Salon: Mitt and the White Horse Prophecy (MUST READ - parallels to Dominionism)

[highplainsdem]

http://www.salon.com/2012/01/29/mitt_and_the_white_horse_prophecy/singleton/

When Mitt Romney received his patriarchal blessing as a Michigan teenager, he was told that the Lord expected great things from him. All young Mormon men — the “worthy males” of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, as it is officially known — receive such a blessing as they embark on their requisite journeys as religious missionaries. But at 19 years of age, the youngest son of the most prominent Mormon in American politics — a seventh-generation direct descendant of one of the faith’s founding 12 apostles—Mitt Romney had been singled out as a destined leader.

-snip-

Upon completion of his foreign mission, he immersed himself in the 1970 senatorial campaign of his mother, Lenore Romney, who was running against Phillip Hart in the Michigan general election. That same year, the Cougar Club — the all male, all white social club at Brigham Young University in Salt Lake City (blacks were excluded from full membership in the Mormon church until 1978) — was humming with talk that its president, Mitt Romney, would become the first Mormon president of the United States. “If not Mitt, then who?” was the ubiquitous slogan within the elite organization. The pious world of BYU was expected to spawn the man who would lead the Mormons into the White House and fulfill the prophecies of the church’s founder, Joseph Smith Jr., which Romney has avidly sought to realize.

-snip-

Smith’s insertion of religion into politics and his call for a “theodemocracy where God and people hold the power to conduct the affairs of men in righteous matters” created a sensation and drew hostility from the outside world. But his candidacy was cut short when he was shot to death by an anti-Mormon vigilante mob. Out of Smith’s national political ambitions grew what would become known in Mormon circles as the “White Horse Prophecy” — a belief ingrained in Mormon culture and passed down through generations by church leaders that the day would come when the U.S. Constitution would “hang like a thread as fine as a silk fiber” and the Mormon priesthood would save it.

-snip-

Called a “militant millennial movement” by renowned Mormon historian David L. Bigler, Mormonism’s founding theology was based upon a literal takeover of the U.S. government. In light of the theology and divine prophecies of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, unamended by the LDS hierarchy, it would seem that the office of the American presidency is the ultimate ecclesiastical position to which a Mormon leader might aspire. So it is not the LDS cosmology that is relevant to Romney’s candidacy, but whether devout 21stcentury Mormons like Romney believe that the American presidency is also a theological position.

-snip-

Stunning article, reminding us that "Romney’s religion is not a sideline, but a crucial element in understanding the man, the mission and the candidacy."

Denton concludes that the issue is not whether there's a religious test for political office, which is forbidden by the Constitution, but "whether, past all of the flip-flops on virtually every policy, he has an underlying religious conception of the presidency and the American government."

I've seen a lot of posts about Dominionism here at DU. It's time to consider whether Romney represents a Mormon version of Dominionism.

[justiceischeap]

1. I keep bringing up the Prophet (Mormon church president)

I mean, according to what I've read, if you're a devout Mormon, if the Prophet gives you a task (which is usually a revelation from God), you're to follow it. I find myself wondering how close a relationship the Prophet would have with a President Romney. It's a scary thought.

[highplainsdem]

5. Agreed.

[mackattack]

19. The same argument

the Klan used against catholics.

[jberryhill]

29. No it is not the same thing

The Pope had never sought to control the government. Attempting to influence policy is fair game, and it is played in the open, cards on the table, face up.

The LDS have a peculiar history in relation to the civil government of the United States. Smith believed the LDS had a destiny to rule the US. That has never been the goal of Catholicism.

[mackattack]

31. That has never been the goal of Catholicism.

I guess you missed the whole middle-ages thing. The catholic church has always tried to control what countries/leaders do.

Protestants in the US believed, rightfully or wrongfully, that catholicism was antithetical to democracy and that catholics (especially elected officials) would be subservient to the pope and the bishops...not the constiution.

The Know Nothing party believed it, it was the major component of their agenda.
the Klan believed it and attacked catholics up until WWII.
Al Smith lost the election in large part because of his catholicism
Kennedy had to go in front of baptist ministers in texas and tell them he would not be subservient to the pope.
Priests have denied communion to senators and congressmen recently because of their political stances.
Priests have denied communion recently based on voting for Kerry
People blamed the church for putting down the assorted European revolutions of the mid-19th century.

With all due respect, the catholic church, more than any other faith has tried to control and dictate civil governments all over the world.

In mass today I heard a lecture on why Obama sucks. That tells me something.

[TheMastersNemesis]

2. Romney Is A Tool

He is just as dangerous as the Dominionists. Both are tools of the rich in the way religion is distorted nowadays. The Mormon church is spending millions on ads in the media and on the net to convince you they are normal people. Mormonism is a cult like Scientology or the Moonies. Both are divorced from any kind of reality or boundaries.

Conservative Christians are against Romney but might go along because they are promised power. It may not work and a Romney candidacy will cause this group to defect or sit out the election. The GOP establishment to embrace Romney may backfire on them.
Every day that Newtzie survives helps Obama hopefully.

The problem is whether or not racial and class resentment will rule. Even lunch pail and blue collar workers allow racial bias to cloud their judgement. What is most puzzling is that the GOP even captures a lot of blue collar Democratic and union votes with their Southern strategy. Many blue collar workers were Reagan supporters and allowed themselves to be fished.

[BumRushDaShow]

3. Insert excerpts of this article into a teabagger chain-letter

and watch the heads explode throughout their constituency!

[TheMastersNemesis]

6. Mormonism And Religion Not Relevant

It is astounding what Mormons believe. And as a former Catholic it is astounding what Catholics believe in a different way. The remark that "religion is the opiate of the people" is all too true. Conservative like religion is also an opiate. All are being used for another purpose. The trouble with religion and even politics is the people will believe some of the most ridiculous things.

The trouble is all the turmoil around religion is largely irrelevant. This brouhaha exposes the real truth with the GOP establishment. Because the GOP sees Romney as their only hope they embrace him and appose Newt. The fundamentalists hate Romney because he is a Mormon. Both Mormons and the religious right are being used by the rich who largely support the GOP for economic reasons. They want all the money and power. So in a sense the religious right is being thrown under the bus and will ordered to accept Romney as their candidate. Romney is just a tool for economic power for people like the Kochs. They don't care what they believe as long as it is the almighty dollar.

The other part of this is that Romney believes in some pretty ridiculous ideas. One has to look at how these beliefs will color his decisions were he to be president. The Mormon church fathers desperately want a Mormon as president to spread their own brand of religion. Romney is a Dominionist of a separate color. The Mormon church wants their influence at the highest level.

[BumRushDaShow]

18. I agree except

with throwing the teabaggers and religious right under the bus, I don't think they'll go along with that this go around, after 40 years of being courted (from Nixon to Shrub) and then summarily dismissed.

It is true they all have a vicious hatred for the current President and that the whole religious turmoil is manufactured by the $$$ed RW PTB, but you have these factors:

1.) There is no "leader" of the party at the moment (i.e., a Raygun to unify them)
2.) The RW media propagandists built them up so that you can see the result as they pummel folks like Coulter, Beck, Drudge, etc., who essentially did the bidding of creating this monster, but who are being forced to tow the line now.
3.) The sane wing of the party would vote for Romney but they are not enough to offset this 10% of the looney tunes who make up the self-described "base".
4.) The Ron Paul factor will pull another 10% with a mix of Libertarians and fiscal teabaggers (unless the Libertarian party itself pulls Bob Barr back out again and installs him as the nominated Libertarian candidate as they did in 2008).

So Romney may try to make a run at it and about the only thing that might salvage him is the VP slot - Or so it seems. But if that VP slot isn't someone like a Palin (basically representative of the teabaggers, the religious right, etc), then he's toast. And if there WERE a teabagger-picked VP, then the ticket is still toast because they'll lose the independents.

[AzDar]

4. I married into one of the oldest Mormon families in Az.

My soon-to-be-ex husband, is of course, a "jack mormon", meaning that he hasn't been excommunicated, he just doesn't participate. All I can think when Mitt's name is bandied about as presidential material is: wait til Middle America examines the beliefs and practices of Mormonism up close. Magical underpants; secret names; oaths and penalties sworn at marriage; Baptism of the Dead (including Jews killed in the Holocaust); Jeebus shall return to Earth and rule from Missouri...the list goes on and on.
When Hubs and I first met, he gave me a book on Mormon History and beliefs, and I would periodically peep over the top at him and say ..."Really?" And he would either nod and giggle or hang his head. All religion is ridiculous in my view, but the Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints is a whole new level of goofy, and will not play well in the Heartland, or the South...

[BlueToTheBone]

7. What's with the Magic Pants?

I love the visual on that one!

[AzDar]

10. When adherents are married or 'sealed' in the Temple, they are assigned special undergarments

or "Temple garments" . It's like an old-fashioned union suit with flap openings for bodily functions. It must be worn at all times, and there is even a special protocol for putting it on after bathing, and when a bedraggled garment is no longer to be worn, it must be burned. Many believe they are protected from car accidents, fires, etc. while wearing them...there are even 'stories' of bullets being deflected. Although warned by the (ahem) Prophet that its style was " sacred and unalterable ", the always-fluid Church declared that a less horrible version would be worn in the '20s or '30s ...lol. I often look at my very stylish mother -in-law, knowing she's compelled to sport hers in the Arizona heat, and wonder how she does it.

[BlueToTheBone]

14. eww

okay, maybe that was too much information!

[grantcart]

34. here's a whole lot more.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_garment#Garment_origins_and_evolution

[snagglepuss]

27. I never heard of that. Actually I don't don't a whole lot about Mormons but the

more I do the less I like it.

[morningfog]

8. This excerpt:

"At the recent GOP presidential debate in Florida, Romney professed that the Declaration of Independence is a theological document, not specific to the rebellious 13 colonies, but establishing a covenant “between God and man.” Which would suggest that Mitt Romney views the American presidency as a theological office."

Scary. Picture Pres. Mormon Romney. Senate Majority Leader Mormon Reid. Or worse (shudder) Senate Majority Leader Mormon Hatch-he is the senior republican serving in the Senate.

[highplainsdem]

13. Here's that exact Romney quote from the debate:

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=1016&sid=19023486

Near the close of CNN's Republican debate in Jacksonville, Fla., an audience member asked the candidates how their religious beliefs would affect their role in the White House.

-snip-

Mitt Romney: "The Creator has endowed us with certain unalienable rights" and he would seek to protect those rights.

"The conviction that the founders, when they wrote the Declaration of Independence, were writing a document that was not just temporary and not just for one small locale but really something which described the relationship between God and man -- that's something which I think a president would carry in his heart."

[Ikonoklast]

9. Want to really get a little sick? Do some research on the LDS over-representation in

every branch of the US intelligence services.

They actively recruit and favor their own within the various intelligence communities with promotions.

The LDS has a plan, and they have been implementing it for 100 years now.

[jwirr]

17. Yes, my sister who lives in the DC area said that in W's term the place was overrun by Mormans

who were advising him on much that he was doing.

[jberryhill]

30. Part of the reason for that is their language school

Their language school and missionary program turn out a lot of well qualified individuals for intel work.

But, yes, it is a remarkable over-representation.

[newspeak]

32. yeah, well it's also their willingness to do anything without question or conscience

Need to read about indoctrination and those who were murdered for questioning smith's teachings. Also, I believe joseph smith aspired to the presidency at the time.

[highplainsdem]

11. More on the White Horse Prophecy, including a comment from Mitt's dad, at Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Horse_Prophecy

Several prominent Mormons have made statements related to the White Horse Prophecy. For instance, US presidential candidate Mitt Romney has said he considers the White Horse Prophecy to be a matter of "speculation and discussion by [LDS] church members" and "not official [LDS] church doctrine."[5] However, US senator Orrin Hatch and conservative commentator Glenn Beck, have stated that they believe the Constitution is "hanging by a thread".[6][7]

-snip-

In 1967, US presidential candidate George W. Romney said the following regarding the White Horse Prophecy: "I have always felt that they meant that sometime the question of whether we are going to proceed on the basis of the Constitution would arise and at this point government leaders who were Mormons would be involved in answering that question."[5]

-snip-

In 2007, US presidential candidate Mitt Romney told the Salt Lake Tribune that "I haven't heard my name associated with [the White Horse Prophecy] or anything of that nature. That's not official church doctrine.... I don't put that at the heart of my religious belief."[5][7]

-snip-

Judging by the Salon article, Mitt's statement there is another lie -- he's been aware, at least since he was in college, that his name was associated with the prophecy. And considering his father's apparent belief in the prophecy, it's likely Mitt felt this was his destiny (one the family had hoped George Romney would achieve first, but when his presidential bid failed, that left Mitt).

[Eid Ma Clack Shaw]

12. So where does the prophecy go...

when Obama defeats him by well over 100 EVs?

[riderinthestorm]

15. K&R for an important thread. Thanks for posting. nt

[highplainsdem]

28. Thanks!

[white_wolf]

16. As someone who enjoys studying various relgions, i have to say Mormonism is 1 of the strangest.

I really think Smith was just making it up as he went along for a while, though I do think after a while began to believe his own legend and truly thought he was doing God's work. The fact that he allowed himself to be arrested instead of fleeing, seems to indicate that he believed his own story, at least at the end.

[jwirr]

20. I read the Book of Mormon just to see what was in it. Can't argue with what you do not know. I

found it to be a poorly written version of old testament ideas with the baptise the dead and Native Americans thrown in. A minister from a branch of our church in Utah told me about the "prophecy" when I contacted him about another issue.

[TeeYiYi]

21. Brigham Young University...

...ISN'T in Salt Lake City. It's in Provo, Utah. Provo is at least 50 miles South of Salt Lake.

That seems like an odd and obvious screw up for Salon fact checkers to have missed...

TYY

[gulliver]

22. Mormon missionaries will go wild if there is a Mormon president

With their aggressive missionary policy and with Mitt in the White House, millions of people will undoubtedly be recruited away from traditional Christian denominations and sects. Or, in the language of those denominations and sects, a Mitt presidency means millions of souls going to Hell. It will be interesting to see how the more radical right Christians rationalize a decision to vote for more people leaving their faiths and going to Hell. Mitt is going to tempt them.

[newspeak]

33. mormonism has been in competition for a while with the baptists

I remember my boss (mormon) stating that the world would be a better place if we all believed the same. Gee, just typing it gave me the chills. I told him there is no way I'd want to believe something that could be false. And if everyone believed a false belief, who would have the courage to correct it? And, if that belief condoned committing an act of inhumanity, like human sacrifice, who would finally see the immorality of it? And, just because everyone believed the same, people would find some other reason to kill others besides religion.

[KamaAina]

36. The Southern Baptists once held their convention in Salt Lake

just so they could go out on the streets and try to convert Mormons.

[Dawson Leery]

23. Which would make Mormonism competition to to the Born Again "Christians".

[highplainsdem]

24. Which would be one reason why he got only 1/5 of the evangelical vote in SC, according to exit polls

[kentuck]

25. But we are not to talk about religion...

..in this political race.

All that I know is that he donates a lot to his church. I can only assume that his church supports him likewise?

[highplainsdem]

26. More on Mike Moody, a BYU classmate and Cougar Club member who's now critical of Romney:

Moody is mentioned briefly in the Salon article.

BusinessWire has a press release about his new book:

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20120126006137/en/Book-Author-Michael-Moody-Talks-Contradictions-Romney

Moody's bio from his website -- and among other credentials, he served as Nevada coordinator of Republicans for Kerry in 2004:

http://mittsetourpeoplefree.com/authorbio1.htm

Here's a 2004 Washington Post article about Moody:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/issues2004/battleground_nevada.htm


Text of the press release:

January 26, 2012 12:32 PM Eastern Time
In New Book, Author Michael Moody Talks About Contradictions Between Romney, His Politics and Mormonism

LAS VEGAS--(BUSINESS WIRE)--In Mitt, Set Our People Free! A Seventh Generation Mormon’s Plea for Truth, Author Michael D. Moody Exposes the Contradiction That Romney Embraces Every Day as a Mormon.

Moody, a former BYU classmate and Cougar Club Brother to the 2008 and 2012 presidential contender, discusses the hypocrisies of Mormonism in an open letter to Mitt Romney in the book www.mittsetourpeoplefree.com. He delivers an insider’s look at politics, Mitt, and the Mormon Church, contending these hypocrisies relate directly to the manipulative mind of Joseph Smith and to practices like communalism and polygamy that he incorporated into his nineteenth century cult.

Romney’s sworn allegiance to the Mormon Church—the Great American Cult—belies his bald-faced claim that he is a conservative Republican. Nothing could be further from the truth. Romney has taken an LDS temple oath to uphold the Law of Consecration, the Church’s communal, socialist system which has been its organizational structure since the 1830s. Moody reminds Romney and warns Americans that according to LDS prophets Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, this structure is the Order of Heaven from “eternity to eternity.”

Romney repeatedly calls President Obama a liberal who wants to transform America into a European-style socialist state, yet, despite his business credentials at Bain Capital, Romney has sworn to uphold the tenets of the Mormon system. In recent decades the Church has tried to reinvent itself as a mainstream Christian Church, while Romney, the Church’s political front man, has reinvented himself as a social conservative.

Moody writes, “I can’t quietly stand aside and watch you march into the American Presidency…a man who believes in a phantom ancient culture, believes the fictitious Book of Mormon is the most correct book on earth, and who reveres Joseph Smith as a Christian prophet. Your political success would advance the Mormon cult kingdom, and that’s unacceptable. Not on my watch!”

A contemporary war rages between those who know the “New Mormon History” and those members who live in a programmed state of denial. Moody challenges Romney to use his respected position as a multigenerational Mormon and former bishop and stake president to lead a modern exodus out of the Great American Cult.

[highplainsdem]

35. Kicking again, since it's relevant to grantcart's thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002436216