. The Velveteen Ocelot May 2020 #7
Thank you! I'm up in Sandstone, MN, so I'm definitely removed from the action. scarletwoman May 2020 #21
Aww, you're missing all the fun! The Velveteen Ocelot May 2020 #22
I know, I know. scarletwoman May 2020 #23
A lot of RW playing at helter-skelter Maeve May 2020 #8
Without video of incidents nothing will happen randr May 2020 #10
Lots of videos showing black clad white men smashing windows Generic Other May 2020 #14
There are videos but they're kind of scattered around in Twitter & Facebook. scarletwoman May 2020 #15
This isn't about Americans protesting anymore. It's about insurgents hijacking America's narrative ancianita May 2020 #24
Well said! scarletwoman May 2020 #25
Spot on! 4chan and Deep Web.... the Insurgents have to be cheering and coordinating... JustFiveMoreMinutes May 2020 #32
I know someone who can do all that. But he says they're a bunch of losers. ancianita May 2020 #38
That is exactly right. But Trump has also been hijacking America's narrative for 3.5 years. cayugafalls May 2020 #34
Not hijacking. TRYING to hijack. We can see how that's been working out. ancianita May 2020 #39
I'll try. I am just so worried. cayugafalls May 2020 #42
It's good to be afraid. It's smart to be vigilant. You save democracy that way. ancianita May 2020 #46
Why did cops let the looting and burning happen? SunSeeker May 2020 #28
For two whole nights they were virtually non-existent. cayugafalls May 2020 #33
Every mayor and police chief should be surveyed on these questions. We can get to the bottom of this ancianita May 2020 #40
I admire your optimism. cayugafalls May 2020 #45
It's doing that alleviates fear. Journalists, the FBI, and other orgs can data collect. It's doable. ancianita May 2020 #47
Thanks for posting this. Alex4Martinez May 2020 #41
Media not showing these white guys, you gotta go on Twitter to see the truth. Plenty there. BamaRefugee May 2020 #29
When we take back this country from these hateful people, BadgerMom May 2020 #35
Amen to that! (nt) scarletwoman May 2020 #36
+1 llmart May 2020 #37
We have to rebuild the DoJ; it's now Dirty Billy Barr's Dirt Services. Hermit-The-Prog May 2020 #44
one possibility Normanart May 2020 #50
Bookmarking- MPR News piece liberalla May 2020 #52
THANK YOU!! ladym55 May 2020 #54
The pro-Trump KKK at work Blue Owl May 2020 #55
Thanks for posting this, scarletwoman. Keeping it kicked! crickets May 2020 #56

Jamastiene

(38,187 posts)
1. So, we are terrorists now, ya know.
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:47 PM
May 2020

Trump just made it so anyone who is "antifa," which means anti-fascism, which was what America was in WWII, is a terrorist. That means either march in lockstep with the Nazis and the KKK or you are a terrorist and not an American any more and you have no rights. Remember Gitmo?

So, the right wing racist groups are angels and we are all terrorists now. That's basically the new normal. I get it.

Jamastiene

(38,187 posts)
9. What do you do when you are not welcome in your own country any more,
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:52 PM
May 2020

simply for being against racist lynchings of black people and anti-fascism?

This is fucked. Watch Europe. This is going to be hideous. We have GOT to get rid of that fucker in November.

warmfeet

(3,321 posts)
48. We are terrorists just as
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:27 PM
May 2020

the founders of this country were terrorists. I have no problem with that. I am against fascism - always will be. I am against authoritarianism - always will be.

I am for life - always will be!

Antifa is being used as a scape goat, as I am sure everyone here knows.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
5. Sorry, but I think that's conspiracy theory nonsense.
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:51 PM
May 2020

These white armed right wingers don't need 'orders from the top', they are self-motivated.

Generic Other

(28,979 posts)
11. I guess I meant they were encouraged from the top
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:55 PM
May 2020

Instigated by Trump. Not a conspiracy theory. I heard him encourage MAGAs and others.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
19. This was AFTER the destructive shit had already gone on for 2 nights.
Sun May 31, 2020, 05:26 PM
May 2020

I don't the timeline of his tweets relative to the Mpls. protests matches up.

Mercurian

(48 posts)
27. Agreed
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:14 PM
May 2020

It's a wag the dog situation. The Beer-belly Brigades are causing random destruction, hoping the protestors will be blamed. Their goal is that Dear Leader will use the chaos they've created as an excuse to give them the race war they crave.

cayugafalls

(5,639 posts)
31. So saying MAGANIGHT was just coincidence? Perhaps, but it was a LOUD signal.
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:35 PM
May 2020

Things got really out of hand after he tweeted that phrase. It seriously escalated all over the country.

Cops in New York on video throwing the hand sign, lots more out of state vehicles and white supremacists causing trouble.

The left has been demonized and discredited. We are now labeled as terrorists. I guarantee Talk Radio will be all over that talking point Monday and calling for the arrest of anyone who is Anti fascist or protesting this government.

God save the Republic.

Kaiserguy

(740 posts)
49. What Trump wants is a good excuse
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:29 PM
May 2020

to declare marital law. He think that by doing that he can postpone the election and make himself dictator for life.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
12. I embedded one phone link in my OP, but didn't want to take the time to chase down more.
Sun May 31, 2020, 04:55 PM
May 2020

People have been sending their phone videos to MPR or posting to Facebook and Twitter.

tblue37

(65,227 posts)
18. I've seen four phone videos of white guys destroying while black people try to stop them.
Sun May 31, 2020, 05:21 PM
May 2020

One is the guy with the gas mask and umbrella and the black person in a pink shirt chasing him away and following him. One is a group of white guys breaking windows while a black woman yells at them to stop. One is a group of white guys starting to break windows, but a group of black protesters chase them away. One is a group of white guys vandalizing cars in a parking lot.

If I have already seen 4 such videos, I bet there are more that I haven't seen.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
20. Thank you! My ancient laptop won't play Twitter videos, so - although I can see they exist,
Sun May 31, 2020, 05:32 PM
May 2020

I can't play them, unfortunately.

26. Why Haven't These Videos been on National Media?
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:10 PM
May 2020

I saw the guy with the umbrella on here and it seemed to be a hot topic. But nobodys following up it seems.. Was it debunked?

intheflow

(28,443 posts)
53. I think it's a combo of complicit media outlets,
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:52 PM
May 2020

too much happening at once, and a endlessly awful desire of white people wanting to deflect blame/ignore the serial killers in their own home.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,603 posts)
22. Aww, you're missing all the fun!
Sun May 31, 2020, 05:48 PM
May 2020


"May you live in interesting times," they said. Could I please be bored for a change?

Generic Other

(28,979 posts)
14. Lots of videos showing black clad white men smashing windows
Sun May 31, 2020, 05:01 PM
May 2020

Often with black bystanders yelling at them to stop.

scarletwoman

(31,893 posts)
15. There are videos but they're kind of scattered around in Twitter & Facebook.
Sun May 31, 2020, 05:04 PM
May 2020

I would also mention that from this morning's MN Governor press conference, the authorities are well aware of the armed instigators.

ancianita

(35,933 posts)
24. This isn't about Americans protesting anymore. It's about insurgents hijacking America's narrative
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:06 PM
May 2020

and expecting media to amplify it.

Good post from MN Public Radio. Thank you!

JustFiveMoreMinutes

(2,133 posts)
32. Spot on! 4chan and Deep Web.... the Insurgents have to be cheering and coordinating...
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:38 PM
May 2020

I don't know about either of them... I'm fine with the info I get and have no clandestine activities that I need to hide......

Does Homeland Security, CIA, FBI, your neighbor kid down the street have means to infiltrate and decipher anything related to the insurgency?

(If not, wow... )

ancianita

(35,933 posts)
38. I know someone who can do all that. But he says they're a bunch of losers.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:01 PM
May 2020

Doesn't mean he doesn't keep an eye on them. Reddit's forums are easily accessible. But who'd want to enter the wild west of the dark net but techies, right?

Hate doesn't confer authority or legitimacy on the right. It's something they've never figured out, since they can bullshit so many people whose bodies got bigger but never grew up.

cayugafalls

(5,639 posts)
34. That is exactly right. But Trump has also been hijacking America's narrative for 3.5 years.
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:45 PM
May 2020

He has emboldened and given the far right nationalist movement the cover they needed. He has called them good people and dog whistled almost daily.

Trump has turned off the light and allowed the cockroaches to come out and destroy and wreak havoc.

ancianita

(35,933 posts)
39. Not hijacking. TRYING to hijack. We can see how that's been working out.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:03 PM
May 2020

The majority of Americans are polling negatively on all things Trump, that's how well he hijacks. Right?

WE run the lights up in here! Do not believe the doubt machine hype.

cayugafalls

(5,639 posts)
42. I'll try. I am just so worried.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:09 PM
May 2020

And afraid. I live with in Trump central and see it everyday. I have a mixed marriage and have experienced the fear and racism first hand. Having to flee in our car because racist chasing us in their pickup truck. Held my son's hand when he cries after being bullied and tormented.

We don't run the lights where I live...

I'll try and do better. Thank you.

ancianita

(35,933 posts)
46. It's good to be afraid. It's smart to be vigilant. You save democracy that way.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:16 PM
May 2020

What? You do better every single time you're here.

We're getting on top of this and having influence on governors and mayors. I hear you about the darkness all around. I'm in Trump central, too. But we've got the convenient covid excuse to mentally distance from each other until they can learn coherent, fact-based sentence construction.

Stay safe!

SunSeeker

(51,513 posts)
28. Why did cops let the looting and burning happen?
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:19 PM
May 2020

They should have been there marching WITH the protesters. This destruction would have never happened if they had done that.

This is how you do it:

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/05/31/genesee-county-sheriff-christopher-swanson-george-floyd-protesters/5299589002/

cayugafalls

(5,639 posts)
33. For two whole nights they were virtually non-existent.
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:40 PM
May 2020

They let it all happen.

It is a very good question. Why stand down for two days? Why let it all burn down before doing anything?

ancianita

(35,933 posts)
40. Every mayor and police chief should be surveyed on these questions. We can get to the bottom of this
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:04 PM
May 2020

ancianita

(35,933 posts)
47. It's doing that alleviates fear. Journalists, the FBI, and other orgs can data collect. It's doable.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:19 PM
May 2020

We can map the models, attitudes of police chiefs and their plans, to see what's worked.

It's a big country with a lot of unpredictable dynamics, but even that is instructive.

Alex4Martinez

(2,193 posts)
41. Thanks for posting this.
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:09 PM
May 2020

I saw it earlier, I know it's not representative of many community police forces but it represents what every force SHOULD be.

BadgerMom

(2,770 posts)
35. When we take back this country from these hateful people,
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:49 PM
May 2020

I hope every domestic terrorist group-every right wing, anti-government, white supremacist group-is identified and tracked by a revived DOJ. No whining from the hate-filled, greedy, ineffective group of traitors called the Republicans. I have NO fucks left to give.

llmart

(15,533 posts)
37. +1
Sun May 31, 2020, 06:58 PM
May 2020

Very well said!

The Democrats are going to have a lot of repairing of the damage the GOP has done to this country.

Normanart

(279 posts)
50. one possibility
Sun May 31, 2020, 07:33 PM
May 2020

The police are the ones committing the arson and property damage. The well situated network of first amendment auditors (people with good cameras who record the police) have positively identified at least one such police officer. Outside agitators have also been recorded doing the damage, while well armed. The peaceful protestors get the blame, while news reporters get gassed, sprayed, and arrested. This all seems a prelude to martial law.

ladym55

(2,577 posts)
54. THANK YOU!!
Sun May 31, 2020, 08:51 PM
May 2020

The information we are getting is so garbled at this point. I am not buying Donny and Billy's "Antifa" line, but that appears to be what M$M is pushing big time.

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