Common person head scratcher re J6

[Laura PourMeADrink]

Re: The encounter Hutchinson described that occured. Presumably, shortly after the event ( trump freaking out in SUV)

1. Why would Engel tell Ornato? Aren't they trump apologists? Why would they trash him? Heat of moment? And then call Hutchinson in? Why?

2. Why did Ornato tell Hutchinson the story? It happened to Engel! In fact it had just happened to Engel! Did he just stand there mute?

3. Why wave her in to tell her? Either they were all incredibly simpatico or something??



Disclaimer:. Just an ordinary Dem. Please just kindly correct if I have something wrong

[RockRaven]

1. Office gossip is office gossip, even in the WH.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

10. +1

[KarenS]

2. I took it that they were very surprised by the intensity of what had happened

and wanted to talk about it,,,,, that they were amazed or surprised,,,, and that they often shared things with each other.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

5. Ah... The "informal" chain of command. Kinda like ehen

A family talks about a crazy uncle, but bottom line they love him?
.

[tinrobot]

13. Love him.... or want something from him.

Such as an inheritance.

In this case, they wanted power.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

20. I never heard .. Did Hutchinson really want to go

To Mara Lago?

[gab13by13]

3. They believed that Hutchinson was loyal to Trump.

The story would not have mattered if Hutchinson doesn't testify.

Why wouldn't Engel tell his escapade? How often does a president freak out, grab the steering wheel and choke his SS agent? It would be hard not to tell someone.

They can all lie now and say it never happened that way.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

7. Yes. And it's one thing for a bystander to speak out, another

For someone in power with personal jeopardy.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

15. Why do you think FG wanted to go to the Capitol? If that's true?

Just for the sheer adoration? To command a literal government overthrow?

And HOW would he know he would be safe? Million dollar question - ergo, Who would
NOT be safe?

[Frasier Balzov]

36. That's where the laurel wreath was to be placed on his head.

[CanonRay]

4. Trying to impress a pretty girl

with their inside knowledge? Men are often stupid in this very fashion if I recall my mispent youth.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

9. I hear ya! It's all starting to make total sense! nt

[Captain Zero]

26. undoubtedly a factor, this happens every office

nt

[mcar]

6. Ornato had been a SS agent and was now overseeing them vis a vis the WH

why wouldn't Engel tell him? Yes, they are Trump Humpers.

Hutchinson was part of the team on a busy, violent, emotional day. Why wouldn't they talk to her about what had happened in the SUV? She was one of them.

Why wouldn't Ornato tell Hutchinson the story? They worked closely together. According to Hutchinson, Engel appeared "discombobulated." If your boss had just attacked you while you were doing your job, wouldn't you be?

Why not wave her in to tell her? They were colleagues and something intense had just happened.

If they want to dispute her testimony, they can do it, under oath and in public. Otherwise, their version of events is irrelevant and there is no reason to trust it.

Hutchinson testified under oath, in public, to what she was told re this event. Which, BTW, is pretty much just a sidebar to the real news of yesterday's hearing, but you do keep wanting to question this.

Common person headscratcher: why?

[Raven123]

8. Maybe warning her of TFG's mood so she can be on her toes to avoid flying plates

[usonian]

11. Wild guess. They spoiled his plan, and needed to

get a story out before he invented one to cover himself (always at someone else's expense)

[Laura PourMeADrink]

21. Expound. FGs plan to take over govt?

[usonian]

24. The ride is news to me. All I can conclude is that he wanted to be "there" And THAT plan was spoiled

Crybaby doesn't want anything, however small, to go otherwise, or he flies into a rage.

I'd be trying to cover my ass ahead of his account of the ride.

No idea if that was part of the script to take over. That's TBD.

It is entirely logical of SS to haul TFG and Pence out of danger. That's exactly their job. They know danger.

More than that, I have no idea.

And I won't speculate. (Other people actually do that better)

Other than "It's completely predictable that he wanted the spectacle."

[Laura PourMeADrink]

31. Agree with everything except that you won't speculate

One thing I keep thinking back to on that day was that the insurrectionists all seemed to be incredibly interested in papers, notes and pc's

[usonian]

33. Want me to speculate? That's a tricky game.

Didn't the woman who stole Nancy Pelosi's laptop claim to want to sell it to Russia? (for what that's worth or worthless)
Others? Hard to say. Some had a definite agenda, and others may have been idiots just for cover.

I don't want to speculate because I have stuff that needs to get done and I really want to focus on my GOTV and Ukraine and Electronic Privacy stuff. I am willing to back off humor and posting photos. It's just that I am relatively new here and easily distracted. I already backed some stuff off and promised myself to let almost everything not on my focus list go.

This is very complex, with deliberate distractions. As I posted "this story is LITERALLY as long and twisted as a Russian novel. }

[Laura PourMeADrink]

35. Carry on ! Look forward to analysis at some point!!! nt

[Sogo]

12. Remember, Hutchinson said Engel was looking disoriented/disheveled....

He had gone into Ornato's office to tell him about the event, and both of them were probably in somewhat disbelief at the line Trump had crossed.

Ornato summoned Hutchinson in to vent....

"Did you hear...."

My take FWIW....

[mcar]

16. That's what it sounds like to me too. nt

[Laura PourMeADrink]

17. Yeah I may have missed it, but wonder why no one asked

Hutchinson did Engel say anything? But actually can envision it. Engel just nodding, yup it happened. Still would have been interesting to have asked her what Engel did/said other than not refute.

[2naSalit]

22. She was asked...

And she said that the telling was by Ornado in the presence of Engel who never corrected the story or denied it then or later, until today.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

32. Yes heard that. But if you just think about something

wild that just happened to you. And someone is telling the story that you presumably just told them, strikes me you'd interject a bunch. Not that it matters one iota, but at least to me, Hutchinson was closer to Ornato than to Engels. And Engels trusted Ornato more than Hutchinson

[Gaugamela]

14. My take: Ornato and Engler weren't in on it, and were taken by surprise. Just

as McConnell was taken by surprise and made a statement from the floor condemning the attack which he later abandoned, Ornato and Engler reacted honestly and then changed their story later.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

18. Very good point!!!!! Have to filter people's reactions

Through that lens!!!

[sheshe2]

19. They 'say' they are willing to testify and call her 'story' a lie.

They say they are willing to testify under oath? I don't think so. Lol, so was Ginni then bowed out saying she had too many personal issues at this time. Snort, I bet she does.

Hutchinson had nothing to gain and everything to lose by testifying. She is not lying.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

23. Well she's got a proponent on CNN who has said something

Like... If SHE said it - it has to be true.

Do wonder why after all the BS trump did, that this was different? Perhaps deep inside they knew he was whacked? And he just went TOO far?

Have to look at this all through the lens of the extraordinary events of that day. And they were in the middle of it. Had the violence started yet or was this before?

[Ohio Joe]

25. Why does it matter?

It is a second hand account of perhaps the least criminal thing said about tfg in her entire testimony and it has quickly grown into the largest right wing talking point on the internet. Is there really nothing else in her testimony that interests you besides this right wing talking point?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

27. Wow.. way harsh OJ

[Ohio Joe]

28. Really...

I went easy.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

29. Feel honored

[MLAA]

30. Heat of the moment?

Remember on Jan 6 mccarthy and a bunch of repugs were very shaken and vocal against the insurrection. Of course it all wore off in 12 hours.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

34. Good point. Guess violence hadn't started yet either.?

Actually important for state of mind. And then later it was like JHC knew he was bad but not THIS bad?

[Hortensis]

37. Let's not be distracted from hugely incriminating evidence by Kool-Aid.

So far SteeringWheelGate is the most effective distraction they've managed. Pathetic.

EVIDENCE THAT MATTERS: The afternoon of J6 tRump repeatedly ordered the SES to take him to the Capitol under attack. He promised the insurrectionists he'd be there with them.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

38. All part of the same event tho isn't it? For me, it's about

overall credibility of witness. Did Ornata really relay this story? Was Engel really in room? And was the story true? And the story includes not only the lunge but FGs adamant desire to go to Cap.

[Hortensis]

39. For the DoJ, that'll be at most a minor detail in a GIANT CRIME.

IF TRUMP WAS TRYING TO CARRY OFF A COUP OR OBSTRUCT CONGRESS, it literally doesn't matter to the legal case if this anecdote is true or not.

As for Ornata, he's known to be tRump's man and long disrespected even among tRump circles, as well as professional WH observers. He has extremely poor credibility to start with. The Republicans' promise to have him testify under oath is a bad joke, as anyone who watched the senate confirmation hearings for tRump's nominees should fully realize.

Regarding Hutchinson's testimony, she and it have all been carefully investigated by the House Select Committee. What was presented in the hearing is THE COMMITTEE'S testimony to the people. Please don't confuse the committee's credibility with tRump's, the coup elements in the GOP, and those fighting desperately to protect them.

The committee has thousands of pieces of evidence and hundreds of interviewed witnesses to these events, and some will be able to corroborate or at least support her account. They're not fools. They know the credibility everything they present will be attacked.

Last, the battle for power is enormous. There will be many more attempts to distract us from what means everything and focus us on lies and fake issues like this that, in the end, are irrelevant. Don't be fooled.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

40. Understand all that H. Not distracted at all. Just, as a

common person, talking out the pieces of particular testimony that popped out as mysterious on a personal human interaction level. Not necessarily anything that could ever be considered federally indictable.

That said, it was the Committee themselves who chose to bring this incident to light, right? Is that what you're implying that it was done for reasons we don't know and that no Democrat should pay any attention at all? If yes, we all may need to take some three dimensional chess lessons