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Thu Nov 24, 2022, 10:41 AM

Scientists Increasingly Calling to Dim the Sun

Yah, what possibly could go wrong with that?


Just last month, the White House announced a five-year research plan to study geoengineering, a sign that the idea has moved out of the realm of science fiction amidst a period of rapidly rising temperatures and failed climate targets.


--- more and more researchers turning to investigate geoengineering as a potential last resort.

Just like particles released by a massive volcano previous eruptions have been shown to lead to dropping temperatures injecting aerosolized sulphur dioxide into the stratosphere could have similar results.

While there's consensus among experts that there's a good chance these particles could actually shade and cool the surface below, we're only starting to understand the possible side effects, particularly on a global scale.


https://futurism.com/scientists-calling-dim-sun-geoengineering

27 replies, 1977 views

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Arrow 27 replies Author Time Post
Reply Scientists Increasingly Calling to Dim the Sun (Original post)
packman Nov 24 OP
maxsolomon Nov 24 #1
Initech Nov 24 #12
at140 Nov 24 #2
NickB79 Nov 24 #19
at140 Nov 25 #24
Dysfunctional Nov 25 #25
unblock Nov 24 #3
Bernardo de La Paz Nov 24 #4
Beetwasher. Nov 24 #5
Initech Nov 25 #22
gulliver Nov 24 #6
CoopersDad Nov 24 #7
ProfessorGAC Nov 24 #13
jeffreyi Nov 24 #8
Darwins_Retriever Nov 24 #10
thucythucy Nov 24 #11
Bernardo de La Paz Nov 24 #16
Kaleva Nov 25 #27
Emrys Nov 24 #9
Shanti Shanti Shanti Nov 24 #14
Liberal In Texas Nov 24 #15
NNadir Nov 24 #17
Hermit-The-Prog Nov 24 #18
RealityChik Nov 25 #20
NickB79 Nov 25 #23
RealityChik Nov 25 #21
Model35mech Nov 25 #26

Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 10:44 AM

1. How many dystopian movies have this plot?

Nevertheless, it should be studied - we're not going to stop CO2 emissions anytime soon.

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Response to maxsolomon (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:53 AM

12. It was the plot of Who Shot Mr. Burns, for one!

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 10:44 AM

2. Then next ice age will arrive sooner?

Those nasty ice ages coming every so many thousand years kill far more mammals than global warming.

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Response to at140 (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 03:22 PM

19. Uh, no. Mammals thrive during Ice Ages

The grasslands and open forests the cooler, drier climate creates are some of the most productive habitats on Earth. The mammalian megafauna that existed until 10,000 years ago is testament to that.

As it stands, we should be slowly cooling now. Instead, we've delayed the next Ice Age by 100,000 years.

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Response to NickB79 (Reply #19)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 04:21 PM

24. You are uninformed

The last ice age covered Chicagoland with many miles thick ice glaciers.
Don't think any grocery stores were open. Humans are mammals as well in case you do not know.

The next ice age is coming fast. You have no way to know when. So stop making ridiculous estimates which are just guesses.

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Response to at140 (Reply #24)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 04:33 PM

25. 10,000 years ago, there were only 1-15 million people.

They were hunter-gatherers and just moved with the animals. 8 billion people aren't going to be able to do that.

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 10:47 AM

3. I'm more of a tapas guy, but I could go for some dim sun

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 10:54 AM

4. Photographers lose, either way. . . nt

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 10:55 AM

5. I call this enemy The Sun

Again, Simpson predicted it.

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Response to Beetwasher. (Reply #5)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 12:51 PM

22. "What town did we just crush?" "Shelbyville!" "Yay!!!!"

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:00 AM

6. It's terrifyingly stupid

It's not that it wouldn't work. It might. What we have to worry about is two-fold, screwing it up and not being able to stop other countries from doing their own go-it-alone screw-up. It has been noted that, for example, India might decide it is taking too much damage from climate change and independently decide to geoengineer.

This is why we need to slap the mics out of the hands of the mere emoters of the world pronto. I am so glad we've got Biden in office. Cool, calm, collected leadership.

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:10 AM

7. Thank you for posting this.

We are incredibly nave, but this is a scientifically accurate account of a potential fix.

IMO, nature will eventually thin our herd, there are too many of us but that's never, or only rarely, discussed as a solution.

Have a good Thanksgiving, you and yours!

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Response to CoopersDad (Reply #7)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:55 AM

13. I'm Unconvinced

SO2 is significant absorber of both infrared & ultraviolet, which nitrogen & oxygen don't do as strongly.
So at the gas-liquid equilibrium in the upper atmosphere, I'm concerned the absorption of the gas phase can be greater than the reflectance of the liquid & solid phases.
The article doesn't provide enough detail to actually do the math.

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:13 AM

8. Is not the elephant in the room human overpopulation?

Addressing that is a whole lot less experimental than spraying aerosols everywhere.

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Response to jeffreyi (Reply #8)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:25 AM

10. What's the solution to over population?

Many of the countries that suffer from over population has laws against birth control. Just imagine the programs/laws the US would pass. Several countries if they would ban or limit births, would intend it for their minority populations and turn a blind eye of violations by the rich and majority. When a person reaches 65, ban them to Texas.

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Response to Darwins_Retriever (Reply #10)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:47 AM

11. It isn't legislation that causes over population, but poverty.

Nations with a poorer standard of living, with inadequate or non-existent social safety nets, force families to care for their elderly and disabled. Which means a family needs to produce children in order to ensure there will be caretakers down the road. Add to this high infant mortality and poor health care, and families need to have lots of kids to guarantee someone will survive to take this on. And on top of that, poorer families need children to provide another source of income--in the fields or home shops, or working for sweat shops in Asia and Africa.

Wealthier nations, such as those in Europe, are seeing a decline in birth rates and have for some time now.

We could solve world poverty in a matter of years if we put our minds to it, and limited the power of the ultra-wealthy to continue to amass an obscene share of the world's resources.

It's not an intractable problem. What makes it difficult is too many powerful people benefit from the system as it is.

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Response to thucythucy (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 12:28 PM

16. Exactly, and there is a productive effect for the people freed up to pursue careers. . . nt

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Response to thucythucy (Reply #11)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 05:30 PM

27. By the time such measures could be implemented, it'd be too late

The population would have to drop drastically in a short period of time.

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 11:20 AM

9. We may be in enough trouble if there's a seriously major volcanic eruption,

and if it happens, we may be glad of a little leeway in atmospheric cover.

Any potentially irreversible measure like this should be a non-starter, especially with the unpredictable disturbances already happening in the jet stream and ocean currents etc.

Then what's next? - Weaponizing it to starve an adversary's land mass?

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 12:03 PM

14. Send all those "scientists" to work in Antarctica for 12 years. See how much they like ice and cold

Yeah, what could possibly go wrong, Snowball Earth?

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 12:07 PM

15. More or less the subject of Neal Stephenson's novel "Termination Shock"

Instead of one country unilaterally deciding to change the atmosphere it's about a Texas billionaire who takes it on himself to change the climate with a layer of sulfur.
I think it's quite possible some idiot like Musk might actually try something like that.

One of the sources of conflicts in the novel is that not every country is on board with the changes to the climate the billionaire is bringing about and how they might try to sabotage it.

It's a very interesting read set in the near future where airports have to be closed when it's too hot for planes to land and take off; where people have suits they can wear outside that cool them enough to be outside without succumbing to heat prostration.

https://www.nealstephenson.com/termination-shock.html

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 12:29 PM

17. There are also "scientists" who say climate change isn't real. Not much difference between them.

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Response to packman (Original post)

Thu Nov 24, 2022, 02:49 PM

18. Sure, everybody loves acid rain. Instead, put some shade in geosynchronous orbit.

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Response to packman (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 12:55 AM

20. Faint-Sun Paradox popsicle dreaming?

According to Carl Sagan, back in 1972, explained that 4.5 BILLION years ago, the sun was about 30% cooler than it is now. This would have made the earth too cold for liquid water, preventing life from forming. YIKES!

Can you imagine if these scientists get it wrong and turns us all into popsicles? There's no way to test their plan before they would pull the trigger.

Oopsie!

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Response to RealityChik (Reply #20)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 01:01 PM

23. Much more CO2 and methane at that time explains the Faint-Sun paradox

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Response to packman (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 12:56 AM

21. Faint-Sun Paradox popsicle dreaming?

According to Carl Sagan, back in 1972, explained that 4.5 BILLION years ago, the sun was about 30% cooler than it is now. This would have made the earth too cold for liquid water, preventing life from forming. YIKES!

Can you imagine if these scientists get it wrong and turns us all into popsicles? There's no way to test their plan before they would pull the trigger.

Oopsie!

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Response to packman (Original post)

Fri Nov 25, 2022, 05:10 PM

26. One the onehand this is something NOT to be left to elitist scientists

They certainly don't experience climate change as I do.

My climate change is winters that are around -8C colder, not warmer. Turning down the sun threatens serious impact survivability of woody fruits on my property. Multiplied across millions of people living in this zone is a significant economic impact of such intervention.

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