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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsFarPoint
(12,207 posts)I think, there will be, with any luck, some patriots that have quietly tucked away much of the criminal data....if we are lucky.
yellowcanine
(35,692 posts)tablets, etc. Anything gets wiped and the perp is in big trouble. FBI forensics can find it all. Only thing they can hide is what is on personally owned computers and phones and even they will leave an electronic trail on the official computers and on cell phone towers, etc.
apnu
(8,722 posts)They know what/when to keep things off gov't books/system. That data will be shredded (metaphorically, and literally). I expect Holland Tunnel sized data gaps when Biden's people take over.
Biden will do nothing about it. Calling it now. He will want to heal and fix the United States of Trump's mess. He will have no time or political capital to prosecute, or compel his staff to prosecute anyone in the Trump administration.
Biden is being cagey about that right now. I think he's signaling that prosecutors can go after Trump, but he's not going to specifically ask them to do that.
That's just who Joe Biden is. He's a 'reach across the aisle' guy. The Republican party, that remains in power after Jan. 20th 2021, will need to be worked with. Even if we flip the Senate because of the Georgia special election, we would only have a narrow majority in the Senate, and the majority in the House has shrunk.
We have to work with Republicans to get anything done, and they will freak out if Biden is investigating Trump and, by proxy, them for aiding and abetting Trump's crimes.
Essentially, Biden will make a plea deal with the GOP to get some things done. The GOP, we know, will negotiate in bad faith. This has been their tactic since the Clinton Administration 30 years ago, so this won't be new.
The only way to actually get traction in America is to destroy modern conservativism, or at least reduce it to minor regional status. That means winning local elections and staving them out.
Until then, we have to work with these hypocritical deplorables, which means they will get away with crimes they committed. This is American politics at its ugliest.
SayItLoud
(1,696 posts)The full scope and depth of the pardons will have to be seen before any move is made by the DOJ. The States, NY, NJ, IL, Ca, etc will also wait to see who is pardoned or given immunity. I suspect besides the obvious inner tRUMP orbit there are SEC violations, international violations and more State level crimes that have been committed. They will ensnare sitting rePUKES in Senate and House.
Biden's "leave it to the DOJ" is the proper and historical position of Presidents. Those given pardons do not have the protection of the 5th Amendment and will be important witnesses for State and Federal investigators.
apnu
(8,722 posts)There will be none from Biden.
And since Trump is such a loose canon, who knows who will get a pardon and who won't. It will all depend on whatever loyalty Trump sees. He's floating Michael Flynn for a pardon right now, but not Michael Cohen. Cohen who was far more loyal and willing to do shit work gets exactly nothing, but Flynn who never worked as hard or as long as Cohen gets love.
I imagine life is very stressful for people in Trump's orbit. Your fate hinges on the emotional status of a man with either dimentia or untreated late-stage syphilis?
azureblue
(2,129 posts)is that it eliminated 5th amendment pleas. So Flynn can be compelled to testify and he cannot refuse. Oops!
Raster
(20,996 posts)Vote. Every. Republican. Out. Of. Office.
None of them deserves re-election.
All of them are guilty of subverting democracy.
NOTHING will ever get better in the U.S. until the GOP* is gone!
#VoteEveryRepublicanOut #DeleteTheGOP
Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,760 posts)Unfortunately, "they" support the current craven GOP with a cultish devotion to its most cruel & corrupt member.
Response to apnu (Reply #27)
Raster This message was self-deleted by its author.
With your thinking. The Republican party is loaded with hypocritical sanctimonious self-righteous deplorables and even more significant is the never ending love affair with THEIR wallets. No wonder so many of them love that worthless SOB that is getting shown on the door.
DonaldsRump
(7,715 posts)The US Department of Justice and the US Attorneys can. Trump was the one that destroyed that concept.
I am sure Joe's Attorney General will look into things, and won't need any prodding from Joe.
apnu
(8,722 posts)Remember all that water boarding stuff? And the spying on Americans with all the TeleComs? And then there was Nixon... famously had to fire is AG to get one who would run amok. I notice a pattern here... I think... hold on... Oh yes! They are all Republican Presidents!
The POTUS influence the DoJ if they so choose. The AG is a political appointed position and serves at the pleasure of the POTUS.
Biden COULD do this, but in my original post, he WON'T. Because he's not that guy. Because he can stay above that particular fray and let prosecutors, as you accurately point out, do that work.
I know that, you know that, but many here and all over the world don't know that and will howl for his head.
Let's recall 2009, Obama's first 6 months... DU was losing its collective mind because Obama, nor Eric Holder, were going after W and his war-criminal cronies.
Let's recall 2009, Obama's first 6 months... DU was losing its collective mind because Obama, nor Eric Holder, were going after W and his war-criminal cronies.
Yes, I do recall that.
So, how'd that work out?
MDN
58Sunliner
(4,339 posts)FarPoint
(12,207 posts)I foresee a desired pardon in the wind....Donnie needs a pardon...How will that happen? Heck....many of them will need a pardon and or face criminal charges...
NCjack
(10,279 posts)TrumpCo's crimes.
murielm99
(30,655 posts)that some evidence has been sent to sympathetic people in Canada. This is purely anecdotal. It is tinfoil, but I believe this person.
FarPoint
(12,207 posts)murielm99
(30,655 posts)spoke about all the climate change information being lost and destroyed. He is a meteorology professor at a large university. He told our meeting that much of the information was being sent to other scientists in Canada so that it would not be lost.
certainot
(9,090 posts)trump wanted it to get WORSE so they could use it like republicans/limbaugh used ebola as an october surprise in 2014 - to get 9 senate seats
trump's friend and ally (possibly paid employee) limbaugh would not have called it a hoax for 2 months if trump didn't want him to, while he as pres had to back off and pretend to 'act'.
trump told woodward he knew in january it was airborne and could kill a lot of people so did he tell that to limbaugh before limbaugh began to call it a hoax?
onenote
(42,373 posts)certainot
(9,090 posts)here are some excerpts from dkos diary "RW use of ebola in 2014 to regain Senate suggests Trump COVID delay was deliberate for 2020 election"
diary suggests other evidence also including putin dupe jerome corsi involvement
Media and Democratic leaders need to follow clues going back to the ebola scare in 2014. The evidence of coordination between Limbaugh and the Trump administration is abundant and some good investigative reporting might convince a lot more Americans that Trumps COVID delay wasnt just incompetence and stupidity.
Ian Reifowitz posted a diary Feb 29 Weaponizing an epidemic for political purposes is exactly what Limbaugh did to Obama (excerpts below) detailing how Limbaugh and the Republicans used ebola to help them regain the house and senate in 2014. Democrats lost 13 House seats and nine Senate seats.After having spent several shows in July and August 2014 using the outbreak of the Ebola viruswhich, counting only documented cases, killed over 11,000 Africans and one Americanas a reason to close the border, on Sept. 8, the host pondered whether the enterovirus D68 outbreak that ultimately infected people in all but one state, and which may have killed fourteen (they tested positive but their deaths could not be definitively linked to EV-D68) was connected to the unaccompanied minors from Central America, and noted that some people believe it could be. Limbaugh also wondered whether the White House was covering up such a connection. Talk about weaponizing illness.In October, the Ebola story began to dominate the media. Republicans, including Limbaugh, hyped fears about the virus and used it to depict Obama as incompetent leading up to the midterm elections. More specifically, the host linked Ebola and immigration and/or border security on nine out of his first thirteen October broadcasts, and on two other occasions later in the month. In addition, Limbaugh talked up the Ebola scare on six other occasions in October as well. On Oct. 16, Limbaugh revisited EV-D68 and the unaccompanied minors.After Election Day, Ebola suddenly dropped off the radar screen for Limbaugh and the right in general, making clear the political nature of their previous focus on the issue. Journalist Elise Viebeck called it the 2014 October surprise. Talking about Ebola and, in particular, connecting it to border security, had served its purpose, however, as Democrats lost 13 House seats and, more importantly, nine Senate seatswhich ended their eight-year run as the majority party in that chamber. David Axelrod rightly termed what Limbaugh and Co. did panic peddling.
North Shore Chicago
(3,253 posts)true patriots inside the WH. There, in my opinion, are a few reasons for anus not to concede, and one of them was to have weeks of shredding documents after documents.
radical noodle
(7,990 posts)They will have to dig deep to find some of it if they even have time to look. Things will be in such a mess that just getting things back in order will be a full-time job.
ProudMNDemocrat
(16,468 posts)He would be perfect, unrelenting, discompassionate towards those who broke the law.
He is the Wyatt Earp Biden needs. "You tell all the curs the law is coming. And hell's coming with me. "
The Cowboys under Curly Bill never had a chance.
wnylib
(21,146 posts)ProudMNDemocrat
(16,468 posts)Because many in the Senate would know that Kirschner would put back the RULE of law back into the law.
BComplex
(7,977 posts)Glenn Kirschner for Atty. General!
Volaris
(10,260 posts)ProudMNDemocrat
(16,468 posts)Those aiding and abetting Traitor Trump would not sleep well at night. Nor would subpoenas be ignored.
Rudy had best watch his steps and his back.
yellowdogintexas
(22,114 posts)He is like a pitbull. He would turn over every stone.
I have been watching his YouTube channel lately; we need him doing something. Heck, if push came to shove, I'd put him on SCOTUS. He has been outlining every aspect of this mess.
Special prosecuter or Independent Counsel (shame on me I do not know the difference).
Volaris
(10,260 posts)Is under that department's immediate jurisdiction.
And IC is assigned via different means, and is answerable only to congress? (I THINK that's correct).
An IC was assigned during Iran Contra. After that, it took an act of congress to appoint Ken Starr as IC to the Clinton Whitewater nonsense, and because there were few guardrails, he was able to follow every single breadcrumb into things NOT related to the original investigation.
Is why IC an be so very dangerous to criminals.
and please DU, if this is incorrect please feel free to chime in with the yelling lol!
leighbythesea2
(1,200 posts)We need someonw like him.
Also my nearly favorite line in Tombstone. "I see red i kill the man wearing it...." is first part. "You tell em I coming, and hell's comin with me".
tanyev
(42,354 posts)NewJeffCT
(56,827 posts)but, sometimes I think he's a little bit too positive in his outlook.
(PS - a friend of mine tweeted out one of those Suicide Awareness tweets and he personally reached out to this friend to make sure they were okay. This was via Direct Message, so not public on Twitter. )
renate
(13,776 posts)I love nice people!
I hope your friend was indeed okay.
Happy Hoosier
(7,068 posts)I suspect shredders and burn barrels are running around the clock.
mopinko
(69,803 posts)electronic evidence is forever.
i dont doubt they think they can hide it all. cuz they ARE that stupid.
Fla Dem
(23,339 posts)Eyeball_Kid
(7,410 posts)wnylib
(21,146 posts)blanket pardons for his entire staff and family to shield them (snd himself) from whatever evidence is discovered? If he tries to do that and the pardons are challenged in court, will SCOTUS .rule in favor of the pardons?
tinrobot
(10,848 posts)They'd have to be truthful in court or risk perjury charges.
wnylib
(21,146 posts)if everyone is pardoned? Other than making their criminal behavior public, it would not accomplish any goal of accountability for crimes committed, abd then pardoned.
Captain Zero
(6,714 posts)Too tough for them to cover all their tracks.
Check DOD first they made a lot of changes there in personnel immediately following the election.
It was for a cleaning I bet. And that is where the biggest budget honey pots reside.
radical noodle
(7,990 posts)including those open skies planes they're supposedly dismantling because I would not be surprised if trump would try to sell stuff and somehow put money in his own pocket from the sale.
flibbitygiblets
(7,220 posts)weve seen lo these miserable four years, were gonna find a FCKTON.
Well be unearthing crimes for decades, Id wager.
Ligyron
(7,592 posts)Not to worry folks, there will be lots of criminal activity and evidence to uncover.
Provided it is allowed...
bringthePaine
(1,726 posts)Larissa
(786 posts)The place is wreaking with the virus.
jalan48
(13,797 posts)triron
(21,914 posts)Demsrule86
(68,347 posts)wnylib
(21,146 posts)would not legally go after Trump and his administration, but that he would not interfere with his AG if the AG pursued investigations and charges.
jalan48
(13,797 posts)President-elect Joe Biden has privately told advisers that he doesn't want his presidency to be consumed by investigations of his predecessor, according to five people familiar with the discussions, despite pressure from some Democrats who want inquiries into President Donald Trump, his policies and members of his administration.
Biden has raised concerns that investigations would further divide a country he is trying to unite and risk making every day of his presidency about Trump, said the sources, who spoke on background to offer details of private conversations.
The dilemma facing Biden is similar to the one Obama faced when he took office in 2009. Democrats were demanding the prosecution of Bush administration officials who were involved in policies that allowed enhanced interrogations, or torture, of terrorism suspects.
To appease those Democrats, Obama released memos about the controversial program and then publicly said he didn't support prosecuting Bush administration officials who devised or carried out the policies. He also rejected calls for a 9/11-style commission or a truth and reconciliation commission, like the one that examined apartheid in South Africa, to review the policies.
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/president-elect-biden-wary-trump-100009812.html
radical noodle
(7,990 posts)so it's up to them who they go after, not up to Biden. Joe has made that perfectly clear.
Lucinda
(31,170 posts)liberalla
(9,165 posts)wnylib
(21,146 posts)RussBLib
(8,983 posts)...in that they kept intricate, detailed records of things and people they fucked over.
But, this is T**** we're talking about, so, nah. I think he learned from Mein Kampf and his time in the Mob to not leave a huge paper trail.
Mr.Bill
(24,103 posts)and he'll shoot himself in the head when it comes time to leave the White House.
LaMouffette
(2,009 posts)I wonder if they'll be able to delete whatever they placed on it before investigators have access to it.
Volaris
(10,260 posts)on some NSA computer that lives in a steel and concrete box under 200 feet of rocky mountain granite somewhere lol
LaMouffette
(2,009 posts)Volaris
(10,260 posts)BobTheSubgenius
(11,535 posts)Even if Il Douche had won, it only delays the reckoning by 4 years. It doesn't mean it's not inevitable. What was the plan?
Hope that 4 years was long enough to bury it (the evidence) deep?
They were "too big to fail," so to speak?
The Magic Pardon Machine?
That they would die first?
I hope that none of this is correct, and the new DOJ and the state of New York start adding wings onto various prisons.
NoMoreRepugs
(9,257 posts)Democratic Presidents operate - stop with the nonsense of "Biden pursuing or Biden not pursuing" - what needs to happen to preserve the rule of law is GOING to happen IMO.
LiberalLovinLug
(14,153 posts)No matter what Biden says for the public, there is no way an AG, whether D or R, is not steered in part by the President. Not necessarily in order to personally protect him/her from prosecution, as in Trump's case, but for other political reasons. Obama famously proclaimed he wanted the nation to "move forward, not backwards" in regards to crimes of the previous administration. No way the next day Eric Holder does the opposite and opens one up. And that was a public proclamation. I imagine there are more in private. I'm sure during the interview, vetting, process, it is made clear the direction the new President wants his AG to concentrate on. There are more than enough other cases any AG could focus on.
And it burns me because I can already read the tea leaves from Biden's initial comments, that a lot of criminals are going to get off scott free. And be emboldened to repeat and take it to even new levels of subterfuge in the future.
maxsolomon
(32,975 posts)2 months of smashing the furniture of the Federal Gubmint is what's about to rain. Then a period where we're all numb and just want to sleep.
Then Trump's 2024 campaign starts.
LizBeth
(9,946 posts)prison ever, it will not happen. But it needs to be exposed whether he is prosecuted or not.
UCmeNdc
(9,589 posts)llashram
(6,265 posts)to see that fool in the WH harassed and eventually his whole family shamed because of prosecution
SunSeeker
(51,367 posts)Brainfodder
(6,423 posts)Initech
(99,909 posts)Cha
(295,899 posts)soldierant
(6,647 posts)Blue Owl
(49,902 posts)Too bad tRump can't figure out how to work an umbrella
lpbk2713
(42,696 posts)The whole Trump family will pay. All in good time.
AdamGG
(1,275 posts)Obama took office and nothing ever came out about Cheney.
Trump is far more corrupt on a far more all encompassing scale, but I'm sure there is massive attention being paid to burning all evidence and as others said, more attention has been paid to using private computer equipment/networks to start with. They probably do have their back channel to Russia that Erik Price/Blackwater tried to set up in the Seychelles, but they probably set it up in a way that is very hard to detect.
I hope that some of the Dump team's coverup attempts are as competent as Rudy's hair coloring efforts, but there may be lots of high level stuff that slips by. That's assuming that Biden's administration is willing to prosecute (damn well hope so) rather than deciding that it would hurt his image as national healer.
It would be great to pick up the 2 Georgia Senate seats because among many other things, it would be effective to air evidence against Trump in public Senate hearings and then let Justice prosecute after it's already been made public that way.
sloopdog50
(36 posts)Yes, there will be evidence. I hope for arrests, indictments, grand juries, trials, and sentences. I want the Justice Department to reinstate its relevance to democracy.
Yet, a real concern is the hollowed out bureaucracy within the government. Think Grover Norquivst. When the Biden teams start the transition, they may find there is nothing to transition. It's all in Mango Mussolini's head.
coolhandlulu
(148 posts)But I just dont think so. We democrats do have one sin...not wanting to dirty our hands with degenerates and their ilk. The newly appointed people in DOJ know the definitions of honesty, integrity, duty, honor. Wasting our precious resources to indict those traitorous twits will further jeopardize our nation. I foresee them reevaluating just how the checks and balances failed us, and place laws that would protect us in the future. The only one imho that needs charges brought upon him should be McConnell. The congress can wheel and deal all day, but they should never, ever enable treasonous President.
bucolic_frolic
(42,651 posts)as that indictments are forthcoming. Widespread knowledge and a few key indictments, even in state courts, would alter public opinion and shrink the MAGAt cult. Americans need to return to reality.