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Judge really kicked the crap out of Guliani..... (Original Post) sunonmars Nov 2020 OP
"With prejudice" equals eff off and die soothsayer Nov 2020 #1
what does With Prejudice mean? demtenjeep Nov 2020 #4
It means they cannot refile it soothsayer Nov 2020 #8
It Means it Can Not Be Refiled (although Defendant could possibly appeal to higher Court) Stallion Nov 2020 #9
telling them to FU@K off MFM008 Nov 2020 #23
It means "This shish is unfixable, so don't even think of bringing it back in here" StarfishSaver Nov 2020 #28
What they said above.... paleotn Nov 2020 #31
Just so you know......... MyOwnPeace Nov 2020 #5
Thenk yew! soothsayer Nov 2020 #10
Gets to the point! MyOwnPeace Nov 2020 #18
Yups! SheltieLover Nov 2020 #6
I wish the judges would/could go further than a wrist slap at this point. It's obvious this is a Karadeniz Nov 2020 #2
Rudy will claim it's another great victory. RoadRunner Nov 2020 #3
It's been leaking out of his head... Mike Nelson Nov 2020 #7
OK, what's the tally now? Brother Buzz Nov 2020 #11
This will be a fun opinion to read Gothmog Nov 2020 #12
This ruling is a thing of beauty! Raven Nov 2020 #13
Indeed it is! MyOwnPeace Nov 2020 #19
Entire pdf malaise Nov 2020 #14
Thank You Thank You Thank you! Tommymac Nov 2020 #24
You're welcome malaise Nov 2020 #32
I bet a bunch of Trump lawyers quit on Monday C_U_L8R Nov 2020 #15
Don't MESS with Democracy in PA.. Cha Nov 2020 #16
My GAWD, Cha!!!! MyOwnPeace Nov 2020 #20
"....nattering nabobs of negativism" is a phrase so bad, it's good. BobTheSubgenius Nov 2020 #21
Of course what makes it SO amazing MyOwnPeace Nov 2020 #22
Breaking: In Total Loss for Trump Campaign in Its Most Major Remaining Election Case, Federal Court Gothmog Nov 2020 #17
It was a Hail Mary to get it to the Legislature Captain Zero Nov 2020 #27
Loved the "In the United States of America" dig! Native Nov 2020 #25
FRCP 12(b)(6) Renaissance Man Nov 2020 #26
12(b)(6) motions are very common, but they are usually granted without prejudice. SunSeeker Nov 2020 #33
Trump's entire career he has sued... Jon King Nov 2020 #29
KNR Lucinda Nov 2020 #30
I was hoping the Subject line was being literal. BobTheSubgenius Nov 2020 #34

Stallion

(6,473 posts)
9. It Means it Can Not Be Refiled (although Defendant could possibly appeal to higher Court)
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 07:46 PM
Nov 2020

Courts don't like to dismiss cases with prejudice unless they find that it is unlikely that the plaintiff can replead the case to state a legitimate cause of action. The general rule is that Plaintiff's can amend their pleadings freely until a trial on the merits

MyOwnPeace

(16,917 posts)
5. Just so you know.........
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 07:42 PM
Nov 2020

When a lawsuit is dismissed with prejudice, the court is saying that it has made a final determination on the merits of the case, and that the plaintiff is therefore forbidden from filing another lawsuit based on the same grounds.

OR, as "soothsayer" so eloquently stated, "F-off" and die!

Karadeniz

(22,461 posts)
2. I wish the judges would/could go further than a wrist slap at this point. It's obvious this is a
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 07:39 PM
Nov 2020

Scheme to overturn a valid election...

MyOwnPeace

(16,917 posts)
19. Indeed it is!
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 08:19 PM
Nov 2020

Worth reading over SEVERAL times through the evening - and bringing a bigger smile each time!

(and the hair dye may have reached Rudy's butt-crack by this point!)


(I know - you're pizzed at me for the image! As Junior would say from quarantine: "Suck it up, big boy!" )

MyOwnPeace

(16,917 posts)
20. My GAWD, Cha!!!!
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 08:24 PM
Nov 2020

You're sounding like Spiro Agnew!!!!!

“In the United States today, we have more than our share of the nattering nabobs of negativism. They have formed their own 4-H Club - the 'hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history.”

But at least we know you're on OUR side!

BobTheSubgenius

(11,558 posts)
21. "....nattering nabobs of negativism" is a phrase so bad, it's good.
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 08:50 PM
Nov 2020

It should never fade from memory of the historical record. I have a faded memory of him actually saying it. If it isn't TOO faded, my impression of him saying it on the tarmac of an airport is true.

MyOwnPeace

(16,917 posts)
22. Of course what makes it SO amazing
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 09:12 PM
Nov 2020

is his own connection to the Nixon regime and the fact the he himself was indicted for corruption and forced to resign from office.

MAN, the RepubliCons can come with the "leadership" - can't they?

Gothmog

(144,890 posts)
17. Breaking: In Total Loss for Trump Campaign in Its Most Major Remaining Election Case, Federal Court
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 08:05 PM
Nov 2020

Prof. Hasen is having fun https://electionlawblog.org/?p=118942

In a total loss the the Trump campaign, a federal district court in Pennsylvania has dismissed the most serious case brought by the campaign and denied the campaign a motion to file an amended complaint.

The judge just excoriates this suit, which those of us in the field have called ridiculous from the start:

In other words, Plaintiffs ask this Court to disenfranchise almost seven million voters. This Court has been unable to find any case in which a plaintiff has sought such a drastic remedy in the contest of an election, in terms of the sheer volume of votes asked to be invalidated. One might expect that when seeking such a startling outcome, a plaintiff would come formidably armed with compelling legal arguments and factual proof of rampant corruption, such that this Court would have no option but to regrettably grant the proposed injunctive relief despite the impact it would have on such a large group of citizens.

That has not happened. Instead, this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence. In the United States of America, this cannot justify the disenfranchisement of a single voter, let alone all the voters of its sixth most populated state. Our people, laws, and institutions demand more. At bottom, Plaintiffs have failed to meet their burden to state a claim upon which relief may be granted. Therefore, I grant Defendants’ motions and dismiss Plaintiffs’ action with prejudice.


In a 37-page opinion, the court concluded:

Defendants’ motions to dismiss the First Amended Complaint are granted with prejudice. Leave to amend is denied. “Among the grounds that could justify a denial of leave to amend are undue delay, bad faith, dilatory motive, prejudice, and futility.” Given that: (1) Plaintiffs have already amended once as of right; (2) Plaintiffs seek to amend simply in order to effectively reinstate their initial complaint and claims; and (3) the deadline for counties in Pennsylvania to certify their election results to Secretary Boockvar is November 23, 2020, amendment would unduly delay resolution of the issues. This is especially true because the Court would need to implement a new briefing schedule, conduct a second oral argument, and then decide the issues.


The court had many problems with the complaint, but this goes to the heart of the merits: “Granting Plaintiffs’ requested relief would necessarily require invalidating the ballots of every person who voted in Pennsylvania. Because this Court has no authority to take away the right to vote of even a single person, let alone millions of citizens, it cannot grant Plaintiffs’ requested relief.”

Renaissance Man

(669 posts)
26. FRCP 12(b)(6)
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 09:20 PM
Nov 2020

When a plaintiff fails to state a claim for which relief can be granted, it means that they’ve been hit with a 12(b)(6) motion under the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure.

When it’s this bad, it means that the plaintiff has jack shit to support his lawsuit, and that it’s immediately dismissed and unworthy of the court’s time.

SunSeeker

(51,504 posts)
33. 12(b)(6) motions are very common, but they are usually granted without prejudice.
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 11:03 PM
Nov 2020

In other words, they are usually granted with leave for the plaintiff to file an amended complaint to try again at stating a valid claim.

Granting it with prejudice on the first go round is unusual and means the plaintiff failed to show how the complaint could be amended to survive a 12(b)(6) motion. In other words, it means the complaint was not worth the paper it was written on.

Unfortunately, this also means the plaintiff can now appeal, because it is basically a final order in the case. Rudy Giuliani, and Trump campaign senior legal adviser Jenna Ellis pointed to the decision as a positive development in their effort to push the case relatively quickly to the U.S. Supreme Court. In a joint statement, they said they would seek an expedited appeal to the U.S. Third Circuit Court of Appeals.https://apnews.com/article/election-2020-joe-biden-donald-trump-constitutions-pennsylvania-87eaf4df86d5f6ccc343c3385c9ba86c

But Rudy is running out of time. PA's counties must certify their results to Pennsylvania Secretary of State Kathy Boockvar by Monday, after which she will make her own certification.

Democratic Gov. Tom Wolf will notify the winning candidate’s electors they should appear to vote in the Capitol on Dec. 14.
https://apnews.com/article/election-2020-joe-biden-donald-trump-constitutions-pennsylvania-87eaf4df86d5f6ccc343c3385c9ba86c

Jon King

(1,910 posts)
29. Trump's entire career he has sued...
Sat Nov 21, 2020, 09:47 PM
Nov 2020

Trump has sued everyone his entire life and gotten away with it. He and his family have destroyed many contractors, associates, tenants, and workers with lawsuits for generations. Now the law and the world citizens need to take revenge. Destroy his bid to steal the election, then destroy every single business and family member in every legal and financial way.

The Trump family has been a 3 generation scourge on the entire free world. Come Jan 21, the world must take its revenge legally and financially until every last Trump is running to the court house to change their miserable name.

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