Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:23 AM

Goodheart (3,157 posts)

So, Moderna's vaccine is clearly superior. Will Pfizer even play a role in our recovery?

What's their stock looking like today?

34 replies, 1311 views

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34 replies	Author	Time	Post
So, Moderna's vaccine is clearly superior. Will Pfizer even play a role in our recovery? (Original post)	Goodheart	Nov 16	OP
I would think both would be used.	Happy Hoosier	Nov 16	#1
They're just working on getting the brain-controlling nanobots to be small enough. 🤣	TheBlackAdder	Nov 16	#25
HA!	Happy Hoosier	Nov 16	#28
Given the production/distribution challenges, I suspect both would be used	unblock	Nov 16	#2
Ford vs Chevrolet?	Brother Buzz	Nov 16	#3
As long as it get's you where you need to go........ virus free... nt	mitch96	Nov 16	#13
But, but Pfizer's comes with a designer suitcase, so maybe it's really Ford v Ferrari	Brother Buzz	Nov 16	#18
O000oooo I like the designer suit case...	mitch96	Nov 16	#21
I read Pfizer's can be manufactured more quickly, plus with their head start	Alhena	Nov 16	#4
88% was already pre-ordered by other countries. Plus Pfizer's has refrigeration delivery issues.	TheBlackAdder	Nov 16	#27
but is the efficacy the same or better?	Native	Nov 16	#5
I don't trust Moderna	Johnny2X2X	Nov 16	#6
And they have NEVER brought a vaccine to market	Horse with no Name	Nov 16	#14
I'm glad that didn't stop them from trying.	Steelrolled	Nov 16	#20
links on this (Kushner connections and the Moderna lying before) please TIA	Celerity	Nov 16	#16
" closely aligned with Jared," ok something stinks right there... hard stop is right!!	mitch96	Nov 16	#22
I think Pfizer can have theirs out first.	NutmegYankee	Nov 16	#7
Superior according to whom? It's a press release based on preliminary phase III trial data. nt	Cognitive_Resonance	Nov 16	#8
Clearly superior?	LisaL	Nov 16	#9
And both need to be stored at sub-zero temperatures N/T	lapucelle	Nov 16	#10
No, the Moderna one can be refrigerated	sir pball	Nov 16	#29
Yes, I saw that later. I had read (or misread) an earlier report	lapucelle	Nov 16	#34
A few percent difference in the short-term efficacy is down in the noise.	lagomorph777	Nov 16	#11
Preliminary data.	PoindexterOglethorpe	Nov 16	#12
No, not clearly superior. Both are 90%+ effective, based on	MineralMan	Nov 16	#15
I think they are about the same	Steelrolled	Nov 16	#17
This message was self-deleted by its author	pinkstarburst	Nov 16	#19
Pfizer and Moderna	Steelrolled	Nov 16	#24
Yep, Oxford uses more traditional adenovirus based technology.	LisaL	Nov 16	#31
Don't think anything has been established as being "clearly superior" and both will be released	lettucebe	Nov 16	#23
Exactly.	LisaL	Nov 16	#30
Moderna's PRESS RELEASE is clearly superior.	spanone	Nov 16	#26
Point taken.	Goodheart	Nov 16	#32
That's all we got from Pfizer too. No peer review, no FDA review.	spanone	Nov 16	#33

Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:24 AM

Happy Hoosier (2,604 posts)

1. I would think both would be used.

The goal is to vaccinate as many people as possible as quickly as possible.

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Response to Happy Hoosier (Reply #1)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:07 PM

TheBlackAdder (19,574 posts)

25. They're just working on getting the brain-controlling nanobots to be small enough. 🤣

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Response to TheBlackAdder (Reply #25)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:21 PM

Happy Hoosier (2,604 posts)

28. HA!

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:25 AM

unblock (48,469 posts)

2. Given the production/distribution challenges, I suspect both would be used

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:28 AM

Brother Buzz (28,818 posts)

3. Ford vs Chevrolet?

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #3)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:41 PM

mitch96 (7,269 posts)

13. As long as it get's you where you need to go........ virus free... nt

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Response to mitch96 (Reply #13)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:52 PM

Brother Buzz (28,818 posts)

18. But, but Pfizer's comes with a designer suitcase, so maybe it's really Ford v Ferrari

Pfizer designed suitcase-sized shipping containers that will keep its doses at ultracold temperatures for up to 10 days. Each container holds between 1,000 and 5,000 doses, charged by dry ice. The shipping containers are reusable.

https://www.fiercepharma.com/manufacturing/pfizer-designed-new-container-and-plans-to-tap-shipping-companies-for-covid-19

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #18)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:56 PM

mitch96 (7,269 posts)

21. O000oooo I like the designer suit case...

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:29 AM

Alhena (2,699 posts)

4. I read Pfizer's can be manufactured more quickly, plus with their head start

that means they should be first.

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Response to Alhena (Reply #4)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:09 PM

TheBlackAdder (19,574 posts)

27. 88% was already pre-ordered by other countries. Plus Pfizer's has refrigeration delivery issues.

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:30 AM

Native (4,001 posts)

5. but is the efficacy the same or better?

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:31 AM

Johnny2X2X (9,667 posts)

6. I don't trust Moderna

This is a company closely aligned with Jared, they've been exposed for lying before.

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Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #6)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:42 PM

Horse with no Name (33,678 posts)

14. And they have NEVER brought a vaccine to market

That’s a hard stop for me

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Response to Horse with no Name (Reply #14)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:56 PM

Steelrolled (1,362 posts)

20. I'm glad that didn't stop them from trying.

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Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #6)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:47 PM

Celerity (16,446 posts)

16. links on this (Kushner connections and the Moderna lying before) please TIA

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Response to Johnny2X2X (Reply #6)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:58 PM

mitch96 (7,269 posts)

22. " closely aligned with Jared," ok something stinks right there... hard stop is right!!

Follow the money and the science... Has not failed me yet...
YMMV
m

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:34 AM

NutmegYankee (14,602 posts)

7. I think Pfizer can have theirs out first.

So it will be vital to first responders/medical staff.

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:43 AM

Cognitive_Resonance (1,450 posts)

8. Superior according to whom? It's a press release based on preliminary phase III trial data. nt

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:46 AM

LisaL (39,576 posts)

9. Clearly superior?

We have only seen preliminary reports from both companies.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #9)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:48 AM

lapucelle (11,666 posts)

10. And both need to be stored at sub-zero temperatures N/T

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Response to lapucelle (Reply #10)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:26 PM

sir pball (3,492 posts)

29. No, the Moderna one can be refrigerated

It has an acceptable shelf life (2 weeks I think) at 36-46F. It lasts a lot longer at 4F, but that's still normal home freezer temperatures, the existing cold storage and distribution infrastructure is perfectly fine for those constraints.

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Response to sir pball (Reply #29)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 06:50 PM

lapucelle (11,666 posts)

34. Yes, I saw that later. I had read (or misread) an earlier report

that the it needed the lower temperature.

Thank you for the update!

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 11:51 AM

lagomorph777 (19,863 posts)

11. A few percent difference in the short-term efficacy is down in the noise.

A repeat of the studies with identical methods and larger samples would just as likely reverse the apparent result.

Other factors will be more important:

Ability to ramp up
Difficulty of storage and transport
Cost
Political factors
etc

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:36 PM

PoindexterOglethorpe (17,800 posts)

12. Preliminary data.

That does not comfort me.

How many times have we seen early reports about some "promising" new medication that should cure, say, Alzheimer's forever, only to learn it simply doesn't have any impact on the disease in humans.

Yeah, I know these are clinical trials in humans, but then again, how many "promising" early clinical trials have turned out to be duds?

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:45 PM

MineralMan (136,104 posts)

15. No, not clearly superior. Both are 90%+ effective, based on

preliminary trial results. That's a very high effectiveness rate for any vaccine.

So, both will probably be distributed and used. I'll take whichever one is available as soon as I can.

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:52 PM

Steelrolled (1,362 posts)

17. I think they are about the same

based on what we know so far. I think the deciding factor will be who can make it the fastest.

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

pinkstarburst This message was self-deleted by its author.

Response to pinkstarburst (Reply #19)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:01 PM

Steelrolled (1,362 posts)

24. Pfizer and Moderna

use the same technology. The Oxford vaccine uses a different technology, but we don't have numbers for it yet.

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Response to Steelrolled (Reply #24)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:29 PM

LisaL (39,576 posts)

31. Yep, Oxford uses more traditional adenovirus based technology.

Moderna and Pfizer are both RNA based vaccines.

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 12:59 PM

lettucebe (1,286 posts)

23. Don't think anything has been established as being "clearly superior" and both will be released

Whatever vaccine by whichever company makes it to your local pharmacy, that's the one you'll get. These are all preliminary results at this point. It'll be a few years before we know the real truth. They don't even know how long the vaccine will last as of yet. Give it time.

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Response to lettucebe (Reply #23)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:28 PM

LisaL (39,576 posts)

30. Exactly.

Each company can make limited doses initially. Not enough to vaccinate the whole population.
So I am assuming whichever one your local places can get their hands on will be available initially.

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Response to Goodheart (Original post)

Mon Nov 16, 2020, 01:07 PM

spanone (125,176 posts)