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Wed Dec 1, 2021, 10:33 AM

Perhaps mass shootings should be treated more like aircraft crash investigations.

Last edited Wed Dec 1, 2021, 07:55 PM - Edit history (1)

Investigations into shootings are kept within law enforcement agencies but they don't report to the public on the true social and psychological causes of behind each event. I believe most investigations take several months and by then, the public has forgotten about it.

We're all shocked when these things happen and there's the typical tons of thoughts and prayers, vigils and all the obligatory press conferences with first responders and local elected officials. Wash, rinse, repeat just like we have this week.

In contrast, the NTSB investigates all causes leading up to an aircraft accident including mental, physical and emotional issues with all involved personnel and a complete review and testing of the aircraft equipment. Their reports are available to the public and are very thorough and readable and their recommendations are usually taken seriously.

Perhaps there should be a special commission established independent from law enforcement and justice agencies with the charge of investigating any shooting incident where greater than a certain number killed or seriously wounded, and charged with reporting to the communities and American public the clear causes and suggested remedies.

Current incident reporting steers away from blaming social and psychological factors such as racism, mental illness or deficiencies in community leadership or law enforcement due to the politics involved. Therefore in most cases, I believe the public never officially hears the root causes of most mass shootings.

I suppose my main point is that law enforcement and other city/county/state officials (including school employees) have vested interests to protect against accepting blame or responsibility, yet the incident reports come from them. Therefore, I feel independent investigations are needed and appropriate.

As an example, I believe that's the case with the NTSB since they have considerable independence from law enforcement, the airlines and aircraft manufacturers and from the FAA. They do have considerable power to access the accident scene and materials and any records created by law enforcement, records of aircraft maintenance, FAA flight records, etc. and they are given the manpower and funding to do the job right.

We've got to do something different because America is steadily becoming more awash with guns......

KY rant done......

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Addition, 12/1/21 (thanks to Brooklynite for the question):

Thoughts on why independent mass shooting investigative commission(s) might provide relief and possibly reduce gun violence, deaths and injury:

1. Far better closure for families and friends of victims and for communities. Knowing that commission reports would be relatively free of blame shifting, coverups and political influence, grieving parties could better reach closure and communities and states might be better incentivized to make changes in laws, protective measures for schools and businesses, and to reform law enforcement practice and policy.

In other words, prejudiced and protected vested interests would be removed from reporting and creation of potential solutions.

2. Law enforcement would still be in charge of the basic criminal investigation but would additionally report to and work with the commission on a coordinated schedule.

3. Picking up where law enforcement efforts usually end, such commissions would investigate the influence of any suspect's environment, psychology and social exposure such as bullying, involvement in radial groups and use of social media. Therefore, commission members would need to have strong legal teeth in it's directive in order to access personal records and evidence of numerous types and it would need the legal power to call witnesses and related professionals for interviews.

By calling in help from whatever expertise is required such as psychologists, engineers/architects, building security experts, educators, etc., their reports would have authority and credibility far beyond the capabilities of local law enforcement.

4. Independent mass shooting investigative commission(s) would provide reporting to, and work with agencies nation-wide, state legislatures and Congress to help reduce shooting incidents and not just reporting to one local community. However, their highest priority would be to inform the public rather than allowing reports to be covered up, side-lined and buried.

We have both the NTSB and CSB (U.S. Chemical Safety and Hazard Investigation Board) as examples of independent agencies with authority that can help prevent future incidents that endanger public health and safety.

NufSed.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 10:37 AM

1. Yes, when that mass shooting in Georgia happened earlier this year and law enforcement...

pretty much said "Relax, it's just a REGULAR mass shooting, not a racist one", I realized then it might be time to take law enforcement itself off the case of mass shootings.

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:02 AM

6. It's a serious problem because law enforcement, mayors and other elected officials don't want....

the news reports to make their city and county or schools look bad or negligent for the sake of business and tourism. Yet, those people's fingerprints are all over the investigation and incident reports.

Plus, in today's political environment, none of them will dare come out in support of better gun control.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Reply #6)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:34 AM

11. Absolutely

You canít expect a surgeon to operate on a relative, can we expect a sheriff to objectively investigate a case that could cost them votes.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 10:39 AM

2. Each case is treated differently.

Why is this kid being hidden from the public when every other kid has been known and every aspect of their lives picked apart. What makes this kid so special?

And why did the van plowing a Christmas parade fall out of the news already? The media picks and chooses which stories to continuously discuss.

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Response to jimfields33 (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 10:58 AM

4. I think because he is under age. Nt

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Response to USALiberal (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:00 AM

5. So was Rittenhouse. Those kids who shot at cars in DC.

The Florida shooters were as well. Most school shooters are underage.

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Response to jimfields33 (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:08 AM

10. "why did the van plowing a Christmas parade fall out of the news already?"

Because nothing newsworthy has happened? He's been apprehended and arraigned? Is there something being missed?

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 10:57 AM

3. The NTSB has a mandate to try and prevent future accidents.

Not sure other agencies have that level of interest but they should.

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Response to LastDemocratInSC (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:06 AM

7. I can think of another but I think Republicans have almost castrated it. That is....

the U.S. Chemical Safety and Hazard Investigation Board (CSB). Very thorough and professional.

KY

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Response to LastDemocratInSC (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:06 AM

8. ATF should have a division with the mandate to to try and prevent future mass shootings?

That would be in the public interest and would NOT directly cut into the "right to own" gins that prevents current investigations into the causes of those shootings.

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Response to KY_EnviroGuy (Original post)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:07 AM

9. How is a different form of investigation going to change future outcomes?

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #9)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:35 AM

12. What's going on is not working though

Itís time to take law enforcement off the case when it comes to the aftermath of mass shooting events.

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #12)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 11:48 AM

13. If by "not working" you mean "not convincing others to conduct mass shootings"....

I'm still lost as to how a different investigation technique will change anything.

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Response to brooklynite (Reply #9)

Wed Dec 1, 2021, 08:07 PM

14. See my additions to the OP, above and thanks for the question!

I'm no expert Brooklynite but we must start throwing ideas around that have merit and teeth for discussion in our communities.

Our nation should need no better incentive and motive than school children being killed in their own community's schools. Shootings in other locals such as homes and businesses might be reduced as well. I feel our efforts must be nation-wide and run much deeper than just reducing the number of guns on the street.

KY

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