NFL REf: up to $120,000 a season (for 32 hours TOTAL of game time) Teachers?

[DonRedwood]

Next time you hear someone complain about how a teacher makes too much, point that out to them.

A first year garbage man makes more than a first year teacher here.

Figure in the cost of education and student loans and...well...you pay more to take out your garbage than to teach your kids.

http://ask.yahoo.com/20070105.html

[99Forever]

1. While I'm...

... not much of a football fan, especially the NFL, I think it's a big mistake and playing right into the 1% Big Corporate's ANTI-Union BULLSHIT to diss on ANY Union getting a good deal for their members.

Do the words "Divide and conquer" mean anything to you?

Nor am I going to minimize the importance of teachers or the need for them to have STRONG union representation.

[Logical]

18. You REALLY think the NFL players or the Referees are like the UAW? LOL. n-t

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

22. The world can be divided

into owners and workers. Just 'cause some workers make a shitload of money doesn't mean they shouldn't be organized.......

[Logical]

40. Laughing at people who think millionaire football unions are like real unions. And you!

[99Forever]

41. Well wiseguy...

... looks like I'm not the only one who sees right thru you. Run along and hump someone else's leg, I'm done wasting words with you.

[Logical]

42. LOL, you got nothing. I get it. n-t

[Teamster Jeff]

43. NFL players, Truck Drivers, Teachers, Carpenters, nurses etc..

all belong to Labor Unions. Unions are legally recognized to represent these workers in collective bargaining for wages, benefits and
working conditions as well as disputes with management over contract provisions. That is how they are the same. Comparing the negotiated wages, benefits and working conditions in different industries is pointless.

[Logical]

44. But they do not support each other the same. That is the point.

[Teamster Jeff]

46. Letter from NFL player association to NFL owners

TO: Owners of NFL Teams

FROM: NFLPA Executive Committee

DATE: September 20, 2012

RE: Your Lockout of the NFL Referees and the Negative Impact on Football


The NFL Players Association Executive Committee is calling on you to end the lockout of our referees. We believe there is substantial evidence that you have failed in your obligation to provide as safe a working environment as possible.

Your decision to lock out officials with more than 1,500 years of collective NFL experience has led to a deterioration of order, safety and integrity. This affirmative decision has not only resulted in poor calls, missed calls and bad game management, but the combination of those deficiencies will only continue to jeopardize player health and safety and the integrity of the game that has taken decades to build.

As we predicted and explained to you weeks ago, the removal of the veteran officials from regular season games left a group of your replacements who have proved to be incapable of keeping pace with the speed of the game. Coaches and players have complained of numerous errors and failures including: erratic and missed calls on egregious holds and hits, increased skirmishes between players and confusion about game rules. Many replacements have lost control of games due to inexperience and unfamiliarity with players and rules.

The headlines are embarrassing: a scab working a game despite having been on the payroll of one of the teams, another who was assigned to referee a team he publicly supported on Facebook, and one who is a professional poker player when you propose even more stringent player rules on gambling.

It is lost on us as to how you allow a Commissioner to cavalierly issue suspensions and fines in the name of player health and safety yet permit the wholesale removal of the officials that you trained and entrusted to maintain that very health and safety. It has been reported that the two sides are apart by approximately $60,000 per team. We note that your Commissioner has fined an individual player as much in the name of “safety.” Your actions are looking more and more like simple greed. As players, we see this game as more than the “product” you reference at times. You cannot simply switch to a group of cheaper officials and fulfill your legal, moral, and duty obligations to us and our fans. You need to end the lockout and bring back the officials immediately.

We are all men who love and respect this game and believe that it represents something beyond just money. For our teammates, our coaches and our fans who deserve better, vote to end this lockout now.

Sincerely,



Domonique Foxworth, NFLPA President

Charlie Batch, NFLPA Vice President, Pittsburgh Steelers

Cornelius Bennett, NFLPA Former Players Board of Directors Chairman

Drew Brees, NFLPA Vice President, New Orleans Saints

Brian Dawkins, NFLPA Vice President

Scott Fujita, NFLPA Vice President, Cleveland Browns

Matt Hasselbeck, NFLPA Vice President, Tennessee Titans

Brandon Moore, NFLPA Vice President, New York Jets

Jeff Saturday, NFLPA Vice President, Green Bay Packers

Mickey Washington, NFLPA Former Players Board of Directors Member

Brian Waters, NFLPA Vice President, New England Patriots

Benjamin Watson, NFLPA Vice President, Cleveland Browns

[Logical]

47. A letter? WOW! They played the games. And have crossed picket lines to play games.

[Teamster Jeff]

48. Players have a "no strike" clause in their contract

Article 3, Section 1 of the NFL's collective-bargaining agreement states "neither the NFLPA nor any of its members will engage in any strike, work stoppage, or other concerted action interfering with the operations of the NFL or any Club for the duration of this Agreement". So the players not playing was not going to happen.

However, a federal law permits workers to refuse to work in "abnormally dangerous conditions". The letter and individual statements from players were hinting/pressuring owners from that angle.

It turned out well for the refs as they got what they wanted. You seem kind of full of shit, do you know anything about unions other than you don't like them?

[Logical]

50. Grew up in a union family, and know what a real union looks like! You and your...

Fucking star struck NFL players shit does not help matters!


Support "real" unions!

[Drahthaardogs]

38. What is sad is that you cannot see that it matters not the amount

what matters is that others are getting rich off of another's person's elite skills and labor and does not want to give a fair percentage to the person's whose neck is on the line.

[hifiguy]

2. Apples and oranges.

The NFL is a private organization that makes billions of dollars. Its union officials should get as good a deal as they possibly can. It doesn't take a penny out of anyone's pocket but the NFL owners.

That said, teachers deserve far better than they are getting.

[CreekDog]

9. I think teachers should be paid as well as those who make our weapons

That's always been my standard.

I also think that our classrooms should be as nice and as well-equipped as the offices of our defense contractors.

[maxsolomon]

3. Yes, teachers are underpaid.

But an NFL doesn't just work the game time. And 120k/year is nothing compared to the 1.75 million average player salary, or the 10 million salary Roger Goddell draws.

This entire strike was over getting rid of the pension program and transitioning to a 401K.

Your post implies that NFL refs aren't worth what they're paid. They are.

Teachers are worth far more than they're paid.

[musiclawyer]

4. I agree: the implication being that they are not entitled to their pay

These refs do highly specialized work. They must be good and must be immune to corruption. They deserve every penny. But that's not to say teachers are not underpaid. They are underpaid. Sometimes grossly. So are a lot of other civil servants like cops. The generous benefits the receive to make up for the low wages are being taken away as we speak. So it's not an either or situation.

We need a higher minimum wage, and we need strong unions, public and private. The NFL refs are just a small part of the equation. Condemning the refs union is a slipperly slope. Just because you don't like football or soccer etc, does not mean those refs deserve meager wages and benefits. If you start thinking that way then ANYTHING you don't like arguably deserves meager wages, ie. teachers, snooty waiters etc....... And that's just wrong on a macro level

[Bradical79]

6. It was a lockout rather than strike, but it looks like it's ending.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/nfl-referees-reach-agreement-end-lockout/story?id=17334799#.UGRx9U3A-2E

The refs got the upper hand after a pretty embarrassing weekend for the replacement officials. A big difference between scabs in football and regular jobs is that they perform on national TV where your entire consumer market sees every single mistake. One bad weekend leads to a complete turnaround in fan and media perception for the league, lol.

[maxsolomon]

13. i keep saying strike when i know it was a lockout.

i'm in Seattle, and the second that play got signalled a TD, i said "the lockout's OVER"!

[Blue_Tires]

34. Also, remember the NFL refs all have "real" jobs and careers in the offseason

They deserve what they're getting, but this deal was not going to be the difference between their families eating or starving...Just wanted to make that distinction...

[Brother Buzz]

5. NFL referees officiate 32 games a year?

[ProdigalJunkMail]

7. No... the poster assumes 32 hours

based on what I don't know...

they also don't take into account the training and prep time.

but hey...

sP

[The Second Stone]

8. Refs also have to travel to cities for games

and be there before and after the game. The headline is misleading. It's like saying pro NFL players only work 18 hours a season. Wrong. Lots of prep time. Same with refs.

[sadbear]

10. The refs deserve their cut.

The NFL makes a lot of money. Let's make sure it goes to those on the field working, not the guys up in the luxury boxes.

[Capt. Obvious]

11. For all of the money I make gambling on teachers to win/lose their state tests

damn straight they need to make referee kind of money.

And don't even get me started on the lucrative tv deals school owners made

[CreekDog]

12. Don, teachers, NFL refs and garbagemen are nearly all union and all on the same side

don't you try to drive a wedge in there.

these are natural allies and should be.

i believe in more power, more pay and more respect to teachers.

[Logical]

19. LOL....you are either kidding or clueless as hell.....

You really think the NFL players are like the UAW? Really?

You honestly think the NFL players would not cross a construction workers picket line? Really?

[JI7]

20. he said Refs, not the players

[Logical]

21. OK, you think they would walk past a picket line on the way to a game? Yes or No?

[JI7]

23. i don't know

are you talking about refs or players ?

[Logical]

24. Either.

[JI7]

26. i think players can be spoiled

and owners are greedy so i don't expect much from them. it might depend on certain players.

don't know about refs but i see that more likely than players.

[CreekDog]

28. I wasn't talking about the players --but you weren't reading my post...nevertheless

the players were the strongest advocates for the officials anyway.

but what you're doing is a big distraction from the main point:

the NFL refs are working people making a good wage, but are by no means wealthy from those jobs.

they should be natural allies with teachers, pilots, garbage collectors, etc. *all* of these professions should pay not just adequately but should pay well and afford a nice living owing to the importance of the jobs as well and/or the difficulty of them involved.

but go on about some other tangent you want to follow --just let it be known that it's *your* tangent not mine.

[JI7]

14. no need to put down people in those other professions

they deserve to make that much.

a better comparison would be the corporate whores who get huge salary plus bonuses when their business goes loses money.

[Tom Rinaldo]

15. Uh, Players? Owners? n/t

[Spike89]

16. I'd say apples and bricks

It is the same argument that starts with "Beiber/Gaga/next-in-line make $millions and teachers eat dog food". It is also related to the "NASA gets billions while kids starve in Africa" argument. I'm from a family of teachers, work in a teacher-oriented non-profit, and believe teachers are woefully underappreciated and underpaid. That said, specialized and rare jobs will always get more money than people working common jobs. Doesn't have anything to do with worth, never will.

Besides, the NFL refs are not the universe of referees that get paid. Take the top 100 best paid educators in the US and compare their salaries to the top 100 best paid referees and even though I still think the comparison is apples to oranges, you'd possibly be surprised that top-level superintendents make a lot of money, deservedly so. You'll also find that "professional" refs working say a high school game or even small college games don't make much at all.

[bluestate10]

17. That comparison can be made about many jobs versus teachers, police officers, ect.

Why does a pro football player make a minimum of over 400k? Why do CEOs make millions per year. If you think NFL Refs make too much and teachers too little, stop attending games and watching games and send the money that you save to your local School Board. Priorities in society will change only when each of us make a personal decision to change them.

[cthulu2016]

25. What is the highest paid tenured college professor paid?

No point not comparing the top to the top.

I'll bet the people who referee high school football games make less than high school teachers. (like, $0)

[PeaceNikki]

27. From Deadspin last week:

You hear the same phrasing over and over again from these kind of missives. "A fair contract." "A fair offer." To the commenters above, NFL owners are kind and generous souls who lovingly bequeathed a portion of their largesse to these ungrateful, pathetic, non-job-creating refs. HOW DARE THEY NOT EAT THE OWNERS' SHIT? This happened during the player lockout a year ago. There were plenty of anti-union folks who thought the filthy peasants at the NFLPA should have been happy with ANYTHING Roger Goodell threw their way. To not accept a "fair offer" was tantamount to ruining America.

People try to frame business struggles like this in moral terms. The refs are greedy! They only work part-time! They have other jobs! People talk about shit like this as if it matters. As if having one job means you don't have the right to try and get more money at another job. That's complete bullshit. This is America. If you have a unique skill set, and you think can leverage more money out of someone who wants your services, there's NOTHING wrong with that. If you think the NFL will eventually cave simply because the league doesn't want its brand to suffer from all the shitty refereeing, you might lose, but you're not being un-American. There's nothing more American than trying to squeeze other motherfuckers for every last penny. There are no "fair" offers. There is only the best offer, and it's your goddamn right to see if you can get it. There's this bizarre mentality that there are only, like, six productive people in the country, all of whom are billionaires. They rest of us simply make money at their behest. Forget 47 percent. I'm talking about virtually everyone being devalued. I don't really know how it came to that, because it's so innately fucked up. If you think you have a skill worth leveraging against the Ginger Hammer and his big stupid face, you have every right to see it through.

http://deadspin.com/5944876/if-you-support-the-scab-refs-because-of-your-politics-youre-either-a-moron-a-profootballtalk-commenter-or-both?tag=jamboroo

Teachers should be paid more, no doubt. However these are not fair comparisons.

[xchrom]

29. I'm not gonna be divided on this horseshit.

Pay scales are are not where you can divide from workers sticking up for themselves.

Teachers getting paid more has nothing to do with these workers getting their fair share from the NFL owners.

[October]

31. So true! I hate these "divide" threads.

It's annoying that we're supposed to compare jobs and people. There's a lot more involved to ref'ing than one might think, but we're obviously supposed to be appalled that refs make more than most teachers.

I'm appalled at a lot of things, but why attack "the guy" one wrung above you -- they're still in the 99%.

[cottonseed]

32. Teachers are worth more than people in sanitation?

[October]

33. I know. I find this line of comparison and division to be infuriating.

Teachers in Bucks County, PA make more money than a lot of teachers in the country, and good for them! Am I now supposed to reference their salaries in annoyance, and shout, "Bucks County teachers make more than "xyz" County teachers"?

NFL refs deserve a decent salary, too, as do sanitation workers!

[Blecht]

35. I really hate these anti-worker threads

I wish they didn't appear at DU, but they do.

[trumad]

36. Really really a stupid OP

They work 36 hours a week....

They are highly trained professionals....

and the league they work for is a multi-Billion dollar enterprise.

Oh but lets diss them because they get what they deserve.

again---dumb op of the week award.

[davidn3600]

37. Difference is that the NFL brings in $9 billion a year

And there are far, far less NFL officials in the country than public school teachers.

Not saying teachers don't deserve it. But governments would go broke if they paid teachers this much money. Schools are largely financed through local and state taxes. And these governments are struggling to stay afloat as it is.

[obamanut2012]

39. All of the people you mention are labor

As are the NFL players, who were very sympathetic to the refs' lockout. ALL labor deserves more money, more respect, and better benefits, no matter what they make.

Refs work more than 32 hours a year. I don;t know where you go that from.

Your OP is a dividing labor tactic, whether or not you are aware of it.

SOLIDARITY!!!

[Yavin4]

45. American Laborers Should Stop Complaining about What Other American Laborers Make

and start asking their employers why they don't make more.

[dionysus]

49. distraction; the players make many many millions a season, the owners moreso.

[LeftyMom]

51. That's a lot of corn nuts.

[Renew Deal]

52. NFL referees are 40+ hour a week "part time" employees

They spend a great deal of time away from home and involved in football responsibilities. They don't just show up and do their games. Also, there are only 119, partly because they have a specific skill.