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Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:06 PM

Quick question!!! "When was the last time you recited the Pledge of Allegiance?"

I'd like to know. Esp. after yesterday when a state Rep in Iowa proposed a bill to go after teachers if they showed any disrespect towards the Pledge.

From late June 1965 when I got out of high school, to my 4-years in college, to my 6-years in the U.S. Army, I NEVER once said the Pledge of Allegiance. No employer had me or my fellow employees do that, nor had any meetings where it was done.

If I thought really hard I might come up with a couple of instances where the Pledge was recited; if, say, at a banquet where the colors were presented by a color guard. In the last 25-years? ZERO!

Is it just me, but do Republicans have an authoritarian fetish about the Pledge?

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Reply Quick question!!! "When was the last time you recited the Pledge of Allegiance?" (Original post)
Grins Jan 14 OP
Ocelot II Jan 14 #1
Journeyman Jan 14 #2
Grins Jan 14 #21
tenderfoot Jan 14 #3
IcyPeas Jan 14 #4
BlueTsunami2018 Jan 14 #5
MineralMan Jan 14 #6
frogmarch Jan 14 #7
LoisB Jan 14 #8
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #9
rsdsharp Jan 14 #45
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #47
rsdsharp Jan 14 #48
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #51
rsdsharp Jan 14 #56
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #58
Totally Tunsie Jan 14 #53
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #55
Totally Tunsie Jan 14 #62
WhiskeyGrinder Jan 14 #10
Jilly_in_VA Jan 14 #11
rateyes Jan 14 #12
redstatebluegirl Jan 14 #13
Demovictory9 Jan 14 #22
genxlib Jan 14 #24
srose58089 Jan 14 #14
musette_sf Jan 14 #15
ChazII Jan 14 #16
3catwoman3 Jan 14 #17
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #49
chowder66 Jan 14 #18
DFW Jan 14 #19
Elessar Zappa Jan 14 #30
Demovictory9 Jan 14 #20
zeusdogmom Jan 14 #23
OldBaldy1701E Jan 14 #25
Ms. Toad Jan 14 #26
NutmegYankee Jan 14 #27
obamanut2012 Jan 14 #28
obamanut2012 Jan 14 #29
Gore1FL Jan 14 #31
gibraltar72 Jan 14 #32
rurallib Jan 14 #33
ProfessorGAC Jan 14 #34
Meowmee Jan 14 #35
Jimbo S Jan 14 #36
TlalocW Jan 14 #37
Maeve Jan 14 #38
NowISeetheLight Jan 14 #39
doc03 Jan 14 #40
GPV Jan 14 #41
bottomofthehill Jan 14 #42
krispos42 Jan 14 #54
Mossfern Jan 14 #43
Emile Jan 14 #44
rsdsharp Jan 14 #46
Solly Mack Jan 14 #50
tavernier Jan 14 #52
dflprincess Jan 14 #57
Iggo Jan 14 #59
Takket Jan 14 #60
Ron Obvious Jan 14 #61
Mr.Bill Jan 14 #64
jcmaine72 Jan 14 #63
sakabatou Jan 14 #65
electric_blue68 Jan 15 #66
hunter Jan 15 #67
ecstatic Jan 15 #68
Bettie Jan 15 #69

Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:10 PM

1. I don't remember. I must have had to learn it because I know it, but

it had to have been in elementary school in the '50s or early '60s. And I don't think it was even a regular thing. To me it was just another one of those things you had to do because you were in school, and it didn't really mean anything.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:10 PM

2. I pledged allegiance to the Constitution when I was inducted into the military in the early '70s...

I haven't repeated the pledge since, and I've no intention of ever repeating it.

The way I figure it, once you pledge yourself to something, if you truly mean it, you need never do it again. In fact, to do so -- to engage in a "doctrine of continual reaffirmation" -- makes a mockery of the original vow, as only a meaningless pledge needs constant updating. I affirmed my commitment to the Constitution as a young man. If I ever change my mind, I'll renounce my pledge. Until then, I consider it my word, freely given. Any attempt to make me renew it simply insults me and casts aspersions on my honor.

As for those who insist it should be recited on multiple occasions, who would prefer to see it rendered meaningless through reduction to nothing more than a rote recitation, I often wonder, if they can't trust me to keep a pledge quietly, what's my mumbling it going to mean?

Perhaps we should just reduce it to a “Reader’s Digest” version: “I pledge allegiance to liberty and justice for all.” Short and to the point, non-controversial, useful for all peoples on the planet.

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Response to Journeyman (Reply #2)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:30 PM

21. When you were inducted?

I never did and I was an officer. I took an oath to defend the Constitution and follow orders and that was it. Never did the pledge.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:11 PM

3. I remember not having to put one's hand over their heart while singing the national anthem

I guess weren’t patriotic enough back in the 1970s.



Having said that, I haven’t recited the pledge since high school.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:12 PM

4. 1996, at the swearing in ceremony when I became a U.S. citizen.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:12 PM

5. No idea.

I’m part of a club that has annual award banquets and they do it there but I never participate. It seems juvenile and ridiculous to me.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:12 PM

6. I don't remember any specific occasions, but I have done so

a number of times, always omitting the "under god" phrase, though. It's a symbolic oath only.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:13 PM

7. 1954, when "under God" was added.

I was in the 4th grade and a budding atheist. To avoid getting slapped around by my teacher, I stood for the Pledge and hand over heart, recited all but "under God."

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:15 PM

8. I haven't said it since I realized that line about "with liberty and justice for all" did not apply

to me. So maybe since I was about 12.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:17 PM

9. I like to ask people who insist on saying it at meetings, etc.

if they say their marriage vows every morning when they wake up with their wife, or was once enough.

When I was in high school in the 60s, people refused to say it and it went all the way to the courts. A judge decided they can force you to stand, but they can't force you to say it. If I ever do say it I leave out the words "under god". The courts in California stopped saying "so help me god" When swearing you in decades ago.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:49 PM

45. It always amuses me to hear people talk about having to swear on the Bible in court.

The oath used, in my state at least, is “Do you solemnly swear (or affirm) to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?” There is no Bible, or any other book or object, used to administer the oath. Moreover, in 33 years of litigation practice, I heard “so help you God” appended to the oath only once, when the judge swore in the local head of Operation Rescue in a contempt case brought on behalf of my client Planned Parenthood.

I had one man, a Rabbi, who was very concerned about having to swear an oath. I explained the oath, and his answer in court was to very clearly say “I so affirm.”

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Response to rsdsharp (Reply #45)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:56 PM

47. They don't use bibles in California.

Haven't for decades.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #47)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 06:01 PM

48. Can't swear to it (no pun intended) but I'm willing to bet

the only place that uses Bibles are TV and movie courtrooms.

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Response to rsdsharp (Reply #48)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 06:23 PM

51. That might be true.

I would add swearing people into office. But I'm sure in most cases that's just for show. Wouldn't want people to think they voted for an Atheist, you know.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #51)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:12 PM

56. It can't be a requirement to hold office or public trust.

Religious tests to hold such offices are prohibited by Article VI of the Constitution.

About three or four years ago, before she was elected, Large Marge stalked the halls of Congress trying to force Muslim members to retake the oath on a Bible, because of the “new law” requiring it. There was, of course no such law, and all she accomplished was proving she had never read the Constitution.

https://m.

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Response to rsdsharp (Reply #56)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:18 PM

58. Like I said, it's likely just for show with many of them.

Large Marge. I like that.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 08:43 PM

53. Just curious, Mr. Bill, how do you feel about

"In God we trust" as the official motto of the U.S.?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_God_We_Trust
"In God We Trust" (sometimes rendered "In God we trust" is the official motto of the United States[1][2][3] and of the U.S. state of Florida.[4][5] It was adopted by the U.S. Congress in 1956, replacing E pluribus unum, which had been the de facto motto since the initial 1776 design of the Great Seal of the United States.[6]


I'm sure this raises the hackles of atheists throughout the land!

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Response to Totally Tunsie (Reply #53)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:03 PM

55. I don't care for that either,

but I have found a good use for it. I tell people I promise when the Atheists take over we will not put "There is no god" on all the money.

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Response to Mr.Bill (Reply #55)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:42 PM

62. LOL - sounds fair!

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:18 PM

10. They recite it at the county caucus when I go, and they also say it at a union federation

meeting I go to regularly. I never say it; I just stand there while other people recite it.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:19 PM

11. It was done

sometime after 9/11 at some function where I was. I did not participate. I also do not participate a whole lot in the National Anthem. Oh, I stand, basically because I have to, but I do not put my hand over my heart or anything. Sometimes I bow my head. I would kneel at basketball games if I thought I could but being a blue dot in a big red ocean I am a little afraid to and spousal unit has cautioned me about making waves. I noticed that some of the players on the women's team also bow their heads. Most (not all) are Black. It will be interesting next year to see what the Russian player does.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:20 PM

12. This morning.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:22 PM

13. Last week at a city meeting.

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Response to redstatebluegirl (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:30 PM

22. yep

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Response to redstatebluegirl (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:36 PM

24. That's what I was going to say

It is mandatory protocol for all the local politicians trying to signal there virtue for higher office.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:22 PM

14. For me it was in grade school

If I remember starting in 1957 in first grade thru about the 4th or 5th grade every school day started stooding by our desk with hand over heart and reciting the pledge of allegiance. The 6th grade had me going to a different school and I think the pledge was dropped then. When I was in boy scouts we did start our weekly meetings reciting the pledge. Now that I am in my 70s I don't think any permanent brain damage was done.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:22 PM

15. During the Vietnam Conflict

many of us in my high school did not stand for the pledge.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:24 PM

16. I am a member of a Masonic group called

the Order of the Eastern Star. We say the pledge at each meeting and we meet twice a month. Other than those meeting I don't recite the pledge.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:26 PM

17. "Do Republicans have an authoritarian fetish about the Pledge?"

What don’t Republicans have an authoritarian fetish about?

And, how many Republicans do you think know that Francis Bellamy, the author of the Pledge, described himself as a Christian socialist.

While we’re at it, how many know that the words “under God” weren’t added until 1954?

I don’t know how long it has been since I last recited it. A long time, most likely. I finished high school in 1969, and once you are out of school, there are not that many situations that require it. Probably a few instance during the 4 years I was on active duty in the Air Force nurse corps from 1976-1980. Most recent opportunity might have been a meeting of my county’s Democratic Party, and I haven’t been to one of those since COVID.

I leave out the under god part.

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Response to 3catwoman3 (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 06:09 PM

49. And even fewer people know that the "under god"

was lobbied for by the Catholic church, specifically the Knights of Columbus.

When people ask me why I don't say it, I tell them I prefer the original version.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:27 PM

18. 38 years ago in private catholic high school. nt

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:28 PM

19. Would I be allowed to recite this version of the pledge?

I pledge no credence to the bag
Of lies Fox tells to America
And to the injustice, for which it stands,
One station, shunned by God, indefensible,
With Hannity, disgusting for all.

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Response to DFW (Reply #19)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:49 PM

30. Good one!

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:29 PM

20. worked for California colleges. said the pledge at start of every board meeting.

so very recently.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:30 PM

23. Veterans Day this past November

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:38 PM

25. I started doing that when I was in kindergarten

In 1969 and we did so until 5th grade. It kind of stopped once we went to middle school, but had a (admittedly short-lived) resurgence for most of 1976. Don't really recall doing it since then. I am sure I have on a rare occasion. And like others have stated, omitting the 'under god' part (once I got to around the age of 9-10).

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:38 PM

26. They've had one since the 90s around here. n/t

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:39 PM

27. I have at civic events and re-enactments.

Probably 3 times minimum this Summer.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:45 PM

28. 1980

Freshman year of high school.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:45 PM

29. 1980

Freshman year of high school.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:50 PM

31. My observation of my rightward friends and acquaintances is the pageantry and symbolism is #1.

The songs, the flags, the "under god" all matter much, much more than what they are supposed to represent--they hate government, after all.

Stupid has no cure, but it leads to disease.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:52 PM

32. Probably 60 years ago.

I have refused to say it as it is witnessing a lie. It is a nice thought but for all of my life it has been a lie.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:55 PM

33. I live in Iowa with all the candidates come through for the caucuses

I go to as many Dems as we can. In 2008 we went to a John McCain event.
The Dems would seldom have any show of patriotic bull shit at their events.

The McCain event had age anthem, a fucking prayer (Our Father IIRC) and the Pledge. Creeped me out big time.

But then I did not actually recite the Pledge, just watched the crowd.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 04:56 PM

34. I Never Do It

When I sub, it happens in the first couple minutes.
I'm too busy counting the kids & figuring out who's missing to be parroting a pointless oath. The attendance numbers are needed 5 minutes after first bell & working in 15 schools, some of them huge, I don't know all the kids.
So, how would they prove my not standing with my hand over my heart is disrespect, rather than doing what they're paying me for.
Admittedly, I think the pledge is silly, and I'm not paying homage to a piece of cloth. Nor to the "country for which it stands". We the people tells me I am the country.. (Along with 333 million others.). It's stupid to pledge allegiance to myself.
So, I don't do it, but how would they prove it's" disrespect "?

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:00 PM

35. Yes they do.

Last edited Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:45 PM - Edit history (1)

I haven’t done it since elementary school years ago. We never did it after that. My brother refused to do it, lol. I most certainly will NEVER do it again under any circumstances. It was meaningless to me then and I don’t believe in fake fascist tokens of allegiance.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:06 PM

36. Elementary School

Each Monday morning. In the 70's.

Maybe once in adulthood when I was at a sporting event and the cassette tape of the anthem didn't work.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:18 PM

37. It seems like the only time I hear the pledge or the national anthem

Is when I'm working as a balloon twister at a Cub Scout party or a sports game, etc. I'll respectfully stop twisting and even take off my heart, but I don't do the hand over my heart thing, and I don't recite the pledge. Fine if you want to do it individually and are not coerced, but it's so hard to understand how conservatives thinking that forcing people to recite the a pledge that specifically mentions freedom isn't brain-synapse-burning idiotic. I suspect what it mainly concerns is being able to force people to say, "Under God." It either mollifies them for a while in their belief that we're a Christian nation, or it's a gotcha moment.

TlalocW

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:27 PM

38. 2002 or thereabouts

I go to schools and civic groups as part of my work, but stopped actually saying the pledge shortly after 9/11. I will stand and hold my hand over my heart but I no longer take oaths on command. That makes them meaningless.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:30 PM

39. Two Years Ago

We used to open our DAV meetings with it.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:31 PM

40. Last time it's been many years nt

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:38 PM

41. Yesterday AM at school opening, but I say "under All."

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:40 PM

42. This morning, 11:02 am.

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Response to bottomofthehill (Reply #42)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 08:46 PM

54. Last time I was at a regular Civil Air Patrol meeting for my squadron.

Early December, I guess.

I skip the "under God" part, so I always finish a beat earlier than everybody else.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:40 PM

43. At a Town Council meeting

before Covid.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:45 PM

44. 1962 6th grade

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 05:52 PM

46. I'm sure I've said it since, but my only real memory of doing so was in grade school.

We stood and said it every day, and then sang God Save the Queen (OK, America, but we stole it and put out own words to the tune).

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 06:11 PM

50. 3rd grade.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 06:35 PM

52. Last year at an Elks event.

I’m a member for years. I was an immigrant and obtained my citizenship when I was 16, 60 years ago. I have no problem with this.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:17 PM

57. Once a month

It gets recited before the start of (state) Senate District DFL monthly meeting.

It got started a few years ago when the then chair of the district decided we had to prove we're as patriotic as Republicans pretend to be and we should "take the flag back". Personally, I think doing this is as meaningless as when we used to have to do it every morning in grade school.

The only thing I find interesting is that more people are leaving "under God" out.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:20 PM

59. 1960-something. (n/t)

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:24 PM

60. i honestly don't remember. depends on what grade the stopped having us do it? maybe 1990?

funny thing about it was it was just a motion for me. i never even thought about what the words meant of got any feelings of patriotism or loyalty out of it. it was just a rote action you were asked to do, like pushing in your chair under your desk or hanging up your coat

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:33 PM

61. Not a big fan of fascist loyalty oaths

Particularly when recited by children who don't even know what all the words mean yet.

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Response to Ron Obvious (Reply #61)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:48 PM

64. I totally agree with that.

It's been a pet peeve of mine for a long time.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:48 PM

63. When did dinosaurs go extinct?

Probably not since junior high, which was a long, long, long time ago.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Fri Jan 14, 2022, 09:51 PM

65. Must've been 5th grade. I don't remember anything later.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Sat Jan 15, 2022, 03:25 AM

66. Decades ago?...

I just ran through it - so I still remember it

Probably last in grade school bc we didn't have General Assembly in JHS.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Sat Jan 15, 2022, 09:10 AM

67. Never. When I was a kid my mom was a Jehovah's Witness.

When she was kicked out of that church because she couldn't stay out of politics we were Quakers.

I simply ignored the pledge in school, not standing up, continuing to read or draw spaceships, etc.. Teachers knew they couldn't do anything about that. If they tried my mom would swoop down on them like an avenging angel.

There's still a little voice in my head telling me that anytime someone says the pledge it's a mark against them when they reach the Pearly Gates.

Basically everyone who promotes the pledge is going to hell.

Unfortunately I have a lot of voices in my head like that which is why I've spent so much money on therapy.


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Response to Grins (Original post)

Sat Jan 15, 2022, 09:13 AM

68. 2 days ago to try to distract myself in order to avoid vomiting.

It didn't work, unfortunately.

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Response to Grins (Original post)

Sat Jan 15, 2022, 10:10 AM

69. My youngest says they still recite it every day at the start of school

every time I have to go to a sports event (band kids, I am not a sports person), there is a group recitation.

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