Huge massacre in Gaza - 5 2000 ton bombs dropped on families in tents

[womanofthehills]

At least 20 families are buried alive under the sand of the Safe Zone, - Mawasi area of Khanyounis- @wizardbisan ( huge craters)

An eyewitness, Attaf Al-Shaarshe; “The strike happened just after midnight and caused a fire. The people were buried in the sand. They were retrieved as body parts."

These 9-meter-deep craters were filled with tents housing displaced families in Mawasi, a designated safe zone. During the Israeli airstrike that took place overnight, they were all obliterated.

Link to tweet

?s=46

Link to tweet

?s=46

Link to tweet

?s=46

[Easterncedar]

1. Israel, killing civilians and exponentially making enemies

You can’t win like this.

[Doc Sportello]

3. Perhaps it's not about winning

But about continual war and ridding Palestinians from the area.

[malaise]

5. More land grabbing

That is all.

[atreides1]

15. Good point

But you can't grab someone else's land unless you remove them from it or bury them beneath it...our own US history shows us that!

For the Israelis it's easier to bury the Palestinians then to remove them...and the US is helping them do it!!!

[malaise]

17. Not just the US

Western power land grabbers

[BannonsLiver]

31. That "evil west" again.

[betsuni]

107. I always wonder if the It's Okay If You're Not The Evil West people realize they are the evil West, the immoral enemy

of glorious "freedom fighters" for radical religious fundamentalism terrorists -- bullet to the head, wouldn't even think about it.

[BannonsLiver]

108. I think in this particular case they mean a certain demographic but won't say it.

But yes, their country is technically part of the “west” and I sure don’t hear any complaints about all the aid money they get from the US.

[betsuni]

116. Well, lots of the bad words: colonialism, slavery, apartheid, war crimes, genocide, racism, capitalism, war, etc.,

that we English speakers use are European and therefore none of those bad things must have existed on the planet until the mean Western white people started building ships and stuff.

This is my theory of why some see the West as uniquely bad and erase human history.

[marble falls]

82. It's just our tax dollars at work, marching into international corporate pockets ...

... When nation give military aid to Israel, they don't give the items or cash - they get credits to buy from manufacturers and their stockholders and lobbies. And we all know: nothing is cheap in the military.

[malaise]

83. MIC must be fed

Correct

[marble falls]

91. And he's getting fatter. It would be interesting to know how many of those procurring weapons in Israel ...

... and the US have financial interests in those companies they purchase from.

[malaise]

92. Great question

Rec

[LauraInLA]

104. Global historical phenomenon, unfortunately

[Hassin Bin Sober]

39. It's called ethnic cleansing.

[sarisataka]

41. What was it called when Hamas executed hostages in cold blood

to prevent their rescue? A recent incident that received much, much, much less condemnation.

[Blue Full Moon]

44. What about Israel

Murdering a record amount of Palestinian children including American citizens before Hammas bombed. This violence didn't happen in a vacuum. Both sides of this is in the wrong. But I smell a Netanyahu rat. The one and only person who has benefitted from all of this. He also didn't give a damn about hostages, nothing to him one way or the other.

[sarisataka]

45. You could not have illustrated my point any better

Thank you.

[lostnfound]

76. You are so right and so moral. It's a beautiful thing to see

The depth of conscience, righteousness, compassion. The humanitarians here at DU are simply the best.

I remember hearing the parents of Hersh Goldberg-Polin speak at the DNC — it was so humanizing, and then he was murdered, and we mourned. My sibling and I cried over it, actually, because we could imagine the intense pain that his poor parents must feel.

But these people buried in the sand in Gaza last night? Who even knows them? I don’t know any of them, they aren’t individuals in my mind — why, i don’t remember ever hearing the names of any of them except a couple of terrorist leaders. So why worry my little head over it? They are nameless, and are likely to remain so, because there is no need to know them as individuals, especially now.

Just cas-u-al-ties.

Thank God I don’t feel the need to cry every time I hear of these Gazans being bombed. How about you.

[sarisataka]

84. I don't see when i have ever condoned

The deaths of Palestinian civilians.

Perhaps you did mourn the announcement of the murder of the hostages by Hamas. To the majority of the world it rated less than a shrug.

Hamas keeps violating international law by setting up in protected areas. How often do we see them condemned for those violations? *Never*

You may have missed it but I have criticized Israel for some of their strikes. Even in the face of such flagrant violations by an enemy, proportionality must be considered.

So when the camp was bombed last month causing over 100 civilian casualties in an effort to get two Hamas operatives, I was critical of that action.

However when dozens of Hamas gathered in a school with over a thousand refugees and the IDF strike eliminated the Hamas fighters with a dozen additional casualties, I found it lamentable but believe the attack was justified.

I have not made any statement on this attack whether it is justified or not. It is unclear how many Hamas were killed, the number killed (which as usual includes Hamas) has been dropping. (Also as usual, Hamas habitually reports very high casualties at first, then quietly reduces the total as it becomes obvious the number was inflated) In addition, I have noticed several inconsistencies in reports of the weapons used. I have found it best to wait as initial reports are often incorrect.

[lostnfound]

88. Thanks for the thoughtful and fair reply

[LauraInLA]

105. FYI: Hamas has now announced 19+ civilians killed (as you predicted).

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/9/10/heinous-at-least-40-killed-in-israeli-attack-on-tent-camp-officials-say

[kerry-is-my-prez]

95. Pretty much the same idea except for Israel is more powerful than the people in Gaza. Unless the other Arab

countries start attacking Israel.

[malaise]

49. Yes

But never forget that land is wealth

[Bettie]

65. Also, don't forget the

enormous natural gas fields off Gaza's coast.

[malaise]

69. Ding ding

;hi:

[soandso]

115. There are currently

FIVE HUNDRED THOUSAND Israeli settlers in the West Bank. They come with animals who graze (about 500 acres per flock), claim that land and, repeat. While it's ostensibly "illegal", they are provided with IDF protection until their settlement gets the seal of approval. Every last one of them needs to be removed.

[AloeVera]

131. There are actually over 700,000 illegal settlers.

Leaps and bounds every year. The largest planned settlement in decades announced just recently. Israel is emboldened now. I wonder why? No, actually I really don't wonder.

[jimfields33]

132. Finding the tunnel that resulted in the slaughter of Israeli

hostages a few days ago resulted in looking for more Hamas hiding in various places. They need to get rid of Hamas which is the goal of day one.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

78. Omg.....

[Trueblue1968]

89. Do not give israel any more aid !!!! No more money or war weapons. Get rid of netiyahoo !!!!!!

[Brainfodder]

2. R.I.P.

TSF have a hand in this suspicious timing?

[malaise]

4. But but but Hamas

As the West arms these monsters

[BannonsLiver]

30. Hamas? Ah yes, the terrorists you called "freedom fighters just like Mandela" a while back.

[Fozzledick]

6. Israel Air Force strikes Hamas terrorists hiding in Khan Yunis humanitarian zone

The Israeli Air Force (IAF) struck Hamas terrorists Samer Ismail Khadr Abu Daqqa, Ayman Mabhouh, and Osama Tabesh in a strike in Khan Yunis in the Gaza Strip, the military said on Tuesday.

The terrorists were operating within a terrorist command and control center embedded in a designated humanitarian area of Khan Yunis, the IDF added.

The military specified that Mabhouh was a senior Hamas terrorist, Abu Daqqa was the head of Hamas’s Aerial Unit in Gaza, and Tabesh served as chief of the Observation and Targets Department in the terror group's Military Intelligence Headquarters.

The military further noted that all three had been directly involved in the October 7 massacre and had carried out attacks against IDF troops and the state of Israel.

https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-819437

[ExciteBike66]

7. So we bombed tents in a humanitarian area to get three guys?

Why not just nuke all of gaza, amounts to the same policy...

[Fozzledick]

13. Hamas committed war crimes by placing military command posts in a humanitarian area

and using civilians as human shields, cannon fodder, and human sacrifices to use as propaganda ("Tactical Civilian Sacrifice" ).

The OP deliberately omitted the actual military targets to create the false impression that Israel was targeting civilians.

Just another Big Lie.

[claudette]

18. Blaming the

victims is not the answer.

[sarisataka]

34. Hamas are now the victims?

I guess if that is the viewpoint, the support they receive begins to make sense.

[forgotmylogin]

51. The Palestinian citizens are the victims.

Hamas and other terrorist criminals tend to take the strategy of hiding within a civilian encampment for protection. Most of the time governments are reluctant to strike a populated area, but if they do the double-edged sword is they garner sympathy.

It's a rough damned-if-you do/don't situation. Israel doesn't seem interested at all in preventing collateral damage.

[sarisataka]

56. I agree

the Palestinian civilians are victims.

I would be interested in the poster's answer however. To some Hamas are also considered Palestinian civilians...

[Bad Thoughts]

102. It's international law. Get over it.

[claudette]

103. I'll never

“Get over” the deliberate murder of innocent Palestinians by Israel

[asm128]

21. The only lies are coming from the IDF

But keep pushing the Likud propaganda there pal.

[uponit7771]

43. More war crimes by Isreal isn't the answer

[Fozzledick]

61. Blaming Israel for Hama's war crimes isn't the answer.

It's just the Hamas propaganda line to justify their atrocities.

[Eko]

63. Israel has used civilians as human shields as well which is a war crime.

Don't get me wrong, Hamas are terrorists and have committed many war crimes. Israel has committed war crimes as well as violate international law for many years. I fully support Israel taking Hamas out but the policies they are using are creating a humanitarian disaster. They don't get carte blanche.
Israeli forces in Gaza ‘use civilians as human shields’ against possible booby-traps
The Israeli army’s use of Palestinian civilians as human shields has been documented on a large scale
‘Human shielding in action’: Israeli forces strap Palestinian man to jeep

[AloeVera]

147. Hamas must be the stupidest terrorists in history.

Going back to the same school that has been bombed FIVE times. Or any school in Gaza, since 80% of them have been attacked by the IDF.

You would think they'd have caught on by now.

Do not go into a school or humanitarian shelter.

Israel kills human shields. Human shields will not protect you.

So not only are they stupid, they are suicidal.

Hmmm..

[NickB79]

26. What's your suggestion to get terrorists that surround themselves with human shields 24/7?

[Buzz cook]

57. Infantry

That's how it's been done for millennia.

[sarisataka]

62. It's a good idea

and back near the beginning I criticized Israel for not going in with ground troops sooner, but do you really think that would stop the "What about Israel".

The IDF will be blamed for any/all Palestinian casualties, regardless of if they were cause by Israel or Hamas. Also, Palestinian casualties will include Hamas members so even if by some miracle only Hamas members were killed, we will still hear cries of "genocide" and "ethnic cleansing".

[Eko]

68. It's not about stopping the "What about Israel".

Its about stopping hamas and rescuing the hostages while minimizing casualties. Something Israel has failed at miserably. Troops going in would have achieved more of those goals far more than has been done so far and shorten this conflict. The Battle of Baghdad in 2003 had comparable troop levels of Iraqi soldiers to Hamas yet the US only killed about 2,000 people and Baghdad had a much larger civilian population.

[sarisataka]

73. At least you acknowledge

Israel will be blamed for all of the deaths.
No one ever suggests Hamas minimize casualties. As we have heard, everything they do is justified.

[Eko]

75. No where did I acknowlege or even suggest that.

It's not about stopping the "What about Israel".
Its about stopping hamas and rescuing the hostages while minimizing casualties. Something Israel has failed at miserably. Troops going in would have achieved more of those goals far more than has been done so far and shorten this conflict. The Battle of Baghdad in 2003 had comparable troop levels of Iraqi soldiers to Hamas yet the US only killed about 2,000 people and Baghdad had a much larger civilian population.
Is this a thing about placing blame to you? If Israel kills someone they killed someone. If hamas kills someone they killed someone. Are you saying that we were not to blame for the Afghanistan civilians we killed in that war?
hamas is a terrorist group. I suggest they minimize civilian casualties. There. Now you can stop with the "No one ever" since I just did that. I also suggest that the US goes in to gaza and captures all of them and prosecute them for their crimes and rescue all the hostages since Israel is doing such a bad job at it.

[lostnfound]

80. Wasn't that a weird comment?

I’m dumbfounded as to who supposedly thinks that “everything Hamas does is justified”.

[sarisataka]

85. My apologies

I took your statement "It's not about stopping the "What about Israel"." in the context you were in agreement that all deaths of Palestinians or hostages will be blamed on Israel by Hamas supporters, many Palestinian supporters and much of the world. I did not intend to apply it to you personally.

Do you really believe the US should go into Gaza and eliminate Hamas? I think that would be a political nightmare both at home and around the world.

[Eko]

93. All good.

Yes we should go in. After the election would be better though. I choose things because they are morally right to me not because they are politically right. Hence why I am not a politician lol.

[LauraInLA]

106. I don't disagree with everything you say, but I believe sending US troops in would be a disaster

of global proportions, no matter when it happens.

[Eko]

136. I think there would be a peace treaty in a week and the hostages would be freed.

[LauraInLA]

138. I believe ME countries that are staying out of the conflict would be forced to become involved against

the U.S. or face riots and possibly overthrow by their own citizens. Inserting the U.S. military into the conflict would complete inflame the ME.

[Eko]

139. It's already inflamed.

Like I said I think hamas would agree to a treaty and release the hostages within a week of the US announcing it. I dont think we would even have to go in and fight just to occupy, police, help rebuild and provide humanitarian aid.

[soandso]

117. You want US troops in Gaza???

You can't be serious.

As far as the hostages getting rescued in ground operation, it doesn't look likely. Hamas has given orders that if any IDF approaches the hostages will be executed.

[Eko]

135. Yes. If the US announced they were going to invade gaza then there will be a peace treaty in a week.

And the hostages will be freed.
With the current events and by the only option left as stated by you is.
hamas will execute any hostages if the IDF (or the US) approaches then that means that there is no hope of rescuing them and the only option is to form a peace treaty with hamas to get them back.

[soandso]

143. I'm not seeing any good outcome

Both sides are intractable. It's a terrible situation.

The US needs to stay the hell out of there.

[Eko]

144. No war has good outcomes.

War is often about making the least-worst decision. The same could be said about politics. But the stakes are higher in war, when the commander-in-chief is called upon to defend the nation.

Mark McKinnon

[lostnfound]

79. Absolutely nothing Hamas does is justified. That is the weirdest statement. Nt

[sarisataka]

90. Have you never seen the protesters

Carrying the banners saying "By Any Means Necessary"? They are not suggesting Israel and Hamas sit down and discuss it over a cup of coffee.

October 24, 2023

Ghazi Hamad: "Israel is a country that has no place on our land. We must remove that country, because it constitutes a security, military, and political catastrophe to the Arab and Islamic nation, and must be finished. We are not ashamed to say this, with full force.
***
We must teach Israel a lesson, and we will do this again and again. The Al-Aqsa Flood is just the first time, and there will be a second, a third, a fourth, because we have the determination, the resolve, and the capabilities to fight. Will we have to pay a price? Yes, and we are ready to pay it. We are called a nation of martyrs, and we are proud to sacrifice martyrs.
***
The existence of Israel is illogical. The existence of Israel is what causes all that pain, blood, and tears. It is Israel, not us. We are the victims of the occupation. Period. Therefore, nobody should blame us for the things we do. On October 7, October 10, October 1,000,000 – everything we do is justified.

It is my belief that in 3 and a half weeks we will see celebrations showing how widespread agreement with these statements are.

ETA> by all means if events prove me wrong come back and call me out on my prediction. I would be happy to eat a seven course meal of crow.

[newdayneeded]

14. Not me

[sarisataka]

33. You don't believe Israeli women who say they were assaulted?

Is it just coincidence she and others had the crotches of their clothes soaked in blood?

"We are learning hundreds of Israelis killed Oct 7 were killed by Israeli bombs & drones."- is Hamas guilty of anything? Or is it all Israel?

[MarineCombatEngineer]

113. Glad that putrid post was taken down.

I read it before it disappeared and said to myself, YIKES.

[ExciteBike66]

8. Remember when Obama killed bin laden by nuking the entire city he lived in?

Nope, we actually tried hard not to cause civilian casualties with that one...

[NickB79]

24. Remember the last time the IDF went in with ground forces to rescue hostages?

Over 200 civilians died in the crossfire between IDF and Hamas fighters. Many here on DU harshly criticized the IDF for that, even though many of the dead were killed by Hamas fighters, and it was successful in freeing Israelis.

I have no doubt a similar event would have occurred if they used ground forces in this situation.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/israel-hostage-rescue-what-we-know-rcna156937

[Eko]

70. The IDF said there were only 100 killed.

From your link and that doesn't separate hamas vs civilian killed. That is the total. Lets say it was half hamas. 50 civilians killed for 4 hostages. They took 251 hostages. 251 divided by 4 is 63. That makes it about 3,200 civilian deaths to rescue all the hostages. I'd say having all the hostages rescued with that amount of civilian deaths would be a far better position to be in than where we are now wouldn't you?

[NickB79]

99. Oh, so NOW we're believing IDF numbers?

LOL.

You seem to have forgotten that, after that rescue mission to get those hostages out, Hamas now executes Israeli hostages (a blatant war crime) before IDF forces can save them.

And, your estimate seems to leave out extremely important part where Israel either captures or kills those behind the brutal attacks of Oct 7 that killed over 1,000 Israelis and saw all those hostages taken in the first place. Leaving them free guarantees more civilian deaths in the future, because thats what terrorists do.

[Eko]

137. You used hamas numbers 1st

so now you are believing their numbers?
So Israel either keeps the war going with no hope of freeing the hostages killing or capturing hamas or they free them by a peace treaty. Which one do you want?

[Easterncedar]

42. I don't approve of government murder. Period

Not even that one. Grab em and try em. Don’t imprison them perpetually or disappear them or torture them. We really should be better than that.

[Mosby]

47. The mission was to arrest him, he wasn't having it.

Nt

[duhneece]

54. Thank you. You worded what I was thinking so much better than I could nt

[Jason1961]

9. While we must support Israel

That support isn't without it's limits

They could've used much smaller bombs to strike that target, this is terrible

[Lonestarblue]

50. Read a few months ago that Israel had two types of 2000 pound bombs.

One is designed to penetrate deep underground, and the surrounding damage is not as extensive. The other is intended to cause the most damage in a wider area and causes more civilian deaths. At the time, Israel was using the bombs that caused the most damage above ground, which is probably what has caused so many deaths of innocent civilians. I’ve seen no reports of which bombs they’re using now, but 2,000 bombs are meant to level huge buildings. Using them on tent encampments is a deliberate massacre.

[LauraInLA]

110. Apparently Hamas now believes 19+ killed -- https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/9/10/heinous-at-least-40-killed-in-israel

I’m left wondering how that many bombs that large could produce so few casualties.

[LauraInLA]

109. FYI Hamas has now lowered the estimate to 19+ killed.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/9/10/heinous-at-least-40-killed-in-israeli-attack-on-tent-camp-officials-say

I am now loathe to believe either IDF or Hamas, especially initial reports.

[soandso]

119. Wise decision

because they both lie.

"Truth is the first casualty in war"

[soandso]

118. "While we must support Israel"

Says who and why?

[claudette]

20. One guess

[Grins]

11. Another reason for me to hate Israel.

And by "Israel," I mean Netanyahu and the Likud.

And those bombs? All had "Made in the U.S.A." on them.

[claudette]

19. Now there

are over 30,000 reasons to hate Israel's leaders.

[Demsrule86]

22. I hate Hamas.

They just executed hostages including the son of the woman who spoke at the convention.

[Grins]

32. And so you should ask why they, or anyone, would do that?

There has to be a reason. It's not genetic. What made them so angry that they are will to let thousands of Palestinians die. What drives their hate?

[NickB79]

35. Religiously motivated hatred, mostly

You could ask what drives the KKK to hate Black people or the Nazis to hate the Jews, and get the same answer. It doesn't exonerate the hatred.

Since the charter of Hamas explicitly calls for the extermination of ALL Jews, it's clear they don't have a logical basis for their thought process. There is no rational reason to explain that level of hate.

[lees1975]

74. It's rooted in history.

Before 1948, there was no state of Israel, and there hadn't been one since before the time of Christ. Jerusalem, the capital of the Roman vassal state of Judea, was destroyed in a rebellion in 70 AD and what was left of a subservient shell of Jewish leadership was executed or scattered.

Most Americans do not realize that the modern state of Israel and the vast majority of its population did not exist in the middle east prior to 1948 and most of the Jewish population that lives there now are descendants of those who migrated there from Europe, particularly the Soviet Union, since the Second World War. That's why all of the hatred. It's not just anti-Semitism, it's the fact that the great powers, after the war, opened Palestine up to Jewish emigration after the holocaust in Europe, and that led, intentionally or unintentionally, to the displacement of millions of Palestinians who already lived there. And the major powers, mainly Britain and the US, didn't consult the local populations, or the Jewish emigrants, before determining how to draw political lines on the ground.

And that is why there is a problem now.

[LauraInLA]

112. I believe a large percentage of Jews in Israel (about half) are from the MENA.

[lees1975]

125. That's what I've read, slightly smaller percentage than those from Europe.

But, Aliyah has a long history of very tiny fulfillment, until it accelerated a bit after WW1, but the balance of today's Israeli Jewish population came in from the Diaspora post-holocaust. And that, along with British meddling in how it was done, is at the root of the conflict.

[soandso]

122. THIS

[soandso]

121. That is not reason

It's the violence against them and theft of their land.

[sarisataka]

36. Israel exists

That is their reason.

[soandso]

123. Correct

Now, do they have a legit gripe considering how it came about?

[sarisataka]

124. Moot question IMO

As we are discussing the murder of six hostages to prevent their rescue. Is there any gripe that justifies such murder?

[soandso]

126. Grins asked

There has to be a reason. It's not genetic. What made them so angry that they are will to let thousands of Palestinians die. What drives their hate?

To which you replied, "because Israel exists", with which I agreed with and posed a follow up question. It's the core issue, long predating Hamas.

[sarisataka]

134. Full context-

Demsrule86- They just executed hostages including the son of the woman who spoke at the convention.

Grins- And so you should ask why they, or anyone, would do that?

My reply- Israel exists

That is how my reply fits in. Hamas murders Jews who were not born when the modern state of Israel came to be.

The question of how Israel came to be is irrelevant unless one is taking the position Hamas actions are justified by the history of the Levant.

[soandso]

142. I think that's the answer

"...unless one is taking the position Hamas actions are justified by the history of the Levant."

Meaning that's what Hamas and all those who support them believe. I believe there was a previous comment about the terrorism not happening in a vacuum. The full historical context is relevant.

[Grins]

145. Disagree!

It's what the Jews did to them after the Balfour Agreement, and after Truman blessed the concept of the Jewish state, and what they do to this date - subjugate the Palestinians. Israel through policy and action subjugates the Palestinians. Their policies are the Israeli equivalent of Jim Crow America.

They steal their homes, bulldoze them into rubble if they with want their land, or claim they took action against Israel.
Every president until Trump took the policy of the 2-state solution. The extremist Likud and Netanyahu blocked it! To this day!
Every president until Trump, and almost every nation in the UN, told the Israeli government to STOP pushing into Palestinian territories with Jewish settlements. The extremist Likud and Netanyahu blocked it! To this day!

And the Palestinians are rightly pointing at the United States!

[soandso]

146. I was agreeing with you

and pointing out that that maltreatment of the Palestinians is the result of the creation of the state. Unpleasant as it is to say that, that's the fact. The violence started even before the state was created. This kind of brutal colonization is how Israel was created. It does NOT have to be that way going forward but with hundreds of thousands of Israeli settlers having moved into the West Bank, does it look like that strategy is going to change? It continues to be ongoing, then is responded to by enraged Palestinians, which is why no solution or peace is ever reached. What's that Einstein said about doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result? Well, this is a perfect example of that.

[AloeVera]

148. Historical context, root causes, injustice - what is that??

Everything started on Oct 7th. There is no suffering except the one inflicted and endured on Oct 7th and since - by the hostages and the people of Israel.

The reality of colonization, ethnic cleansing, massacres, apartheid and oppression, the continuing and accelerated confiscation of Palestinian lands - they do not exist, having all occurred in the historical miasma before or since Oct 7th.

No recognition of the historical injustice of the ethnic cleansing of 750,000 natives, or progress towards compensation or a settlement. Now Israel and supporters are so emboldened they openly state things like Gaza must be resettled and there will be no Palestinian state, only Greater Israel.

The really sad thing is that that kind of talk is becoming accepted, normalized by many who just a few years ago would have been outraged. Where will it stop? I see where this is going, nowhere good for the Palestinians.

[BannonsLiver]

37. Ah

The old “see what you made me do?” bit.

[AloeVera]

149. Yes, every day since Oct 8th is a perfect example of that.

I find it interesting that each side uses the same argument.

So does what happened before Oct 7th justify Oct 7th? If you care about human life, the answer is NO.

So does Oct 7th justify what's happened since?

Should the answer to the second question be any different?

NO.

But it IS different for many people, and therein lies the problem.

The I/P issue distilled to its essence.

[Dan]

38. I had a friend in college almost fifty years

Ago, from Palestine…and he hated the people from Israel with every breath that he took.

That type of hate tells me that Israel is in a forever war.

[Redleg]

58. So your Palestinian friend of 50 years ago is representative of all Palestinians?

NT

[Dan]

127. Smiling,

Well, I can’t say he was representative of all Palestinians, but he was definitely representative of all my Arabic friends from that region of the world.

[Demsrule86]

96. Hamas? They don't value human life period.

They are bad guys.

[soandso]

120. "What drives their hate?"

The violence and theft of their land (which remains ongoing) that established the Jewish state.

[BannonsLiver]

25. What was your reason before?

[sarisataka]

40. The reason that is not started out loud, maybe?

In polite society some say "Zionists"

[kerry-is-my-prez]

129. I'm fed up with both sides. Netanyahu/The right wing and Hamas.

I could not believe it when Netanyahu was re-elected but I also can’t believe all the people who want to re-elect Trump.

[claudette]

16. And the

murder of innocents in Gaza by Israel continues while America sends the money and weapons to do it. What a total disgrace. I don't understand why this is still going on.

[soandso]

128. Some in congress have argued for conditions

including Pelosi. That said, the support will never stop because even Pelosi said this and she has always maintained that position of an "ironclad" alliance :

?si=-AS2XIF4o4tF6CQS

There's just not the political will to end support for Israel. Why that is probably has several answers.

[Nanjeanne]

23. Thoughtful article Opinion America's Support of Netanyahu Is Killing Us All

By Mical Raz is a professor of history and clinical medicine at the University of Rochester, and is spending this academic year in Jerusalem. Naftali Kaminski is an Israeli physician-scientist and Professor of Medicine and Pharmacology at Yale University School of Medicine.

In their insistence on uncritical support for Israel's actions, and in stark contrast to the Israelis protesting the deaths of hostages whom the government could have saved, American Jews are actually bolstering Israel's worst enemy – Netanyahu

https://archive.is/Qthfp]. Free Haaretz link

[soandso]

130. I think Netanyahu is a psychopath

and getting rid of him would give a better chance of getting the hostages back. That said, it will not end the war. He is far from the only one who wants it "finished" and I mean the complete destruction of Hamas.

[Nanjeanne]

133. Agree.

[brush]

28. The warmonger Netanyahu strikes again, makes sure there's no peace deal/cease fire/ hostage release...

so he con't be tried for his corruption.

It's a broken record...over and over and over.

[bdamomma]

55. He's the tRump

of the Middle East.

[sarisataka]

29. Why is the tweet claiming five bombs were dropped dated July 14

But the others are dated September 10?

[TBF]

46. Excellent question. nt

[Typewitch]

60. Also, the strike happened at midnight.

That is a daytime video of an explosion not connected with today's story.

[JohnSJ]

86. It would be far better if people used other sources than twitter. Too much misinformation gets posted on twitter. BBC

is an excellent source.

https://www.bbc.com/news/topics/c2vdnvdg6xxt

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyx9znxl4eo

[LW1977]

48. Pure cowardice

[ecstatic]

52. Omg. :(

What a clusterfuck. Why are we complicit in this?

[orthoclad]

53. Your taxpayer dollars at work.

[waterwatcher123]

59. Are these pictures accurate - shows explosion in broad daylight versus midnight as reported.

[iemanja]

66. The first one seems to be a different explosion, dated Sept 14

[Duncan Grant]

64. You're losing when you bomb humanitarian safe zones with mega-bombs. (nt)

[Jirel]

67. Israel is murderous, full stop.

You don’t have “accidents” like that. There is no “but Hamas fighters were hiding among refugees” excuse that makes this remotely legitimate. Try some leadership for war crimes, already.

[lostnfound]

71. Well, there goes one of Kamala's North Carolina votes

Every time i talk to a young one i know, i get an earful about kids being bombed in Gaza whose lives don’t matter and not understanding why Biden is still allowing weapons to get shipped to Israel for them to do this.

Yeah whatever. I’m too old to spend another hour of my life arguing or debating with yet another powerless person over what the US government is or is not responsible for in I/P.

Goodbye, some votes in Michigan too. Probably Benji’s friends picking their timing.

[BannonsLiver]

94. Sorry your friend is obsessed over something that has zero impact on their life.

But antisemitism is a powerful draw among some folks, and one issue voters are generally quite stupid. So here we are.

[JohnSJ]

101. yes they are.

[lostnfound]

140. Idealism is contagious among the young.

I remember being quite disturbed by scenes of civilians blown up by various wars — i remember how angry i was that US foreign policy had helped put Pinochet in power.
Now I’m old and definitely not a one-issue voter. I also trust Kamala and Joe to do what they can. I’m just able to understand that what they fight for behind the scenes may not be spoken about in public.

But young people get their information from certain bubbles, including some bubbles that focus on civilian casualties in Gaza.

My friend never was a one-issue voter, until recently, when stories or images of children dead and injured are stuck in his mind.

[EllieBC]

141. That makes no sense.

So your friend is fine with Americans losing voting rights, American women losing the rights to control their bodies, and the LGBTQ losing rights because of the ME?

Perhaps you should tell your friend then that they don’t actually give a shit about the country they live in.

And please don’t even talk about Michigan until you talk about that little shitty town in Michigan with the all Muslim council and mayor that banned pride. True paragons of democracy and fairness right there.

[C0RI0LANUS]

72. Canadian Editorial: "Netanyahu is Israel's Curse"

"Israel's prime minister is playing for time with the war, using it to avoid his criminal corruption trials, and an inquiry into whether he could have prevented Hamas’ brutal attack. The longer that’s put off, the better for him."

Source via archive:

https://archive.is/FuUE1

Original source:

https://www.hilltimes.com/story/2024/09/05/netanyahu-is-israels-curse/433174/

[onecaliberal]

77. We better not give them one more thing to kill children.

What in the entire fucking hell.

[MarineCombatEngineer]

114. And what if we do?

What then?

[C0RI0LANUS]

81. Axios: Israel Asks Congress to Press South Africa to Drop ICJ Genocide Case

Axios reports that Israel is lobbying members of the US Congress to press South Africa to drop its legal proceedings in the International Court of Justice (ICJ) over alleged war crimes in Gaza. Israeli officials want members of Congress to make clear to South Africa that there will be consequences for continuing to pursue the legal case. The official filing is linked below.

Last December, South Africa filed a case at the ICJ accusing Israel of violating its obligations under the 1948 Genocide Convention, alleging Israel’s actions “are genocidal in character because they are intended to bring about the destruction of a substantial part” of the Palestinian population in Gaza. Israel has rejected the accusations.

Israeli diplomats were instructed to ask members of Congress and Jewish organizations in the US to reach out directly to South African diplomats in the US and make clear South Africa would pay a heavy price if it doesn’t change its policy. But the US wants to maintain a positive relationship with South Africa in order to counter the influence of Russia and China.

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has already been indicted by the ICC for alleged war crimes and now he has exposed Israel to international legal jeopardy at the ICJ. The UN General Assembly convenes in NYC this September.

Sources:

https://www.axios.com/2024/09/09/israel-gaza-icj-genocide-un

https://www.icj-cij.org/case/192

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx88l499vero

https://www.un.org/en/high-level-week-2024

[JohnSJ]

87. BBC is a far better source than twitter. If you want accuracy I suggest twitter is the medium to use.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyx9znxl4eo

"At least 19 people have been killed in an overnight Israeli strike in the designated humanitarian zone in southern Gaza, the Hamas-run health ministry says.

Witnesses said the strike obliterated an area crowded with tents for displaced Palestinians in al-Mawasi, south-west of Khan Younis, leaving huge craters in the sand.
“The bombing was incredibly intense. People were thrown into the air,” one displaced man told the BBC. “You can’t imagine the devastation.”
The Israeli military said its aircraft attacked what it called “a number of senior Hamas terrorists” operating there - a claim Hamas denied."

[B.See]

98. Unconscionable.

[Sky Jewels]

97. Israel is cementing its status as brutal world pariah.

We need to cut Netanyahu off immediately.

[bif]

100. 2,000 lb. bombs. Not 2,000 ton.

It's still horrific.

[purr-rat beauty]

111. There best be indisputable intelligence of HAMAS operating there

and not just a pitiful presence.

You can't attack civilians in safe zones unless there was something much much much more nefarious going on ( did they warn the civilians? )

[AloeVera]

150. There is no accountability for Israel.

Unless the victims are Western Citizens like the WCK workers. Yet these types of attacks on civilian convoys, ambulances, UNRWA trucks etc happen every day.

No accountability, no foreign press = emboldening and worse and worse crimes.

As for IHL, it is clear that there must be an immediate threat or actual attacks coming from a civilian area, to be allowed to attack. Even then, care must be taken to avoid civilian casualties.

2,000 lbs bombs on crowded civilians tents is the opposite of care.

But "care" is the defining word. There is not enough "care" for Palestinian lives from any quarter, including sadly our own countries.

Some lives are not worth the same as others, but of course no one wants to come out and say it.