Most ransacked office on 1/6.

[gab13by13]

According to Jon Karl's book it was interesting which office was the most ransacked during the coup attempt. Remember that the internet was filled with diagrams of the Capitol pre coup attempt. It was assumed that the diagrams were used to find the escape routes, but was that the real reason? The most ransacked office the day of the failed coup was the Parlementarian's office where the Electoral college ballots would have been stored. Surprise. When people were being evacuated a wise staffer for the Parlementarian grabbed the ballots and they remained where she was sequestered. Had the traitors gotten their hands on those ballots who knows what the outcome would have been. Add another quick thinking staffer to the list of people who saved our democracy that awful day, another hero.

[Irish_Dem]

1. They obviously wanted to steal the ballots. What would have happened if they had done so?

The vote count would have at least been delayed?

[rockfordfile]

8. I agree they wanted to steal votes.

[Evolve Dammit]

14. I doubt we would have ever seen them in their original form again. Very close.

[Irish_Dem]

19. I agree, intent was to destroy them. The point was to delay or stop the vote.

[patphil]

36. You're absolutely correct. Those ballots would have been destroyed.

It would have thrown the whole electoral process into chaos.

[Irish_Dem]

46. Yes the delay would have given Trump time to do more dirty work.

[lees1975]

38. Not likely

The presentation and counting of ballots is ceremonial. Electors votes are recorded in the states where they are cast. They'd have had that information before they re-convened.

[Irish_Dem]

48. Unless Trump planned to get to the electors in certain states.

And get them to do his bidding. He was already lining up the military and AGs.

[dflprincess]

50. The votes had already been cast, counted & certified in the states.

The Secretaries of State would have been able to confirm the official results. The electors would not have been involved at all.

[Mister Ed]

61. Do I recall correctly, though, that several states, such as AZ...

...had GOP-majority legislatures that were talking about proffering "alternate slates" of electors?

Muddy the waters sufficiently, and the election decision might be sent to the U.S. House, as per the Constitution. One vote per state delegation. The GOP represents more states in the House than Dems do, and would hold sway.

A cockamamie scheme, to be sure, but it may have been the Trump camp's plan nonetheless. By that time, they had little to lose by trying.

[2Gingersnaps]

72. No less cockamamie than

hanging the Vice President or "putting a bullet in the friggin skull" of the Speaker of the House so martial law could then be declared.

[Kablooie]

77. It would still cause a substantial confusing delay

During which trump would cause more chaos and rally the Maga to revolt. .

I’m sure there was no well thought out plan because trump is a fish out of water when there is.
He is in his environment when there is chaos and he can always use it to his advantage because chaos means everyone else has lost control.

[wnylib]

81. Authoritarian politicians often

Last edited Wed Nov 17, 2021, 05:05 PM - Edit history (1)

create chaos around them in order to take control.
. When they are in power as a leader, they keep things chaotic around them in order to stay on top of the political heap. It was SOP for Hitler..

[Demsrule86]

84. Nope...without the ballots, there would have been delays.

[Ocelot II]

2. And how did they know where the parliamentarian's office was?

That building is an enormous rabbit warren of hallways and offices, and without some inside info you wouldn't know where that particular office was.

[gab13by13]

4. That is my main takeaway,

this coup attempt was planned not a spur of the moment attack on the Capitol. The traitors knew where to go, were directed to go there by higher ups.

DOJ needs to be investigating this shit.

[Wounded Bear]

6. This nt

[Evolve Dammit]

15. Indeed they should. Are they? is the question....

[lees1975]

39. I believe they are doing that.

[uponit7771]

52. The public needs to know this definatively, there's no way investigation into 911 would be left up

... to internet forum speculation.

The news on J6 constantly gets worse in regards to who was in on it, at what point does this become a situation were the sane in the nations institutions should set their hair on fire ?!

[2naSalit]

16. Several Cabinet members were formerly...

Members of the House so they would have known and maybe made sure that was covered on the tours before 1/6.

[Rebl2]

24. Exactly

[Irish_Dem]

20. Inside information and help.

[3catwoman3]

28. Would most of the insurrectionists even know...

...what the parliamentarian does?

[leftieNanner]

31. Most? No.

But clearly some of them did.

They went there with a distinct purpose.

[Lovie777]

3. If they would have succeeded the USA would still be under shithole . ..

and more bloosled would have occurred. On a brighter note tho, I think the military would be quite effected and shithole and his comrades would be standing trial for treason.

[2naSalit]

17. There would be fighting in the streets.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

62. Definitely don't want "bloosled". . . . nt

[padah513]

5. And somebody said this was a random thing that just happened

A heck of a lot of planning went into this coup attempt and I hope the Commission gets to the bottom of it. Would like to believe that the DOJ is keeping its powder dry for something big but we'll see.

[Wounded Bear]

7. That's the RW/Faux Nooze spin of it...nt

[PRETZEL]

9. That is definately an interesting observation,

but did they not realize that the certifications that were at the Capitol on that day was not the only copy of the certificates. I think I had heard during the conversations that states sign multiple certificates.

[gab13by13]

11. I think there would have still been a legal question,

which had to do with the signatures. Without the actual ballots someone could have appealed this to the SC from what I read.

[PRETZEL]

13. Maybe I used the wrong terminology

I'm pretty sure they sign 6 individual certifications. At least that's what I remember. And it wouldn't be the first time I've misread or misheard something.

[lees1975]

40. The "actual ballots" are kept in the states

what goes to Washington is a certification of the vote. And I saw someone posting that there are 6 copies, you are correct.

[gab13by13]

10. Something else has been pissing me off for quite some time now.

People, insurrectionists, were given guided Capitol tours prior to the coup attempt. Is it that freaking hard to find out who authorized those tours? Has anyone investigated this? The insurrectionists could have been walked right up to the Parliamentarian's door during that tour. I want to scream because this shit gets pushed under the rug.

[Grasswire2]

25. I'm pretty sure the identity is known to investigators.

Just like I'm sure that the identity of the pipe bomber is known to the FBI.

Think about this: If the pipe bomber was some nobody, we would already know the identity and have an arrest.

But if the pipe bomber is a member of Congress, that would not yet be made known.

I would not even be surprised if those are one and the same person. The pipe bomber may have been the same person who authorized or gave the Capitol tours. A member of Congress, perhaps.

[SoCalDavidS]

43. If The Pipe Bomber Is A Member Of Congress....

They should have been Fucking ARRESTED, and not allowed to continue with the rights and privileges afforded to a member of Congress.

If it's a member of Congress, the fact they have not been arrested yet, shows that some people are ABOVE THE LAW.

We're talking about someone planting explosive devices. I don't give a shit if it's Kevin McCarthy, ARREST THE MOTHER FUCKER.

[Grasswire2]

47. agreed

But if is a member of Congress the matter might be slow-walked like other aspects of the investigation. Adjudication held back for now, to allow more investigatory time before blowing up in jaw-dropping news.

Doesn't it sound logical to you that if this were an everyday person we would know the identity by now, through law enforcement?

[Evolve Dammit]

26. and which members of Congress provided that info.?

[IronLionZion]

12. Either these nice tourists did their own research ahead of time

or they got help from RW congresspeople and RW staffers who know where everything is.

Someone knows who helped them. Time for the jailed folks to squeal.

[empedocles]

18. Seems like a significant piece of the Jan6 puzzle - being constructed by investigators.

[IronLionZion]

23. I hope some criminal charges come from it.

[lpbk2713]

21. It would be very interesting to see the traitors' phone records.

It would be nice to know who they called for further instructions once
it was apparent to them they couldn't find what they were looking for.

[Mr. Ected]

22. The perpetrators will never, ever, ever be brought to justice

Too much money, too many familiar names, too much power, too much at stake.

Justice is only administered to the masses; the folks who bargain and sell us for the highest bid go about their business unscathed.

Sure, there are exceptions, but deep down, every one of us knows this is the TRUTH.

The myth of American "justice".

[Evolve Dammit]

27. I hope not, but I'm also not disagreeing.

[DENVERPOPS]

54. We have seen it far too many times

during our lives............

[Historic NY]

29. Those ballots

[link:https://www.businessinsider.com/senate-aides-rescued-electoral-votes-before-congress-evacuated-capitol-2021-1|]

[gab13by13]

30. Sadly, I just listened to Dan Goldman,

on Nicolle Wallace say that he doesn't believe that DOJ is investigating the conspiracy by the Trump administration to overthrow our election, even though there is ample evidence to open up an investigation. Goldman said there would have been leaks by now.

So much evidence out there, video, audio, I just don't know why?

[onecaliberal]

35. This is why I think we are fucked. Why in gods name isn't this being investigated?

What is more important?

[SoCalDavidS]

44. I Agree, We're Fucked! nt

[Bernardo de La Paz]

63. Your super-dooper ESP powers have confirmed that it is NOT being investigated? How do you know?

[Scrivener7]

59. If the DOJ were investigating, there would be SOME publicly visible activity.

Some laptop would have been confiscated, some person would be deposed and leak it, someone would have said something.

People are acting as if the indictment of Bannon is the end of the DOJs responsibility and his indictment is proof the DOJ is on this.

It's not. Bannon is a different issue. This is the main issue and there is no evidence they are doing anything about it.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

64. And you have inside information leaked to you confirming this has not happened anywhere?

[gab13by13]

66. Dan Goldman reported the exact same thing on Nicolle Wallace.

Goldman stated that grand juries are bound to silence but an investigation would have been leaked by now by a number of different people.

Goldman is my source that no investigation is happening. It is hard to prove a negative, I must admit.

[Scrivener7]

68. Oh, dear God. Not this shit again.

3,2,1 till someone posts the "What are YOU doing to help Merrick Garland??1?" post.

[LiberalFighter]

32. Which indicates it was planned.

[live love laugh]

41. +1

[hurple]

33. I said the minute the "riot" started

That is was a cover for trained blackwater "troops" to get In and steal the votes.

Blackwater is Erik Price's mercenaries, right?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

60. It's obvious watching film that there was a group within a group

Because there was so much film of activity outside of them breaking in... But what I haven't seen yet, have you?, Is film compiled focused just on what this smaller group did once they got in?

PS impressed that you noticed so early on!!

[hurple]

73. There was a photo

That circulated early on of a group of 4 or 5 men in full tactical gear (my memory says they also had guns but that might be a trick of memory based on the clothes) locked up and moving through the crowd to the doors.

My initial, first thought when it the "riot" started was, " they're going to steal the votes."

My first thought when I saw that photo, "This is an organized, planned op to steal the votes and occupy the building."

My next thought, "This will end in bloodshed."

I didn't quite bat 100 on that. But, I still believe the purpose of rallying the crowd and pushing them to "march" on the Capitol was to hide a trained mercenary force to steal the votes in the idiotic belief that no votes = no vote counting = no new president.

Thank goodness for those pages who secured the votes and hid them.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

78. You have a logistical mind. Have you seen the New York Times

Documentary compendium of videos and photos that they hired a whole group to put piece together? It makes you feel really sad when it's over but it's very well done.

That said it's pretty short on video and photos from inside the chamber once the lockdown occurred. I didn't realize that C-SPAN stopped filming when they adjourned. Imagine the fbi tried to piece it together but I think it would be really interesting if someone could identify this particular paramilitary group and map out their actions till the very end.

I mean, like you said, if they were trying to steal the ballots, did they just throw their hands up in the air once they realized the ballots were secured and turn around and head out the door? Were they arrested at that point?

I still think it's strange the way they were all rummaging through paperwork on people's desks. What were they instructed to look for? Some kind of document that a Democrat was hiding that said "election was rigged so do not vote to certify" and that Democrat was ignoring it? LOL

[hurple]

80. I am a cisa certified info-sec analyst

So I better have a logistical mind.



I think they were digging through desks looking for the Watergate transcripts. Ha ha ha.

Nah, those randos are best exemplified by the duo that took the laptop and have been trying to sell it. They were just looking for something, anything, juicy to either make money or prove Q.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

82. Not sure about that. Only because I have seen all the tapes

These people were instructed to look for something specific. You could just tell by the way they were looking it wasn't just a random curiosity.

Just my novice take obviously know more about it than I do.

[hurple]

83. No, I don't know any more than anybody else watching at home

Just making an educated guess based on the belief that about 90% of the people involved really were just ordinary, but obsessive trumpanzees, people caught up in the moment.

I could be very wrong from that base belief all the way up...

[Laura PourMeADrink]

85. I hear ya. And I totally agree that most of them were just

Dumbshits

It just dawned on me that you could be right maybe these people that were rifling through people's paperwork were all just trying to please leaders of the coup.

Like I could see a low IQ person thinking "wow I don't know what I'm looking for but what if I find something I might get famous w/trump and I might please higher-ups"

[Bernardo de La Paz]

65. Oathkeepers militia squad was organized and focused. Look to them first. . . nt

[malaise]

34. I remember asking about the ballots

while watching live coverage of the attempted coup/ Everything about the coup plotters was and is sloppy - give thanks. Give thanks for the deep state.

[gab13by13]

37. Thank goodness for that staffer

realizing the ballots needed protected.

[cstanleytech]

42. If true that could explain why there were given a tour beforehand so as to know where to go.

[NullTuples]

45. Had the traitors gotten their hands on those ballots...there are multiple copies.

Their efforts would not have mattered. That's what makes the whole thing all the more pathetic.

[empedocles]

49. There is most likely multiple copies and related records. The 'whole thing' may be hopeful,

in a way. Seems that everything trump touches, does indeed turn to shit. This is just further evidence - albeit further, incriminating evidence.

[NullTuples]

53. Not just Trump but the entire GOP. Grift and greed come 1st; Trump was their chosen agent of chaos

[imavoter]

51. I don't remember which D rep it was...

but I saw several on TV interviews
saying that staffers risked their lives
and took the ballots with them.
They need fucking medals.

[gab13by13]

56. I agree,

Congress was being quickly ushered out and the staffers saved the day, literally.

[relayerbob]

57. I recall seeing video of the young lady staffer(s) ...

and a couple of others qho kept their wits long enough to grab the ballots and run to safety, literally moments before the mob broke into the area where they were.

[iamateacher]

71. One was a former student

Her father was a former state senator. Proud of her!

[relayerbob]

74. Cool, and thanks for that!

[Blue Owl]

58. K&R for exposure

[gab13by13]

67. If those ballots had been burned,

the Supreme Court would have picked our president once again.

[orangecrush]

69. Read this

Link to tweet

?t=3CAV-hg4I2Usi3WCViXD1w&s=19

[amywalk]

75. What about Mike Flynn's brother,

who is also a General. He was in charge of the National Guard and kept them from coming to the aid of the Capitol police and the Congress members and their staffers. I wonder if he has been subpoenaed?

[calimary]

70. And how would they know A) about the Parliamentarian

and B) where her office was - unless they had a load of strategic planning, and, I suspect, inside help, guidance, and direction?

This wasn’t just some mass collective public hissyfit.

They knew what they were doing and where they were going.

This was organized and planned, with intention.

Very specific, criminal, reckless, and violent anti-democratic intention.

[kiri]

79. Their win failed only by lack of leadership plans

There was serious planning, but it seems to me that it was wholly inept.

There was no coordination between the sundry groups, ProudBoys, 3%ers, OathKeepers, et al., and the naive hangers-on. Once they breached the House and Senate chambers they had no idea, no plan on what to do next. Getting this far was a major success--possibly they never expected this and therefore had no plans. Typical TFG incompetence?

But consider this: if they had had their wits about them and leadership, they could have won easily. They could have simply called in the crowd and occupied both Chambers. Sit in every seat, 600 in the House, 150 in the Senate, counting floor and galleries. Leaders would rant from the podiums, runners would bring in new pizzas, rotating toilet breaks for occupiers. They could have occupied the Congress for days, maybe weeks. Everything in government would stop. Trump was still Pres.

Displacing them would be extremely difficult; how would you do it? Starve them out over weeks? Shoot them? Negotiate with the leaders? Therein was their problem: they had no leaders who could command the mob and the sit-in.

They could have offered "safe passage out" to all staff, and kept Pelosi, Pence, etc as hostages. Who could have stopped them? Storming with the National Guard? Probably a blood bath as its own failure.

They would have stopped the electoral vote count. They would have effectuated Eastman's coup plan.

That this scenario did not happen amazes me. Trump, Bannon, Flynn, James Dobson, Tony Perkins, et al., were on the cusp of a grand victory. These jerks planned for a takeover of the barricades, but did not plan for later success, which they held in their hands.

[BumRushDaShow]

76. I remember seeing stills and video clips of what they did in there

Drawers of files were flung about and chairs shoved aside, etc. The office was relatively small.

And the aides grabbed the boxes when evacuated and were eventually escorted out of the building -

(I actually remember some early video clip when they first grabbed the boxes and got them out of the Chamber)