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LaMouffette

(2,013 posts)
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 08:45 PM Nov 2020

He has fired Esper. Can Trump fire the Joint Chiefs of Staff and replace them with his loyalists?

We have learned over the past four years that Trump will do ANYTHING in an attempt to get his way. He has some 70 days left in office, and I am getting a bit nervous, what with Esper's firing, and McConnell now seeming to back Trump's refusal to concede, and Martha McSally refusing to concede, and Bill Barr now saying he will start investigations into voter fraud, and the Trump supporters' Million "Maggot" March on Saturday.

Could he be trying to instigate an actual military coup? I don't want to be alarmist. I hope that other DU posters are right and that this is just to create chaos and keep his supporters roiled up so that they vote in the Georgia runoff. I am just looking for reassurance that this is not possible and we will be rid of that repulsive sack of pus on January 20, 2021.

19 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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He has fired Esper. Can Trump fire the Joint Chiefs of Staff and replace them with his loyalists? (Original Post) LaMouffette Nov 2020 OP
I think he can BlueNIndiana Nov 2020 #1
Trump is trying three ways to stay in power BlueNIndiana Nov 2020 #2
The GOP majority leader in PA said they will not overrule popular vote and the will of the ppl Thekaspervote Nov 2020 #9
The hard line GOP of the state want an audit some are calling for more (Today) BlueNIndiana Nov 2020 #13
Yikes. Guess I won't be getting much sleep tonight! LaMouffette Nov 2020 #3
I am not saying it will happen but it could. BlueNIndiana Nov 2020 #5
What would Putin recommend? Buckeye_Democrat Nov 2020 #4
trump was mad at Esper for questioning his use of military during protests. Hoyt Nov 2020 #6
Thanks for the reassurance. I will try to channel Biden and Harris's calm confidence that LaMouffette Nov 2020 #7
If not the two thousandth Thekaspervote Nov 2020 #10
Absolutely BGBD Nov 2020 #15
The military won't follow his orders that go against democracy AmericanCanuck Nov 2020 #8
Yes! Military leaders everywhere were quite clear in written statements following the DC protests Thekaspervote Nov 2020 #11
I agree . LSFL Nov 2020 #12
But there are cult 45 members in the military MyMission Nov 2020 #14
rank and file cannot make decisions AmericanCanuck Nov 2020 #16
Understood, but who's orders will they be following? MyMission Nov 2020 #17
Whom Presidents can fire iSquire Dec 2020 #18
So he could indeed fire the Joint Chiefs of Staff between now and Inauguration Day. *Gulp!* LaMouffette Dec 2020 #19
 

BlueNIndiana

(94 posts)
2. Trump is trying three ways to stay in power
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 08:52 PM
Nov 2020

Have the courts overturn the election

Have the republican legislatuers seat different electors. ( I know the law says no but that doesnt matter to the GOP).

Last but not least a military coup (or at least an attempt to start one)

I knwo i sound alarmist but pundits have said Trumo can't do this, Trump can't do that. The courts or polictiaon wont allow him. During these past four years Trump has done pretty much whatever he has wanted to do.

The GOP does not beleive in democracy, period.



LaMouffette

(2,013 posts)
3. Yikes. Guess I won't be getting much sleep tonight!
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 08:55 PM
Nov 2020

Because I know it sounds like crazy-talk, firing the Joint Chiefs of Staff, but how many times have we thought, "Naaah, he wouldn't dare do that!" and then he does it. Or just surprises us out of the blue with something we never even imagined a U.S. president would do (like collude with Russia to win an election).

I hope the Biden team is already considering this worst-case scenario.

 

BlueNIndiana

(94 posts)
5. I am not saying it will happen but it could.
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 09:02 PM
Nov 2020

This is not Qanon theories.

The GOP does not exist as a party anymore its just a party of one, Trump.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
6. trump was mad at Esper for questioning his use of military during protests.
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 09:11 PM
Nov 2020

Don’t think he’s planning a military coup. It wouldn’t work anyway. This is what, the thousandth CT along these lines?

LaMouffette

(2,013 posts)
7. Thanks for the reassurance. I will try to channel Biden and Harris's calm confidence that
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 09:28 PM
Nov 2020

everything is going to be all right. They've got this!

 

BGBD

(3,282 posts)
15. Absolutely
Wed Nov 11, 2020, 03:45 AM
Nov 2020

Esper came out against that and now Trump is being petty and getting his "revenge" once it can't cost him politically.

Expect him to fire a bunch of other people too before it's over.

I don't know why he think firing someone who's going to lose their post in 10 weeks is a big deal to them, but whatever.

Thekaspervote

(32,606 posts)
11. Yes! Military leaders everywhere were quite clear in written statements following the DC protests
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 09:41 PM
Nov 2020

To enlisted soldiers that there were legal and illegal orders, they knew the difference and should follow their oath.

LSFL

(1,109 posts)
12. I agree .
Tue Nov 10, 2020, 10:30 PM
Nov 2020

Me ( to my rep military buddy) We fought people who started out with this shit.
Him: I know

Me : Ready to do it here?

Him :
I can't kill US soldiers.

Neither can I. But as for the 3 %s and cops who emulate what they see on TV?

We laugh at these ass clowns. They talk like assholes and mishandle their weapons to appear to be military per Hollywood.

I guess it depends on whose side they're on

MyMission

(1,845 posts)
14. But there are cult 45 members in the military
Wed Nov 11, 2020, 03:33 AM
Nov 2020

Both current and former; some who joined as cult members but many were activated as cult members while already serving or after they left.

I would think that being part of a cult would disqualify one from serving, since their loyalty and actions could be swayed by the cult leader, but that's not the case.

Sadly, I do see some who would consider it their duty to protect the president, their commander and chief, at all costs. But they will be taken down by those military who are not cult members, and then it will hurt the military units that will experience this.


 

AmericanCanuck

(1,102 posts)
16. rank and file cannot make decisions
Wed Nov 11, 2020, 09:58 AM
Nov 2020

There people who decide where to dig, how fast to dig and how deep to dig. Rank and file just digs - they have no say in the digging.

MyMission

(1,845 posts)
17. Understood, but who's orders will they be following?
Wed Nov 11, 2020, 03:07 PM
Nov 2020

The commander and chief? Or
Their commanding officer, who tells them to either
A) do what the president says or
B) do what I say, not the president

That's my concern. Who's giving the orders, and does the military allegiance go to the president or the country? And of course some of the grunts and enlisted will think for themselves, and may decide to act contrary to orders they don't approve of. Enlisted men have killed their commanding officers , on rare occasions.

I know some former military who are cult members. They would follow the president. They know the generals consider him dangerous, but they voted for him anyway and would protect and defend him, to keep him in power.

These are very unsettling times, as they are clearly planning a coup. I don't want to worry or think about that, but I do.

iSquire

(1 post)
18. Whom Presidents can fire
Mon Dec 14, 2020, 06:41 PM
Dec 2020

These days, Presidents can, in practice, fire:

Cabinet Secretaries and other senior Executive-Branch Officials he appointed (but until now they would usually be careful about certain positions within the DoJ)
Ambassadors and other senior Diplomats
White House political Staffers
Any Member of the military, from the topmost Generals and Admirals to the lowliest Privates

Only if a Position is Established as a Legislative, Judicial, or a dual Legislative-Executive Office which were more common in the past, or the Position comes under the Civil Service System, is it protected from a President's whim.

LaMouffette

(2,013 posts)
19. So he could indeed fire the Joint Chiefs of Staff between now and Inauguration Day. *Gulp!*
Mon Dec 14, 2020, 07:12 PM
Dec 2020

Now I'm really scared what today's firing of Bill Barr could mean. It sure seems as if Trump is clearing himself a path to doing something really horrific. Now that Barr is gone, who is left with a scintilla of intelligence and a crumb of morality to tell Trump not to do something insane like nuke Iran?

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