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Brown to Warren: "She said she is a native American and look at her, obviously she's not." (Original Post) DonRedwood Sep 2012 OP
Link ... doublethink Sep 2012 #1
'He's just made up the tax numbers.' elleng Sep 2012 #17
I don't like this guy ... lol. doublethink Sep 2012 #21
Yes, but apparently he's a 'successful' thug. elleng Sep 2012 #23
Just heard on Ed mimi85 Sep 2012 #115
no!! he tried that and Harry Reid cancelled the evening's votes so brown had no excuse DonRedwood Sep 2012 #118
Yep, I just got that... mimi85 Sep 2012 #124
oh--not a perfect quote, by the way, i was typing and listening DonRedwood Sep 2012 #2
what a stumbling, bumbling fuck CatWoman Sep 2012 #3
He's a rat. graywarrior Sep 2012 #4
my son is 1/32 native American, blond and blue-eyed Fresh_Start Sep 2012 #5
My best friend too and her kids, all blond and blue eyed but she's a quarter Cree Cleita Sep 2012 #31
We recently found out that my kids are part Nanticoke. Tracer Sep 2012 #168
I think they're all supposed to be red-skinned HoneychildMooseMoss Sep 2012 #146
i wonder how many people have been offended by him tonight DonRedwood Sep 2012 #158
Lots, I think HoneychildMooseMoss Sep 2012 #159
I certainly was mercuryblues Sep 2012 #173
Don't they all look like this? demwing Sep 2012 #167
that looks just like the Wasilla Braves DonRedwood Sep 2012 #171
Yes. laundry_queen Sep 2012 #175
Scott--maybe she should have spray painted her face brown for you like Rmoney did librechik Sep 2012 #6
DAMMIT! You beat me to it!! renie408 Sep 2012 #9
exactly...the way he said "just look at her" was a sneer.... really nasty DonRedwood Sep 2012 #11
Oh, the women MA voters are gonna LOVE that remark...doncha know... CTyankee Sep 2012 #123
Did you see the look on his face when he said it? DonRedwood Sep 2012 #164
you mean his perpetual smirk? CTyankee Sep 2012 #166
That's gonna leave a mark sammytko Sep 2012 #7
I hope so-it was unsettling the way he went at her DonRedwood Sep 2012 #119
Oh, dear... The Velveteen Ocelot Sep 2012 #8
Both sammytko Sep 2012 #12
I am a white Cherokee/Choctaw nebenaube Sep 2012 #10
that's the same combination shanti Sep 2012 #149
We may be related... n/t nebenaube Sep 2012 #170
DU, bringing families together since 2002. DonRedwood Sep 2012 #179
she must have forgotten her headdress bigtree Sep 2012 #13
bwah!! CatWoman Sep 2012 #40
warren: he has voted against three jobs bills DonRedwood Sep 2012 #14
One Drop Rule maxsolomon Sep 2012 #15
Exactly. And the tribe she descends from is the Delaware, who allow for lineal descent as kestrel91316 Sep 2012 #54
I think that is an important reminder - there were a lot of families who "passed" hedgehog Sep 2012 #81
There was great shame attached to being part or all native American for most of the past 200 years. kestrel91316 Sep 2012 #132
Oklahoma is kind of famous for that DonRedwood Sep 2012 #165
This, from the whiniest crybaby in the US senate TheCowsCameHome Sep 2012 #16
Tell me about it. I am so sick of being bombarded with his television ads where is whining about smirkymonkey Sep 2012 #49
But, but he has a TRUCK!!!! arcane1 Sep 2012 #77
So did Janet Reno when she ran for Gov of Florida. nt julian09 Sep 2012 #120
I'm sick of seeing Mr. Mom's face all over the media. TheCowsCameHome Sep 2012 #91
Warren : (budget/tax) "He has made up his numbers" DonRedwood Sep 2012 #18
Warren: "I will not vote to increase taxes on working families, ever." DonRedwood Sep 2012 #19
brown sneezed DonRedwood Sep 2012 #20
From Warren wryter2000 Sep 2012 #22
brown mispeaks: "Chamber of commerce...is the biggest threat" DonRedwood Sep 2012 #24
This is about taking a balanced approach--warren DonRedwood Sep 2012 #25
Warren continuing to attack him on his record, he continues to change the subject 1-Old-Man Sep 2012 #26
He's rambling graywarrior Sep 2012 #27
And some nasty, nervous laughter wryter2000 Sep 2012 #32
She, she, she....he's such a condescending creep graywarrior Sep 2012 #35
yes he iis, this can be watched online at c span NotThisTime Sep 2012 #42
blunt amendment must refer to religion or at least he thinks it does NotThisTime Sep 2012 #67
It's that awful thing wryter2000 Sep 2012 #69
You go, Don! I'm following you and other commenters in this thread. Thanks! DippyDem Sep 2012 #28
Yanno....... Marrah_G Sep 2012 #29
brown: "SHE IS OBssessed with raising taxes" DonRedwood Sep 2012 #30
I can't imagine this is doing well for him in liberal MA n/t wryter2000 Sep 2012 #34
brown: "I don't want to put (all your) money in a piggy bank and give it to Warren to spend." DonRedwood Sep 2012 #33
Translation: "I want to put it all in a piggy bank to give it to the Oil Companies to Spend" SunsetDreams Sep 2012 #39
She continues to nail him with his own voting record 1-Old-Man Sep 2012 #36
yes, going for gut reactions with hyperbole DonRedwood Sep 2012 #41
talking about his record is hyperbole? fascisthunter Sep 2012 #109
sorry, I meant that was talking about brown, not warren DonRedwood Sep 2012 #157
haha... gotcha fascisthunter Sep 2012 #181
Warren keeps returning to facts and refers to where her info comes from DonRedwood Sep 2012 #37
Her conclusion to that segment wryter2000 Sep 2012 #38
Hooee wryter2000 Sep 2012 #43
OH MY GOD. What a fucker. Her Delaware tribe roots are back in Ohio in the very early 1800s. I did kestrel91316 Sep 2012 #44
abortion: warren "Roe v Wade is settled law". Brown voted against Kagen DonRedwood Sep 2012 #45
I'm sorry I didn't vote for your boss (on voting against Kagan) MattBaggins Sep 2012 #46
That's stupid. It sounds like Scott Cha Sep 2012 #143
Screw Brown! My son (1/8th) had a teacher say that to him... bluesbassman Sep 2012 #47
OMG Bryn Sep 2012 #125
Thanks Bryn. bluesbassman Sep 2012 #135
Seriously jsmirman Sep 2012 #138
gorgeous family! elehhhhna Sep 2012 #133
Thank you! bluesbassman Sep 2012 #137
How awful TuxedoKat Sep 2012 #177
Dude, Gorgeous Family, Your Son Must Be Beating Them Off With A Stick! Skraxx Sep 2012 #178
Brown: "women raped in the military" is an abortion he would support DonRedwood Sep 2012 #48
brown to warren: "Stop scaring women". DonRedwood Sep 2012 #52
he said it again DonRedwood Sep 2012 #62
"I don't think that's what Senator Kennedy fought for" Warren slaps down Brown for using Kennedy to DonRedwood Sep 2012 #65
Brown: I would have voted for lily ledbetter" warren follows: he voted against equal pay DonRedwood Sep 2012 #66
Warren: "All three of my brothers served in the military. I know what families do when (people are DonRedwood Sep 2012 #71
"I agree with you again, it's amazing." brown DonRedwood Sep 2012 #73
warren: "we have a very special relationship with israel" DonRedwood Sep 2012 #75
Mass Citizens For Life supports you in this election Brown. There is no chelsea0011 Sep 2012 #50
He says he's pro-choice n/t wryter2000 Sep 2012 #51
OMG, he's been fighting for women since he was 6! graywarrior Sep 2012 #53
creep! n/t flamingdem Sep 2012 #56
Fighting over or for? ChairmanAgnostic Sep 2012 #76
For graywarrior Sep 2012 #97
I hear he marched with the Suffrage marchers. whistler162 Sep 2012 #141
Hahahahahaha! graywarrior Sep 2012 #155
He appears hostile and condescending. This will cost him a lot of women votes n/t Blaukraut Sep 2012 #55
I sure hope so! n/t flamingdem Sep 2012 #57
Agreed wryter2000 Sep 2012 #58
He's mean graywarrior Sep 2012 #59
"she's wrong".....what a dickhead chelsea0011 Sep 2012 #64
He sure can call Kennedy's name malaise Sep 2012 #60
Warren comes off as sincere & Brown is strictly snarky & desperate. pacalo Sep 2012 #61
She is defining every issue, and this broadcast will draw crucial assessment 1-Old-Man Sep 2012 #63
Nice job Scotty, probably won over a lot of intellectual types. Scuba Sep 2012 #68
Even on the foreign policy/military question EW wins Blaukraut Sep 2012 #70
I can't stand Jon Keller but he is doing a good job moderating this debate chelsea0011 Sep 2012 #72
Same here graywarrior Sep 2012 #82
By the way, good Moderator and two good debaters who are not talking over each other 1-Old-Man Sep 2012 #74
Right. Good format that's working. elleng Sep 2012 #78
Interesting. Brown just blamed Warren for the high cost of Harvard. chelsea0011 Sep 2012 #79
F this bastard wryter2000 Sep 2012 #80
He stinks of desperation graywarrior Sep 2012 #83
Now he's on to her piggy bank again. n/t wryter2000 Sep 2012 #85
warren ; hitting him hard for protecting loopholes over student loan interest DonRedwood Sep 2012 #84
brown; "you are misrepresenting" again he says she is not telling the trugh DonRedwood Sep 2012 #86
"He is about a rigged playing field. " DonRedwood Sep 2012 #94
Warren " A man like that should not be in charge of the EPA" (imholf) DonRedwood Sep 2012 #96
I want her to mention Mitch McConnell by name when talking about Brown's votes Blaukraut Sep 2012 #87
She should also keep telling people he is a republican, something chelsea0011 Sep 2012 #92
He's accusing her of protecting corporations? wryter2000 Sep 2012 #88
Appears that way. Did she represent a corporation, in her legal practice? elleng Sep 2012 #93
He says employees injured by asbestos are not getting paid due to her work for the corporation NotThisTime Sep 2012 #106
Don't know about her parents. elleng Sep 2012 #131
I did a search, they apparently eloped due to his family's objections, the asbestos, don't know the NotThisTime Sep 2012 #136
Fact. bluestate10 Sep 2012 #160
I really wish Warren would point out what the US Chamber of Commerce and NFIB are Bombtrack Sep 2012 #89
He says he believes in climate change wryter2000 Sep 2012 #90
She's saying wryter2000 Sep 2012 #95
"radical occupy protest movement" ..Brown LOL chelsea0011 Sep 2012 #98
"Warren would vote with her party 100% of the time." brown DonRedwood Sep 2012 #99
I proclaim her winner! 1-Old-Man Sep 2012 #100
Warren won.... JohnA1 Sep 2012 #104
She won if what he said about Asbestos is not true NotThisTime Sep 2012 #110
Love how she said "You can't have it both ways. An R when fundraising but not when campaigning. No." RBInMaine Sep 2012 #112
So he said he wants to compete on the global market AND XemaSab Sep 2012 #101
WTF does he "think" Native Americans look like? Do they all have paint on their faces and Raine Sep 2012 #102
WRAP UP: wow... Warren was collected and smooth, VERY factual. Brown got worked up and DonRedwood Sep 2012 #103
I hate to say it, but I think Scott Brown won that debate. reformist2 Sep 2012 #105
If the viewer was a repuke that might have worked, Dems will respond to her facts nt flamingdem Sep 2012 #107
She did fine. He came across like a total and complete fucking asshole. SUNK himself with women. RBInMaine Sep 2012 #108
I agree these things will land a blow, however she briefly said the asbestos charge was not true, I NotThisTime Sep 2012 #113
boston.com has the asbestos article if you have a membership NotThisTime Sep 2012 #117
Elizabeth Warren was key in asbestos case dkf Sep 2012 #134
Thank you for the link, we should all familiarize ourselves with the case. Nobody could have NotThisTime Sep 2012 #147
One wonders if it was part of Travelers strategy and she was unaware of the road map. dkf Sep 2012 #148
I honestly don't think so unless Chubb and Travelers were in collusion and just got a judge who NotThisTime Sep 2012 #161
I don' think so. Viewers for a Senate debate are critical analysts, not looking for a circus 1-Old-Man Sep 2012 #116
My impression is that MA people like to watch a good scrap jsmirman Sep 2012 #142
nope... I'm a Mass native and she won the scrap fascisthunter Sep 2012 #154
I hope so jsmirman Sep 2012 #156
she will... she set him up and placed him on the defensive about his record fascisthunter Sep 2012 #180
Her first teaching job was for $18,000 she worked her way up. julian09 Sep 2012 #128
This is MA, not AL. The facts matter here, not puffed up chests and phony platitude... Liberal_Stalwart71 Sep 2012 #129
Usually senate debate viewers are LIVs and usually partisan, nothing won by Brown uponit7771 Sep 2012 #139
I'm in Mass, and no HE lost the debate fascisthunter Sep 2012 #153
I found her frustrating jsmirman Sep 2012 #111
I wondered if it was just me rhiannon55 Sep 2012 #121
Yep, he was in attack mode, she was in debate society mode. reformist2 Sep 2012 #122
She can stick him a coupleof times without totally going to infantile attacks.. uponit7771 Sep 2012 #140
I watched the debate... she won by pointing out his RECORD on voting fascisthunter Sep 2012 #114
So he flunked 7th grade biology. aquart Sep 2012 #126
Boorish WilliamPitt Sep 2012 #127
Saw that. What an ass. ProfessionalLeftist Sep 2012 #130
boston.com poll tomm2thumbs Sep 2012 #144
Maybe he has never been to an Indian pow-wow. RebelOne Sep 2012 #145
Lots of twitter folks are calling Scott Brown one word: condescending Jennicut Sep 2012 #150
Those are exactly the words I used in describing him to my husband who did not watch the debate NotThisTime Sep 2012 #162
I have a cousin who is 1/2 Native American and 1/2 White. Terra Alta Sep 2012 #151
Amen. He is an idiot for sure. My blue-eyed blonde brother-in-law is 1/4. MatthewStLouis Sep 2012 #172
Unlike Mitt Romney, Warren didn't feel the need to get a spray tan before her event LynneSin Sep 2012 #152
She's from Oklahoma, it would be a surprise if she wasn't part Native American! CreekDog Sep 2012 #163
At that point he lost last night madokie Sep 2012 #169
Most Europeans are part Native American Coyotl Sep 2012 #174
Just curious if any of the MA newspapers are calling him on his definition of Native American? jwirr Sep 2012 #176

elleng

(130,870 posts)
23. Yes, but apparently he's a 'successful' thug.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:20 PM
Sep 2012

Thanks for the link. Posted it as a free-standing thread, at GD.

mimi85

(1,805 posts)
115. Just heard on Ed
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:09 PM
Sep 2012

that he backed out of their planned debate tonight. Says he has work to do in the Senate.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
118. no!! he tried that and Harry Reid cancelled the evening's votes so brown had no excuse
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:13 PM
Sep 2012

Reid did it on purpose!!

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
2. oh--not a perfect quote, by the way, i was typing and listening
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:05 PM
Sep 2012

you'll have to look up the debate notes to get an exact quote.

Fresh_Start

(11,330 posts)
5. my son is 1/32 native American, blond and blue-eyed
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:06 PM
Sep 2012

so what do people with native American heritage look like?

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
31. My best friend too and her kids, all blond and blue eyed but she's a quarter Cree
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:24 PM
Sep 2012

and her kids one-eighth.

Tracer

(2,769 posts)
168. We recently found out that my kids are part Nanticoke.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 09:00 AM
Sep 2012

And my son was the blondest toddler you'd ever find.

Brown's petty remarks were completely offensive.

159. Lots, I think
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:16 PM
Sep 2012

I wrote in another thread that I have some Native American (Cherokee) blood in my family, and all the males look strictly Caucasian, while the females tend to have Cherokee features.

mercuryblues

(14,530 posts)
173. I certainly was
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:31 AM
Sep 2012

My great-grandmother was Indian. The discrimination was so horrid that when she gave birth to her kids, the mother's name was left blank on their birth certificates. My Grandmother married an Irishman. I have auburn hair and blue eyes my youngest has red hair and blue eyes, who is certainly part Indian. Like Warren, I have never bothered to get Indian 'certification'. In brown's world, because I do not have dark skin [I hear you can get that out of a bottle] I cannot possibly be part Indian.
My ancestors were discriminated against because of their skin color and now according to the smug bastid, their struggles should be meaningless to me because of their descendant’s skin color.

laundry_queen

(8,646 posts)
175. Yes.
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:50 AM
Sep 2012

My cousin, who is 1/4 First Nations/Native Canadian has blond hair and blue eyes. She does have some features that are classified as stereotypical native, but still. Blond hair and blue eyes - her dad is Metis and his mom was Icelandic so it's not a mystery why she looks that way. I can see one more generation and the 'features' could well be completely gone. Moral is: You can't tell by looking. Does anyone remember, on America's next top model once there was one girl who was tall, pale and blond, looked Norwegian almost, and she revealed her mom (by birth, not adoption) was African American and no one believed her. Recently she appeared on Dr. Phil (she's a hardcore addict) and her parents were on. Her mom is clearly A.A. and her sister looks black. But this girl was blond. It's never okay to make those assumptions. My SIL, who is half Jamaican, has a niece who is pale/blond.

I wonder if that moron Brown knows how genetics work. Didn't he ever learn about recessive genes? Idiot. My ex and I both have brown eyes and 3 of our 4 kids have green or green/hazel eyes. Doesn't mean they aren't my kids. My ex's dad has blue eyes and my dad has green eyes. So no real mystery if you're smart enough to understand rececessive genes.

librechik

(30,674 posts)
6. Scott--maybe she should have spray painted her face brown for you like Rmoney did
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:06 PM
Sep 2012

would that satisfy you?

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,681 posts)
8. Oh, dear...
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:07 PM
Sep 2012

I think at one time she said her family told her they had a Native American ancestor, so she's maybe 1/8 at most Native American. Was she supposed to show up wearing a feather headdress and beaded moccasins? What was he talking about? Is he racist or just stupid?

shanti

(21,675 posts)
149. that's the same combination
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:40 PM
Sep 2012

as my ex-husband. he was at least 1/4 choctaw, plus some cherokee. you could definitely tell his indian ancestry by looking at him, though.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
54. Exactly. And the tribe she descends from is the Delaware, who allow for lineal descent as
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:33 PM
Sep 2012

the only qualifier, regardless of how little %age you are. But her family had lots of stories handed down telling of how life was when they were known as basically half-breeds in their area, they got trouble from both whites AND natives with more pure ancestry.

hedgehog

(36,286 posts)
81. I think that is an important reminder - there were a lot of families who "passed"
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:46 PM
Sep 2012

as white and concealed the Indian part of their heritage back before the 70's when the American Indian Movement stepped forward.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
132. There was great shame attached to being part or all native American for most of the past 200 years.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:03 PM
Sep 2012

Warren's own family had some folks who embraced it, and many more who tried to deny it.

TheCowsCameHome

(40,168 posts)
16. This, from the whiniest crybaby in the US senate
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:11 PM
Sep 2012

Brown plays the part of the proverbial victim quite well.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
49. Tell me about it. I am so sick of being bombarded with his television ads where is whining about
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:32 PM
Sep 2012

how Elizabeth is lyyyying about him and what he represents. Actually, she hasn't been hard enough on him. She actually says in one ad that he's not a bad guy and that he doesn't always vote the wrong way, but then goes on to list his shortcomings. Pretty tame if you ask me.

I also can't stand his fake "folksy" ads where he tries to portray himself a an all around good guy, family man and champion of the underdog. He basically says nothing of substance, it's all show. He keeps talking about being an "Independent" candidate and voter which is highly misleading. He's a Republican and should be taken to task for trying to mislead the undecided.

TheCowsCameHome

(40,168 posts)
91. I'm sick of seeing Mr. Mom's face all over the media.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:52 PM
Sep 2012

I'm surprised he didn't bake fresh cookies for Jon Keller.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
19. Warren: "I will not vote to increase taxes on working families, ever."
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:16 PM
Sep 2012

I will not vote to increase on working families ever.

Brown will defend the top percentages.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
25. This is about taking a balanced approach--warren
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:21 PM
Sep 2012

brown: accuses her of placing blame and raising taxes. He is accusing of doing things she has never done (since she has not held office).

1-Old-Man

(2,667 posts)
26. Warren continuing to attack him on his record, he continues to change the subject
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:22 PM
Sep 2012

She is well prepared, hitting him on his voting record, while he just stammers the same old platitudes.

wryter2000

(46,039 posts)
69. It's that awful thing
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:40 PM
Sep 2012

That allows employers refuse coverage for any health issue they have some vague problem with.

Marrah_G

(28,581 posts)
29. Yanno.......
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:23 PM
Sep 2012

I'm an 1/8 NA and I am pale with tons of freckles, red hair and have never had a tan in my life. Looking at me you would never know I had anything but scot/english blood.

His picking on this particular thing is just irritating and juvenile at this point

1-Old-Man

(2,667 posts)
36. She continues to nail him with his own voting record
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:26 PM
Sep 2012

She is fact filled, he is just blowing smoke with probes at the emotion.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
37. Warren keeps returning to facts and refers to where her info comes from
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:26 PM
Sep 2012

He keeps accusing her of being obssessed, lying, making stuff up and he does not refer to many facts.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
44. OH MY GOD. What a fucker. Her Delaware tribe roots are back in Ohio in the very early 1800s. I did
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:30 PM
Sep 2012

her genealogy to look into this. The Delaware/Lenni Lenape were the first to sign a peace treaty with the new USA in the late 1700s, and they were relocated to Ohio from western NY. She also has a lot of WASP blood.

The Delaware include in their tribe anyone who can show lineal descent. It does not require any particular percentage like 1/8 or 1/16. A photo of I think her g-grandfather looks VERY Native American.

Scott Brown is an ignorant, racist asshole.

bluesbassman

(19,372 posts)
47. Screw Brown! My son (1/8th) had a teacher say that to him...
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:32 PM
Sep 2012

He was in an ASL class and signed to one of his classmates "NA". When the teacher asked him what he was doing, he replied "I said I was Native American". The teacher said nothing, but the next day he pulled my son in front of the class and said that he had checked the school records and found nothing indicating Native American and accused him of lying about his heritage. My son was stunned and didn't respond, but it made him angry as he's very proud of his heritage. My wife has always been careful to make sure that "Native American" was indicated in the kid's school registrations, but apparently someone forgot to transcribe it to his permanent record at H.S. When he came home that night and told us what happened I went ballistic. First I called the school and made an appointment with the principal, then I called my son's uncle, the Chairman of their tribe, and asked to get a copy of my son's tribal registration. His uncle did more than that; he composed a beautiful two page letter about intolerance and the bigotry the tribe has experienced over the years, and how hard they have worked to overcome the negative attitudes.

You should have seen the look on the teacher's face when he was presented with the letter and a copy of my son's tribal registration. Of course he apologized, but before letting him off the hook, I berated him for making false accusations and for humiliating my son in front of his classmates.

BTW, here's my wife, son, and daughter at a tribe function a couple years back.

Bryn

(3,621 posts)
125. OMG
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:29 PM
Sep 2012

Your son is one of the best looking guys I'd ever saw in my life! I can see Native American in him clearly!

Wow! Arf! Arf! Arf!

TuxedoKat

(3,818 posts)
177. How awful
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:58 AM
Sep 2012

that that happened to your son. I hope the teacher apologized to him in front of the class too. As an aside, your son is a very handsome young man!

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
65. "I don't think that's what Senator Kennedy fought for" Warren slaps down Brown for using Kennedy to
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:36 PM
Sep 2012

make a point.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
66. Brown: I would have voted for lily ledbetter" warren follows: he voted against equal pay
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:37 PM
Sep 2012

she is slapping him down with his voting record over and over. fact after fact.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
71. Warren: "All three of my brothers served in the military. I know what families do when (people are
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:41 PM
Sep 2012

deployed".

She demands a whole plan, entry, fight, exit in place before you go to war.

brown: "We can't have a nuanced approach. Warren (Iran) asks for a nuanced approach."

He says he is drawing a line in the sand for Iran. (referring to going back to washington to work)

Warren: "We cannot have a nuclear Iran. I think Obama has done a good job.... He has taken nothing off the table and that's the best way. "

chelsea0011

(10,115 posts)
50. Mass Citizens For Life supports you in this election Brown. There is no
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:32 PM
Sep 2012

way they support a pro choice candidate. Nice try.

wryter2000

(46,039 posts)
51. He says he's pro-choice n/t
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:33 PM
Sep 2012

She's bringing up his record...voted against equal pay for equal work, against health coverage for birth control. Has been endorsed by anti-choice groups.

Bastard "Stop scaring women, professor."

He's talking a "conscience exemption." Asshole

wryter2000

(46,039 posts)
58. Agreed
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:34 PM
Sep 2012

He voted for the Blunt amendment.

She's hammering him on that (employeers can refuse to cover birth control for vague reasons of "conscience&quot

He's quoting the Chamber of Commerce on this issue??!!

1-Old-Man

(2,667 posts)
63. She is defining every issue, and this broadcast will draw crucial assessment
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:36 PM
Sep 2012

She's killing him in this debate because she is actually debating.

Blaukraut

(5,693 posts)
70. Even on the foreign policy/military question EW wins
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:41 PM
Sep 2012

She puts a human face on missions before going into policy, by mentioning soldiers and families

1-Old-Man

(2,667 posts)
74. By the way, good Moderator and two good debaters who are not talking over each other
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:42 PM
Sep 2012

Staying on subject to a pretty good extent too.

wryter2000

(46,039 posts)
80. F this bastard
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:46 PM
Sep 2012

The high cost of education is administrative costs and salaries. WTF? He made a crack about her having a free loan. Don't know what that was about.

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
84. warren ; hitting him hard for protecting loopholes over student loan interest
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:48 PM
Sep 2012

he said "She is not telling the truth". She only talks about his voting record and he calls her a liar

Blaukraut

(5,693 posts)
87. I want her to mention Mitch McConnell by name when talking about Brown's votes
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:50 PM
Sep 2012

People will visually connect Brown to McConnell, whom they do not like.

chelsea0011

(10,115 posts)
92. She should also keep telling people he is a republican, something
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:53 PM
Sep 2012

he never wants to admit. Listening to him, he wants people to think he is an independent.

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
106. He says employees injured by asbestos are not getting paid due to her work for the corporation
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:03 PM
Sep 2012

She did say the Boston Globe said it simply was not true. I don't know if the Boston Globe looked into this.

Were her parents never married due to the racial differences?

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
136. I did a search, they apparently eloped due to his family's objections, the asbestos, don't know the
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:10 PM
Sep 2012

story entirely

bluestate10

(10,942 posts)
160. Fact.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 11:56 PM
Sep 2012

"One of the more aggressive charges from Brown came when he accused Warren of taking the side of a giant insurance company against asbestos victims. It's true that Warren worked as an expert for Travelers Insurance in a major asbestos case, but she was working to create a $500 million trust for current and future victims, as well as to preserve a key element of the bankruptcy code, the Boston Globe has reported. She and Travelers were successful in that effort, but after Warren left the case, Travelers managed to wriggle out of its $500 million payment, hurting victims desperately."

Bombtrack

(9,523 posts)
89. I really wish Warren would point out what the US Chamber of Commerce and NFIB are
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:50 PM
Sep 2012

(Partisan, rich, right wing lobbyists and not "independent groups" as Senator Zoolander was characterizing them as.)

wryter2000

(46,039 posts)
90. He says he believes in climate change
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:52 PM
Sep 2012

"Some man-made and some natural."

He's for the Keystone Pipeline.

JohnA1

(67 posts)
104. Warren won....
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:00 PM
Sep 2012

Brown seemed arrogant and wanted to run from his record. Warren was calm, composed and had the facts on her side and I like how she reminded everyone that control of the Senate is at stake.

Man do I hope she wins!

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
110. She won if what he said about Asbestos is not true
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:06 PM
Sep 2012

To me he came across as schmarmy, the only thing he kept saying was Warren would raise taxes, that's her solution to everything he says.

 

RBInMaine

(13,570 posts)
112. Love how she said "You can't have it both ways. An R when fundraising but not when campaigning. No."
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:07 PM
Sep 2012

Raine

(30,540 posts)
102. WTF does he "think" Native Americans look like? Do they all have paint on their faces and
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 07:58 PM
Sep 2012

feathers in their black hair (???), how are they supposed to look? What a disgusting racist statement!

DonRedwood

(4,359 posts)
103. WRAP UP: wow... Warren was collected and smooth, VERY factual. Brown got worked up and
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:00 PM
Sep 2012

repeated a lot of catch phrases to refute her facts.

He was emotional and went for reaction. She made note of where her info came from and did not rely on many catchphrases. She said she was in full support of Obama several times. Brown never mentioned what's-his-name, the ex-governor of the state (that I recall). (quite telling, that)

If I was judging a college debate I would judge in Warren's favor.

reformist2

(9,841 posts)
105. I hate to say it, but I think Scott Brown won that debate.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:01 PM
Sep 2012

A lot of snide remarks, yes, but they were very effective. The asbestos charge, the $375,000 salary for teaching one class, those charges hurt, and went unanswered.
 

RBInMaine

(13,570 posts)
108. She did fine. He came across like a total and complete fucking asshole. SUNK himself with women.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:04 PM
Sep 2012

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
113. I agree these things will land a blow, however she briefly said the asbestos charge was not true, I
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:08 PM
Sep 2012

hope he can prove it's not true

 

dkf

(37,305 posts)
134. Elizabeth Warren was key in asbestos case
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:09 PM
Sep 2012

It was also notable because Warren, who has gained fame for defending consumers against big business, was in this case working on behalf of a big business. For her contribution, Warren was paid $212,000 over three years by Travelers, the nation’s largest insurer.

Travelers was fighting to gain permanent immunity from asbestos-related lawsuits by establishing a $500 million trust. The trust would have been divided among current and future victims of asbestos poisoning who had claims against the nation’s largest asbestos manufacturer, Johns-Manville, which had been insured by Travelers before it went bankrupt.

Travelers won most of what it wanted from the Supreme Court, and in doing so Warren helped preserve an element of bankruptcy law that ensured that victims of large-scale corporate malfeasance would have a better chance of getting compensated, even when the responsible companies go bankrupt.

But after Warren left the case, it continued to twist and turn through the legal system, leaving a result that has been disastrous for asbestos victims. Travelers, in part because of its Supreme Court victory, has held onto its immunity from most lawsuits. But a ruling on Feb. 29 in a separate court has taken the company off the hook for paying out the $500 million settlement.

http://articles.boston.com/2012-05-01/metro/31499452_1_asbestos-case-asbestos-victims-travelers

Looks like it didn't work out how she may have planned.

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
147. Thank you for the link, we should all familiarize ourselves with the case. Nobody could have
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:25 PM
Sep 2012

foreseen the case with Chubb would have the effect it did on the trust... the judge who issued that ruling was just wrong.

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
161. I honestly don't think so unless Chubb and Travelers were in collusion and just got a judge who
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 12:05 AM
Sep 2012

randomly threw the trust out, did I read that's the firs time that's happened? I think she was certainly acting in good faith, and hopefully appeals will work in the victims favor and she even said that.

1-Old-Man

(2,667 posts)
116. I don' think so. Viewers for a Senate debate are critical analysts, not looking for a circus
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:09 PM
Sep 2012

She stuck to script, she kept hammering him on his hard record, how he voted. A critical audience will appreciate that as compared to the sort of riff-raff that will watch a Presidential debate hoping it will break out into wrestling match or something. Debate watchers at this level tend to appreciate fact more than the emotional appeal that Brown kept trying to capture. That's my take on it anyway.

jsmirman

(4,507 posts)
142. My impression is that MA people like to watch a good scrap
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:20 PM
Sep 2012

just like us New Yorkers.

I'm open to correction, although I feel like I know Mass about as well as I know any state I'm not from.

jsmirman

(4,507 posts)
156. I hope so
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 10:11 PM
Sep 2012

I mean, let's be honest, of course I think you're all massholes...



But being real, I felt like Brown was really playing up his Mass accent and needed to be slapped down on his claim that egregious oil subsidies lead to any difference at all at the pump.

I know that Mass is an educated electorate, but Brown did portray an easy guy charm, imo, and I was distressed by Warren's seeming unwillingness to directly engage.

That debate format was so purely Northeast, and I was concerned people would think, come on, take him on.

 

fascisthunter

(29,381 posts)
180. she will... she set him up and placed him on the defensive about his record
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 07:25 PM
Sep 2012

...from here on out, we will be hearing more.

Talking like a Masshole may work on some, but not all of us.

 

julian09

(1,435 posts)
128. Her first teaching job was for $18,000 she worked her way up.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:39 PM
Sep 2012

AND she will be taking a big pay cut to become senator. that is dedication.

jsmirman

(4,507 posts)
111. I found her frustrating
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:07 PM
Sep 2012

it may be that I'm hungry and cranky.

But she looked to me like exhibit #1 why I have always thought that "debate people" and the ridiculous game of playing at "debate" is worthless.

It's a damn knife fight.

I still don't have an answer to the question of did she defend insurance companies against paying out claims - I'm sure it's not that there is not an answer, but you better give a fucking answer.

I thought that too many times she talked past things that needed to be answered. Debates may be about point accumulation - a debate for a political office is about attacking and defending.

I saw his charm, too, which was disturbing.

Please keep in mind I am a *strong* Warren supporter.

Why the *fuck* would she not make the point that billions in oil subsidies DO NOT TRANSLATE TO SAVINGS AT THE PUMP?

It's like she couldn't or wouldn't bring it down to a knife fight.

rhiannon55

(2,671 posts)
121. I wondered if it was just me
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:23 PM
Sep 2012

I love her, but I was frustrated when she didn't answer his charges. It always annoys me when politicians sidestep a question or don't answer a charge in a straightforward way, even if it's MY politician doing it.

reformist2

(9,841 posts)
122. Yep, he was in attack mode, she was in debate society mode.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:25 PM
Sep 2012

She may have won on points. But average voters don't keep track of debate points.
 

fascisthunter

(29,381 posts)
114. I watched the debate... she won by pointing out his RECORD on voting
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:08 PM
Sep 2012

and for being on the side of the rich and wealthy. He was all over the place when she did that. Anyone with half a brain could see his heated reactions, and how was just flinging shit at a wall to distract viewers from his own record.

 

WilliamPitt

(58,179 posts)
127. Boorish
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:37 PM
Sep 2012

Boorish: implies rudeness of manner due to insensitiveness to others' feelings and unwillingness to be agreeable.

The word you're going to read about Scott Brown's performance in the debate tonight.

Think Lazio v. Clinton in 2000.

RebelOne

(30,947 posts)
145. Maybe he has never been to an Indian pow-wow.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:20 PM
Sep 2012

I go yearly to the one in Canton, GA. And it is a big yearly event. There are plenty of blond-blue-eyed Native Americans there. My former daughter-in-law was part Cherokee and her skin was as fair as mine and I am a blonde. She had dark hair though.

Jennicut

(25,415 posts)
150. Lots of twitter folks are calling Scott Brown one word: condescending
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:45 PM
Sep 2012

He came off as smarmy, a jerk and very patronizing and condescending to Elizabeth Warren. I sure hope this helps Elizabeth Warren even more. My neighbors to the north in Mass deserve a good senator even if the second I drive across the state line you people drive like crazies and beep non stop. I will forgive you for the Mass Turnpike tolls.

NotThisTime

(3,657 posts)
162. Those are exactly the words I used in describing him to my husband who did not watch the debate
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 12:14 AM
Sep 2012

Glad I'm not the only one. Oh, and score one for the good guys, after Bush and Romney my Husband votes a straight Dem ticket.... We used to be Independent voters, when moderation wasn't a bad word. I was never an Inde after Mitt, he continued with Bush, I don't know how our marriage survived that.... but he's a strong Dem now

Terra Alta

(5,158 posts)
151. I have a cousin who is 1/2 Native American and 1/2 White.
Thu Sep 20, 2012, 09:49 PM
Sep 2012

She has very light skin, red hair, and freckles. You can't tell just by looking at her that she's half Native American.

Scott Brown is an idiot.

CreekDog

(46,192 posts)
163. She's from Oklahoma, it would be a surprise if she wasn't part Native American!
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 12:23 AM
Sep 2012

what a freaking idiot!

madokie

(51,076 posts)
169. At that point he lost last night
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 09:15 AM
Sep 2012

no matter if he was slick here or seemingly intelligent there he had already lost. Did he cut his losses and go on, no he doubled down. He's about as slimy as they come. How anyone can still like him after his acceptance speech where he tried to sell his daughters off to the highest bidder. or it sound that way to me. blurting out, Yes they're available. From that and that alone tells me everything I need to know about the man. He's vacuous, an empty suit on steroids.
All needs to be said for Elizabeth is she is smart, pleasant and talks honestly with facts and was not intimated by his coming out and pouncing on her like he did and kept doing. I love her and hope she wins. I don't live there but she'll be good for me way over here in flyover land no matter.

 

Coyotl

(15,262 posts)
174. Most Europeans are part Native American
Fri Sep 21, 2012, 10:37 AM
Sep 2012

because Native Americans began to move to Europe over 500 years ago. Do the math, Scott. Some of the Pilgrims may have been moving home, albeit England was quiet separate from the Spanish realm.

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