General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhen the dust settles in Ukraine
Zelenskiiy, the Ukrainian government, and the Ukrainian military have said from the day the Russian invasion began, that it will be over when every bit of Ukrainian territory is free of Russian control. Some, even knowledgeable political and military analysts, assumed that was a negotiating tactic, propaganda for domestic morale, etc., and that ultimately Ukraine and Russia would negotiate an end to hostilities that would leave Russia in control of some part of Ukraine.
It now seems more likely that a) It will be over when every bit of Ukrainian territory is free of Russian control; and b) that may happen a lot sooner than the knowledgeable military and global geopolitical analysts imagined it could be accomplished.
Slava Ukraini, indeed.
So the world better begin planning now, for the aftermath of this war.
The rebuilding of Ukraine is the most obvious challenge. They have been literally bombed back to the Stone Age in large parts of their Eastern territory. Population has been massively displaced, almost all resources will be depleted, agricultural production capacity substantially diminished, infrastructure destroyed and/or seriously degraded, and economic and social capabilities across all sectors significantly reduced.
The Ukraine government, to the extent it can spare capacity right now to think and plan ahead for the massive rebuilding that will be required, has signaled a desire to reconstruct as a "green state" - implementing environmental reconstruction and building stewardship and sustainability into everything from infrastructure to economic development. This is an important goal, but without support from the rest of the world its achievement could be delayed or even denied in some respects.
Those parts of the world that value principles of human progress, civilization, and cooperative/collaborative models of geopolitical interaction have promised help to Ukraine, and that's wonderful. However, as anyone who's ever run a disaster reconstruction effort knows, there's meaningful assistance with regard to the needs, situation and future well-being and sustainability of what's under reconstruction, and then there's truckloads of surplus and unwanted junk landing on top of you, messing up your logistics and requiring a lot of insincere thanks and appreciation for the donors' noble sacrifices.
If we want Ukraine to become an anchor for positive progress in a key region, we need to be prepared with the first kind of help, and very generously. And while it may look like an expensive and possibly risky investment, it will pay off much bigger in the long term. If Ukraine is able to develop and pilot new technologies that the rest of the world can build on as we all address climate change together, it'll be a win-all-around.
Then there's the other challenge: Post-Putin Russia
It's just a guess, but an additional agenda for Bill Richardson's recent very low-key diplomatic visit to Moscow was as much to scope out the potential players in a post-Putin Russia as to negotiate specific hostage resolutions. As a good many analysts have pointed out, the Putin-precipitated collapse of Russia into a mid-tier nation in global power and influence still leaves them with "spoiler" capability in the form of their enormous nuclear arsenal, U.N. veto, and positional value as a client state and resource pipeline for China.
And that's just how they'll end up, if whatever leadership remains in Russia continues to be oriented toward a kleptocratic oligarchy. It's an Awful Warning of what happens when a nation's leadership values kleptocracy, via strongman autocracy, direct oligarchy, or a weak autocrat fronting for an oligarchy. Russia should be making every kleptocracy-enabling nation with any remnant of a broader self-governance structure seriously rethink the risks and costs of their downhill slides, based on that vivid, technicolor Object Lesson.
Whether any kind of assistance could help Russia pull back from its own depths of kleptocratic degradation and reshape itself with a government focused on building a functional, broad-based economy with broadly-distributed benefits and a robust middle class, I don't know. They're pretty far gone. Stubbornness and resilience cut both ways, in pushing through or avoiding difficult change.
I think it's worth a try. In low-key ways. There may be cracks in the facade that honest, well-crafted offers of assistance might hammer some wedges into. If any leadership remains with the potential to work toward a vision of a genuinely strong Russia with a broadly-based, sustainable economy producing population-wide benefits and building increasingly-robust self-governance into their future, we should be finding them and providing them with some help.
None of this will be easy.
But it's essential, if we want to keep this planet habitable for our grandchildren.
presciently,
Bright
Irish_Dem
(46,946 posts)I have had some questions lately and you answered them.
I would like to see some of Putin/oligarch wealth directed to Ukraine.
Frustratedlady
(16,254 posts)We don't hear much about all those yachts and/or mansions that were seized. Where does that money go, if they can find someone rich enough to pay a decent price. I'm afraid they will be sold to the rich and famous for a garage sale price.
The problem with Putin's wealth, is it will probably be impossible to find. Supposedly, some of his wealth was hidden or laundered by oligarchs. It will be interesting to learn what he is really worth.
The other point of Ukraine rebuilding as they project, is that they can end up being a good example to other countries on environmental considerations and involving citizens in the rebuilding of that pathetically war-torn country. We've seen what they can do to defend themselves. Imagine the impression they'll make when they put their lives back together.
I just fear what Putin will end up doing. He's getting backed into a corner and his selections could be devastating for Ukraine and the world. We all know what those are.
Irish_Dem
(46,946 posts)All those meetings he had with sitting US members of congress.
Handing out his money to be hidden.
Putin knows the US has no stomach to embarrass GOP politicians.
So it would be a brilliant plan.
By most estimates he is worth $300 billion.
He is one of the richest men on the planet, if not the richest.
Oh yes that is going to be so wonderful to see Ukraine rebuild, all green, 21st century.
It is going to be something to behold.
Yes if they put their mind to it, the Ukrainian people can and will achieve anything.
Yes Putin is capable of blowing up everything.
HOWEVER, right now he has royally pissed off most of the world.
And his own generals, oligarchs and citizens are not too happy with him either.
He probably doesn't want to be dragged out of the Kremlin by his ****s and hung upside down
in Red Square.
Frustratedlady
(16,254 posts)That was my first reaction, as well. We never did get a reply to our questions about the reason for the trip, unless I missed it. They are never forthcoming with any questionable activity on their part. Let's just say the plane weighed more on the return trip than the original flight.
The one irritation I have about Repukes is they think we're so stupid we won't catch on to their shenanigans. All you have to remember is that it is spelled $henanigan$.
Irish_Dem
(46,946 posts)I assume they had hidden meetings as well.
And money funneled through Russian agents.
Of course they will not tell us the truth about anything.
The GOP lies as standard operating procedure.
Putin made them travel in public on the 4th of July to embarrass the US.
GOP politicians begging for money and help on America's independence day.
The GOP doesn't even bother to hide their crimes anymore.
Part of the US population does not care or have the stomach to take action.
The other part thinks it is great the GOP is aligning with Putin.
Frustratedlady
(16,254 posts)Walleye
(31,015 posts)Becoming a model of democracy and green energy in Europe. It would be so much better for Europe and the world and the Ukrainian people definitely deserve it. I guess you may say Im a dreamer
TygrBright
(20,758 posts)Walleye
(31,015 posts)MarineCombatEngineer
(12,369 posts)that is a great song.
Tomconroy
(7,611 posts)a settlement. Russia has kidnapped over a million Ukranians and won't return them. This war was ultimately about Russia's failing demographics. Ukraine will spend the next 50 years hunting down war criminals inside Russia.
Hekate
(90,646 posts)Amishman
(5,555 posts)I really hope the Russian people rise up and take care domestically what we will struggle to force from the outside.
The problem is their populace has such a significant brainwashed contingent that you will have a neo-Putinist underground. It will make our Trumper problem look like nothing in comparison.
Rebuilding Ukraine is easier.
Rebuilding Ukraine starts with turning over the $250 billion in frozen Russian assets to the Ukrainian government. The eventual peace agreement should include Ukraine getting a modest - but long lasting - cut of Russia's oil revenue. Possibly an ownership stake in several of Russia's large government owned companies.
Ukraine's allies add to this with favorable trade deals with Ukraine and encourage western companies to invest there.
The main concern is Ukraine does have a history of corruption issues, reconstruction will need external auditing and guidance.