Even if they really believed the shooter was done killing kids (stupid assumption) kids in the class

[Quixote1818]

rooms needed medical care right away. I wonder how many died because they were bleeding badly, their organs began to fail etc. because they got ZERO medical care for over an hour?

[madaboutharry]

1. "The Golden Hour"

That is what doctors call it. And those stupid cops wasted it all away.

[DENVERPOPS]

23. Exactly........

This same exact pitiful cowardice by police went on at Columbine big time, and several other school shootings.
You can bet that if those cops had given their assault weapons to the fathers of the kids, THEY would have gone in

Those cops should be tarred and feathered and run out of town in disgrace........

[Takket]

2. Excellent point

I hadn’t even thought of that but there were bound to be kids in there injured but alive. Even if only one life could have been saved that is enough.

[msongs]

3. but they mighta been shot I tell ya nt

[unblock]

4. The slow rising death count is a hint

Remember how the death count kept rising and rising after the incident?

Most likely, these were victims who were alive when transported to the e.r. but who couldn't be saved. Obviously dead people can be added to the death count at the scene.

The ones who died at the hospital or en route were people who would likely have benefitted from getting to the hospital faster.

[madaboutharry]

25. The initial count was 14.

And then over the next hours it went up to 21.

[Hav]

32. I think it was lower than that but I have no idea about official numbers

On DU, I saw several posters talking about 2 deaths.

[madaboutharry]

33. You are right, the very first reports were 2 deaths.

Then it became 14. Then a few hours later it was 18. and then 21.

[LisaL]

5. As far as I can tell, gunshots were heard during that time, and kids

were calling 911. So how could they believe shooter was done?

[BigmanPigman]

16. They lied!

And incredibly stupid lies too. Do they really think that the truth won't come out. Pathetic liars.

[Tomconroy]

6. The NY Times tonight reports kids were making 911 calls from the classroom

The murderer was in while the police did nothing.

[2naSalit]

7. A whole police department...

Needs to be replaced immediately, top brass on down. Details from other departments can fill in until replacements have been hired.

Anything else is bullshit.

[lpbk2713]

11. If Texas had a governor maybe that could happen.

But no. All the current governor will do is bullshit his way through this.

[orleans]

22. but wait--he said he was "livid"

so it's gotta be true, right?

(he's probably just pissed they didn't give him a heads up on this fucked up lie. after all, when greggy bullshits people he really wants to give it his all)

[DENVERPOPS]

24. Instead the Governor and his cronies

should give the cops the Congressional Medal of Cowardice.........

[In It to Win It]

8. Initially, I read that the police assumed that

if there were any kids or teachers in the room where the shooter had barricaded himself, they were already dead, and therefore not a risk to any additional kids who was not in the room with him, and that's why they waited so long. They thought no additional people were at risk because they figured he's not leaving that room, and the people in that room with him are already dead.

I'm not so sure how true that is anymore because the story has changed several times.

[Quixote1818]

9. Just want to point out, they started getting 911 calls from inside the classrooms

that he was in, after 30 minutes and it still took another 45 to 50 minutes for them to make an attempt at getting into the classroom. The girl calling 911 said there were eight kids still alive about 30 minutes into things.

[In It to Win It]

10. Yes, I read that earlier today.

I also read that the information about the calls was not relayed to the officers at the scene so they didn't know these calls from inside the classrooms were coming in.

It was a massive systemic failure.

[Captain Zero]

12. Not relayed possibly because 911 dispatch

Assumed the cops on scene WOULD FOLLOW THE PROTOCOL TO ENGAGE The perp(s) immediately !

[In It to Win It]

13. I don't presume to know what anyone thought or assumed on why it wasn't relayed

From my point of view, no matter who did the assuming, officers or the dispatchers, they were all the wrong assumptions. It was a fuck up all around

[stopdiggin]

17. indeed. all around. but, I would think that getting that info to

the front lines (commander/post) would be somewhat critical? Talk about wearing blinders!

[In It to Win It]

18. I agree

If it is the case that officers at the scene thought the shooter was stuck in that supposedly barricaded room, it would have changed their assessment of the situation if that info had been relayed.

[stopdiggin]

15. Hmm. I'm thinking that relaying that information

would be pretty important - and therefore part of fairly standard protocol? The idea that 911 just decided they didn't need that information ... Seems a bit of a stretch.

[LisaL]

30. The perp was still shooting.

Even if cops claim they didn't know about children calling 911 (which doesn't make sense, as 911 should have been updating the police), they should have heard the shots.

[stopdiggin]

34. doesn't exactly follow

this is a guy that spent 12 minutes outside the school, blasting away at - essentially nothing. So, shots inside the school do not necessarily mean human targets. Hindsight is everything of course - but it sure would have helped if the forces on site had known about these (living) pleas.

[crickets]

21. Yes. Systemic failure is a perfect description.

For the most part, almost anybody can listen to police comms with scanners or online apps, and people did at the time.

If the police themselves aren't listening, wth? It's a bit odd that there's a police jurisdiction for the school alone, separate from the community. I'm still not quite clear about the distinction, but if police - any police, anywhere - are somehow not receiving pertinent 911 information in real time and that doesn't become a public issue until a school shooting occurs, it's an issue that's been ignored until it's not possible to ignore it any longer.

Every excuse just points out the incompetence in starker relief.

[madaboutharry]

27. Andrew McCabe (former FBI Director) said that it would be a total breakdown of protocol

if the information in the 911 calls wasn’t relayed to the incident commander and all the way down to people inside the school. He was stunned and shocked by the thought that didn’t happen.

[LisaL]

29. The protocol for an active shooter situation is to go and confront the shooter as quickly as

possible. Clearly that wasn't done. So I don't think they were following protocol.

[stopdiggin]

35. 'Command' on site

(whatever the hell that means in this situation) had decided on another course of action. That decision was egregiously wrong (of course) - as everybody and their brother has made clear by now - but nonetheless, that's the decision that they acted on.

and I'm with McCabe (and every other thinking person) here - how do you have a 'command' situation - that isn't getting input from 911?

[Tree Lady]

14. It was even longer because I read local

Hospital couldn't take care of the trauma so they sent them to San Antonio hospitals.

[Gaugamela]

19. If they believed it was over then why wait? They're cops,

you go in at the first opportunity. None of this makes sense. Moreover, I have no doubt most of them wanted to go in. This is profoundly disturbing. It’s not a conspiracy theory, but I think ideology swayed their thinking. The people to blame isn’t the cops, it’s the cowards at the top who don’t know who they are or what they stand for.

[Joenobody]

20. Yes

I mentioned this in a few other threads.

There are two factors highly correlated with GSW survival.

1: location of wound.

2: time to treatment

The first one they couldn't control, but the second they could have. A lot of kids are dead who might have otherwise survived had their time to treatment been 15 minutes rather than 75.

[Novara]

26. I was thinking about the little girl who played dead after smearing her friend's blood ...

... on her. How long did she lie there waiting for help? How many of her classmates lay dying and she heard them take their last breaths?

That level of incompetence and utter absence of care flabbergasts me. It's as if the children didn't deserve their consideration at all.

[Irish_Dem]

28. Yes it is possible dying children could have been saved.

The cops let them bleed out.

[sanatanadharma]

31. To be fair, the magic number of fatalities has to be MUCH higher before the gunstubaters get" woke

We have learned that the fatalities of no single death event (like Los Vegas) or series of events, have yet added up to enough death and blood for the NRAterrorists to say "enough".

Likely nothing changes until an entire high school of 3000 is eliminated by a well regulated, trained, armed and insane dozen 'good guys with guns". Well they were good guys ten minutes before they arrived at the school. ut of fu(ks to give: