Vice-President Obama for 2024?

[Willis88]

Read this, thought it was interesting.

https://themessenger.com/opinion/bidens-2024-hail-mary-name-barack-obama-as-his-running-mate

I tried to check the legitimacy of this source but it was unconclusive. https://www.allsides.com/news-source/messenger

[Ocelot II]

1. Oh, FFS. It's stupid and it's not going to happen.

And all this idiotic speculation about Biden's running mate impliedly disses Kamala Harris and it needs to stop.

[Diamond_Dog]

23. +++Agree

[betsuni]

31. Variation on the Michael Moore prediction that the only way Democrats would win in 2020

was if a beloved celebrity like Oprah or Tom Hanks ran. Stupid.

The erasure of Kamala Harris (one of the most progressive senators who actually got bills passed) is disgusting.

[DemocraticPatriot]

71. Yes, and PJB has already stated that Kamala will remain on the ticket in '24....

I wish she had more exposure and better 'approval ratings',
but when did any Vice President have 'approval' close to that
of their President ??


Still, the campaign team needs to work on this...

[Hekate]

2. President Biden already has a running mate, & she is abundantly qualified

May I ask why you would want him to ditch VP Kamala Harris?

[Willis88]

5. Agreed. I don't want her replaced.

I'm asking if this website is biased because it's something I've never heard of before.

[Ocelot II]

19. The opinion is by one Phillip Aaron Lacovara, who, per Google, seems professionally legit.

"He has served as counsel to the Watergate special prosecutor, deputy U.S. solicitor general and president of the D.C. Bar." https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/06/27/trump-insurrection-prosecute-nixon-pardon/ However, his spin is extraordinarily negative (he claims Biden is so unpopular that he is likely to lose the election in 2024 unless he does something extraordinary, and Harris is "faced with the prospect of a career-ending defeat partly of her own making" ). He doesn't seem to be overtly Trumpish or GOP, but he identified as "conservative" in a letter urging the speedy confirmation of Judge Ketanji Jackson to the Supreme Court. https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Letter-from-conservatives-endorsing-Jackson-to-SCOTUS%20(1).pdf

[Celerity]

3. oh ffs

[tanyev]

4. Heh.

I don’t think Obama wants it, but it would be fun to see the right wing go supernova.

[Claustrum]

6. Obama wouldn't do it no matter how much you or we like the idea.

VP is supposed to fill in as president if anything happens to the president and Obama is term limited out of being the president so he should be disqualified as the VP.

Imagine Reagan or Bush tries this. We are getting into the Putin manipulation of being president and that not president but high position with a puppet president to later become president again BS. We don't want a system similar to that.

[Ocelot II]

10. Technically he's not term-limited; the 22nd Amendment says "No person shall be *elected*

to the office of the President more than twice." If he were to become president on account of the disability of the president he wouldn't have been elected. But it's still a stupid idea. He wouldn't do it; Michelle wouldn't let him do it; and the suggestion is disrespectful of VP Harris.

[Claustrum]

12. Isn't the VP position still "elected" office?

This is weird and should be written into law. If there is anything we learn from TFG's presidency, it's that we need more well written law instead of relying on people doing the right thing or electing a normal and rational person into the position. We know republicans will game the system if it's not written out in black and white law.

[Ocelot II]

13. The VP is an elected office but that's not how the amendment is worded -

it says nobody can be elected president more than twice. It IS written into law; the Constitution is the controlling law.

[Willis88]

39. What about 12th amendment?

But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.

[former9thward]

46. The 12th does not apply here.

Obama is constitutionally eligible to be president (over 35, natural citizen and resident for 14 years). If he became president he would not be "elected" to the office a third time.

The 12th was put in the Constitution to keep foreign born people from getting the presidency thru the vice presidency.

[muriel_volestrangler]

76. That's a highly dubious interpretation, and you'd be relying on the Supreme Court to decide it

If you assert that "the 12th was put in the Constitution to keep foreign born people from getting the presidency thru the vice presidency", then we can assert that "the 20th was put in the Constitution to keep people who had served as President for over 6 years from becoming president again". And that would have the advantage of being obvious.

It would be the world's dumbest move to rely on this (or, really, any) Supreme Court making a highly dubious decision based on the disputed letter of the law rather than the acknowledged spirit. Plus, it would make the USA look like Russia if it succeeded.

[Willis88]

77. I agree with this

I can see loopholes for a future manipulation by TFG and his kids if precedent was set here.

[BlackSkimmer]

7. Lol.

No further comment.

[Progressive dog]

8. Not a chance

First, Biden has already decided on a running mate. Second, Barack Obama would not run. Third, Biden does not need a hail mary.

[mcar]

9. Why are you trying to erase our great VP Harris?

[Willis88]

11. That would be the wrong takeaway

It's a concept I didn't think was possible Constitutionally nor have I heard it before today. Sharing the link does not mean I endorse the idea. I was wondering if the source (The Messenger) is right wing trash or legitimist perspective. Never heard of them before either.

[Celerity]

21. you have the wrong site in your bias link btw

Vice-President Obama for 2024?
Read this, thought it was interesting.

https://themessenger.com/opinion/bidens-2024-hail-mary-name-barack-obama-as-his-running-mate

but

https://www.allsides.com/news-source/messenger

The Messenger (Iowa)
Bias Rating Not Rated
Type News Media
Region Iowa
Website messengernews.net

here is the correct one

https://www.allsides.com/news-source/messenger-media-bias

[Demsrule86]

27. It is anti-Biden trash.

[mcar]

33. Sure

[betsuni]

14. Again with the Kamala "The Invisible VP" Harris crap.

[J_William_Ryan]

15. Please, don't give Republicans any ideas.

We’d be stuck with a third GWB term – and no one wants that.

[brooklynite]

16. Why do people waste their time with things like this?

1) Obama doesn't want to run.

2) If elected VP, he wouldn't be able to step in as President.

[Ocelot II]

36. The 22nd amendment wouldn't prevent him from stepping in

because he wouldn't have been elected president twice. Nevertheless, it's a dumb idea and he wouldn't do it/ Biden won't need a "Hail Mary" anyhow.

[H2O Man]

17. Will Trump pick Lincoln?

[obnoxiousdrunk]

18. Thats funny .

Good one ...

[Stinky The Clown]

20. Constitutionally impossible, I think

He is not qualified to be president since he's already served two terms.

[Ocelot II]

24. See post #10. The 22nd Amendment says nobody can be *elected* president more than twice.

But a VP who becomes president because the elected president is unable to serve hasn't been elected president.

[Demsrule86]

28. It is a ridiculous idea and Kamala Harris has done a good job.

[Ocelot II]

29. Yes on both counts.

The author posits that both Biden and Harris are so horribly unpopular that Biden can't win the 2024 election unless he does something drastic and unexpected. This, of course, is rank bullshit. This is the kind of thinking that caused McCain to choose Palin as his running mate, and we saw how that turned out (he'd have lost anyhow, but maybe with fewer embarrassing incidents along the way).

[mcar]

35. Then the author is full of shite

Biden/Harris are not "horribly unpopular." Author is basing this nonsense on a false premise.

[Polybius]

48. But he's ineligible to be VP too

VP's have the same constitutional requirements.

[Ocelot II]

52. No, the 22nd Amendment doesn't apply to VPs.

It sets a limit on the number of times an individual can be elected to the presidency but there is no such limitation on the office of vice president, meaning an eligible person could hold the office as long as voters continued to vote for electors who in turn would reelect the person to the office; one could even serve under different presidents. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vice_President_of_the_United_States#:~:text=While%20the%20Twenty%2DSecond%20Amendment,turn%20would%20reelect%20the%20person

[Polybius]

53. I disagree

I read it as once a President has served two terms, he can no longer be VP either. It would go to the Supreme Court.

[Ocelot II]

54. The 22nd Amendment says specifically that nobody can be *elected* to the presidency

more than twice. If the VP becomes president because the president can't serve, he hasn't been elected to the presidency.

[Polybius]

55. If he's on the ticket and it wins in 2024, then he can't serve as VP because it counts as a 3rd time

I don't think Obama can be "elected" on a Presidential ticket as VP. But.................


He might be able to sneak in if he is appointed VP now (say Harris steps down and Biden nominates Obama, and he's confirmed).

[Ocelot II]

56. No, it doesn't. The ticket isn't the office. A22 does not refer to the VP at all.

The legal guys seem to be in agreement on this. But it's all academic because it isn't going to happen, and the article author's underlying premise - that Biden and Harris are so disastrously unpopular that the ticket is doomed and Biden can't win unless he dumps Harris and picks Obama - is wrong and stupid.

[Polybius]

57. Yes, it does

And no they are not in agreement on this. They would lose at the SC, possibly 9-0.

VERIFY: No, President Barack Obama can not be named Biden's VP; Here's why

[Ocelot II]

59. Show me where it does.

Here's the 22nd amendment in its entirety.

Section 1. No person shall be elected to the office of the President more than twice, and no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once. But this Article shall not apply to any person holding the office of President when this Article was proposed by the Congress, and shall not prevent any person who may be holding the office of President, or acting as President, during the term within which this Article becomes operative from holding the office of President or acting as President during the remainder of such term.

Section 2. This Article shall be inoperative unless it shall have been ratified as an amendment to the Constitution by the legislatures of three-fourths of the several states within seven years from the date of its submission to the states by the Congress.

[Polybius]

60. See my edited comment with one link

The 22nd didn't resend the 12th.

Here's another:

https://www.zippia.com/answers/can-a-former-president-become-vice-president/

[Ocelot II]

66. What's "Zippia" and how is it credible authority?

As far as I can tell it's just a job board, not a legal resource; they don't cite any cases or other legal authority and their argument is circular. They say "The 12th amendment states that an individual cannot run for the vice presidency if they are not eligible to be president. That's because they would have to become president if the sitting president died or was unable to fulfill their duties. Since a former president would be ineligible to be president, they are unable to become vice president." This is true as far as it goes, but what the 12th actually says is "no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States." Since the 12th was enacted long before the 22nd, it therefore did not and could not have taken into consideration the issue of term limitations. It governs qualification for service; that is, a vice presidential candidate would not be qualified for the position unless he/she were also 35 years old and a natural-born citizen (the constitutional qualifications), like the president. #22, however, relates to qualification for election. Here's an actual lawyer's opinion. https://cornerstonelaw.us/22nd-amendment-doesnt-say-think-says/

[Polybius]

73. The only Amendment that was ever nullified was the 18th

So the part saying "no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States" is still in effect. The 22nd does not nullify that that part of the 12th.

No point in going on, we're never going to agree, even if the SC ruled on this 9-0 (well, I'd change my mind if it were 9-0 ). I'm sure we agree on most other topics.

[Celerity]

25. that is actually incorrect

he just cannot BE ELECTED to POTUS again

the article actually does do a good job of explaining that, despite my disagreeing with it that Obama should or would run as VP

[Stinky The Clown]

43. This article suggests my theory is correct.

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/verify/obama-cant-be-vice-president-for-biden-verify/65-9e4eb588-7725-42e0-b852-69da87a69c63

[EYESORE 9001]

22. Howzit hangin, 88?

That your birth year? Graduation year? Must mean something.

[Celerity]

30. yep, not a good number, nor is 14

[EYESORE 9001]

38. In over 30 years of knocking around the intertubes

I’ve never seen an association with that number come to anything good. You’d think that it’d be common knowledge by now.

[Celerity]

41. Swedish ice cream bars

launched in 1964, it was the 88th product that Trollhätteglass produced

https://www.gb.se/vara-marken/flerpack/88:an-6-p.html

[EYESORE 9001]

42. I wonder when '88' as nazi code first started spreading among adherents

I certainly never found out until at least the late ‘80s with the advent of the internet. Not sure when I actually read about it.

[Hekate]

69. Well spotted. Whatever it means, he got to 101 posts.

Yippee.

[EYESORE 9001]

75. They always overreach

I saw some long-time DUers ‘out’ themselves as RW trolls in 2004. Some were better at disguising it than others. Most of those didn’t draw undue attention because of an obvious username. Some garnered thousands of posts before yanking the disguise and doing a victory dance before receiving the granite cookie. They didn’t choose usernames incorporating code for ‘heil Hitler,’ I can tell ya that! As far as disruptions go, this one is doing it poorly.

[LiberalFighter]

26. It was a big sacrifice for Michelle when she was First Lady.

And considering the wackos out there they would want to keep themselves safe.


AND there would be negatives by dumping Kamala.

[Celerity]

34. the article is referencing Barack, not Michelle (unless I misunderstand your reply)

[carpetbagger]

62. I think the point is that Michelle would likely not buy in.

They seem to make decisions like a healthy couple.

[blogslug]

32. No

Stop it.

Also, The Messenger is owned by the guy who used to own The Hill and partially funded my Mark Penn. It sucks.

[NH Ethylene]

37. Why would he?

He's done his stint and it can't have been pleasant. He deserves his retirement. And no Michelle either. She gracefully endured 8 years of right-wing demonizing and politics does not interest her.

[keithbvadu2]

40. Don't do it.

[DemocraticPatriot]

44. Since President Obama has already served 2 terms as President,

and thus cannot succeed to the office,

the entire idea of him as a VP candidate is silly... so I did not bother to read the article link you posted....


However, I would certainly support him in any other effort for elective office---

There is nothing to prevent him from becoming once again a United States Senator,
or a member of the House---

or a Supreme Court Justice, which many here dream of
(although that could not happen without an absence on the SC)

[former9thward]

47. It may be a bad idea but nothing in the Constitution prevents it.

The 22nd amendment prevents him from being elected to the presidency a third time -- not the VP. The 12th applies to foreign born people and Obama is natural born.

In the real political world he is far too old to be a SC Justice nominee.

[DemocraticPatriot]

50. I presume he could serve 20 years as an SC Justice---

is that too little? I suppose we would prefer someone in their late 30s...

He is now 61 or 62--

but it doesn't matter anyway, there appear to be no likely openings for many years---

unless we get lucky and some rightwing justice walks in front of a bus---



Maybe I should reconsider my options, and work towards becoming a bus driver...


PS Yes, there is nothing to prevent him from becoming VP,
but what is the point of that ?

[Polybius]

51. What about this:

VERIFY: No, President Barack Obama can not be named Biden's VP; Here's why

[former9thward]

61. The article relies on an opinion from Gary Nordlinger.

No offense to Mr. Nordlinger but he is a part time poly sci prof. There is nothing in his background to indicate he is an expert in constitutional law. So his opinion is as good as anyone here.

And his opinion is:

For example, a vice president must be at least 35 years old, and they must be born in the United States, just as a President must follow these requirements. Nordlinger said this likely applies to term limits as well.

"If anyone tried this," he said. "It would for sure end up at the Supreme Court. Because that’s who decides conflicts within the constitution.”

Wow, really? Cases go to the Supreme Court? I never would have guessed. Yes, I am sure it would go to the SC. And I think it is not likely that it applies to term limits. Say whatever you want about the court but it does not like to overturn political judgments no matter the party. And it is very likely it would not overturn the selection of a major party's choice for VP.

[FakeNoose]

67. PBO would make a great ambassador too, if he's willing

The man is so popular around the world.

I'd love to see him appointed to the Supreme Court. But the way things are right now, I'm not sure it can happen. Several things need to be settled with current SCOTUS personnel before we can talk about "changing the guard."

[pinkstarburst]

45. If he needs to do that in order to win

then the problem is at the top of the ticket, not the bottom.

[jcgoldie]

49. ridiculous

[Beautiful Disaster]

58. lmao why would Biden even need a hail mary? he's going to be fine in 2024.

Reminds me of all the talk about Obama dumping Biden for Hillary in 2012.

[betsuni]

63. So now Teh Democratic Establishment is going to "inspire" voting?

I thought Teh Establishment was bad.

[emulatorloo]

72. ++++

[MerryBlooms]

64. Idiotic shit like this is trotted out weekly now...

Don't forget Oprah! We have an exceptional VP. Her name is, Kamala Harris. Every time you or anyone else posts garbage trying to erase her, I'm happy to push back, and happy to see DU join me. The lack of support for our first black woman VP disgusts me. All under the guise of, Thought this was interesting, or Just asking questions... Where have I heard that before? Hmm... 🤨

[we can do it]

65. Not this shit again, and not Michelle either. Kamala Harris. FFS

[carpetbagger]

68. Not a good idea, cf. Putin

We have the two-term limit for a reason. I think it practically makes no sense for Biden to go with Obama, even if Harris were not the obvious and qualified choice. First, off, unless you have a working majority in at least the Senate, Obama wouldn't get seated. And it really doesn't make sense to leave a succession fight in the air where the USSC or the House Speaker could take the presidency away by law, rule, or mob.

Beyond that, nothing good ever comes from taking a term-limited head of government and moving them to a puppeteer position. That's what happened in Russia when Putin termed out the first time. It defeats the purpose of the 22nd Amendment, which is critically important now that we've had a number of rogue presidents who have shielded criminality behind the power of the office.

[FakeNoose]

70. I'm sorry ... this isn't a good idea

It's a slap in the face to Kamala Harris, for one thing. PBO would make an awesome Ambassador to one of our major allies (Canada, or UK perhaps?) But really, Obama is doing so much already as our Good Will Ambassador that I don't think he even needs an official appointment or title. Obama is loved everywhere and so is the entire Obama family.

[canetoad]

74. CEO of the Messenger

Is Jimmy Finklestein, former owner of The Hill. There's plenty about him if you search.

One example: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/20/business/the-hill-sale-nexstar-media.html

Mr. Finkelstein, the heir to a New York real estate fortune and a longtime associate of former President Donald J. Trump, said that he had purchased control of The Hill in 2014, when it was primarily a print publication that covered Congress, at a fraction of the valuation he sold for. He said he had not always enjoyed the attempts by Mr. Trump and another old New York associate, the Democratic Senator Chuck Schumer, to pressure him for favorable coverage.

[Wounded Bear]

78. 12th Amendment...

But no person constitutionally ineligible to the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice-President of the United States.[1]"

Pres Obama is not eligible to be VP.

[niyad]

79. Oh FFS!

[lees1975]

80. Why would a sitting President who is the clear favorite to be re-elected in 2024

and who has a strong, well-qualified VP, want to pull some kind of political stunt because the media crazies think he needs it to win?

If Trump winds up escaping justice and becomes the GOP nominee, which is not a sure thing at this point, Biden wins an easy electoral college and popular vote victory. If one of the other wannabees, like pitiful Nikki Haley or Ron the Fascist become the GOP nominee, it's a Biden landslide--think LBJ 1964.

The straight-up, straightforward, call-em-out kind of campaigning that is already coming out of the Biden campaign is exactly the right strategy. Have you seen ads for Adam Frisch in Colorado, or Lucas Kunce in Missouri? Campaigning like that is going to win elections.