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Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:09 PM

I'm truly shocked. Some Republicans literally believe Obama is a Muslim

I was just on the phone with a woman I met a year ago at the university we attend. She's 38 years old and has a high (3.7 or 3.8, if I recall correctly) GPA.

She's also an evangelical Christian, and the hundreds of friends she has on her Facebook page are almost all evangelical Christians. She doesn't have a TV signal and doesn't pay a lot of attention to the news, so I'm sure most of her information comes from FB postings, and from conversations she has with other Christians.

On the phone just now we were discussing the presidential race, and she said, "I don't know, there's something about Romney that I really don't like. He seems really untrustworthy, and he creeps me out. But I can't get past that whole Muslim thing with Obama."

I asked if she was serious about the "Muslim thing" -- did she really believe Obama's a Muslim? -- and her answer indicated that she thought it was common knowledge.

Then I asked, "Do you mean he's a 'secret Muslim'? ...that he's really Muslim but pretending to be a Christian, or do you think he actually claims that he, himself, is Muslim?"

The questions apparently confused her. When I didn't get an answer, I asked, "Do you remember Reverend Wright, Obama's Christian pastor, who..." To make a long story short, I covered the whole Wright controversy, but the point I was making to her was that people were having issues over what Obama's Christian pastor had said.

She said she didn't follow the 2008 election closely enough to see any of that. She had never heard of Reverend Wright.

I said, "There are some people who say Obama is secretly Muslim, that he's lying and pretending he's a Christian. Are you saying you think he's actually a professed Muslim?"

She said, "I think it might not be possible to know some of these things."

She's 38, earning a high GPA at a liberal college, but otherwise gets most of her information from Facebook friends who think the way she does. And she can't vote for Obama, even though Romney creeps her out, because of "the whole Muslim thing."

I honestly did not know these people existed. They're living and working among us, connected to the same Internet, and they truly believe we elected a professed (not "secret" Muslim president in 2008.

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Reply I'm truly shocked. Some Republicans literally believe Obama is a Muslim (Original post)
Shampoobra Oct 2012 OP
HERVEPA Oct 2012 #1
Populist_Prole Oct 2012 #8
Enrique Oct 2012 #2
ruffburr Oct 2012 #3
OldDem2012 Oct 2012 #4
still_one Oct 2012 #5
begin_within Oct 2012 #6
geckosfeet Oct 2012 #7
underthematrix Oct 2012 #9
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #11
WinkyDink Oct 2012 #28
Democratopia Oct 2012 #10
trof Oct 2012 #12
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #14
trof Oct 2012 #16
krawhitham Oct 2012 #13
tarheelsunc Oct 2012 #15
blueknight Oct 2012 #17
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #19
maxsolomon Oct 2012 #59
War Horse Oct 2012 #18
Algebra Palin Oct 2012 #20
sarge43 Oct 2012 #54
ballabosh Oct 2012 #65
Alekei_Firebird Oct 2012 #21
A-Schwarzenegger Oct 2012 #22
WinkyDink Oct 2012 #27
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #36
A-Schwarzenegger Oct 2012 #38
Separation Oct 2012 #23
Mariana Oct 2012 #30
Separation Oct 2012 #40
spanone Oct 2012 #24
WinkyDink Oct 2012 #29
Arugula Latte Oct 2012 #25
WinkyDink Oct 2012 #26
Dash87 Oct 2012 #31
Douglas Carpenter Oct 2012 #32
MatthewStLouis Oct 2012 #33
Tennessee Gal Oct 2012 #34
DavidDvorkin Oct 2012 #35
LeftInTX Oct 2012 #37
porphyrian Oct 2012 #39
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #41
porphyrian Oct 2012 #42
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #46
porphyrian Oct 2012 #47
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #48
rbrnmw Oct 2012 #43
rbrnmw Oct 2012 #44
B Calm Oct 2012 #45
Douglas Carpenter Oct 2012 #49
Javaman Oct 2012 #50
EasyGirl Oct 2012 #51
ronnie624 Oct 2012 #52
NOLALady Oct 2012 #53
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #57
Douglas Carpenter Oct 2012 #58
hamsterjill Oct 2012 #55
get the red out Oct 2012 #56
TeamAmerica Oct 2012 #60
Shampoobra Oct 2012 #62
Proud Liberal Dem Oct 2012 #61
GoCubsGo Oct 2012 #63
Vattel Oct 2012 #64

Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:13 PM

1. Unfortunately, the low (no) information voter is the norm

 

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #1)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:20 PM

8. It's worse yet people like that are "high information" voters

Obviously fox news, right wing radio, reading only the IBD and WSJ is rife with mis-information, but they believe absolutely they are on top of events and know what's what more than everybody else. You can tell this because the fact they "know" what's what causes them to want to share it freely with everybody....forcefully and aggressively.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:15 PM

3. STUPID is as STUPID DOES

Some people can be very intelligent and have 0 common sense,

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:16 PM

4. I'm very far from shocked. Too many GOPers just like her. nt.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:18 PM

5. I am not if you look who has taken over that party

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:19 PM

6. They've been told that "fact" for over 4 years by the RW noise machine, so it has to be true...

 

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:20 PM

7. There is so much information out there - sometimes it's easier to just pick and choose

what you want to believe than to actually think about it and try to make an intelligent informed decision.

Naturally every decision is tainted with personal bias and subjectivity and information boundaries, but for christs sake it sounds like your friend is in serious denial.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:21 PM

9. To me, it sounds as if the young woman

has very poor critical thinking skills because it seems she was unable to discern the contradiction in the firestorm over President Obama attending a CHRISTIAN CHURCH - Church of Christ and the bizarre notion that he is also a Muslim. The interesting thing is John Sununu is Palestian and a rightwing nutjob and until 1988 was anti-Israel.

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Response to underthematrix (Reply #9)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:27 PM

11. She was, just today, learning about Reverend Wright for the first time

...and I think she thought I was passing on some sort of unverified, partisan spin.

Had we been together in person, instead of talking on the phone, I could have pulled up the videos of Wright's famous statements.

But today, I think her "might not be possible to know some of these things" comment was because she didn't know how to process this new information.

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Response to underthematrix (Reply #9)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:40 PM

28. She's THIRTY-EIGHT, FGS! That's only "young" to an old codger!

 

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:25 PM

10. That's why they hate him so much

 

Because they believe he's a Muslim, and all Muslims are terrorists, and he palls around with terrorists, he was born in Kenya, with a fake birth certificate, he's a socialist, communist, who wants to destroy America, take guns away and he's fully responsible for gas prices, unemployment and the national debt. Worse still, his middle name is the same as that Saddam guy who had WMD.

They actually believe that.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:40 PM

12. My 'friend' does.

Majored in electrical engineering, dean's list.
Career airline pilot.
World traveled.
Best Man at my wedding.

Birther.
And Obama is a Muslim.

Hard for me to deal with this level of stupidity in a guy I used to be very close to.

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Response to trof (Reply #12)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:52 PM

14. But ... but ...

He believes Obama's a liar, right? That Obama's keeping his supposed Muslim beliefs a secret?

Because this woman actually believes that we elected a president who openly claims to be a Muslim.

It's as if she saw so many "Obama = Muslim" memes that she took it to be a known, verified fact.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #14)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:03 PM

16. Yeah, I guess. 'Secret Muslim'

He's still full of shit and it's hard for me to come to terms with that.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:49 PM

13. Most don't, it's dog whistling

Just the normal GOP race baiting


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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 06:57 PM

15. Even if Obama was a Muslim, I'd support him over the alternative.

These right-wing paranoid schizophrenics need to get out of their bigoted mindset.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:03 PM

17. jesus

how fucking stupid is she?

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Response to blueknight (Reply #17)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:17 PM

19. She has roughly 1/2 a GPA point higher than I

I'm currently averaging around 3.3, and she's at about 3.7 or 3.8.

I understand people not following politics. What I don't understand is, people with Internet access not thinking: Really? Our president is Muslim? I should see if I can find that backed up by a legitimate source. Instead, she accepts it as fact, and lets that so-called "fact" bother her.

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Response to blueknight (Reply #17)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:05 PM

59. there are different kinds of intelligence

Rain Man could count hella numbers, but I don't think he was "intelligent".

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:11 PM

18. I'm not shocked at all

Otherwise seemingly functional people actually believe that Obama's on some sort of mission to destroy the U.S. from the inside.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:19 PM

20. i think if more people responded to the muslim 'charge'

with 'so what?' the nonsense would stop.
obama could be a member of the jedi church, and i really wouldn't care.
*shrug*

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Response to Algebra Palin (Reply #20)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 12:42 PM

54. Exactly

"So what?" has been my answer the couple of times I've heard that. Then, I ask "You do know about Section 3, Article VI of the US Constitution?" (Que crickets)

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Response to Algebra Palin (Reply #20)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:44 PM

65. That's my response too.

Usually met with a blank stare or apoplexy.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:22 PM

21. Muslim = N*gger

"Muslim" is just the latest code word to characterize scary Black people who'll take away the White Way of Life.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:23 PM

22. Are you shocked, or are you shocked shocked?

Because gambling's been going on back there a long long time.

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Response to A-Schwarzenegger (Reply #22)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:39 PM

27. Yeah! Like, is it a LEGITIMATE shock?

 

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Response to A-Schwarzenegger (Reply #22)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 08:10 PM

36. Shocked shocked. It's not as if I'd never heard this BS before

I just never expected to hear it from someone who otherwise appears to be intelligent, and who is not saying it in a conspiratorial manner. It makes me wonder how many others (who don't come across as nutjobs) really believe this without questioning it.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #36)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 08:38 PM

38. It makes me wonder, too, I tell you.

Or wonder wonder.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:25 PM

23. Sadly

I have a really good friend who is almost 70, Vietnam Vet, and is very new to the Internet surprisingly. He is a member of his vet unit group, Blue Stars I think, and some of the chain emails he gets are incredible. I believe that if he got an email that said the sky is green and Obama was actually born on Mars, he would believe it. I try my best to try and explain that everything he reads on the Internet isn't real.

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Response to Separation (Reply #23)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:52 PM

30. My parents get those chain e-mails.

Those e-mails have made me lose any last bit of respect I might have had for conservatives. Do you know what they do when they get one of those e-mails that they know is bullshit? They forward it to everyone anyway, hoping the recipients will be stupid enough to believe it. What kind of person does that? Not one that I want to have anything to do with, that's for sure.

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Response to Mariana (Reply #30)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 09:06 PM

40. It's sad sometimes.

Sadly I think my friend truly believes them. I do all I can to politely give him the other side of the story. But he is older, set in his ways, served with these people and has a gullible/naive look on life.

So I do my part when I can, and shake my head when I can't. He is not an evil/mean person. He was a Huey pilot and is in a losing battle with cancer caused by Agent Orange. He doesn't even realize he isnt the target audience of Romney. He lives on VA disability, I've tried to tell him that he is the %47 that Rmoney wrote off.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:26 PM

24. you should put her in your car and take her to the nearest emergency room...or call 911

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Response to spanone (Reply #24)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:41 PM

29. On the roof.

 

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:34 PM

25. Religion tends to make people stupid.

 

Some exceptions, yeah yeah yeah.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:37 PM

26. Obama's a Muslim Communist! Study it OUT!

 

Never gets old.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:56 PM

31. I know a truly delusional one. I used to work with her.

She thinks that Obama is a Muslim from Kenya. She's says that we can't elect Obama in 2012 because he'll force us all to become Muslims. She also claims that, if Obama is elected, "The Arabs" (her wording) will invade us and overthrow our government in order to install a Muslim theocracy. She loved that Obama 2016 (or whatever it was called) movie, and is recommending it to everyone.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:57 PM

32. at least 30% do and a significant number of them actually believe he is a kind of Islamist agent

working to put Americans under Sharia Law. Many of the same people would with equal fervor claim that he is waging a war on religion to make America a secular socialist-atheist state. I don't know how they square those counter claims - but they do and they are serious.

I have been regularly following this YouTube video (note the millions of views) partly just to follow the comments and occasionally try to correct misinformation:




The few comments they extracted to suggest that Obama is deeply anti-Christian comes from this 40 minute speech he gave in 2006- addressing a group of Evangelicals and actually explaining how and why he became a Christian. But even that 2006 speech is being used as proof that he is a Muslim and fiercely anti-Christian

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:57 PM

33. They are good at fantasizing. That's what their entire economic policy is based on: a fantasy. /nt

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 07:57 PM

34. They definitely believe it. A local minister where I live believes it and posts it on Facebook.

There is no reasoning with him. I tried. He persisted. I unfriended him on Facebook. I will not give him any of the space on my new feed to spew that crap.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 08:10 PM

35. I'm shocked that anyone thinks his religion matters.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 08:22 PM

37. Even wierder

A survey was done of Ohio Republicans and many gave Mitt Romney credit for Osama Bin Laden.

(Not even Bush, but Romney)

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Thu Oct 18, 2012, 08:42 PM

39. Come on, you're not really shocked... n/t

 

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Response to porphyrian (Reply #39)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 01:21 AM

41. The fuck I'm not

and I see no reason for you to call me a liar.

Like I said in up above in another reply, it's not like I was unaware that this BS is rampant. But I never expected an otherwise-intelligent person to be so disconnected from current events and so reliant on FB friends as a source of information that she would actually believe that Obama is a professing Muslim.

I thought that crowd was limited to two types: liars, and those with very low IQs who fell for the lies. And even then, I thought both groups were limited to the "he's a secret Muslim" line.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #41)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:53 AM

42. Simmer down, unnecessary overreactor.

 

I didn't call you a liar. I just don't believe anyone can be really shocked by this after four years of it unless you've lived on an island, are very young or drank the Koolaid until now. I'm sorry that it's such a sensitive topic for you.

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Response to porphyrian (Reply #42)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 11:13 AM

46. Can you even read?

WTF did I just say in my reply to you?

I thought that crowd was limited to two types: liars, and those with very low IQs who fell for the lies. And even then, I thought both groups were limited to the "he's a secret Muslim" line.


It's not a "sensitive topic" because it's never once been an issue with me until thirty minutes before I typed the OP.

I don't start many threads, but I started this one after calling a number of people on the phone, none of whom had ever heard of an otherwise-intelligent person who believes an openly-Muslim candidate was elected president of the post-911 United States. This was a series of shocking moments for me.

My sensitivity results not from the subject of Obama's religion, but from being flat-out accused (by you) of not believing what I'm saying. That sounds exactly like being called a liar.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #46)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 11:14 AM

47. Ha! You're something else. Goodbye! n/t

 

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Response to porphyrian (Reply #47)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 11:19 AM

48. Bye!

and thanks for your concern

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:59 AM

43. Republicanism=Racism

in this day and age They don't believe that they only know he's black and they can't come out and say that's why they hate him so much they use birtherism or say he's a Muslim which is Religious discrimination and just as wrong as any other type of discrimination

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)


Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 09:05 AM

45. They know he's not a mooslum, but they

 

don't give a shit! That's what republicans do. They make a big mess when they are in power, then when they are out of power they sit on their big fat hemorrhoidal buttocks, make up shit, and then point their brown stained fingers at democrats for not cleaning up their mess fast enough.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 11:48 AM

49. Iraq attacked us on 9/11! Just yesterday talked with a reasonably articulate person who even now

insisted that was the case and seemed to be unaware that this was no longer common knowledge. I know a majority of Americans believed that in March 2003 and about 70% or more of those who voted for George W. Bush in 2004 still believed it then. But I found it it mine boggling to learn that a serious number of Republicans still believe it - even now.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 12:32 PM

50. A good GPA doesn't always equate to high intelligence.

I knew many fellow students when I was in college that had high GPA's but were as stupid as a mud fence.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 12:35 PM

51. Girl friend should not be votin'

 

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 12:36 PM

52. Rachel Maddow explains it very clearly, here:

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 12:40 PM

53. So what?

Even if he were a Muslim, that has nothing to do with the fact that he's the best qualified candidate for 2012. Geez!

Hitler was a Christian.

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Response to NOLALady (Reply #53)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:40 PM

57. I agree with you that it wouldn't matter if he were Muslim

But this encounter revealed to me the extent of what Rachel Maddow calls "the bubble" that so many conservatives have come to occupy. Before yesterday, I assumed "the bubble" meant things like Fox, Limbaugh, and Free Republic.

But this conversation yesterday completely floored me. This is a woman who once decoded Descartes for me (on the fly, and without any previous exposure to his work) when I couldn't understand any of that. And now I'm suddenly learning that she appears to consume and regurgitate all her "news" from her church friends' Facebook posts.

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Response to Shampoobra (Reply #57)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:54 PM

58. having many, many years ago been part of the fundamentalist mindset - fundamentalist church groups

are among the most insular little worlds one will ever find. Of course, in such a group you might have doctors, lawyers, accountants and lots of otherwise educated people. But one of the social dynamics of fundamentalist church groups is that fellow believers are really the only people who hold opinions that count. There is a suspicion borderlining on paranoia about the world of non-believers. Thus there is a strong tendency to discount any information that does not come from believer sources. If you accept that your band of believers holds a special truth about the nature of the universe that the world cannot comprehend and only the true fellow believers can comprehend - one is going to end up knowing all kinds of things for certain that simply are not true.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 12:43 PM

55. Don't be shocked. Be outraged.

I get emails on a daily basis for idiots trying to persuade me that Obama is a Muslim. This morning's buffet of emails including (yet again) the picture from 2008 where Obama is holding the book about "post America". They're still screaming about that one!

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 01:10 PM

56. evangelical Christian identity

I think people have a lot wrapped up in their identity, especially folks who identify as evangelical Christian. They have a lot riding on being accepted by their group and believing the "right" things. I think that they will "believe" what they are told because it is literally a part of who they work hard to project to the world. The Republicans have done a masterful job at taking over evangelical Christianity and molding it for their own purposes. An evangelical Christian will be applauded for believing a thrice married drug addict when he lies about our Christian President who is a devoted husband and father. Their group acceptance, social support, and identity depend on it.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:07 PM

60. I see this photo floating around a lot.

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Response to TeamAmerica (Reply #60)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:18 PM

62. And this one...

...but I guess occasionally wearing clothing styles that originate from outside dominant U.S. culture is part of the job. I don't think wearing this outfit makes him Vietnamese.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:10 PM

61. Somebody should remind them

that even if he was, it doesn't matter one iota. The Constitution- which many of them claim to revere- forbids religious tests for public office. End of story.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:25 PM

63. Why does it surprise you?

Being an evangelical Christian, she's likely one of the millions of people who believe the human race began with a couple of naked people who conversed with a talking snake. NOTHING these right-wing nutbags say or believe surprises me any more.

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Response to Shampoobra (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:35 PM

64. Smarter people just come up with more subtle and complex rationalizations for their crazy beliefs.

 

Bottom line: people can convince themselves of anything.

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