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VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 08:45 AM Jan 2012

Picture the person(s) you love most in the world.

Picture them being executed, on their property, by Chinese snipers.

Now, picture those assassins desecrating their corpses and broadcasting video of the crime.

"Have a nice day, buddy."

32 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Picture the person(s) you love most in the world. (Original Post) VioletLake Jan 2012 OP
All I need is to picture it happening to anyone lunatica Jan 2012 #1
There are those of us who were opposed to this shit before it ever started.. Fumesucker Jan 2012 #2
I remember, VioletLake Jan 2012 #6
+1 Fuzz Jan 2012 #13
Picture your loved one going to work as usual JCMach1 Jan 2012 #3
Ah, I see. So we're all barbarians now because of 9/11. VioletLake Jan 2012 #4
Not excusing it at all JCMach1 Jan 2012 #7
War? VioletLake Jan 2012 #8
authorized anyway by the AUMF... JCMach1 Jan 2012 #9
In my opinion, it is a defect of the culture, VioletLake Jan 2012 #11
Of course racism isn't the only chauvinism that can turn a person into their own worst nightmare. VioletLake Jan 2012 #15
What does 9/11 have to do with Afghanistan obamanut2012 Jan 2012 #10
9/11 was blowback. RC Jan 2012 #12
And the people being desecrated flew those planes or were proven to have planned that attack? No. The Wielding Truth Jan 2012 #32
9/11: The Revenge Cow VioletLake Jan 2012 #5
Executed? kctim Jan 2012 #14
As I said to JCMach1: VioletLake Jan 2012 #16
Oh, so it is just your opinion, not new evidence kctim Jan 2012 #17
And we know that they were in combat because, VioletLake Jan 2012 #18
No kctim Jan 2012 #20
This particular case is mild, though. Isn't it? VioletLake Jan 2012 #28
I saw with my own eyes sites on the internet where polly7 Jan 2012 #29
Yes, mild and dumb kctim Jan 2012 #30
Um, that's a caricature of my claim, VioletLake Jan 2012 #31
How can we be sure that the victims of the crime in question VioletLake Jan 2012 #19
Blatant appeal to the emotions treestar Jan 2012 #21
In this case, emotions are what it's all about. VioletLake Jan 2012 #22
Just exuberant adolescents strutting their stuff. Killing is "manly". Tierra_y_Libertad Jan 2012 #23
Nothing manlier than adding humiliation to murder. nt VioletLake Jan 2012 #25
Just imagining that made my heart drop. polly7 Jan 2012 #24
I apologize for that, polly7, VioletLake Jan 2012 #26
No apology necessary! polly7 Jan 2012 #27

lunatica

(53,410 posts)
1. All I need is to picture it happening to anyone
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 08:49 AM
Jan 2012

War itself is an obscenity so why is this somehow different?

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
2. There are those of us who were opposed to this shit before it ever started..
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 08:51 AM
Jan 2012

I remember how much love we got at the time.

JCMach1

(27,544 posts)
3. Picture your loved one going to work as usual
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 08:56 AM
Jan 2012

and the building explodes around them as a plane crashes into it.

At least the deceased fighters had agreed to fight and possibly die for their cause.

Unfortunately, war makes barbarians of us all.

The soldiers should be punished, but we also have to remember that as well.

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
4. Ah, I see. So we're all barbarians now because of 9/11.
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 09:04 AM
Jan 2012

How convenient for the warmongers. Carry on.

Show me proof that the victims were fighters and not executed for "sport" like so many others have been.

JCMach1

(27,544 posts)
7. Not excusing it at all
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 09:30 AM
Jan 2012

and the soldiers should be punished (most likely) after a court martial.

War is a barbaric practice... a practice that in this case included dropping some very young people into a war zone where they made some really bad choices...


Choices which we also don' t have full details about...

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
8. War?
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 09:38 AM
Jan 2012

I was unaware that war had been declared.

Technically, I believe, we're talking about "military engagements". But your apparent critique stands.

JCMach1

(27,544 posts)
9. authorized anyway by the AUMF...
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 09:42 AM
Jan 2012

All of this (of course) begs the question are we not out of Afghanistan yet...?

I just remember back to Lyyndie England and what happened with Abu Ghraib...

These are very young people. Is this a complete pattern of abuse where all are guilty? Or, are there superiors who really need to metaphorically hang for this since they encouraged the behavior? I don't think we know any of that yet.

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
11. In my opinion, it is a defect of the culture,
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 10:09 AM
Jan 2012

and it has a major "racial" component. I put the word "race" in quotes because it is a nonsense word that should be replaced by "breed".

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
15. Of course racism isn't the only chauvinism that can turn a person into their own worst nightmare.
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 12:00 PM
Jan 2012

In this case there is also religious and cultural/nationalist chauvinism.

obamanut2012

(25,905 posts)
10. What does 9/11 have to do with Afghanistan
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 10:04 AM
Jan 2012

Or even Iraq? Nothing.

The murders on 9/11 have nothing to do with the millions killed in Afghanistan and Iraq.

 

RC

(25,592 posts)
12. 9/11 was blowback.
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 11:12 AM
Jan 2012

They did not start it, we did. They just brought it home to us.
What did we do about it? We invaded a innocent country and murdered upwards of a million people. Saddam did not suffer terrorists in his country. Now Iraq is a terrorist haven.
The war against terrorism. The self perpetuating war. They more WE kill, the more terrorists we make as an excuse for us to kill again.

The Wielding Truth

(11,411 posts)
32. And the people being desecrated flew those planes or were proven to have planned that attack? No.
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 03:19 PM
Jan 2012

The behavior of these men is an act of brutality and is as wrong as torture.Our pain or hurt from 9/11 is ours to handle not ours to use as an excuse for

abuse.

 

kctim

(3,575 posts)
14. Executed?
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 11:42 AM
Jan 2012

Holy cow, I had not heard about that evidence. Certainly changes things.

Pissing on a corpse is dumb, executing somebody is a crime. Will definetely try to stay up to date on this one now.

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
16. As I said to JCMach1:
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 12:03 PM
Jan 2012

"Show me proof that the victims were fighters and not executed for "sport" like so many others have been."

Pissing on a corpse is dumb? Callous understatement noted.

 

kctim

(3,575 posts)
17. Oh, so it is just your opinion, not new evidence
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 12:14 PM
Jan 2012

that says they were executed? In that case, seeing how they are in combat, the burden of proof is on you to provide proof that they were executed. Until then, they are casualties of war.

A corpse has no idea it is being pissed on nor is it harmed by being pissed on. Callous? Yes, but many Christians accuse me of that on a daily basis, so no biggie.

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
18. And we know that they were in combat because,
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 12:43 PM
Jan 2012

American snipers killed them and pissed on their corpses?

Because they live in a "war" zone?

 

kctim

(3,575 posts)
20. No
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 01:02 PM
Jan 2012

because nobody has provided proof that they were not enemy combatants.
When they do, which is what I thought you were saying, the 'executed' claim will have merit. Until then, it is nothing but an opinion.

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
28. This particular case is mild, though. Isn't it?
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 01:57 PM
Jan 2012

I read an article recently that described horrific incidents including a man that had his face skinned off, and another that had his brain cut out.

An army of Dexters.

polly7

(20,582 posts)
29. I saw with my own eyes sites on the internet where
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 02:02 PM
Jan 2012

'trophies' were being photographed by troops and posted with tags ..... really disgusting tags. Some of those body parts were claimed to have come from children. The sites were eventually scrubbed, but I'll never forget it as long as I live. This pissing on corpses is nothing new in the line of atrocities. These things were happening from the very start in Iraq.

 

kctim

(3,575 posts)
30. Yes, mild and dumb
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 03:13 PM
Jan 2012

I am not defending horrific incidents that clearly scream for psychiatric evaluations, I am disputing your claim that everybody is being executed for no reason.

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
19. How can we be sure that the victims of the crime in question
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 12:51 PM
Jan 2012

were combatants and not assassinated, like the victims of Jeremy Morlock's death squad.

The callous disregard for human life is the same in both cases. Psychopaths all around...

treestar

(82,383 posts)
21. Blatant appeal to the emotions
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 01:04 PM
Jan 2012

And not everyone is a person loved most in the world by some other person.

But who is approving of what here to bring this on?

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
23. Just exuberant adolescents strutting their stuff. Killing is "manly".
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 01:21 PM
Jan 2012
“Eternal boyhood is the dream of a depressing percentage of American males, and the locker room is the temple where they worship arrested development.“ Russell Baker

VioletLake

(1,408 posts)
26. I apologize for that, polly7,
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 01:49 PM
Jan 2012

I posted it to help people understand that the desecration of a corpse is a big deal. Especially in the context in which it happened.

There is no dichotomy between caring about the killing & caring about the desecration. It's one on top of the other.

polly7

(20,582 posts)
27. No apology necessary!
Tue Jan 17, 2012, 01:55 PM
Jan 2012

I can't imagine that anyone who really did what you asked and closed their eyes to imagine it, wouldn't feel the same.

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