I didn't see the Oscars, but I am skeptical of Alexey Navalnyy

[tornado34jh]

A lot of people from Ukraine didn't like that Navalny won an Oscar (documentary). Many are not happy with his past, specifically that he is not against Russian imperialism, his views on Crimea, and his disgusting remarks during the Georgian War in 2008 so I really am not really sure if I should support him.

https://time.com/6262460/oscars-alexei-navalny-documentary-ukraine-russia/

[Joinfortmill]

1. Yeah, it's complicated, I think.

[tornado34jh]

9. Well, again it is not me saying that

I visit many sites involving Ukraine both on Facebook and Instagram, and they all point to the Navalny's history and statements. So I think from the Ukrainian standpoint, he is not somebody to be trusted.

[Joinfortmill]

21. Yup, I hear you.

[cbabe]

2. Which doc would you have voted for? I choose Stranger at the Gate.

[tornado34jh]

3. There is one called A House Made of Splinters

It's about four children in a shelter in war-torn eastern Ukraine. I think it is based in Lysychansk in the occupied territory of Luhansk Oblast.

But I think what people are upset about is the fact that Alexey Navalny has never really opposed Russian imperialism and his views on Crimea.

[XanaDUer2]

23. All That Breathes nt

[ITAL]

34. Fire of Love

By far the best of the bunch IMHO.

[jimfields33]

4. I believe they look at the work and decide. I don't believe personality comes into play.

[tornado34jh]

6. I get that part, I am not disputing that

But I think what others are saying is that the Oscars are hypocrites in that the war film All Quiet on the Western Front won Oscars (4 of them) but not hearing what is going on in the real war Ukraine. I think many are saying that they didn't allow Zelensky to speak there. I am just reading from what I have seen. This is from another source:

https://babel.ua/en/news/91468-the-word-ridiculous-is-not-enough-to-describe-this-hypocrisy-the-mfa-reacted-to-the-refusal-to-allow-zelensky-to-speak-at-the-oscars

This is what Dmytro Kuleba said:
"I think that if the film All Quiet on the Western Front wins the Oscar award for the best foreign film, but President Zelensky, who leads a country at war — waging the biggest war since the Second World War in Europe — will not be allowed to speak at Oscars, then you will not find a better example of hypocrisy of top managers and producers in the film industry."

"The word ridiculous is not enough to describe this hypocrisy. I do not question the quality of this film. Iʼm just saying, people, if youʼre going to award a war movie and donʼt realize that when youʼre drinking champagne and wearing nice clothes and diamonds and donʼt want to hear a real war story happening right here and now, something is wrong with you."

[Bev54]

5. He changed his stance on a lot of these issues years ago.

[tornado34jh]

7. Maybe, but a lot of them don't believe him

Keep in mind, that's not me saying that. A lot of Ukrainians think he is just as much of an imperialist. They also think he is just doing it for personal gain.

[Bev54]

8. Funny I belong to a few expat groups on fb from Ukraine, which includes

a lot of Ukrainians as well, haven't heard a peep against him.

[tornado34jh]

11. I see

Some of the places/people I visit on Instagram think that Navalny is an ethnonationlist and by extension, a part of the Russian values. They also don't think he is genuine in his stance.

[Bev54]

12. Well I guess it depends who those people are I guess but certainly is not my

experience with the Ukrainians that I have contact with and the sites are well monitored, including IP addresses to ensure no Russians or anti Ukrainians are part of the community. I wonder if your Instagram is as well monitored? It sounds a bit like a smear job to me.

[tornado34jh]

14. Well, Instagram is part of Meta

Many of my friends use it a lot more than Facebook, but I think the reason is because of the war, a lot of Ukrainians see Russians as imperialists and the like. Look, I guess Navalny is a complicated figure, but again, we know history can and has been used as a weapon. I can understand why many Ukrainian would be angry at this. They do not see Navalny as rallying the Russian population against the genocidal regime and that freeing him doesn't really change anything. But again, in terms of Instagram, you would be surprised what accounts there are. However, many Ukrainians are saying that Instagram, or more specifically Meta, is censoring what they see as "the truth." They see Russians who don't say anything against the war in Ukraine as part of the terrorist state. But again, I don't really know what algorithm/program they use, but again, since Facebook and Instagram are both part of Meta, I assume it would be similar.

[Bev54]

15. All I am saying is the groups I belong to are very particular who is allowed to be a member

not everyone is accepted. Not just anyone can make a statement and if they think it is bs that person would be banned. Anything or anyone that even smells like Russian propaganda would be gone. It is not by algorithm. I am very conscious about Russian propaganda and this could well be an attempt to smear.

[tornado34jh]

19. I am fully aware of how Russian propaganda works

I follow Russian Media Monitor on Youtube by Julia Davis. But all I am saying is that everything I have seen since the war began has been Ukrainians that want nothing to do with Russia and that Russia shouldn't be part of the civilized world, Oscars or otherwise.

[arthritisR_US]

10. Your choice, can't say I'm onboard.

[tornado34jh]

13. Don't take my word for it, that's not me saying it

That is what a lot of Ukrainians are saying about Navalny. I don't know if any of the stuff that he said in the past is true, I can't tell. Now some are saying that A House Made of Splinters was a better one at the Oscars, as it shows what is going on for some kids stuck in a shelter the frontlines in Ukraine. I probably would have gone with that one if it was my pick.

[JI7]

16. it may just have to do with internal Russian politics .

He would still be better than Putin.

[tornado34jh]

18. True

However, I don't think Ukrainians are ever going to forgive Russia, even if it is someone that may be different to Putin.

[tornado34jh]

17. Have a look at this

This is from Ukrainian Toronto Television:

[Tommy Carcetti]

20. He's far from perfect. He's still a persecuted dissident.

I’ve read that if he were an American politician, he’d land in the solidly Republican part of the political spectrum.

But in Putin’s Russia, he’s a liberal. Which really says things about Putin’s Russia.

I’m Ukrainian American and I can understand Ukrainian misgivings about Navalny given some of his past statements. For better or worse, he has attempted to walk back some of his older statements. I guess sincerity is in the eye of the beholder so that’s that for that.

But you don’t get to choose your dissidents, and make no mistake about it, Navalny is a dissident. He has spoken out against Putin’s corruption, documented his corruption, and as a result he was poisoned and then imprisoned. Unlike those January 6th traitors, he’s a legitimate political prisoner.

So in short, he shouldn’t be canonized as a saint. But he should still be commended for his bravery and willingness to stand up against Putin’s tyranny. And I support him for that, even if he’s not perfect.

[Hortensis]

22. Sounds like Russia's hand to me: Can EITHER be "for" Navalny and "against" Ukraine,

or vice versa. But not both.

Best wishes for not letting this attempt to divide you split you in two, Tornado.

[Tommy Carcetti]

24. Agreed.

And the thing is, Ukrainians right now are extremely skeptical and contentious towards basically all Russians. Given the events of the past year--Bucha, Mariupol and everything in between--that's extremely understandable, even if it's rather overbroad from a strictly objective standpoint.

But you have Navalny, and he's an anti-Putin dissident but he also has this history of having made some harsh Russian nationalist statements in the past as well as not speaking out against the seizure of Crimea.

Again, he's since distanced himself from those statements, but for battle weary and emotional Ukrainians, the instinctive response for a lot of them is still "Too bad, tough cookies, you're no better than the rest of them."

Now, personally I'm willing to give Navalny the benefit of the doubt in retreating from his past statements. (Consider me a Pollyanna in that type of situation--I feel the same way for reformed conservatives like Joe Walsh.) And I'll go on record that I do think his willingness to speak out against Putin and expose his corruption was a brave thing for him to do, as was his return to the country even after the Kremlin had attempted to kill him.

I think he's an imperfect hero, but most of our heroes are imperfect. Look no further than Washington or Jefferson in that regard.

But as people with the benefit of not being Ukrainian citizens living in Ukraine at this moment, we have the benefit of looking at things objectively and without emotion. For Ukrainians in the soup, the general feeling is that they couldn't care less about what they see is internal Russian squabbles.

I do think, however, that Kremlin disinformation will play up a wedge against the Navalny skeptical crowds in order to bolster Putin and the Russian state. Because that's the nature of that particular beast.

[Hortensis]

25. Umhm. The only side I feel a need to take is against mindfucking by Russia

for its own purposes -- which include destroying the United States. Putin is only one of many hard-liners in government who are committed to recreating the Russian empire, and they cannot do that while the U.S. superpower stands. Many in congress know that very well, and as with WWII existential threats would unite our government to contain Russia.

Americans living today have never had to huddle without heat and food. If Putin succeeds, millions will once again. These days when we see how destabilized we've already become and how incredibly ruthless, and barbaric, Russia's leadership is, that's obviously possible if we don't stop them.

(On the attempted-divisive subject of discussion, I admire both Navalny and Ukraine intensely for what decent, honorable people around the planet agree should be admired. And I believe that in these times it, and they, are far greater than what should not.)

[Tommy Carcetti]

26. +1

[tornado34jh]

33. Ukraine isn't the only country who are skeptical of Russian politicians

The Baltic States, Romania, Moldova, Georgia, they all are skeptical of it, even if it is a politician against Putin. Look, I am not saying that people can't change over time, but right now, most Ukrainians do not trust anybody from Russia, even if it is someone against Putin. It already was an uneasy relationship for a long time before the war, and it's even more so now. So of course, they are going to look at this with a lot of criticism.

[tornado34jh]

30. Here's the thing

Even before the war, Ukrainians have had an uneasy and weary relationship with Russia, but now it is complete hostility. They also point out that while people who are artists, singers, and what not are fighting in the front lines against Russian imperialists, they think that Russians have it way too easy and that they shouldn't be able to go anywhere while their people are fighting for their survival.

[BannonsLiver]

27. And I'm skeptical of those who are skeptical of the film.

[tornado34jh]

28. Well, Ukrainians aren't just skeptical of Navalny

They are skeptical of anybody who is Russian. Anna Netrebko, an opera singer, gave a check to Oleg Tsaryov, one of the people who were part of the separatists group in the Donbass region, so they have a reason to not trust anybody. Several opera theaters have included her in their season program, and to many Ukrainians, she is part of the "Novorossiya" group by association, and thus is a supporter of Putin and his war.

[BannonsLiver]

29. I'm sure they all have bigger things to worry about than Oscars.

[tornado34jh]

31. Look, I am not saying that Navalnyy is a saint

Is he a dissident? Yes. Is he against Putin? Yes. No doubt he is a controversial figure, both in Russia and Ukraine. But I am saying that many Ukrainians don't think that Russians should be able to go anywhere in Europe or otherwise.