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Thu Apr 29, 2021, 11:57 AM

To say America has problems with racists is not the same as saying America is a racist country

This is where I believe the right wingers try to confuse things.

If you say America has a racist history they immediately jump to the conclusion that you are calling all of America racist.

That's my 2 cents for the day.

47 replies, 1180 views

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Reply To say America has problems with racists is not the same as saying America is a racist country (Original post)
Ohioboy Apr 2021 OP
LizBeth Apr 2021 #1
brooklynite Apr 2021 #23
Crunchy Frog Apr 2021 #30
LizBeth Apr 2021 #36
brooklynite Apr 2021 #38
LizBeth Apr 2021 #43
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 2021 #2
Claire Oh Nette Apr 2021 #3
Budi Apr 2021 #9
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #10
Hortensis Apr 2021 #21
Ms. Toad Apr 2021 #24
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #29
StarfishSaver Apr 2021 #32
Celerity Apr 2021 #40
StarfishSaver Apr 2021 #42
Ms. Toad Apr 2021 #33
Caliman73 Apr 2021 #27
uponit7771 Apr 2021 #4
Pantagruel Apr 2021 #5
Shell_Seas Apr 2021 #6
ProudMNDemocrat Apr 2021 #7
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #22
ret5hd Apr 2021 #8
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #11
Claire Oh Nette Apr 2021 #14
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #19
Claire Oh Nette Apr 2021 #44
StarfishSaver Apr 2021 #47
CrackityJones75 Apr 2021 #12
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #15
CrackityJones75 Apr 2021 #16
AZSkiffyGeek Apr 2021 #13
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #18
AZSkiffyGeek Apr 2021 #35
Claire Oh Nette Apr 2021 #45
StarfishSaver Apr 2021 #17
Ohioboy Apr 2021 #26
TDale313 Apr 2021 #20
KG Apr 2021 #25
Hassin Bin Sober Apr 2021 #28
Johnny2X2X Apr 2021 #31
Midnight Writer Apr 2021 #34
Scrivener7 Apr 2021 #37
gulliver Apr 2021 #39
Deuce Apr 2021 #41
SoonerPride Apr 2021 #46

Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 11:58 AM

1. We do say there is systemic racism thru out. And there is. Same with misogyny. Fact.

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Response to LizBeth (Reply #1)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:14 PM

23. Who should I listen to: you or Vice President Harris?

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #23)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:41 PM

30. Maybe form your own conclusions based on your evaluation of the evidence?

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #23)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 02:30 PM

36. Wow. Did Harris state there is not systematic racism? Whatever. Not playing this game.

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Response to LizBeth (Reply #36)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 03:10 PM

38. Kamala Harris agrees with Tim Scott that America not a 'racist country' but says must 'speak truth'

Source: Detroit Free Press

WASHINGTON — Vice President Kamala Harris said America is not a "racist country" but the nation must "speak the truth" about its history with racism on ABC News' "Good Morning America" on Thursday.

The vice president's comments were in response to Sen. Tim Scott, R-S.C., who gave the Republican Party's rebuttal to President Joe Biden's speech to Congress on Wednesday.

Scott, the only Black Republican in the Senate, spoke about his own experience with racism in the U.S. The senator contended "America is not a racist country" and said progressives perpetuate discrimination akin to Jim Crow-era policies.

...snip...

"Well, first of all, no, I don't think America is a racist country, but we also do have to speak the truth about the history of racism in our country and its existence today," Harris said while praising Biden's comments on race and domestic terrorism in his first joint address to Congress on Wednesday.


Read more: https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/2021/04/29/kamala-harris-responds-tim-scott-saying-america-not-racist-country/4886682001/

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #38)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 03:33 PM

43. Harris did not say there was not systematic racism so I guess you can listen to both of us. I dunno.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 11:58 AM

2. We are a racist country.

Why is that hard to understand. We were build to make everything great for whites and the after effects of that are still in place to make things difficult for people of color. People just don't want to face that.

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Response to Cuthbert Allgood (Reply #2)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:00 PM

3. It's written into the Constitution, ffs.

There are amendments about race, specifically.

Yes, this nation was built with and on racist ideas.
Democratic ones. And, slowly, the democratic ones are winning out.

And the old racists know it.

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Response to Claire Oh Nette (Reply #3)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:09 PM

9. K & R & Thank You

Kudos to your post, Claire Oh Nette

**
"It's written into the Constitution, ffs.
There are amendments about race, specifically.

Yes, this nation was built with and on racist ideas.
Democratic ones. And, slowly, the democratic ones are winning out.

And the old racists know it.
"
---------

(The old racists know certainly do know it)

VP Harris made the point clear:
"And so these are issues that we must confront, and it does not help to heal our country, to unify us as a people, to ignore the realities of that," the vice president said.

"The idea is that we want to unify the country but not without speaking truth and requiring accountability where it is appropriate,"

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Response to Claire Oh Nette (Reply #3)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:22 PM

10. I am not denying our nation's racist past

The point of my post is that the "right" tends to equate recognizing our nation's racist past as a slam against all of America. When in reality recognizing a racist history helps to improve and grow the country. I'm not a very good communicator at times.

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #10)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:08 PM

21. You're communicating very well, and I agree. nt

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #10)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:16 PM

24. What about its racist present?

Do you really think Derek Chauvin could have knelt with his knee on George Floyd's neck for more than 9 minutes without the confidence that an America steeped in a racist present would find his actions justified?

Thank goodness there was a finding that his actions were not justified - BUT - look at the extensive preparation that was done to prepare for the likelihood that a racist present jury system would acquit him (or only find him guilty on lesser charges)?

We are not going to move forward, past racism, until we stop pretending that racism is the exception (in the present) rather than the rule.

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Response to Ms. Toad (Reply #24)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:40 PM

29. Recognizing present day racism in America gets the same treatment from the right

If you bring up current racism they say the same thing- that you are attacking them and calling them racist. It's their way of wallowing in fake outrage instead of moving forward.

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #29)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:47 PM

32. Not just the right. Look around this board.

 

Some of it is coming from inside of the house.

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #32)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 03:22 PM

40. this board is littered with white fragility far too often

some even deny white fragility even exists, or that is a priori a slur to even bring it up

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Response to Celerity (Reply #40)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 03:28 PM

42. You just need say "white fragility" to prompt an array of responses that illustrate it in real time

 

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #29)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:47 PM

33. But without recognizing it, we will never get rid of it.

Our message must be consistent with reality. Pretending our racism does not exist does just about as much good at eradicating it as pretending I don't have cancer. If I don't acknowledge it is there, I have no chance of curing it.

So their reaction to the truth cannot be the concern that carries the day, because failing to speak the truth (by insisting only our past is racist) perpetuates the systemic racism that currently exists.

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #10)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:30 PM

27. You need to remember that "the right" does not argue or discuss anything in good faith.

If they had a good faith misunderstanding of the situation and were seeking information, then I might be inclined to engage. They don't. The objective of the right, of conservatives, is to maintain the current power structure and/or to increase the hierarchical structure of society with the people they deem as worthy (White, wealthy, Protestant, men) at the top, and the rest of us relegated to subservient status.

Racism, sexism, anti-immigration, etc... are all tools that are used by those with power to maintain their power, and the benefits to members of their own in group.

They use the discomfort that people tend to have around those topics, as an emotional trigger to resist speaking about them in ways that make it everyone's responsibility to address them.

It is easier to reject the message that racism is built into the society, than it is to examine all aspects of society and try to purge racism from those aspects. That is what the right is counting on.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:01 PM

4. America is built of stolen land and stolen labor and the kGQP wants to keep the stealing going

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:01 PM

5. But a "racist history"

virtually defines a racist nation. It's implied and essential.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:02 PM

6. America is a racist country, though.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:02 PM

7. America has a lot of Racists living within it borders.

They showed up in Charlottesville. They showed up at Trump rallies. They showed up at the Capitol on January 6th.

Until racists and racism are dealt with, America remains for the most part, a racist country.

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Response to ProudMNDemocrat (Reply #7)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:08 PM

22. Yes, there are tons of racists in this country that need to be dealt with

But, it is my hope that the majority of Americans are not racist. I think we can see this by things like Democrats winning the popular vote and the changes that have been made to our Constitution over our history.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:02 PM

8. It's the exact same fake self-righteous attitude...

SOME people give if you call them a MF’er...

“What’d you say about MY MOM???

“Didn’t say shit about your MOM! I called YOU a MF’er!”

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Response to ret5hd (Reply #8)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:28 PM

11. You get my point

They frame the recognition of our nation's racist history as a personal attack.

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #11)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:35 PM

14. Hit dog yelps.

When I hear we are a racist country, I agree.
When they say we have a racist history, I agree.
When they say America has a race problem, I disagree. White America has a problem with races other than their own.
All of that is true. If the label "racist" hurts, or touches a nerve, then the nerve's owner might just be racist. See how insidious it is?

Once you know better, do better.

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Response to Claire Oh Nette (Reply #14)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:01 PM

19. Yes, if the shoe fits , but you are not calling everyone in America a racist are you?

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #19)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 08:37 PM

44. Reading is Fundamental

"you are not calling everyone in America a racist are you?"

also presents as

"You're not calling *me* a racist are you?"


and I repeat, "a hit dog hollers."

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Response to Claire Oh Nette (Reply #44)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 08:43 PM

47. ...

 

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:29 PM

12. Maybe but both are true.

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Response to CrackityJones75 (Reply #12)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:36 PM

15. Hopefully not always

I believe that we can change America's future in this regard. We have made changes to our Constitution and enacted other progressive measures to help change things already.

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #15)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:38 PM

16. I think so too!

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:33 PM

13. Same principle as the "basket of deplorables"

Secretary Clinton said some were in the basket, and every Republican took personal offense at being called deplorable.

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Response to AZSkiffyGeek (Reply #13)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:40 PM

18. Exactly

They changed her words to make it sound like she was attacking them all.

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #18)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 02:25 PM

35. Methinks they protest too much nt

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Response to Ohioboy (Reply #18)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 08:40 PM

45. They took pride in being deplorable

They went out of their way to ratchet up deplorable qualities. The right knows exactly which of their policies is hurtful and hateful. That's the point. They don't want to help anyone but their overlords and the uber wealthy, so the only policies they offer hurt other people not like them.

Of course, GOP policies hurt the GOP base, but as long as it hurts Black and Latinos and the gay more, they don't care.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 12:40 PM

17. Republicans LOVE to say America is a "great" country

 

But they certainly don't think that means every person within our borders is great. In fact, they think the majority of the people here are unworthy and worse.

And many of the Democrats who also insist that calling America a racist country means they are personally being called racism don't think calling this a great nation or caring nation means every American is great or caring.

So, obviously, they're able to separate the the nature of the country from individual traits of its inhabitants. But when it comes to telling the truth about this country's complicated and troubling relationship with race, suddenly, they go all "How DARE you call me a racist!"

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Response to StarfishSaver (Reply #17)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:17 PM

26. Yep, they shut down the truthful conversation with their fake outrage

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:05 PM

20. We have both

a problem with racists and major systemic racism that pretty much impacts everyone. So, it’s hard to face, and doesn’t make any particular white person a racist or bad person, but we are a racist country. We have a racist history, and we still have a lot of systemic racism that needs to be addressed.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:17 PM

25. America is a racist country .

tim scott can piss down his own leg.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:38 PM

28. America IS a racist country.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 01:45 PM

31. Systemic Racism

We have an entire criminal justice and law enforcement system that is racist and was intended to be racist from the start. It's so ingrained in it and fundamental to it that even those inside it might not see that it is racist.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 02:18 PM

34. Not all Americans are racist, but I sadly have to conclude America is a racist country.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 02:49 PM

37. America is a racist country.

What is this hair splitting nonsense? America is a racist country. It isn't going to change until we can all say that and understand that it is true.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 03:19 PM

39. America is not an "anything" country. It's absurd to even try to characterize it.

It's a whole bunch of land with a ridiculously large and varied population. That we can say without being absurd.

Calling America racist is absurd (just so broad a statement that it is meaningless), stupid, and unethical. Republicans always try to expand any criticism of them to include the whole country. No, Republicans, we're not saying America is a racist country, we're saying it has a racial problem, basically endemic to the Republican Party.

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 03:26 PM

41. I wonder, if we are not a racist country, what would we look like if we were?

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Response to Ohioboy (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 08:42 PM

46. America is built on racism. Literally.

The racism is baked into the systems.

America is a racist country.

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