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Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:43 PM

Vice Presidents are so frustrating. They can't or dont

speak their minds. And they recoil at anything that could be controversial Seems like such a waste of opinion and talent. All across the board, Rs and D's....what a thankless, horrible place it must be?

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Reply Vice Presidents are so frustrating. They can't or dont (Original post)
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 OP
Ocelot II Jun 27 #1
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #2
Just_Vote_Dem Jun 27 #3
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #6
Ocelot II Jun 27 #5
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #8
Ocelot II Jun 27 #10
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #45
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #4
Ocelot II Jun 27 #9
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #27
Effete Snob Jun 27 #33
Atticus Jun 27 #7
Ocelot II Jun 27 #11
Atticus Jun 27 #16
Beautiful Disaster Jun 28 #51
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #22
2naSalit Jun 27 #39
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #42
Xavier Breath Jun 27 #12
Demsrule86 Jun 27 #14
SoCalDavidS Jun 27 #13
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #23
mcar Jun 27 #15
Post removed Jun 27 #18
speak easy Jun 27 #17
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #25
Rhiannon12866 Jun 27 #32
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #43
speak easy Jun 28 #49
speak easy Jun 28 #50
speak easy Jun 28 #52
Rhiannon12866 Jun 27 #19
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #29
Rhiannon12866 Jun 27 #30
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #34
Rhiannon12866 Jun 27 #35
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #44
Scrivener7 Jun 27 #20
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #24
TwilightZone Jun 27 #21
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #28
Effete Snob Jun 27 #31
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #36
Effete Snob Jun 27 #38
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #40
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #41
JI7 Jun 27 #26
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 27 #37
JI7 Jun 28 #46
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 28 #47
JI7 Jun 28 #48
Laura PourMeADrink Jun 28 #54
Patton French Jun 28 #53

Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:46 PM

1. Which *Democratic* vice presidents are you referring to

who can't or don't speak their minds and recoil at anything that could be controversial?

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #1)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:47 PM

2. Have any?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #2)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:48 PM

3. Well, you brought it up n/t

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Response to Just_Vote_Dem (Reply #3)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:51 PM

6. Ok.. I'll research Vice Presidents. Just watched Harris's

CNN interview and thought about it.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #2)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:50 PM

5. You made the claim; just asking you to back it up,

keeping in mind that vice presidents have exactly zero constitutional power other than to act as understudy for an incapacitated or dead president. IIRC, all the Democratic VPs in recent times have been very active and influential, so which ones do you think were not?

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #5)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:53 PM

8. Wow such a confrontational tone. Jeez

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #8)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:55 PM

10. I'm not being confrontational. You implied that Democratic VPs

weren't doing anything and I just asked for names because I don't think it's true.

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #10)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:59 PM

45. Absurd conclusion sorry

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #1)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:49 PM

4. Is this an American thing? Or do other countries

Have "vice" leaders?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #4)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:53 PM

9. They all have arrangements for someone to step in if the head of government dies or can't serve.

In most parliamentary systems it's the deputy prime minister. In the UK the Queen would appoint an acting PM until someone could be elected.

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #9)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:47 PM

27. I'm referring to toeing the Prez's line?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #27)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:27 PM

33. Well there's a lot to the job...

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:51 PM

7. FDR's VP, Mr. Garner, described his job as "not worth a bucket of warm piss". Another VP, whose

name eludes me, characterized the position as "inside work with no heavy lifting".

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Response to Atticus (Reply #7)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 08:56 PM

11. That has changed significantly since Clinton assigned a lot of duties to Al Gore.

Now VPs have a lot of work to do besides attend state funerals. Obama kept Biden very busy.

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #11)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:05 PM

16. I agree regarding Democratic VPs, but Pence was in the "bucket of warm piss" category. nt

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Response to Ocelot II (Reply #11)

Tue Jun 28, 2022, 03:14 AM

51. It actually changed with Carter/Mondale.

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Response to Atticus (Reply #7)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:37 PM

22. Interesting. Think I would hate it having to temper every thought.

Guess you just assume the opinions and positions of your prez and relegate your own and carry on. Seems kind of crazy since many VPs go on to run for Prez themselves. Then...they are caught in a dilemma... Express their own if different? or diss their own Prez..

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #22)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:54 PM

39. I don't think it's quite like that.

In these current times it has become necessary for the VP to be visible yet support the agenda of the president. And that is what we will see from VP Harris in public.

That is her job and she knew it when she agreed to do it, but that's the visible side of the job.

What you don't see, partly because the news does not cover it, is the work she does behind the scenes.

She's not there to be the star of the show, she's there to support the president and his agenda AND offer advice which is when she offers her opinion, to the president, in the Oval Office, after briefings. And that, too, is her job.

In more common layman's terms you might think of her job description, in the private sector, as executive administrative assistant; executive envoy/liaison internationally. Which is quite a handful along with her duties in the Senate and tasks I can't think of at the moment.

She just isn't on the teevee very often and she shouldn't have to be.


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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #39)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:45 PM

42. All true. Guess you have to just hope you have a prez who

will unequivocally stand up for you once it's all said and done? And the degree of enthusiasm in that endorsement is a direct clue as to why you picked that person to begin with?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:00 PM

12. Happens on occasion. I would argue Joe spoke his mind

that one time about same sex marriage and it seemed to catch the WH a bit off guard.

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Response to Xavier Breath (Reply #12)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:03 PM

14. Joe spoke his mind and on occasion...Obama was pissed too.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:00 PM

13. Cheney Was A De Facto President For 8 Years nt

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Reply #13)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:38 PM

23. Yes!!!!

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:04 PM

15. Which VP are you referring to?

Please, be specific.

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Response to mcar (Reply #15)


Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:06 PM

17. You mean like VP Biden taking a stand on marriage equality on national TV?

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Response to speak easy (Reply #17)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:44 PM

25. You are saying Obama was against marriage equality?

Or Biden just spoke first on a national platform?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #25)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:24 PM

32. That's exactly what VP Biden did - forcing President Obama to change his thinking and take a stand

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Response to Rhiannon12866 (Reply #32)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:56 PM

43. Don't agree at all. It was a matter of timing and politics.

Obama, as president was much more politically aware than Biden. Which says good things about Joe. But to conclude that Biden caused Obama to change his mind ( other than timing of announcement). ... Not sold on that, sorry.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #43)


Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:16 PM

19. Al Gore, Walter Mondale, Joe Biden, Kamala Harris??

No Democrats that I can remember were prevented from speaking out. Same with Dick Cheney, yikes! It's only been true for Mike Pence - till now.

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Response to Rhiannon12866 (Reply #19)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:00 PM

29. Prevented from speaking out 100% different than speaking out. But maybe

they just agree?? Cheney definitely an anomaly. But he had an affable yet very dim prez. He probably quickly realized he could take charge and manipulate the prez

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #29)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:04 PM

30. Jimmy Carter changed the status of the U.S. VP

Vice President Mondale had an office right near the POTUS, in the middle of the action, and had his own independent responsibilities. And that's been the case ever since.

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Response to Rhiannon12866 (Reply #30)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:30 PM

34. Perhaps this importance of a VP has been grossly underplayed?

In my mind, they have to toe the line, in general, with perhaps an exception or two. Seems like a constricted thankless job... But then your reward is that you get to be the heir apparent. Guess it totally works if you agree all the time.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #34)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:33 PM

35. VP Biden led the fight for marriage equality causing President Obama to change his mind

And take a stand.

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Response to Rhiannon12866 (Reply #35)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:58 PM

44. Perhaps the timing of taking a stand, not sold on changing mind.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:16 PM

20. Yes. I imagine it must be an infinitely frustrating job.

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Response to Scrivener7 (Reply #20)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:42 PM

24. Yup.. extremely careful dance you have to play

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:17 PM

21. Did you miss the Clinton and Obama presidencies?

Gore and Biden were heavily involved in their respective administrations and were quite vocal.

As for Rs, as others noted, Cheney was the de-facto president for eight years.

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Response to TwilightZone (Reply #21)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:53 PM

28. Yes was in a coma

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #28)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:24 PM

31. Lol


The VPís Constitutional role is really minor. Yes there have been varying degrees of ďgiving them stuff to doĒ, but it varies.

Nixon played up the importance of his role in the Eisenhower administration.

This is what Eisenhower had to say.

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Response to Effete Snob (Reply #31)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:43 PM

36. Wow. Impressed you dug that up!!! Think it would be really

interesting to know exactly why people picked a particular VP. Probably unlikely there'd be an honest comment tho. My guess would be that "thinks just like me" might be below other criteria? Guess you can tell based on how big and sincere their praise & recognition is?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #36)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:53 PM

38. Winning the election


Does this pick help me among voters in some area where Iím weak?

The president can choose a cabinet and seek advice from whomever he or she wants. If the VP is also worth consulting, great, but you have to win the election.

Joe Biden might be one counterexample, since electoral considerations didnít seem to favor him as a pick.

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Response to Effete Snob (Reply #38)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:03 PM

40. If I could guess, it would be youth and inexperience coupled

with tenure and wisdom.

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Response to Effete Snob (Reply #38)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 11:07 PM

41. And of course the obvious, that he is white. But what

About Hillary? Why did she pick her VP? Tim Kaine? For VA?

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 09:45 PM

26. All across the board ? This hasn't been the case since Gore became

VP. It's only Pence who has been useless but those were unusual circumstances where even the so called president was useless.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #26)

Mon Jun 27, 2022, 10:51 PM

37. Perfect example! He was picked to appease the religious wingnuts

Not because he's simpatico with the criminal murderer FG. Guess we will see .. how far FG goes to support him if it comes to that. Although gleefully watching as people chant to hang him is a very low bar

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #37)

Tue Jun 28, 2022, 12:06 AM

46. Trump didn't need to appease the religious right. They were Trump's base

He picked Pence because he wanted someone that would not overshadow him and would do as he told him to which he did up until the end.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #46)

Tue Jun 28, 2022, 12:28 AM

47. Both. He picked him primarily to attract Evangelicals plus

He was a calm yes man.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Reply #47)

Tue Jun 28, 2022, 01:23 AM

48. He didn't need to attract evangelicals. Evangelicals voted for Trump in the Primary

They were his biggest supporters .

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Response to JI7 (Reply #48)

Tue Jun 28, 2022, 02:45 PM

54. Evidently he and his advisors disagree.

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Response to Laura PourMeADrink (Original post)

Tue Jun 28, 2022, 08:22 AM

53. There's some truth to that

I suppose they donít want to contradict or get out ahead of the President, which I can see.

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