Thanks to naivete I made an error in judgement in my early twenties

[Fumesucker]

That was my age when Nixon was forced from office in disgrace, naively I was convinced that no Republican would be President again for at least a generation, that it would take that long for the Republican brand to shed the stench of Nixon and rehabilitate itself to the point a Republican President was again a possibility.

We all know how that worked out, we had one Democratic President for one term and then it was Mourning In America with Ronaldus Maximus for eight horrendous years and then Poppy Bush for another four. We have not to this very day begun to climb out of the hole in our society those two unspeakable creeps put us in.

I get the impression reading for the last few days that a great many DUers who should know better think that there will never be a Republican President again and they don't have to worry about granting powers to that office that they would surely come to bitterly regret should a Republican once again hold it.

One thing I have learned in six decades of life is that you could run the Republican party through a wood chipper and it would reassemble itself like that liquid metal Terminator in T2, they are too useful to the 1% and have more money than God, Allah and Yahweh combined as well as all the moral sense of a rabid badger on meth.

Dismiss the possibility of another Republican President at your extreme peril.

[Cirque du So-What]

1. I wouldn't dream of disregarding that advice

Aside from a national attention span that can be measured in astoundingly small units of time, the RW has a propaganda machine that would have been the envy of the Third Reich. Even Hitler didn't have corporate benefactors with such bottomless pockets.

[n2doc]

2. When you have the spectacle of Chris Christie getting big money from 'democratic' fundraisers

You know they are thinking ahead. If nothing else the American voter has a very short attention span/memory and a constant thirst for the 'next new thing'.

[csziggy]

102. And Florida Democrats dissing real Democratic candidates

And lauding Charlie Crist as if he weren't a DINO.

[Mopar151]

3. all the moral sense of a rabid badger on meth.

Oh, so true.

[90-percent]

23. all the moral sense of a rabid badger on meth.

a line Hunter S. Thompson wishes he had written back when he was alive.

I'm 59 and lived through the times of Nixon. I had no idea how cutthroat and craven Republicans could be until after 9-11.

At the time of Nixon, his criminality was a perverse fluke. Surely few on national office could be that corrupt and Machiavellian? As history reveals more and more "not to be opened in my life time revelations", it seems like Republicans have been very very bad for this country since Eisenhower. Bad for the country and bad for democracy itself.

-90% Jimmy

[awoke_in_2003]

4. K&R. nt

[RainDog]

5. k&r n/t

[Phlem]

6. K&R!

-p

[WinkyDink]

7. Same age here---and I thought men would always see the attractiveness of long hair! The

deliberately bald look appalls me!

[Fumesucker]

47. It works for some men

For others, not so much.

[Aerows]

71. He looks like he just swallowed a turd n/t

[MsPithy]

8. I think the most important thing the, "Nothing to see here!" crowd is missing

is: WHO DECIDES WHO IS A TERRORIST?

Is it so farfetched that President Cruz, VP Bachmann, Speaker Boehner, Leader McConnell, CIA Director Palin and NSA Commander Cheney would classify abortion providers, or anyone who works for or supports Planned Parenthood, as terrorists? After all, they "murder millions of babies," every year.

[tblue]

22. Add to that Gitmo, kill lists and drones

And drones right here in the US, and you got something evil and unholy going on here, to paraphrase Kate Corleone.

[EC]

9. The way everyone seems to be piling on Obama

I'm more worried we'll never have a Democratic One again. I'm also worried about the Senate in 2014.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

13. That was the goal of the media....

It fits into their "both sides do it" meme.

[tblue]

19. Because both sides DO do it!

And neither side really gives a damn about you and me. They really don't.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

36. Here's the thing,...While Obama isn't that Liberal...

....the people who are a major part of his machine and who moved into positions of power within the Democratic Party ARE.

We weren't going to go from the DLC to the Progressive Caucus in a single election cycle.

Just be glad the Republicans are claiming Obama is a radical Socialist because America is thinking that's not so bad.

[We People]

63. Reminder of another factor: Supreme Court Appointments

Of "supreme" importance!

[Spitfire of ATJ]

65. That's generational change you can believe in.

[frylock]

30. is that not the case?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

34. Hello? McCain/Palin or Romney/Ryan? Seriously?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

52. What people need to remember is it wasn't just BUSH...

It was the entire Conservative Movement and all of their ideas that led to total disaster.

To listen to them now they claim their ideas have never been given a chance.

[tblue]

17. He could do something about that.

He gives us so much fodder. What did he expect?

[EC]

21. How is this about him?

In 2008 The Congress did pass the FISA law of 2008 which made this legal with warrents- that is what everybody was requesting of Bush...It is what Obama said he would do, what more should HE - himself do? They get warrants from the FISA court. Well, everyone then says, well that court didn't deny even one request...well, yeah...they likely don't request a warrant unless it'll pass muster to allow one. Why would anyone ask for a warrant that isn't legit in the first place?

[tblue]

24. If you were POTUS, what would you do?

Whine about how powerless you are? Give the man some credit that he's not some helpless puppet. It's not ONLY him and he's not the only one who is to blame, I'll grant you that.

[EC]

28. If I were POTUS

I'd do exactly what he did.

[hfojvt]

35. We won't

right now the future looks all DLC to me. Sure, they are technically Democrats, but as far as class issues go, they are to the right of Richard Nixon.

That looks like the future. Two terms of DLC Hillary and then her DLC veep.

But thanks to THIS supposedly Democratic President, a majority of the Bush tax cuts are permanent, so we cannot even put that cat back in the bag, much less go back to pre-Reagan.

[xtraxritical]

54. What is DLC?

[AAO]

64. Democratic Leadership Council (DINO's)

[xtraxritical]

100. Thanks, I'll bing it up.

[MADem]

79. Enough with the DLC shit. They folded their tent years ago.

Their paperwork is in the archives at the Clinton Library.

Name the head of the DLC--you can't. There isn't one.

It's KAPUT.

The leader of the Democratic Party is a guy named Barack Obama. The person who does the heavy lifting for him at the DNC is a woman serving in Congress and doing double duty, named Debbie Wasserman Schultz (who was re-elected to her leadership position, unanimously, this past January).

[xtraxritical]

101. DNC, would that be Democratic National Committee?

[MADem]

105. Exactly.

They are running a very tight ship in terms of their fundraising and policy pronouncement mechanisms. It's why this "DLC" boogieman is so damn lame. That entity was dormant for quite a while before they finally packed everything up and -- I am not kidding -- shipped their archival papers to the Clinton Library in AR. They belong to history, now.

[AAO]

103. Same people. Just because you don't receive their newsletter is irrelevant.

[MADem]

104. Who are you? And why do you think spreading misinformation is funny?

The Women's Temperance League folded their tent, too.

Move on. Stop beating a dead horse--it makes you look, dare I say, UNINFORMED.

[AAO]

106. It's because I am informed that I say the things I do.

Do you think these people have changed their ideas just because they found a political calculus in dismantling the DLC?

Nuff said.

[MADem]

107. Nuff said, indeed--more than enough.

You aren't speaking from a place of knowledge, that much is plain. Your "information" led you to believe that the DLC was still an active entity.

The "political calculus" is that Obama won the election in 2008. The winner takes it all, that's how it works, and you're the only one who doesn't seem to appreciate that rather significant fact.

[AAO]

108. That's crazy talk.

[DCBob]

76. +1

me too.

[Politicub]

85. Now you know what the GOP was planning during their retreats

The spin about them broadening their base by moderating their positions was complete and utter bullshit.

And their strategy is working. Scandal fatigue is real and they're pulling out all the stops to play the American people.

The GOP has double-downed on racism, homophobia and sexism.

I believe Obama is a good and honest man. He deserves better and especially from the Democratic Party.

And democrats who are embracing Christie as ill informed, outright stupid, or both.

My hope is the Democratic Party will outsmart the republican's political game. If DU is any kind of barometer, we've got a long road ahead of us.

As a member of the gay community we have made so much progress. A rabid tea party administration can set things back a generation.

[EC]

93. And a generation is more than

the life I've got left. I'd really hate to see us go backward again. I'm pretty much fed up with WI.

[RC]

86. Well maybe if Obama would stop appointing Republicans and caving to them, then maybe we could have a

real Democrat as president next time and in the foreseeable future.

We need a president (and Congress) a bit to the Left of the real political center, not someone a little to the right of our dragged to the Right apparent center.
Being a Democrat is not enough. Not nearly enough. There are way too many DINO's, Blue Dogs, DLC, 3rd Way and other Right of Center critters mucking up civilization in this country.

Forgot this:

[Egalitarian Thug]

10. Have you heard Thom Hartmann's proposition that Eisenhower was the

last legitimately elected republican President? Fascinating and sad.
& R

[tblue]

20. I'll have to google that. Oh wait.

Could that search wind up putting me on some kind of watch list?

[Egalitarian Thug]

49. Don't worry, I'm sure we're all in several databases already.

The recording of LBJ discussing Nixon's treason is fascinating.

[KittyWampus]

11. as po'd as I get at elected Democrats (including our current POTUS) this is why I control my outrage

Not going to burn down the village to eliminate a few vermin.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

12. Back during Vietnam we thought America would never get sucked into another war...

Kids rebel against their parents. Hippies gave birth to Punkers who gave birth to Dittoheads who gave birth to half-hippie half-rappers.

[marions ghost]

14. True that!

"One thing I have learned in six decades of life is that you could run the Republican party through a wood chipper and it would reassemble itself like that liquid metal Terminator in T2, they are too useful to the 1% and have more money than God, Allah and Yahweh combined as well as all the moral sense of a rabid badger on meth." (Fumesucker)

at the same time

[WovenGems]

18. Mind bender

If we ran Hillary with Christie as VP the right would tremble because we just took the middle of the Republicans from them. A split ticket hasn't been done in a long time and may be a play to make once again.

[marions ghost]

37. Hillary-Christie

Well I got a good laugh out of that. Or how about, as journalist Clarence Page joked, a Hillary/Ron Paul ticket.

Sure it would be symbolic, but not necessarily productive. Might be one of those pushmepullyus.

Kinda done with Clintons myself, tho I know Hill is popular.

[Enthusiast]

75. Why would we want an anti-labor, anti-worker - pro-corporation ticket?

I don't get it.

[riqster]

15. Well said!

[Gus Lammas]

16. We're all screwed

Don't worry about past misjudgments. It really doesn't matter at this point

[meti57b]

25. *We know.*

Dismiss the possibility of another Republican President at your extreme peril.

[graham4anything]

26. Don't like Bush, simple, don't elect Jeb/Rand and elect Hillary/Booker in 2016.

[Bluenorthwest]

43. Does that mean you love Chris Christie, who is your governor, elected by you?

Or did you support the Democrat and watch Christie win anyway? Why wasn't it 'simple' for you to elect the Democrat?

[Nimajneb Nilknarf]

27. Memories are short. Public opinion goes as the wind blows. Propaganda works very well indeed.

Less than seven years passed between the fall of Nixon and the election of Ronald Reagan.

[corkhead]

29. maybe by pouting and staying home in November, we will send a message

it sure seemed to have worked in 2010

[frylock]

32. did you stay home in 2010?

[corkhead]

38. no, but frankly I feel different at this juncture.

I am stuck with a gerrymandered Koch brother toady as my congressman and nobody I have been able to get excited about in the state wide races.

I have voted in every election since I came of age. At the moment, I am feeling like it hasn't made a shit-pots worth of difference.


do I sound a little discouraged?

[frylock]

42. i feel the same as you do

[CrispyQ]

56. I think there are many on both sides feeling that way. -nt

[Aerows]

70. Yep n/t

[still_one]

31. I suspect some don't care because they believe there is no difference. Of course that is their

right but that is not how change occurs

[hfojvt]

33. very nicely written

but the way I remember it, Ford barely lost to Carter

and then the media spent four years horse-whipping Carter.

But at the time I was both a Ford and a Reagan supporter.

Hey, I was young and foolish, but even in 1992 I did not think that Poppy was that much worse than Clinton.

[Renew Deal]

39. You're right

[Amonester]

40. Alright, then let's say Obama would somehow manage to scrap that sh*t.

Then, by some hoRRendous machin_e_ation (against all demographic odds showing their numbers are sinking year after year), a repuke tyrant gets in, and decides to make a new one... and this time, top-top-top-secret and sealed until climate change kills us all.

In other words, what would stop them from Re-creating it then?

[Fumesucker]

45. If you do not object when a Democrat does it you have no legitimacy when a Republican does it

At least that's the way I see it.

Speak now or forever hold your peace.

[Amonester]

46. Well, that's a good point.

There are lawmakers (D) out there who are actually requesting a serious discussion about this.

So they must expect receiving a lot of letters (or emails) of support. (see LBN)

[Uncle Joe]

41. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, FumeSucker.

[octoberlib]

44. There was a photo of LBJ from the 60's in a book I was reading

and the caption was "Will the Republicans ever win another Presidential election again?" I never discount the Republican party. They still seem to be doing fine at the state level although a lot of that is probably due to gerrymandering.

[quakerboy]

48. The only way the Republican Party will truely end

is if the Democratic party can be fully, wholly purchased, for a lower cost, to take their place as the tool of greed.

[pnwmom]

50. I agree. The flip side of that, however, is that even if we succeeded now

in tying Obama's hands and replacing the Patriot's Act with whatever our dream act was -- all it would take would be a future Republican President and Congress to undo everything.

Or a future 9/11 -- or worse.

Nothing is forever.

[DCBob]

87. +1

or they would simply ignore the laws and do whatever they wanted.. eg Bush/Cheney.

[indepat]

53. Refreshing to know someone else considers Republicans (and all right-wingers) to be as loathsome,

noxious, and repugnant as I. Republicans have imo inflicted more unimaginable harm, destruction, and damage to this country since 1981 than can be repaired in two generations, even should moderate/progressive Democrats gain and retain control of all major branches of government and that is not likely to happen. I shudder to think of the kind of country my grandchildren and great-grandchildren face.

[woofless]

55. Truer words were never spoken.

I agree 100%.

[ErikJ]

57. 2010

Lets not forget the Lesson of 2010. Lots of Obama disatisfaction led to the 2010 GOP landslide in the House and state governors. They gerrymandered the districts. And now we'll pay for that sin for a generation.

[Fumesucker]

58. My understanding is that it was the squishy middle that didn't turn out

They usually don't in off year elections for both parties but it tends to be more so for the Democrats.

I've seen this hashed out in GD more than a few times now.

[Curmudgeoness]

59. I also made that same mistake,

and will not do that again. I am amazed at the resilience of the Repubs. And the difficulty we have in elections.

And I thought that you would make a really juicy admission from your youth! Hell, I had many more errors in judgment that were much greater! Although you are right, it seemed impossible that anyone would vote for a Republican so soon after Nixon.

[Fumesucker]

60. I figured that would get people clicking on my OP

And I nearly put in "Not that you perverts" as the first line.

Yeah, I had a few pretty serious errors of judgment back then.

It's surprising sometimes how much the wisdom and maturity of advanced age resembles being too tired to bother.

[Curmudgeoness]

61. .................

My problem is that I am still lacking in wisdom and maturity.....and I keep doing things that I would be better not to do. Like posting on this subversive site.

[WillyT]

62. HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!!

[woo me with science]

66. K&R

[Rozlee]

67. Yeah, those bastards are like Freddie Krueger, Jason and Michael Myers.

They create carnage and destruction and then you think that the country has had it's fill of them, but they keep coming back over and over. They say it'll be different in years to come because of demographic shifts, but I can't help thinking that the powers-that-be are scrambling even now to get their ducks in a row and turn it all to their advantage. They know how to make people vote against their best interests and how to stir resentment within groups. They've been doing it for a long time now. We've got a generation coming up the pipeline that's forecast to be more liberal, more in favor of issues like reproductive rights, gay marriage and income equality, more secular and racially diverse. But, the 1% is canny and know how to divide and conquer and have been pitting people against each other and their best interests for a long time. I'm always astounded at conservatives who make barely over minimum wage and consider themselves middle class and rail against the 47% that depend on government assistance, never once seeing the irony of their situation. I have a feeling the plutocracy has a back up plan in place. They don't plan on relinquishing control to any future generation.

[struggle4progress]

68. Conclusion: We need to pressure Congress to change the laws, because merely changing

current Administration usage of the laws is inadequate

[Vinnie From Indy]

69. Bravo!

Cheers!

[MissMarple]

72. You make me smile.

A Republican by any other name would smell the same as we do. Oligarchs are a bit different. Their smell is that of dessication. They want the death of democracy and discount us both. I say... Silly rabbits. The people will win, Democrats and Republicans together will contiue to keep them at bay. But we will still squabble. Life goes on, uncertainty is our companion. At least he is a familiar one.

The kids will be ok. They seem to find a way.

[pam4water]

73. I don't think they are actively thinking. They are just in the cult of personally blindly following

Obama.

[Kolesar]

81. You dont have to participate here if you hate us...eom

[pam4water]

98. And you should not if you can't think.

[tomp]

74. obviously, bad actions from the govt....

.....do not require the republican party. if you don't see bipartisan collusion against the people, you're not paying attention.

[Fumesucker]

78. You are correct, however Republicans guarantee worse actions from the government

I've noted before on DU that often the worst policies have bipartisan support, the Democrats are by no means blameless when it comes to bad policy but the Republicans are in a league all of their own when it comes to bad actions.

[tomp]

109. I disagree. but that's exactly what they want you to think.

the two work hand in hand to produce the ultimate outcome, and this is pervasive across all levels of govt including elections, and with complicit corporate media. the fundamental role of the democratic party is to LOOK LIKE the good guys. once you understand that, you know everything you need to know about american politics.

I strongly recommend chris hedges "death of the liberal class" for an eye opening historical perspective.

[DCBob]

77. Im more worried about Democrats self-imploding over this issue..

thus giving the Senate and WH to the Republicans. Then they will make their own rules.

[Kolesar]

80. You are projecting others' thoughts and are way off the mark

"third paragraph" in particular

[quaker bill]

82. FISA courts are a limit

specifically designed to restrict Nixonian behavior and were created after Watergate. They still exist, just the same.

[Smarmie Doofus]

83. Rec. But is anyone here really that dum....errhh...*naive*. I hope not. n/t

[mgardener]

84. Did you really think that?

I, too, was alive when Nixon resigned. I was angry. Angry that he got the chance to resign instead of being impeached.
I never thought the republicans learned their lesson from Nixon and his corrupt presidency, they got away with one of the most corrupt regimes in our history.

All this 'mess" was swept under the rug. Nothing was learned from Nixon. And when Democrats do not have strong candidates, republicans win.

[DCBob]

88. You are still naive if you think any future Republican administration..

will adhere to any new restrictions placed on anti-terrorism.. re: Bush/Cheney.

[Fumesucker]

94. I think you mistake my point

If Democrats and liberals don't speak up now then what reason would anyone have to take them at all seriously when a Republican does it?

Speak up when your guy does something you don't like or forever hold your peace.

[DCBob]

96. Perhaps.. but my point is it wont really matter.

What matters is keeping Republicans from taking full control. If that ever happens we are in deep shit.

[deutsey]

89. The problem is

during the time that Reagan and Bush I were in power, they successfully rigged the whole game so that even when a Democrat is elected president, they can't govern from the center-left.

[thecrow]

90. That's why they are trying to dis Hillary any way they can.

They are throwing the whole kitchen sink at her, just hoping something sticks.
And suddenly they want an immigration bill? Something that they said would harm our country and they would never vote for? C'mon.

[rhett o rick]

91. We must not get distracted by thinking the Democratic Party as good and the Republican Party

is bad. With that linear thinking then all Gov Christie would have to do is switch parties and easily defeat another McCain-like Republican dipshit candidate. Then everyone would be happy. We would not have a Republican President and yet the Republican ideology would be leading our nation.

It is not enough that the Democratic candidate be registered as a Democrat if they uphold Republican ideologies.

But it's not like we can hope for a progressive candidate. With unlimited resources any progressive candidate can easily be squashed.

NGU

[Fumesucker]

95. My thinking isn't quite that linear

It's more a matter of if you don't speak up when your team does something wrong or stupid then you have no credibility if you complain about the other side when they do something similar.

[jimlup]

92. Strongly agree...

Never underestimate the possibility of extreme backlash. The weirdness we've seen since Obama became president could well grow into a backlash movement strong enough to elect another repuke. And the we've given the dems a chance and things aren't better contingent will also gain some traction in '16

[existentialist]

97. all the moral sense of a rabid badger on meth

That is a good coinage.

[Sheepshank]

99. This statement is so freaking obvious....

One thing I have learned in six decades of life is that you could run the Republican party through a wood chipper and it would reassemble itself like that liquid metal Terminator in T2, they are too useful to the 1% and have more money than God, Allah and Yahweh combined as well as all the moral sense of a rabid badger on meth.

Dismiss the possibility of another Republican President at your extreme peril.

so obvious I almost hit myself in the forehead. Of course there is no hope of a theird party...that daydream will never have a chance especially while Citizens United stands!!!!