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Sun Jul 12, 2020, 09:58 PM

School reopening....

This was posted elsewhere by Cong. Joe Miller. Long read. I dunno if DU can post the whole thing.
This country is nuts if people think we can open schools like we normally do. Or at all like anything approaching normal.
Please don't bother telling me "TL;DR"

"Copied from Fairfax County Public Schools
Written by a SPED Teacher

To our fellow FCPS families, this is it gang, 5 days until the 2 days in school vs. 100% virtual decision. Let’s talk it out, in my traditional mammoth TL/DR form.

Like all of you, I’ve seen my feed become a flood of anxiety and faux expertise. You’ll get no presumption of expertise here. This is how I am looking at and considering this issue and the positions people have taken in my feed and in the hundred or so FCPS discussion groups that have popped up. The lead comments in quotes are taken directly from my feed and those boards. Sometimes I try to rationalize them. Sometimes I’m just punching back at the void.

Full disclosure, we initially chose the 2 days option and are now having serious reservations. As I consider the positions and arguments I see in my feed, these are where my mind goes. Of note, when I started working on this piece at 12:19 PM today the COVID death tally in the United States stood at 133,420.

“My kids want to go back to school.”

I challenge that position. I believe what the kids desire is more abstract. I believe what they want is a return to normalcy. They want their idea of yesterday. And yesterday isn’t on the menu.

“I want my child in school so they can socialize.”

This was the principle reason for our 2 days decision. As I think more on it though, what do we think ‘social’ will look like? There aren’t going to be any lunch table groups, any lockers, any recess games, any study halls, any sitting next to friends, any talking to people in the hallway, any dances. All of that is off the menu. So, when we say that we want the kids to benefit from the social experience, what are we deluding ourselves into thinking in-building socialization will actually look like in the Fall?

“My kid is going to be left behind.”

Left behind who? The entire country is grappling with the same issue, leaving all children in the same quagmire. Who exactly would they be behind? I believe the rhetorical answer to that is “They’ll be behind where they should be,” to which I’ll counter that “where they should be” is a fictional goal post that we as a society have taken as gospel because it maps to standardized tests which are used to grade schools and counties as they chase funding.

“Classrooms are safe.”

At the current distancing guidelines from FCPS middle and high schools would have no more than 12 people (teachers + students) in a classroom (I acknowledge this number may change as FCPS considers the Commonwealth’s 3 ft with a mask vs. 6 ft position, noting that FCPS is all mask regardless of the distance). For the purpose of this discussion we’ll say classes run 45 minutes.

I posed the following question to 40 people today, representing professional and management roles in corporations, government agencies, and military commands: “Would your company or command have a 12 person, 45 minute meeting in a conference room?”

100% of them said no, they would not. These are some of their answers:

“No. Until further notice we are on Zoom.”
“(Our company) doesn’t allow us in (company space).”
“Oh hell no.”
“No absolutely not.”
“Is there a percentage lower than zero?”
“Something of that size would be virtual.”

We do not even consider putting our office employees into the same situation we are contemplating putting our children into. And let’s drive this point home: there are instances here when commanding officers will not put soldiers, ACTUAL SOLDIERS, into the kind of indoor environment we’re contemplating for our children. For me this is as close to a ‘kill shot’ argument as there is in this entire debate. How do we work from home because buildings with recycled air are not safe, because we don’t trust other people to not spread the virus, and then with the same breath send our children into buildings?

“Children only die .0016 of the time.”

First, conceding we’re an increasingly morally bankrupt society, but when did we start talking about children’s lives, or anyone’s lives, like this? This how the villain in movies talks about mortality, usually 10-15 minutes before the good guy kills him.

If you’re in this camp, and I acknowledge that many, many people are, I’m asking you to consider that number from a slightly different angle.

FCPS has 189,000 children. .0016 of that is 302. 302 dead children are the Calvary Hill you’re erecting your argument on. So, let’s agree to do this: stop presenting this as a data point. If this is your argument, I challenge you to have courage equal to your conviction. Go ahead, plant a flag on the internet and say, “Only 302 children will die.” No one will. That’s the kind action on social media that gets you fired from your job. And I trust our social media enclave isn’t so careless and irresponsible with life that it would even, for even a millisecond, enter any of your minds to make such an argument.

Considered another way: You’re presented with a bag with 189,000 $1 bills. You’re told that in the bag are 302 random bills, they look and feel just like all the others, but each one of those bills will kill you. Do you take the money out of the bag?

Same argument, applied to the 12,487 teachers in FCPS (per Wikipedia), using the ‘children’s multiplier’ of .0016 (all of us understanding the adult mortality rate is higher). That’s 20 teachers. That’s the number you’re talking about. It’s very easy to sit behind a keyboard and diminish and dismiss the risk you’re advocating other people assume. Take a breath and think about that.

If you want to advocate for 2 days a week, look, I’m looking for someone to convince me. But please, for the love of God, drop things like this from your argument. Because the people I know who’ve said things like this, I know they’re better people than this. They’re good people under incredible stress who let things slip out as their frustration boils over. So, please do the right thing and move on from this, because one potential outcome is that one day, you’re going to have to stand in front of St. Peter and answer for this, and that’s not going to be conversation you enjoy.

“Hardly any kids get COVID.”

(Deep sigh) Yes, that is statistically true as of this writing. But it is a cherry-picked argument because you’re leaving out an important piece.

One can reasonably argue that, due to the school closures in March, children have had the least EXPOSURE to COVID. In other words, closing schools was the one pandemic mitigation action we took that worked. There can be no discussion of the rate of diagnosis within children without also acknowledging they were among our fastest and most quarantined people. Put another way, you cannot cite the effect without acknowledging the cause.

“The flu kills more people every year.”

(Deep sigh). First of all, no, it doesn’t. Per the CDC, United States flu deaths average 20,000 annually. COVID, when I start writing here today, has killed 133,420 in six months.

And when you mention the flu, do you mean the disease that, if you’re suspected of having it, everyone, literally everyone in the country tells you stay the f- away from other people? You mean the one where parents are pretty sure their kids have it but send them to school anyway because they have a meeting that day, the one that every year causes massive f-ing outbreaks in schools because schools are petri dishes and it causes kids to miss weeks of school and leaves them out of sports and band for a month? That one? Because you’re right - the flu kills people every year. It does, but you’re ignoring the why. It’s because there are people who are a--holes who don’t care about infecting other people. In that regard it’s a perfect comparison to COVID.

“Almost everyone recovers.”

You’re confusing “release from the hospital” and “no longer infected” with “recovered.” I’m fortunate to only know two people who have had COVID. One my age and one my dad’s age. The one my age described it as “absolute hell” and although no longer infected cannot breathe right. The one my dad’s age was in the hospital for 13 weeks, had to have a trach ring put in because she could no longer be on a ventilator, and upon finally getting home and being faced with incalculable time in rehab told my mother, “I wish I had died.”

While I’m making every effort to reach objectivity, on this particular point, you don’t know what the f- you’re talking about.

“If people get sick, they get sick.”

First, you mistyped. What you intended to say was “If OTHER people get sick, they get sick.” And shame on you.

“I’m not going to live my life in fear.”

You already live your life in fear. For your health, your family’s health, your job, your retirement, terrorists, extremists, one political party or the other being in power, the new neighbors, an unexpected home repair, the next sunrise. What you meant to say was, “I’m not prepared to add ANOTHER fear,” and I’ve got news for you: that ship has sailed. It’s too late. There are two kinds of people, and only two: those that admit they’re afraid, and those that are lying to themselves about it.

As to the fear argument, fear is the reason you wait up when your kids stay out late, it’s the reason you tell your kids not to dive in the shallow water, to look both ways before crossing the road. Fear is the respect for the wide world that we teach our children. Except in this instance, for reasons no one has been able to explain to me yet.

“FCPS leadership sucks.”

I will summarize my view of the School Board thusly: if the 12 of you aren’t getting into a room together because it represents a risk, don’t tell me it’s OK for our kids. I understand your arguments, that we need the 2 days option for parents who can’t work from home, kids who don’t have internet or computer access, kids who needs meals from the school system, kids who need extra support to learn, and most tragically for kids who are at greater risk of abuse by being home. All very serious, all very real issues, all heartbreaking. No argument.

But you must first lead by example. Because you’re failing when it comes to optics. All your meetings are online. What our children see is all of you on a Zoom telling them it’s OK for them to be exactly where you aren’t. I understand you’re not PR people, but you really should think about hiring some.

“I talked it over with my kids.”
Let’s put aside for a moment the concept of adults effectively deferring this decision to children, the same children who will continue to stuff things into a full trash can rather than change it out. Yes, those hygienic children.

Listen, my 15 year old daughter wants a sport car, which she’s not getting next year because it would be dangerous to her and to others. Those kinds of decisions are our job. We step in and decide as parents, we don’t let them expose themselves to risks because their still developing and screen addicted brains narrow their understanding of cause and effect.

We as parents and adults serve to make difficult decisions. Sometimes those are in the form of lessons, where we try to steer kids towards the right answer and are willing to let them make a mistake in the hopes of teaching better decision making the next time around. This is not one of those moments. The stakes are too high for that. This is a “the adults are talking” moment. Kids are not mature enough for this moment. That is not an attack on your child. It is a broad statement about all children. It is true of your children and it was true when we were children. We need to be doing that thinking here, and “Johnny wants to see Bobby at school” cannot be the prevailing element in the equation.

“The teachers need to do their job.”
How is it that the same society which abruptly shifted to virtual students only three months ago, and offered glowing endorsements of teachers stating, “we finally understand how difficult your job is,” has now shifted to “screw you, do your job.” There are myriad problems with that position but for the purposes of this piece let’s simply go with, “You’re not looking for a teacher, you’re looking for the babysitter you feel your property tax payment entitles you to.”

“Teachers have a greater chance to being killed by a car than they do of dying from COVID.”

(Eye roll) Per the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS), the U.S. see approximately 36,000 auto fatalities a year. Again, there have been 133,420 COVID deaths in the United States through 12:09 July 10, 2020. So no, they do not have a great chance of being killed in a car accident.

And, if you want to take the actual environment into consideration, the odds of a teacher being killed in a car accident in their classroom, you know, the environment we’re actually talking about, that’s right around 0%.

“If the grocery store workers can be onsite what are the teachers afraid of?”

(Deep breath) A grocery store worker, who absolutely risks exposure, has either six feet of space or a plexiglass shield between them and individual adult customers who can grasp their own mortality whose transactions can be completed in moments, in a 40,000 SF space.

A teacher is with 11 ‘customers’ who have not an inkling what mortality is, for 45 minutes, in a 675 SF space, six times a day.

Just stop.

“Teachers are choosing remote because they don’t want to work.”

(Deep breaths) Many teachers are opting to be remote. That is not a vacation. They’re requesting to do their job at a safer site. Just like many, many people who work in buildings with recycled air have done. And likely the building you’re not going into has a newer and better serviced air system than our schools.

Of greater interest to me is the number of teachers choosing the 100% virtual option for their children. The people who spend the most time in the buildings are the same ones electing not to send their children into those buildings. That’s something I pay attention to.

“I wasn’t prepared to be a parent 24/7” and “I just need a break.”

I truly, deeply respect that honesty. Truth be told, both arguments have crossed my mind. Pre COVID, I routinely worked from home 1 – 2 days a week. The solace was nice. When I was in the office, I had an actual office, a room with a door I could close, where I could focus. During the quarantine that hasn’t always been the case. I’ve been frustrated, I’ve been short, I’ve gone to just take a drive and get the hell away for a moment and been disgusted when one of the kids sees me and asks me to come for a ride, robbing me of those minutes of silence. You want to hear silence. I get it. I really, really do.

Here’s another version of that, admittedly extreme. What if one of our kids becomes one of the 302? What’s that silence going to sound like? What if you have one of those matted frames where you add the kid’s school picture every year? What if you don’t get to finish the pictures?

“What does your gut tell you to do?”

Shawn and I have talked ad infinitum about all of these and other points. Two days ago, at mid-discussion I said, “Stop, right now, gut answer, what is it,” and we both said, “virtual.”

A lot of the arguments I hear people making for the 2 days sound like we’re trying to talk ourselves into ignoring our instincts, they are almost exclusively, “We’re doing 2 days, but…”. There’s a fantastic book by Gavin de Becker, The Gift of Fear, which I’ll minimize for you thusly: your gut instinct is a hardwired part of your brain and you should listen to it. In the introduction he talks about elevators, and how, of all living things, humans are the only ones that would voluntarily get into a soundproof steel box with a potential predator just so they could skip a flight of stairs.

I keep thinking that the 2 days option is the soundproof steel box. I welcome, damn, beg, anyone to convince me otherwise.

At the time I started writing at 12:09 PM, 133,420 Americans had died from COVID. Upon completing this draft at 7:04 PM, that number rose to 133,940.

520 Americans died of COVID while I was working on this. In seven hours.

The length of a school day. #302"

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Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 13 replies Author Time Post
Reply School reopening.... (Original post)
albacore Jul 2020 OP
global1 Jul 2020 #1
bottomofthehill Jul 2020 #2
onecaliberal Jul 2020 #3
Raastan Jul 2020 #4
Moostache Jul 2020 #5
PoindexterOglethorpe Jul 2020 #6
PufPuf23 Jul 2020 #7
Dem2theMax Jul 2020 #8
LastLiberal in PalmSprings Jul 2020 #9
Aussie105 Jul 2020 #10
irilli_hadenoff Jul 2020 #11
uponit7771 Jul 2020 #12
duforsure Jul 2020 #13

Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 10:12 PM

1. Hey Parent - You've Taken Good Care Of Your Child All This Time....

Do you want to squander that care now and take the chance of having your child be infected because Trump says it's safe?

Come on parent - you're smarter than that.

He also said this virus would magically disappear and that when the weather gets hot it will go away.

Do you think he's right about sending kids back to school?

Don't take the risk. Keep them safe at home and love them.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 10:18 PM

2. Well, that should be enough to scare the hell out of you

It was for me.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 10:26 PM


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Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 10:38 PM

4. K + R

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 10:57 PM

5. Great read...depressing reality is STILL reality though...schools should remain closed, period.

This nation has about 3-4 states with limited population and low enough viral penetration and spread to be on the fringe of "safe"...

The vast majority of schools, especially 'urban' schools - which is code for minority schools and just an average racist trope - are usually over-crowded and facing student to teacher ratios in the vicinity of 35 or even 40 to 1. There is ZERO chance that schools can open with 12 students per class without a massive culling of the enrollment. Even for the majority of other schools, the student to teacher ratios are nowhere close to capable of handling 12-to-1 restrictions.

Then there is the fact that kids are notorious rule breakers - especially teenagers and grade 7 through 12 students. Is the National Guard going to be in the hallways to stop conversations, yelling, singing grabbing, hugging, jumping up and down while yelling into each other's faces? There is simply no chance that social distancing in the hallways of a school with 2,000 - 3,000 students will be anything short of total chaos.

Masks half-worn or incorrectly covering only one's chin? Guaranteed 'rebel' statement akin to being "Goth" or "Punk" or "Alternative" or "Emo" or any other more current label one wishes to apply...

Opening schools to full enrollment or half-enrollment or quarter-enrollment is an uncontrollable mess. The ONLY option is to figure out how to leverage technology to allow the students to attend a single, broadcast class lecture, followed by the equivalent of recitation periods with smaller ratios, but all done virtually. Hell, kids will figure out that MS teams has a chat function that allows them to ignore the lecture and talk to each other just fine...only no touching, or sharing breathing air...

If schools open in August, they will be closed by the end of September and there won't be an October Surprise big enough to change the subject from the dead and dying teachers, staff and yes, students across the nation.

IF this is to be allowed, then all fake and phony 'reasons' must be debunked and people forced to confront the truth - they crave a 'return to February 2020 attitudes' and they are scared and frustrated by the government bungling of this whole thing, but they also are tribal and many are unwilling to break with their "team" despite facts, bodybags, ICUs turning away everyone and ERs and Hospitals broken and unable to fulfill their functions.

Kids to school = MANY MORE PEOPLE DIE. Period.
Someone needs to ask Trump how many dead is too many. How many dead is OK? When will Ivanka be stepping up and into a class room for 7 hours a day? Jared? Uday and Qusay? When will Baron be reporting to a crowded classroom with no masks and little to no social distancing? (That last one probably only impacts his trophy wife and only until she reaches her 'sell by' date soon...

Schools, theaters and sporting venues should ALL remain closed and locked down until the RISE of the Virus and the TRACING of all contacts with new cases can be confirmed and a system of quarantine established AS A BARE MINIMUM!

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 11:04 PM

6. If no other reason matters,

the one where managers in corporations would absolutely not put 12 people together in a conference room for 45 minutes should be the clincher.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Sun Jul 12, 2020, 11:06 PM

7. My perception is that some people who want to reopen schools ASAP

have the motive of less child care as, having kids at home and isolated, takes effort away from other responsibilities or just rest and relaxation.

Seems to me that when schools are reopened attendance would best be in staggered schedule of small fixed pods (5 to 10 children max) of students.

Now is way too early and will serve to spread the virus.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Mon Jul 13, 2020, 12:25 AM

8. I have a retired college professor living across the street from me.

She is a Democrat. She should know better. She has a grandson who is extremely intelligent, light years ahead of most of the adults I know. I think he's in the 8th grade.

Grandma thinks he needs to go back to school ASAP. She says he needs socialization. He needs more stimulation. He needs to continue his education. Everything I just read in this post, I could swear I heard it coming out of her mouth.

I will be forwarding this to her.
Thank you so much for posting this.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Mon Jul 13, 2020, 12:26 AM

9. "I wasn't prepared to be a parent 24/7" and "I just need a break."

Don't you worry about that. Just tightly pack your children into classrooms with dozens of other kids, and the chances are good you won't have to be a parent anymore. Or a spouse, for that matter.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Mon Jul 13, 2020, 12:46 AM

10. So well written.

The frustration, fear and anger come out so clearly.

I'm a retired high school teacher. If I was working still, and I was told school would reopen, and I was expected to attend, my response would be a very firm NO!, with my resignation emailed soon after.

It's a recipe for disaster.


Worth a read.

Personally, I think not going to school for a year or two is good for kids' personal development. Learn self reliance, how to entertain yourself, etc.
It's the parents who want to get rid of kids during the day, and kids who rely on school to structure their day and entertain them.
And of course, the wish for things to be 'normal'.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Mon Jul 13, 2020, 01:37 AM

11. There are so many analogies that can be drawn in this situation


that I sat for a long time going through a number of them. Stating any of them makes one sound like a morbid creep who is employing How About-ism. Suffice to say that there are many far less dangerous situations that parents would not dream of sending their child into.

But lets look at a simple case. Suppose in that classroom of 12 students, just one showed up with Covid. And only infected 2 other students. And, at the end of the 2-day period, there would be one kid with Covid. Next week, 3 sick kids show up in that classroom and infect another 4 kids (2 each for the newly infected, we give the original kid a pass). Next week, those kids show up and infect another 2 each. Uh-oh, ran out of kids to infect. In a couple of weeks, any room where a kid with Covid showed up, we probably have close to full infection.

If this is a middle or high school, each of these kids gets to go mingle with another group after 45 minutes. And another. And another. And another.

By the end of a few weeks, there will be close to full involvement of the students. Who will bring it home to mom, dad, sis, bro, Granny and Grampy.

Sounds like a recipe only Putin could love.

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Mon Jul 13, 2020, 04:07 AM

12. K&R

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Response to albacore (Original post)

Mon Jul 13, 2020, 05:14 AM

13. If they reopen making any children or teachers attend school

This will be worse than their re-opening has gone after trump pressured Red State Governors to do prematurely for businesses causing the the dangerous increase in its getting spread now. Could they be held liable for damages in a civil court if they do this? trump puts his re-election above your children's , and your heath now publicly.

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