Mitt Romney, I'm not as smart as you, so let me see if I've got this correct

[louis c]

you are telling me that 47% (or 48% or 49%) of American households are dependent on the government because they pay no federal income taxes, therefore they consider themselves victims and are expecting health care, food and housing, at the government's expense. Also, you're not going to "worry about those people".

47% is quite a number, Mitt. Something like 160,000,000 or so.

That would mean a lot of people. Let's see, as I said, I'm not as smart as you, but that would mean all our wounded warriors who have come home with war related disabilities from WWII, Korea, Viet Nam, Iraq and Afghanistan. You remember those wars, your father supported WWII, but didn't fight it. You supported Viet Nam, but didn't fight it. You supported Iraq and Afghanistan, but none of your 5 boys fought there. So now that those who did fight for our country need our help either transitioning to a normal setting, or permanent help, due to a severe wound, you consider them free-loaders because they are part of the 47% that pay no federal income taxes. As I said, I'm not as smart as you, but maybe that's the explanation for your not mentioning the troops at the Republican Convention. I bet if one of your boys was there, you would have remembered.

Also, how about the tens of millions of Americans, like my Mother, who live on Social Security and Medicare. My Mom, and so many of her family and friends, pay no federal income taxes because their income is at or below the poverty line ($1,100 a month). They (or their spouse) worked their whole lives to have a meager Social Security benefit. Of course, she's also the widow of a WWII Veteran, so what the heck, let her find a job at 84 years old and with osteoporosis. After all, in the world according to Mitt, she's just a freeloader, too.

Kids in college on student loans, disabled Americans who need special care. Holy shit, I could go on and on.

Now, since I really am interested in the politics of all of this, could you tell me how this helps you in Florida, with the highest senior population in the United States, or Ohio, which is second or third. How about the veterans in Virginia, which has the highest veteran population in the country?

Since I know you are good at math, after all, you compiled a fortune, could you tell me how you get to 270 electoral votes by losing just one or two of these states (by the way, you're behind in all 3, before your brilliant statement went public)?

I just thought I'd ask, Mitt, because I'd like to know, because, as I've said, I'm just not as smart as you.

[louis c]

1. thanks for the Recs, but I'd like a reply

so I won't fall off the page.

This 47% thing should be aimed at the returning troops. After all, many of them pay no federal taxes, and shouldn't. Mitt Romney has no empathy for people who don't live like him or his family.

Seniors and Veterans is the way this should be explained. After all, you can't get to 47% without them.

[trumad]

2. Sometimes my DU friend...

The writers words are all that is needed.

[ReasonableToo]

5. All according to plan...

I'm not sure if they are really trying to win White House. Remember Christie said he was told its "not his time"? The R primaries were a sham. No legitimate candidates. Sorry - the only legitimate candidates were ignored and belittled by media.

They are getting all they want from Pres Obama so why change now? Putting up these non-candidates stops single-payer, privacy, justice and peace proponents from running a third candidate for fear of getting a R in the White House.

They're not stupid. They've been manipulating the system for many years and have evolved into a well-tuned machine who gets what they want. This is what they want.

[Skittles]

71. nice try

the truth is, repukes are shittting their pants

[ReasonableToo]

80. Clarify...

Oh, I'm not saying the video release is part of the plan - Romney as a non-candidate is part if plan. The video is a problem because it may affect down ticket races. Their plan is to take state houses and US Senate.

[Skittles]

86. again, nice try (well actually, it sucks)

you might find yourself more comfortable at the freak republic

[ReasonableToo]

88. More comfortable with...

I'd be more comfortable with the likes of Amy Goodman, Tavis Smiley, Cornel West and Michael Moore.

We know Rs would be a detriment to the world but that doesn't mean Pres. Obama is a knight in shining armor either. Eyes wide open.

Presidents still need pressure to do the right thing.

[ananda]

14. Good post! Also..

.. you can't anywhere near 47% who depend on the government and/or don't pay taxes
without those who took government bailouts and who park their money in tax havens...

... well, you know, people like Mitt Romney.

[tavalon]

15. Romney is a sociopath. Sociopaths are not able to feel empathy

Ergo, no empathy from Romney makes perfect sense. Having a sociopath running for President makes no sense. Having sociopaths in the White House as we did with Bush/Cheney is fucking scary.

I'm glad he got outed.

[drlindaphd]

54. Yes he is!

I am happy that someone else besides me has noticed this. I am a clinical psychologist with 25+ years of experience. I find it astounding that so few people are able to spot the power hungry sociopaths that run for office in this country. More and more of them are actually getting elected and we are suffering.

Romney is just one more in a long line and one of the worst I have seen in a while. Yes, Bush/Cheney are another pair.

Vote for President Obama, he is real and not a sociopath. He does feel empathy. Just watch him and listen to him. There is a real person in the White House right now.

When you hear politicians say they do not care about the country. When they say their first goal is to make President Obama a one term president regardless of what happens to us, these are sociopaths. This is the Republican leadership in congress. This is why they have blocked every effort of President Obama to move this country forward.

Sociopaths are not interested in governing or the welfare of the citizens of the United States. They are only interested in their own welfare and profit.

[tavalon]

72. I was raised by one

I can spot them easily, thank goodness, because I do everything I can to stay away from them.

[drlindaphd]

84. I feel for you

Fortunately sociopathy is not contagious. You did miss the bullet genetically, however. You are fortunate that you can see through the veneer of shallow likability. Romney's is very shallow, indeed. I am shocked that more people can not see through it.

[tavalon]

89. Yeah, sort of

I'm not a sociopath but the years of therapy and I'm about to go in for another round. Would that my father and his second wife had never shown up in my life.

[justiceischeap]

3. He didn't think this would get out

that's why he made the comments. Someone at that fundraiser screwed Mitt royally--that's how in disarray his party is at the moment.

You can guarantee that had he ever thought the public would see these comments, he wouldn't have made them.

[HughBeaumont]

30. Likely one of the wait staff, who make bupkis.

Don't blame them for wanting to expose Mitt for the complete fraud that he is.

[justiceischeap]

40. I don't think it was the wait staff

I think it was a "supporter". Let's keep in mind, Mitt is a hard sell even to many in the GOP. It's not out of the question that one of them, after his disastrous display of idiocy over Libya/Egypt, decided that maybe his campaign needed to be tanked.

[truebluegreen]

38. As noted elsewhere...

it was probably The Help.

[lunatica]

4. How much does Mitt pay in income taxes?

Or the people he was talking to in that tape?

We don't know. Now isn't that convenient?!

And how much of his money is invested in the USA? Why, not very much is it?

[hatrack]

6. Here's another thought . . . what if Rmoney pays no federal income tax? What is he, then?

I mean, why bother with all those shell corporations and Cayman Island banks if they don't reduce your tax liability?

Not only would it explain his boneheaded refusal to release his returns, but it would render him one of the 47%. Talk about two-for-one . . .

[reformist2]

7. Answer: Repugs may conclude they need to steal the election to "rescue" America.

[librechik]

42. I agree, but fortunately they can't steal unless the polls are very close

now they will do everything possible to "fix" the polls. However the courts are blocking them on the vote suppression strategy.

My intuition is they know they are beaten. This time.

They have four years to prepare the next attack.And Obama is not a factor. If the candidate is Hillary, we know what they will do. Is that enough time to prepare a response?

But we're Dems. We don't think it's war, like they do. We will just act surprised and hurt when it happens.

[alcibiades_mystery]

8. The Freepers' response is hilarious

Since many of them fall into this category, which would include the majority of seniors, those on disability, and others, they've come up with a fix: "Of course we know Romney wasn't talking about seniors, like us. He wasn't talking about veterans. He was talking about the leeches - those who can work but choose not to! Not us. Them!"

It's funny, of course, because if you limit the number to some imaginary "welfare" class, it never comes close to 47% (a huge, huge number of people). So, either Romney is desperately and shockingly wrong about the number of "pure leeches" by orders of magnitude - which utterly disqualifies him from serving as the nation's chief policy person - or he is, in fact, including just the kind of non-income-tax-payers that make up perhaps half of Free Republic's members (seniors, the unemployed, etc.).

It's hard to spin utter shit into gold, even for the delusional.

[reformist2]

9. But they will continue to use the 47% figure. They are complicit in the lie, and they know it.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

44. It's all framing the debate by language, and part of that means to fuzz meanings. nt

[queenjane]

16. All the Freepers I know defend their OWN benefits

Because they think they deserve them, but those "other people" are mooches & leeches upon society.

The stupid in this country makes me very, very tired.

[Curmudgeoness]

73. Your statement is completely accurate....

I work with a far right wingnut, also married to a far right wingnut....who is on permanent disability, and whose daughter is going to college with government grants, whose other daughter is on welfare, whose mother lives in subsidized housing because her SS is too low to live on. But they all deserve it. He is "really" disabled but all the other people are just scamming the system (and he really is disabled). They paid taxes when he was working so his daughter should get something for it by getting help with college so she can better herself, but the others with grants are lying to get them. The welfare daughter "isn't going to be on it for too long" and is just in a rough spot----as if others aren't in that same boat. And they all hate the mother and will not "take personal responsibility" for her because she is so nasty. Mom "qualifies" for the programs she is getting, so it isn't wrong....but everyone else there are just there because the kids hid the assets.

Give me a break. They have a million excuses in their minds to justify their actions. Un-f'ing-believable.

[B Calm]

77. Republicans = not us, them syndrome

[porphyrian]

10. I wonder how smart he is to hide his taxes. n/t

[tavalon]

13. Now there is a lose/lose

Put them out and let us find out he paid no taxes for certain years or don't put them out and have us assume the same. He's FUBAR.

[porphyrian]

17. We have a few more hurdles, such as a ton of money that will be dumped for his campaign soon...

but, mostly, yeah.

[Angry Dragon]

69. It is not about not paying taxes

The foreign accounts he holds laundered drug money and as someone else has said perhaps there are ties to terrorist groups

[VWolf]

46. OMG can you imagine ...

if he paid NO taxes??? Then he'd be part of "the 47%" he can't reach and has given up on.

[porphyrian]

47. That may be why he won't release them. Senator Reid seems to think so. n/t

[VWolf]

48. Yep. and then we'd have the delicious irony of

Rmoney doomed by his very own words.

[porphyrian]

49. I can't wait to find out. n/t

[louis c]

75. Show us your tax returns, Mitt

[tavalon]

11. Mitt committed Seppuku at that dinner

I'd been wondering what was trailing behind him all these months. I just thought he was Cthulhu. I didn't realize it was his intestines.

He wasn't talking to "you people", he was talking to his fellow millionaires and billionaires.

Last night, he lost the race.

[lapislzi]

41. Oh, no, no, no.

Seppuku is actually an honorable form of death. The act permits you to regain lost honor and face. A warrior who commits seppuku without dishonoring himself (showing pain, crying out), is respected.

This particular form of political suicide is far from honorable. But a lot more fun to watch.

[tavalon]

43. Point taken

He's not an honorable man.

[Auntie Bush]

52. What a difference in cultures!

In one...the disgraced or guilty gets his honor back for him and his family by killing himself. In another culture...The guilty party regains honor back for him and his family by killing his wife... or some innocent woman.
Have you ever heard of anything so backward?

[seabeyond]

12. hubby with a masters in math could quite add up obama having 48%

romney ignoring that 48% and gaining an illusionary 10% undecided for a win.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

18. The point about Romney is the 0.01 % who have already bought and sold *his* vote. nt

[MindPilot]

19. Troops in Iraq and Afghanistan are part of the 47% too.

Personnel serving in a combat zone do not pay any federal income tax.

In regards to determining taxable income, members of the military should remember that any income earned for services performed while in a combat zone is considered to be combat pay and is therefore not taxable and is not considered earned income. Combat pay is reported in Box 12 (code "Q&quot of Form W-2, Wage and Tax Statement (not Box 1). If you serve in a combat zone for any part of one or more days during a particular month, you are entitled to an exclusion of income for that entire month.

[louis c]

22. I love that one

[MindPilot]

23. I suspect a lot of folk unfamiliar with the military are unaware of that.

--so I made it an OP.

[Bandit]

25. I wonder when that came into being because it sure wasn't there when I was receiving

Hazardous Duty Pay That was what they called "Combat Pay" way back then..

[MindPilot]

55. It was in effect when I was in Vietnam

But hazardous duty pay and "combat pay" are two different things. You get hazardous duty pay based on the job, not your location; combat pay is simply your regular pay, except you are in a designated "combat zone".

For example, someone handling live ordnance on a carrier probably gets hazardous duty pay in addition to their regular pay as long as they are assigned to that job. Once that ship moves into the combat zone, everyone on board is exempt from paying federal taxes for that calendar month. At least that's how I understand it.

[Bandit]

82. My experience was different

When I was in Vietnam I received my regular pay grade plus Hazardous Duty Pay and Flight Pay and Rations Not Available Pay and Overseas duty pay but nothing was called Combat Pay and every single bit was taxed....I was a gunner on a Huey Gun Ship and we were always in the shit so I reckon we would have qualified for Combat Pay if such a thing existed..

[MindPilot]

83. Been trying to find out when that took effect...not having much luck.

I was in at the very end, 72 & 73, so it might have been something the LBJ administration enacted toward the end of his term.

I distinctly recall our skipper keeping the ship--on several occasions--on-station just a couple more days so we could get tax-free pay for the next month. I also remember it was commonplace to do re-enlistments in the combat zone so the bonus would be tax-exempt.

[KurtNYC]

31. Mitt finally told the truth: He's "not worried about them"

[pinboy3niner]

51. Wounded warriors also are part of the 47%

Combat-disabled veterans receive disability pay (non-taxable) from their service branch and/or the VA.

[mgardener]

20. Mr. 'I stand by what I said and I'll say it again'.

Romney is an arrogant SOB. He is blatantly saying that he will not represent 1/2 the US population if elected POTUS. he would lie as he took the office of POTUS. Think about that.

Talk about a contract with America. We paid our share of SS and medicare tax with the understanding that we were paying into a system that would be there when we needed it.
We paid the unemployment taxes. We paid our fair share of taxes because we were not able to take advantage of loopholes in the tax laws. We pay state and county taxes.
It is now imperative that the US people, republicans and Democrats DEMAND the we see the Romney tax returns for at least the last 10 years.

Democrats need to make sure that republicans that help make up the 47 % understand that Mr. Romney is not going to represent their interests, has no intention of representing them and could care less if they live or die. Dying would be preferable. More money for the US!!!!
This is a man who will not fight your fight for abortion or against gay marriage unless there is a monetary advantage in doing so.
He is all about money.

And Ann? Get a dictionary and learn what empathy really means. You don't know it and your husband does not have it!!!

[radical noodle]

21. Yep!

My husband and I worked for about 40 years, paying our taxes at a higher rate than Mitt. Now we're retired and in Florida. Guess I'm a freeloader too.

This man dares to say anything about not paying taxes when he refuses to release his tax returns?

[reflection]

24. kicking and reccing for truth n/t

[SCVDem]

26. The thought is terrifying!

President Romney appoints two Supreme Court justices.

Just imagine .......

[Justice]

27. Excellent Post

These specifics need to be fed to the media - take this info plus the map from the Taxpayer's Foundation which shows the states with the highest % of non payers (Deep south, Florida, Texas) - to show Mitt was talking about them.

[heaven05]

28. mmmmm

this clown is a dangerous joke, and oh yeah, I get social security that I paid into for 50 years and a small postal pension. I MUST be part of the 47% that will not vote for you, you evil demented asshole! the last smilie depicts your campaign,jerk!

[WinkyDink]

29. ROMNEY DOES NOT CARE! He wants to fulfill a "Mormon prophecy" for a Theocracy.

[ashling]

32. And lets remember that, falling below the tax threshold, they are not legally obligated

I think I recall Rmoney defending his 12% tax rate by saying he pays all of the taxes he is legally obligated to pay , and then adding proudly "but not a dollar more."

As Bill Clinton said, it take a lot of brass to blame someone for doing what you did.

[mnhtnbb]

33. This piece of $hit a$$hole continues to amaze with his self satisfied, unempathic arrogance.

How can this election possibly be as close as the 'pollsters' are calling it?

[newspeak]

56. because like what was said up thread

you got the clueless thinking he wasn't talking about them. They're on SS or disability, but no Rmoney is not talking about them, it's those other leeches. I've known some who railed about those women on welfare, those undeserving, shiftless poor and then, the same damn people would find a way to collect, like on worker's comp by lying about injuring themselves. Instead of at work, they injured themselves at a baseball game. but, they are so disconnected, it's all about "them," that they put down others that must get assistance, and yet, they know nothing about those they rail against.

[vlyons]

34. Oh, I think there'll be more than 47%

who don't vote for Romney. As they say over on KOS, everyone know that Romney is a dick.

[sarge43]

35. For the record, shortly after WWII military pay began to be taxed.

Romney forgot to mention that of 47/48/49% (whatever), most are paying payroll taxes, usually on minimum or slightly above wage. Some more don't have enough income to be taxed. My mother, like your mother, was in the category. The remainder don't have any income.

Romney is a blivet.

[Hoosier]

36. yahtzee

Perfect analysis...thank you, louis c

[louis c]

92. you're welcome

and thank you for the compliment

[sinkingfeeling]

37. Stick a fork in him. He's done.

[louis c]

79. From your lips to God's ears

[George II]

39. Here's what Romney said in 2007 about his sons "serving America" (excerpts)

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/08/08/questions-about-romneys-sons-and-military-service/

A woman at an Ask Mitt Anything forum earlier today in Iowa raised the question again, asking whether any of Mr. Romney’s five sons are serving in the military, adding pointedly, “If none of them are, how do they plan to support this war on terrorism by enlisting in our U.S. military?”

“one of the ways my sons are showing support for our nation is helping to get me elected.”

Mr. Romney expressed appreciation for the country’s “volunteer army” and said “that’s the way we’re going to keep it. He explained his sons had made different career choices in life and had not chosen to serve in the military but he mentioned a niece whose husband he said had just been called up by the National Guard.

As part of that call, he personally donated $25,000 to various organizations that support military personnel. But he wound up his response with this: “It’s remarkable how we can show our support for our nation, and one of the ways my sons are showing support for our nation is helping to get me elected, because they think I’d be a great president. My son, Josh, bought the family Winnebago and has visited 99 counties, most of them with his three kids and his wife. And I respect that and respect all of those in the way they serve this great country.”

THE MAN IS SO F-ING OUT OF TOUCH IT'S FRIGHTENING!!

[newspeak]

58. my daughter was in the military and my SIL is still in

served in Iraq and afghanistan. Now he's got two years until retirement. it seems that rmoney and his boys had better things to do than sacrificing for their country. to even mention the military, is an insult to those soldiers who have sacrificed. I remember when little boots got his war hard on, those in the reserves who were called to duty, leaving their great jobs to serve. some of those families became financially distressed and lost their homes. the guy is fekkin clueless or really thinks the plebes are to be used and tossed aside for the benefit of his wealthy corporate buddies.

[Doctor_J]

45. Re: FL and OH

wile they have high rates of seniors and unemployed, they are also most succeptible to Fox News lies. I have a senior relative who has availed himself of medical procedures that would easily run $500,000 on the open market, but were completely covered by Medicare (with, along with SS and a public school pension, are his only means of support). But Fox has him convinced that he's not one of the moochers Rmoney detests so much.

FOX News - when reality doesn't fit your world view

[oldsarge54]

50. Seeing Stories Elsewhere

I been seeing a trend developing that the big con money is now going to congressional races. I guess they are at the point of conceding the White House. If the money bags get their way, we will have four more years of obstruction in the House. Perhaps we will even see a poll showing a negative number for the Congressional approval rating. At that time, I would give the President the advice I wrote while stuck in the Pentagon 30 plus years ago.

C-4, administered as a suppository, engenders an immediate desire to cooperate with whomever is holding the detonator, because one way or another, shit will happen.

[louis c]

87. That would be great

[Blue_Tires]

53. don't forget the audience Mitt was addressing really believes that and much worse...

[PoliticalBiker]

57. Rommy, Rommy, Rommy....

Rommy has been running for president for AT LEAST 6yrs. now
He wants the JOB of president, but it is painfully clear, he is incapable of DOING the job of president.

I can't wait for the debates...

Obama is going to eat him for breakfast and take his lunch money

[freshwest]

59. Louis c, you're a lot smarter than Mitt. And you included all the people I care about.

[louis c]

81. this is a big deal

and could be the tipping point in this election.

I'm not as smart as Mitt (and I've talked to him when he was Gov. of Mass,), or better looking.

But I bet I know politics better than he does.

I was involved in a campaign for a candidate for Mayor one time. They hired a consultant. At the first meeting the consultant attended he told the candidate from the time you leave this room tonight until the last ballot is counted, act like you're being recorded or filmed all the time. Assume every conversation will be repeated. Don't take anything for granted." This was a successful campaign, but that advice was never lost on me.

If Mitt followed that advice, he'd still be in the hunt.

[Blue Owl]

60. Why didn't I ever think of letting my dog ride on the roof?

Romney is a GENIUS.

[cr8tvlde]

61. The Republicans pretty much know they've lost the presidency...

so I agree with many on this board...and restate...take the outrage and work it down ticket.

Maybe their best, perhaps even initially unintended act is to lose the presidency and relent to Obama four more years ... complete with obstructionism ... then come in with Jeb in 2016 to show that even in 8 years, a "mixed race" Democrat is just a do-nothing failure. That would be a giant task, even for Hillary.

Jeb has been very quiet. They now have W's advisors firmly entrenched and on the scene. And they have Fox News' Republican (official Romney advisors...see Rachel Maddow) "News Analysts" getting paid stumping on Fox at no cost to the Romney campaign, 24/7, as "experts".

And a great portion of the "47%" Mitt is really referring to, think he's talking about "those people", the Welfare Queens, et al. The stupid runs deep.

Not done by a long shot.

WHERE ARE THE TAX RETURNS...should be the mantra now/again.

[louis c]

62. This is the greatest response to a post I've had in 8 years here

By the way, today's my 60th birthday (9/18/52)

So this was quite a DU present.

I should thank Mitt for his remarks. I certainly couldn't have done it without him.

[cr8tvlde]

63. Happy Birthday, and thanks for the post.

[louis c]

67. I really appreciate your thoughts

I'm off to a dinner party with family and friends at a restaurant in a Boston Surburb..

I work a lot, as I'm a Union President in Boston.

This has been a special week for me, as I went fishing this week-end and I will celebrate my birthday tonight. I usually don't even get a day off.

But the best gift I got for my birthday was this tape. Romney has denigrated the work that I do for more than 8 years. I actually had to deal with his staff while he was Governor here in Massachusetts.

Eric Fernstom and rest are arrogant, condescending bastards. I will enjoy seeing this piece of shit go down in flames.

If you really want to get under Mitt's skin, a reporter should ask him..."Governor, this tape, by most accounts, has been devastating to your campaign. How would you compare the release of this tape to your Father's "Brain washed" comment in 1967?"

[amuse bouche]

74. I just don't think so

Besides a bad run as governor and family getting in all kinds of trouble, his wife detests D.C and wants no part of it

Unless he administers a lobotomy to her, it ain't happening

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

64. The same statement would be true if the audience consisted of a gathering of canned peas.

[AAO]

65. Awesome - and Very Clever! n/t

[louis c]

66. Thank you, newbie, and welcome to DU

[geckosfeet]

68. 46.4%

[The Wizard]

70. If Rmoney is correct

then the policy put in place by Saint Ronald is the source of a failed system heavily slanted in favor of the wealthy elites. What happened to all that wealth that was supposed to trickle down? Since Obama took office the stock market has doubled. If trickle down really worked unemployment would be 4%.
Front loading tax breaks causes jobs to be shipped out because there's no incentive to employ Americans. It failed under Coolidge, and Hoover, and Reagan, and both Bushes.
Treasury looting is not patriotic.

[rks306]

76. 13%

The only idea they have is tax cuts for the wealthy and deregulation. We tried that for 30 years, its led to a morbid failure. Role back the Reagan tax cuts.

[Fridays Child]

78. k/r

[ProSense]

85. Kick! n/t

[louis c]

90. Thanks for keeping this post alive

[TBF]

91. I'd love to see his arithmetic -

I highly doubt 47% of this country is on complete welfare and doesn't work.

Folks receiving "benefits":

There are the disabled (and disabled vets).

There are seniors (who paid in their entire working lives).

There are moms who collect social security (just try to tell me they "didn't work" all those years).

There are children.

There are students.

There are unemployed (often through no fault of their own - and their employers paid in that insurance).

There are folks working for the government now - is he counting active military?

There are also working poor who pay in all year but get some back after the tax credits are done ... but they did pay in as they went along.


Are these all the "free-loaders"? Romney is a jackass.

[louis c]

93. Kick for a Sunday