Without the Southern States, the rest of us would miss...

[alp227]

Last edited Thu Jun 20, 2013, 12:25 AM - Edit history (3)

Here's my response to this stupid anti-south thread. I am a resident of the Left Coast whose only experience in the South (defining "South" as former official Confederacy states) was visiting Central Florida (Disney World, Universal Studios, and the Kennedy Space Center) and flight layovers at the Atlanta and Houston airports. I regretfully have yet to set foot in the Carolinas or non Florida/Texas Gulf Coast states. Virginia? When I vacationed to the East Coast I ate dinner & stayed overnight in Arlington. Now about that thread: it was very poorly thought out and over-generalizing. Never mind how NORTHERN politicians like Scott Walker, Rick Snyder, John Kasich, and Mitch Daniels have worked to undo the efforts of organized labor in the USA.

And c'mon, do you realize what the US would miss without those evil, evil Southern States?
- LBJ, Carter, and Clinton, the past 3 Democratic presidents before Obama
- The matchups in the past 3 NBA Finals (2011: Dallas Mavericks & Miami Heat; 2012: Heat & Oklahoma City Thunder; 2013: Heat & San Antonio Spurs). before that, the 1994, 1995, 1999, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, and 2009 Finals all included a team from the South in the matchup (the Orlando Magic in 1995 and 2009, Mavs vs Heat in 2006, Houston Rockets in 1994 and 1995, and the Spurs in 99, 03, 05, and 07)
- OutKast
- Lynyrd Skynyrd
- Pantera
- SEC football
- Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers
- Elvis
- B.B. King
- Pecans, peanuts, legumes
- TBS
- Johnny Cash
- The Mike Malloy Show, since Malloy began his radio career at WSB-AM in Atlanta and continues to do a show from Atlanta to this day
- Texas Gov. Ann Richards (remember her 1988 Democratic convention speech that included such quips as "Poor George, he can't help it. He was born with a silver foot in his mouth&quot and her daughter Cecile Richards, the president of Planned Parenthood
- The North Carolina Research Triangle and the Duke/UNC rivalry
- Pancakes
- Tex-Mex culture
- No need to worry about blizzard conditions in the winter; there's a reason snowbirds exist

lesson learned? DON'T be a regional bigot. Here are highlights from Ann Richards's 1988 DNC speech:

(edit to add) thanks everyone for the suggestions i'll also add
- Tennessee Senator later VP Al Gore - who else would've given Bush a challenging election 13 years ago?
- Jim Hightower

[Trajan]

1. Honestly

I didnt much like 90% of that stuff ...

Signed,
Goddamned Yankee from NYC

And yes - We occasionally make salsa, and it's fucking delicious !

[okaawhatever]

4. Get the rope. (from a commercial) nt

[KansDem]

131. Say, okaawhatever, do you remember the change in that commercial?

Originally, one of the cowhands said...

This sauce was made in...New Jersey?!!"
NEW JERSEY??!!
Get a rope!

But then after airing for a short while, the cry of disdain suddenly changed from "New Jersey" to "New York City"...

This sauce was made in...New York City?!!"
NEW YORK CITY??!!
Get a rope!

It kinda looks like "New York City" is dubbed over the original clip

I've always wondered if the New Jersey Attorney General, acting on behalf of the Governor, informed Pace that no company in NJ makes picante sauce and that constantly maligning NJ for doing so hurt their feelings and might result in perhaps a lawsuit?

If so, Pace sure picked up the pace in correcting their mistake!

[okaawhatever]

167. Ha Ha thanks for the flashback. I didn't remember the New Jersey version. I also didn't remember the

one with the cows. I love the bit at the end "animal" LOL. I also like the Lone Ranger reference, but I doubt a lot of younger folks would have understood the reference. That was a great commercial. I remember people using the "New York City" meme for other things, so it really had an impact.
Thanks for the blast from the past. Oh, and the pun.

[cali]

2. Jambalaya! Zydeco music

dirty rice, etouffee.

[Katashi_itto]

38. Don't worry. Here in New Orleans, we would declare ourselves Union.

We went 78% for Obama. To much slave history here to go off with the South. We know what the result would be.

[sylvanus]

123. The Athens music scene, Pylon, REM and the B-52's!nt

[dawg]

153. What? No love for Love Tractor?

[TDale313]

3. Really good thread.

I'm in a similar position. Born and bred Californian, visited Florida and Virginia, but never spent a lot of time in the South. That said, I think looking down our noses at that whole region and everyone living there is ridiculous and self-defeating.

[alfredo]

27. I was born, raised, and remain a southerner. I'm used to cringing at what our

political and religious leaders say and do.


They never got over losing the civil war, and that hatred is passed on to their children. Those lessons don't stick with all children. It's going to take a few more generations.

[susanna]

86. This is an interesting take on it.

I agree with you. I am not so unusual, I suppose, but I am a part of the first generation of my family born/educated in the north. Both of my parents' families were southern, and their ancestors as well, dating well back into the 1700s.

I was taught a lot of southern manners and cultural minutiae growing up. Not so strangely, though, those teachings did not always jibe with my experience in the north. This is also true for all of my cousins (in the same boat as me). I think it's been easier for us to change when we're in the north and not surrounded by the cultural pressures. My southern kin are still how they were, and your post pretty much sums it up, so I won't belabor that.

Of course, my southern kin can pry my fried chicken, smoked pork, and buttermilk biscuits from my cold 'Yankee' hands, if they think they're up for the fight. I still make them and still love them. I'm pretty confident that my takes on these classics would past muster south of the Mason-Dixon line as well. Learned from the best (thanks to Grandma and Grandpa).

on edit: I spell things wrong sometimes. It's a gift.

[alfredo]

120. I lived in Michigan for five years. I could see some

Southern culture in Pontiac. There were very rigid color lines there. Detroit was a different story to some extent.

[susanna]

171. Well, you hit my geographical location back then on the head.

I was raised between Pontiac and a northern suburb of the same city.

It really was about all the folks from down south coming up for the auto jobs. Detroit was probably lesser because it wasn't so "small," for lack of a better term.

On edit: then vs. there, makes no difference...oh wait, it does.

[tammywammy]

5. Correction: Cecile Richards is not the founder of Planned Parenthood

She's their current president.

[Moses2SandyKoufax]

6. I could live happily without everything on your list

if it meant the rest of the country was free from the regressive politics that dominate that region.

[HooptieWagon]

12. Fine. Don't buy any food grown in the south next winter.

See if we care.

[Hoyt]

22. Gram Parsons called Waycross GA the ahole of the world.

I live here, and tend to agree. But, I know all the shortcuts, and cool trails along the river.

[Tom Ripley]

33. I went through Waycross once and thought "Man, no wonder Gram Parsons was so melancholy"

[Hoyt]

40. No joke. I've been there a few times, not much and hot.

At the museum, they have this petrified dog in a log. Other than that, it's a sleepy town that one better play banjo or something to pass a lot of time on a big porch under oak trees.

[HooptieWagon]

60. IIRC he spent some of his youth in J-ville.

But i think his great love was desert SW.
He sure loved country music though, and was a driving force in integrating it into rock n roll.

[Hoyt]

72. I was waiting in line when Sweetheart of the Rodeo was released.

Good time for music.

[HooptieWagon]

75. yes, it was. And he was a great one.

A lot of that sound is having a big resurgence in Tampa area. Rebekah Pulley from St Pete, Have Gun, Will Travel from Bradenton, Will Quinlan, Dean Johanesen,...they've all got signed to labels now, doing a lot of touring. Keep an eye out for them. Def worth hearing if ya like Americana.

[npk]

152. LOL. At least Waycross is famous for something.

BTW, just full disclosure I live in town in Georgia every bit worse than Waycross.

[HooptieWagon]

7. Add shrimp, grouper, softshell crab...

and other delicious seafood.
Cajun food and music.
New Orleans Jazz.
Delta Blues.
Bluegrass.
Allman Brothers.
Gram Parsons.
Jaco Pastorious.
G Washington and T Jefferson.
Warm water to swim in and boat on.
Nice beaches.
Year round supply of fresh fruit, including citrus.
Cattle.
Multi-culturalism...Cuban, Carribbean, Central and South American, Vietnamese, Indian, Eastern Europe.
A Gulfstream, to keep NE America and NW Europe warm.

[oneshooter]

19. Also add, fried catfish, pecan pie, Jack Daniel whiskey,

hush puppies
Texas Rio Star grapefruit
Austin
Galveston
50-60% of gasoline production
50% of natural gas production

[dixiegrrrrl]

20. Helen Keller, Booker T. Washington, Muscle Shoals recording studio

( do I have to tell anyone what a HUGE deal Muscle Shoals Studio was???)
and of course..
Elvis!

Oh, and the ORIGINAL Mardi Gras, began in Mobile Ala.

And, a bit closer to home...To Kill a Mockingbird's author is still with us, couple miles from my place.

[HooptieWagon]

73. Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton,

Nashville, Ashville, Austin
Key West
Savannah
Blueridge Parkway
Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn
Fresh-squeezed orange juice
Iced tea
real sugar from cane, not beets
Pirates and other interesting scalawags
Oldest cities in US.
Cool shipwrecks
Spanish gold doubloons washed up on beaches
Keys Highway
Marjorie Stoneman Douglass
Jack Kerouac
Hemmingway

[raccoon]

107. That's SWEET tea, iced, yall. One of the best things about the South. nt

[DontTreadOnMe]

74. The Allman Brothers are from NYC

72 st Street and Broadway.

[HooptieWagon]

77. What? No they're not!

Duane and Gregg both born in Tennessee, grew up in Florida. I used to see them play VFW picnics and shit as a kid, when they were teens. Duane died in Macon Ga. Dickie Betts from Sarasota, still lives there. I know several former and current of his band members. A whole bunch of Allman Bros Band kids live in Sarasota, too.

[DontTreadOnMe]

83. You are obviously not an Allman Brother fan...

like I said... oh wait... 74th and Broadway.

[HooptieWagon]

87. Only for 47 years....

I only saw them play in Fl, except for 1973 at RFK Stadium with the Grateful Dead. I met Gregg and Duane in the sixties, before ABB. I've met
Dickie Betts, Derek Trucks, and Berry Duane Oakley. Derek plays one of Duane's old guitars, I've held it. And I'm friends with Dickie Betts former guitarist, and current bassist. Jammed with them.

[Ghost in the Machine]

90. I have pictures of Duane Allman and Berry Oakleys' graves, side by side, at the Rose Hill Cemetary

in Macon, Ga. Many years ago, we did a big job near the cemetary, and I spent many a lunch hour visiting their grave sites.

Both were killed in motorcycle accidents, two weeks shy of a year apart...and 3 blocks apart... Both died at age 24, taken wayyyyy too soon from this world.

Peace,

Ghost

[HooptieWagon]

95. Cool, man.

I haven't seen them, but a friend touring in Ga took pics and sent them to me.

[DontTreadOnMe]

148. I guess you guys didn't get my joke...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beacon_Theatre_%28New_York_City%29

I have photographed the current band over 150 times... here is one of my recent photos from this March.







enjoy!

[HooptieWagon]

151. No, I didn't at first.

But when you posted the first pic I figured you were working on some angle. Is that from Fillmore East or something?

[DontTreadOnMe]

155. It is the Beacon Theater in New York City

Duanne never played at the Beacon - they made the Fillmore East famous, but ever since 1989, the Allman Brothers have been playing regularly every March at the Beacon Theater. It is often referred to as "Peakin' at the Beacon" in the NY Times reviews. The Allman Brothers hold the record for most amount of shows of any band playing at the Beacon Theater, currently at 245 shows. The subway stop at 72nd Street on Broadway is the way to get to the Beacon Theater.

So my initial post was a poke at the fact that the Allman Brothers have played more concerts in New York City more than any other place in the country - and that when touring, they also mainly play "Northeast" venues. They just don't sell tickets playing in the southern states. Many of the current band members, including Gregg live in Manhattan.

Although the band is from Macon, and yes I have photos of Rose Hill Cemetery, the band rarely even plays in Georgia anymore. Too bad, because Atlanta has the beautiful Fox Theater. The Allman Brothers could announce 15 shows at the Fox and they would sell out instantly.

[HooptieWagon]

159. Down here they mostly play the festival circut...

MagFest, Boneroo, etc.
The large venues in my area (Cent Fl) usually book pop stars, country, and moldy-oldie rock bands on reunion tours. Got to go to festivals to see the better bands. Lately, though, I've been mostly just getting into the local bands...there's a shitload of good ones here.

Funny story...the bil of a good friend was in town visiting inlaws for holidays a year+ ago. He used to be Nirvana's guitar tech, now he's with White Stripes. I dragged him out to a tiny local dive that hosts an open mic...lots of good local musicians show uo to jam. He heard several of my friends jamming, grabbed me by the shoulder and said it was best band he'd heard in a long time, wanted to know their name. I replied they didn't have a name, they were just locals jamming, but...lead guitarist/vocalist used to be a Nashville session guy that played with Dickie Betts, other guitarist plays with Bobbie Lee Rodgers (godfather of florida jam bands), bassist was auditioned by Prince for his touring band (rejected only because of exte.sive tats and piercings, which Prince didn't like one bit), and the drummer tours with one of the biggest Christian rock bands in the country. The guy was dumb-founded.

[pinboy3niner]

8. Friends & relatives, the Alamo, Civil Rights Memorial & SPLC (Montgomery, AL)...

...Disneyworld, Houston Space Center, New Orleans, Cheer Wine (NC soft drink), Georgia peaches and Vidalia onions, Grand Ol' Opry, Graceland...just to add a few.

[Warren Stupidity]

9. Strange fruit.

Oh wait.

[WovenGems]

16. Do you mean

Georgia peaches? Love the drawl.

[Warren Stupidity]

18. Interesting that y'all don't know the idioms of the other half of your culture.

[cordelia]

23. I know the idiom - and am curious as to why you would bring up lynching.

Oh wait.

[Warren Stupidity]

41. Things the south is famous for.

[Stonepounder]

68. Giving smallpox infected blankets to Native Americans.

Oh, wait. That was in the North. And don't forget John Boehner is from Ohio. But generalizing over any group is silly and offensive. It is nothing more than racial profiling, and we all know how much in favor of that DU is.

Do southern states pass wing-nut legislation? You betcha. But the last time I looked, Michigan and Wisconsin were not south of the Mason-Dixon line. And even California managed to pass the prop that is now before the SCOTUS regarding gay marriage.

And regardless of their politics, most southerners would give you the shirt off their back if you needed it. Low-information? Yeah, many of them are, but at the same time, on a personal level they are some of the nicest and friendliest people you would ever want to meet.

[Warren Stupidity]

100. Yes indeed we did fucked up shit too. Slightly off topic for a celebration of southern culture.

[cordelia]

115. And you are capable of only focusing on the bad. Got it.

Speaks volumes.

[Stonepounder]

116. I wasn't the one who brought up 'strange fruit'

I was responding to the 'strange fruit' post. And, if you had bothered to read the rest of my post you would have seen that I said that the vast majority of southeners are warm, friendly and caring.

A couple of years back, in the dead of winter, a woman lost control of her car and ended up in a creek. Three young men, who looked like they could have stepped out of a Deliverance poster saw the accident. Two of them jumped into the creek and held the woman's head out of the water (she was trapped in her car), while the other ran to get help. The woman was rescued and the two men who helped her were treated for hypothermia. When interviewed for TV they couldn't understand what the fuss was about. Their attitude was they just did what anyone would do.

Do we seem to have more than our share of wing-nuts? Yeah, probably. But here I know more of my neighbors that I ever did in California. And when I was laid up from gall bladder surgery, the guy from three doors up (who, by the way can't really walk, he gets about on one of those motorized chairs) came down on his riding mower and cut my grass for me when he saw my wife our cutting it. Call it sexist if you want, but he didn't think it was proper for a lady to have to cut the grass.

[Warren Stupidity]

129. asking people to celebrate a culture

By presenting only the good aspects of that culture is basically dishonest, as was the op that started this, by focusing only on the negative.

[cordelia]

142. And in what Utopia do you reside?

Seemingly it is a land populated by kitties and unicorns that frolic in the warm sun and bake cupcakes and all the people of all the races walk hand in hand in eternal glee and joy and bliss.

Oh wait.

[Warren Stupidity]

149. huh?

I reside in the dystopia of the usa, just like you. Where did I say that southern culture is fucked up and, for example yankee culture or western culture isn't?

[malaise]

101. I think he means

Nina Simone

I have three Southern born nephews, one Southern born niece and two Southern born grand nieces - all the adults are progressives.

[Warren Stupidity]

103. Ignorance is bliss.

Do the words Billie Holiday strike a chord?

[RoseMead]

160. Ignorance

Nina Simone also recorded Strange Fruit, in 1965. But don't let that stop your condescending roll.

[LanternWaste]

132. An idiot may believe strange fruit would never have existed without the south.

An idiot may believe strange fruit would never have existed without the south. But I don't really know any idiots on a personal level.

History is hard for many people. Oh wait.

[RedCappedBandit]

10. Could easily do without all of that if it meant a less conservative government

[Tom Ripley]

36. +1000

[Egalitarian Thug]

11. This reads, with the exceptions of Ann Richards & Johnny Cash,

like an argument in favor of the proposition that southerners started both 154 and 2 years ago.

Do you want a detailed list or is the point sufficiently made?

[LanternWaste]

133. The SEC was a point of contention 154 years ago?

The SEC was a point of contention 154 years ago?

[Blue_In_AK]

13. Ann Richards, Johnny Cash,

that is all. (Although you could have added Barbara Jordan.)

I'm not a huge fan of the south, but I do hate region-bashing threads.



Oh, Hakeem Olajuwon (you mentioned Rockets), although he's Nigerian, I think, so does that count?

[pacalo]

14. How nice -- thank you, alp227!

[carolinayellowdog]

15. ...having a Despised Other to look down on

and just how much that is needed, and by how many people, becomes apparent in threads like the one you comment on

[dixiegrrrrl]

137. I sure see a lot of "either-or", "all or nothing" thinking.

And since we know that people put others down in an attempt to build up their own lack of self worth...
nuff said.

[wercal]

17. I've sometimes thought 'what if' the conderacy had been successful

For starters, much of the midwestern agricultural products would have to be shipped overland to get to the northeast...or pay a toll to use the Mississippi. I imagine the north would have an interstate system, while the south would have something less advanced. I think port cities like New Orleans, Mobile, and Charlston would have more traffic than presently. In general neither the north or south would be a superpower...and the outcome of the world wars could be different. I think slavery in the south would be over by now...but they wouldn't have complete equal rights. I think the north would have had a tough time during times of energy crisis, and generally fuel and gas would have cost more, until very recently. I do think the south would actually be more cosmopolitan...assuming people wouldn't have the option of growing up and moving to the east coast, without immigrating. But on the flip side, I think the south would vigorously prohibit immigrants from Mexico. My hometown of Birmingham would steel be an industrialized steel town...and in general southern products would flood the north like Chinese products do today (in a way they already do with all the car plants opening up in the south).

[Hoyt]

37. If confederacy had won, we'd be a 3rd world country, and worse.

[DebJ]

88. If the Confederacy had won, it would not have lasted very long.

The entire concept of a 'country' comprised of 'independent' states is an oxymoron.
One of the biggest problems the South had in the war was that many states just
refused to ante up any money, men or supplies....it was their 'state's right' to
not participate.

How long could a 'country' survive with this 'me first and only' attitude.

[Uncle Joe]

89. Of course no one has a crystal ball but if the Confederacy had won,

we would be two weaker nations, probably not entering or having the impact the U.S. had on WWI.

Had Germany won WWI or at least obtained a more favorable peace treaty than Versailles, Hitler may never have rose to power and WWII wouldn't have happened, at least in the way it did.

[wercal]

122. I agree...the history of the world would have been very different, has the Confederacy won

Because of this, I place great importance on the Battle of Gettysburg. Prior to this battle, the Union had been unsuccessful in their campaigns against Lee's army in the east...and had not been able to fully exploit victories in the west.

There were draft riots in New York. And, the whole reason there was a battle at Gettysburg - the confederate army was freely roaming around in the north, and moving east to hit either Washington DC or New York...or whatever other major city they could harass. It was a bad time for the north; and, I believe the political will to continue the war was about to run out.

So, imho, the course of the 20th century was set by some mistakes and individual leadership and heroism in this one battle.

[carolinayellowdog]

21. William Faulkner, Alice Walker, Harper Lee, Robert Penn Warren, Zora Neale Hurston, Carson McCullers

I care nothing about sports and little about white musicians, but consider the southern contribution to twentieth century American literature important. Not to mention the jazz greats: Louis Armstrong (Louisiana), John Coltrane (North Carolina-- also home of Nina Simone), Dizzy Gillespie (South Carolina), Thelonious Monk (North Carolina), Ella Fitzgerald (Virginia).

[cali]

24. and don't forget Walker Percy and Kate Chopin

[Tom Ripley]

39. With the exception of Armstrong, all of those musicians left the south in order to develop...

their art. I honestly don't think bebop would have flourished in Cheraw, SC or modal jazz in Washington, NC.

[carolinayellowdog]

44. Ella left as a child, not to develop her art

Of course the south of the early 20th century was a cultural backwater people had to leave; so was most of the US as there weren't all that many large cities where art and music flourished.

Zora is my favorite of all the people listed, and while she had to leave to get an education and mature as a person and writer, she had to come back to fulfill her artistic potential.

[raccoon]

118. Truman Capote. nt

[Apophis]

25. I can live without most of that list.

I liked Ann Richards and Mike Malloy.

[Martin Eden]

26. I just spent a week vacationing in the South

Hiking in the mountains of North Carolina -- Linville Gorge & Wilson Creek wildernesses, to be exact.

On our first overnight backpack down Gragg Prong creek it rained all day, all night, and into the morning. We found a room in Linville the next day at the Pixie Motel, owned & operated by a nice lady in her 60's who was obviously conservative (she had a big photo of Ronald Regan in a cowboy hat on her office wall). The room was nice & very reasonably priced, and when we asked if we could spread out our camping gear on the front lawn of the motel (the sun came out with a nice breeze) -- she not only had no objection to that, she let us use the motel's industrial dryer, at no charge, to dry our wet clothes.

When I cheerfully thanked her she made a remark about Southern hospitality, and that indeed is what it was

[Martin Eden]

28. Molly Ivins !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe I missed her being mentioned already in this thread.

I hope I did.

[mountain grammy]

57. Of course!

[alp227]

66. and JIM HIGHTOWER too! another great texan.

i hear his commentaries on the Progressive Voices streaming radio channel. Funny and witty stuff.

[Coccydynia]

29. I've lived in the South, North East, and the West.

In my opinion the Union lost the Civil War by winning the Civil War. The South has been an ignorant ball and chain for 150 years since.

[Tom Ripley]

30. Almost all of that could be imported from the south if they were another country

[HooptieWagon]

80. Assuming we'd sell it to you...

...if we were another country.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

31. pie shakes

[mnhtnbb]

32. As a damn Yankee (born in Manhattan) currently living in Chapel Hill, NC

I have to add JAMES TAYLOR who grew up in Chapel Hill
and toured NC in 2008 giving free concerts in support of Obama's
candidacy for POTUS. He returned to give free concerts in 2012 to
the volunteers and staffers working in the campaign offices here
for Obama.

And yes, I'm also happy to see someone finally added Molly Ivins!

[ZombieHorde]

34. Your post seems to be anti-South to me.

I don't really care for region bashing, and I think this OP is Southing bashing while being disguised as a pro-South OP.

- LBJ, Carter, and Clinton, the past 3 Democratic presidents before Obama

Sure, but the US government would be more liberal without The South.

- The matchups in the past 3 NBA Finals (2011: Dallas Mavericks & Miami Heat; 2012: Heat & Oklahoma City Thunder; 2013: Heat & San Antonio Spurs). before that, the 1994, 1995, 1999, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, and 2009 Finals all included a team from the South in the matchup (the Orlando Magic in 1995 and 2009, Mavs vs Heat in 2006, Houston Rockets in 1994 and 1995, and the Spurs in 99, 03, 05, and 07)

This is a good argument against The South.

- OutKast

Who?

- Lynyrd Skynyrd
- Pantera
- SEC football
- Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers
- Elvis

Another fantastic argument against The South.

- B.B. King
- Pecans, peanuts, legumes

These are great, but we would still have access to them. We can buy Beatles albums and bananas, and they're not from the US.

- TBS

The TV station? No loss.

- Johnny Cash

Another great argument against The South.

- The Mike Malloy Show, since Malloy began his radio career at WSB-AM in Atlanta and continues to do a show from Atlanta to this day

Never heard it.

- Texas Gov. Ann Richards (remember her 1988 Democratic convention speech that included such quips as "Poor George, he can't help it. He was born with a silver foot in his mouth&quot and her daughter Cecile Richards, the founder of Planned Parenthood

Planned Parenthood is a national treasure, so this would be a great loss.

- The North Carolina Research Triangle and the Duke/UNC rivalry
- Pancakes

More South bashing.

- Tex-Mex culture

What's that?

- No need to worry about blizzard conditions in the winter; there's a reason snowbirds exist

Blizzards are fun. Especially if you have hot cocoa.

[alp227]

69. But I LIKE all thos things I listed! Wow, some people here STILL don't get it.

And to clarify some things here are my favorite OutKast songs

My point was: Don't trash the South "Oh they're just right wing backwards hicks" when it's contributed so much good to our culture and economy.

And if you think "without the South" the USA would be more liberal, well if LBJ/Carter/Clinton could NOT run when they did, try to see our nation letting Barry Goldwater become president or letting Gerald Ford or George H.W. Bush get re-elected.

And for samples of the Mike Malloy show please check out my YouTube channel. Fiery progressive talk radio.

http://www.youtube.com/user/andrewsaccount09/search?query=mike+malloy

If you've ever eaten Mexican food, it's because of Texas! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tex-Mex

[bunnies]

130. Um no. Mexican food came from Mexico. Not Texas.

We eat food from all over the world despite not having a neighboring state. And real Mexican food is head and shoulders above what Americans did to it. gross.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

35. Neil Young

Oh, wait, he's even more northern than a Yankee.

He just lives in Florida.

[deurbano]

47. He moved from Woodside (CA)?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

98. Born in ontario

[deurbano]

121. Yeah, I'm a big fan, and know he's from Canada originally...

but he has (had?) been living in Woodside (not far south of San Francisco, where I live) for many years. His wife helped start The Bridge School for kids with communication (and other) disabilities in Hillsborough. Did they move to Florida?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

139. I once read that he was living in fla while

he was penning the words to Alabama. That may be inaccurate, though. I do know that he looked at some parts of the colonies as being about as sophisticated as manure piles. Which does fit parts of the south, given all that animal husbandry that takes place.

[ErikJ]

42. Just think what we've missed without Canada.

Universal health care, hockey, Justin Bieber.

[abelenkpe]

43. I grew up in VA

As soon as I could I packed my tiny car full of my few belongings and escaped to CA. I have many relatives in the south and have visited frequently. I miss my grandmothers cooking. But there is no way in hell I'd ever move back. Don't miss it. You can have it

[Spitfire of ATJ]

45. You forgot ZZ Top and Flipper.

[liberal_at_heart]

93. oh hell yeah, ZZ Top.

[Buns_of_Fire]

46. Grits!

Well, okay, maybe that's not the best example. I'll give it some thought...

[reusrename]

150. Shrimp & grits?

[oneshooter]

162. Cheese Grits

[zentrum]

48. Would do anything for the South

...to secede. The North could go ahead and pass climate change laws, increase the minimum wage, get medicare for all, increase chances for bank regulation, have representation in Congress that actually matches the dominant demographics of the country and on and on---on.

[alp227]

70. What if liberals from the South want to escape? Would the North grant them amnesty? n/t

[mckara]

49. Speak for Yourself

[NightWatcher]

50. If the Yankees were so smart, why haven't they split?

That other thread is so stupid I don't see how it wasn't locked.

[Chipper Chat]

51. Key Lime Pie.

Fried gator tail.

[CBHagman]

52. Lots of our relatives and friends.

And speaking just for myself, grits. I mean, really!

Also, I had no idea cornbread could be sweet. Quite a revelation.

[JoeyT]

53. Most of the non-white population of the united states.

Something that's always conveniently ignored by the people from both sides that think secession is a fine idea.

[carolinayellowdog]

56. thanks-- a thread that stressed "imagine a US that is much whiter and richer"

would meet the scorn it deserves, and (since we're not supposed to refer to trolls) be denounced as the work of a griefer

[alp227]

71. This graph is a little misleading, doesn't account for heavily Latino or Asian communities

can't use this map for all "non white populations"

[graham4anything]

54. I am just looking for an 80-20 America, like in LBJ's time. Without the south, no LBJ, no MLK

I just want the draconian leaders and the extremists all over to be rendered 100% obsolete and the voting booths in 2016.

and in 2016 it will happen.

And Hillary45 will win 500 electoral votes including Texas and 125 million popular votes.

and then the draconian leaders (who are NOT liked by voters in those states) won't matter.

Why do they think they are throwing everything against THIS president? Because they know they are losing big time in 2016
and are trying to change every single law they can in 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016 before 1/17/2016 and forever after that they no longer can't.

Which is why it is imperative that Ed Markey win in Mass next Tuesday(the 25th) and Cory Booker wins in NJ in Oct.

nothing else is more important than that.

[Uncle Joe]

55. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, James Monroe, Andrew Jackson, Al Gore,

Harry Truman, Martin Luther King, Bill Moyers.

Patrick Henry

George Mason; author of the Bill of Rights

John Marshall

Whether you like Andrew Johnson or James K. Polk or not, Johnson was President when Alaska was purchased from the Russians and without Polk, the western United would not be the western United States, it would be Mexico.

Cordell Hull (father of the United Nations)

Democratic Underground, without the selection of 2000 and Al Gore's early work in opening the Internet to the American People, this site might not exist. Of course George Bush would probably still be in Connecticut selling peanuts and having wet dreams about pulling wings off flies.

Harper Lee; author of To Kill A Mockingbird and her inspirational father

For those people that can only see a red flag, Lynyrd Skynynd is a most progressive band, they sing against racism, regionalism, gun violence, and drug addiction.

The Dixie Chicks

David (Damn the torpedoes full steam ahead) Farragut, the first Rear Admiral, Vice Admiral and Admiral in the United States Navy.

If Kentucky is counted as a Southern State, the only Supreme Court Justice; John Marshall Harlan(born into a slave holding family) that dissented 7 to 1 against Jim Crow Laws, Plessy vs Ferguson.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plessy_v._Ferguson

Alvin C. York; single handedly captured over a hundred Germans during World War I.

Louis Armstrong

If you count Missouri as a Southern State, Audie Murphy; the most decorated soldier in U.S. history.

Chester Nimitz

Rosa Parks

Will Rogers, he was born the son of a Confederate Soldier.

Jim Thorpe

Booker T. Washington

If you count Maryland as a Southern state, Babe Ruth

Lewis Chesty Puller; The only Marine in U.S. history to be awarded five Navy Crosses

Pocahantas

Sequoyah; The only known individual to create an alphabet.

Hank Williams

This list is highly incomplete, just a drop in the ocean.

Thanks for the thread, alp.

[broadcaster75201]

58. THe negatives FAR outweight the positives

We can start with the Civil War and move forward. I love Tom Petty too, but . . . pales in comparison to the horror that is the South.

I am from the South and lived there 40 years until I escaped. Let the South sink in the ocean for all I car. The misery it has caused millions is not worth any list you put up here.

[cordelia]

143. Doubt you're missed much.

[Sissyk]

147. Let me say that we're

glad you're gone.

Hope your family moved with you so they don't drown in the ocean.

[Art_from_Ark]

161. Great comeback

"Hope your family moved with you so they don't drown in the ocean."

[Sissyk]

163. lol!

[Art_from_Ark]

164. As one who hails from the extreme northwest corner of the Old South,

all I can say is, maybe my mom will finally get that oceanfront property she's never dreamed about

[npk]

158. LOL. What misery has south caused upon millions

[Samantha]

59. I have a real problem with this thread

You left Al Gore off your list. Without Al Gore, there would have been no Election 2000 contested election. Without that purloined election, there probably would be no DU!!!

Sam

[itsrobert]

63. Anna Nicole

n/t

[Samantha]

76. Dolly Parton

Willie Nelson!

Sam

[itsrobert]

61. SEC Football?

Is this a joke?

[ajk2821]

67. Nope

Plenty of liberals like my entire extended family and friends love SEC football. My grandad and great uncle were proud socialists who would never miss a Florida game.

[Gravitycollapse]

92. It's people playing a game where everyone beats the shit out each other for a ball.

Not terribly important. Certainly not important enough to be missed.

[ajk2821]

104. Easy to say...

That something won't be missed if you don't like it already. I don't really like baseball, hockey (a northern sport in which players are encouraged to fight and being a "goon" is celebrated) or opera. None of those are terribly important enough to be missed. To some, however, those three things give great pleasure and would be missed. It is not my place or yours to say what would be missed.

[Go Vols]

124. +1

for the SEC

[Chiennoir54]

62. Southerners

There are some worthwhile people and things on your list, but I have family in KY, TN, and I live in VA and I tell you, I could do without the South. For one thing, are there ANY evangelists on TV without drawls? I've heard dozens of them, and I can't remember one. Likewise all the Strom Thurmonds, Jeff Sessions, Lindsay Grahams in Congress. If you're hearing some backward, anachronistic, right wing speechifying, chances are they have that accent. Someone wrote that Neil Young lives in FL. Just read his autobio and he spoke of California and Hawaii, but I never heard of Florida. That would be a disappointment. Southern ears are welcome to their thing, but I almost wish the Confederacy had worked out; they could have their own country down there, and I would be happy to move further North to accommodate that.

[frustrated_lefty]

64. The vast majority of the nation's domestic oil production, for starters.

[ajk2821]

65. Ronald Reagan

From California.

HW Bush from Ma.

Nixon from Ca.

The Koch brothers from Ks and went to school at MIT.

Joe McCarthy of Wisc

There are good and bad from every state.

[Uncle Joe]

81. Three of the infamous five were born and raised either in the North or California

William Rehnquist from Wisconsin

Antonin Gregory Scalia born in New Jersey and raised in New York.

Anthony Kennedy from Sacramento California

Clarence Thomas from Georgia

Sandra Day O'Connor born in Texas and raised in Arizona is the only one to come out and repudiate her own decision in Bush vs Gore.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandra_Day_O%27

ConnorSince retiring, O'Connor has reflected on her time on the Supreme Court by saying that she regrets the court hearing the Bush v. Gore case in 2000 because it "stirred up the public" and "gave the court a less-than-perfect reputation." The former justice told the Chicago Tribune that "Maybe the court should have said, 'We’re not going to take it, goodbye,’...It turned out the election authorities in Florida hadn’t done a real good job there and kind of messed it up. And probably the Supreme Court added to the problem at the end of the day.

There is no "probably" to it, they most assuredly did.

After being out of office, she also dissented against the disastrous Citizens United decision.

On January 26, 2010 O'Connor issued her own polite public dissent to the Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission decision on corporate political spending, telling law students that the court has created an unwelcome new path for wealthy interests to exert influence on judicial elections.

Too little, too late.

[Uncle Joe]

82. P.S. Of the Citizens United Decision 4 of the five were born and raised in the North or California

John Roberts from New York.

Samuel Alito from New Jersey.

Antonin Gregory Scalia born in New Jersey and raised in New York.

Anthony Kennedy from Sacramento California.

Clarence Thomas from Georgia.

[Marr]

165. They all owed their positions to a political party built on southern support.

No one's saying the south has a monopoly on right-wingers. But GW Bush put on his Texas act for a reason, after all.

[Uncle Joe]

166. I disagree, they all owed their positions to a party built on division, propaganda,

mass brain washing and no institution is more culpable in dividing and deceiving the American People than today's corporate media.

George Bush's "Texas act" wouldn't have worked without the group acquiescence of the corporate media along with that, while camouflaging his vast short comings for the most powerful job in the land.

Al Gore not truly being from or of Tennessee, but only being the product of a D.C. upbringing and the ridiculous mass perception that he actually claimed to have invented the Internet wouldn't have flown without the active participation of the so called "fourth estate" in brainwashing the American People with institutional wide, continuous slander, libel and that was only one ongoing, 24/7 lie out of multitudes promoted by them.

How much integrity did it take for the corporate media to actually give Gore credit for his revolutionary, legislative achievements instead of trashing him over it? Apparently too much.

As my post #85 points out, the U.S corporate media is totally headquartered in the North, the Lion's share being in New York with Pennsylvania and California also having a piece.

Ultimately that's where the decisions are made on how to present "reality" to the American People. You can promote the people's dreams and hopes, be an honest broker of information or you can manipulate the people magnifying their fears and prejudices.

The U.S. corporate media most assuredly took the low road, it's not the first time and it wasn't the last, but it was done in institutional wide concert and that's reality.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3052188

There is more, virtually all of the U.S. corporate media is headquartered in

Last edited Thu Jun 20, 2013, 01:42 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

New York, Pennsylvania or California, that includes News Corp. which owns FOX, Disney which owns ABC, the AP, CBS Corp, Time Warner, Comcast which has significant holdings of NBC and the Hearst Corporation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concentration_of_media_ownership

[Marr]

169. It's hard to argue with that.

I do think we've got plenty of regional differences, but it is indeed our corporate media that specializes in inserting a crowbar into the gaps and yanking. Our real divisions in this country are class/wealth based, not regional.

[Uncle Joe]

170. Peace to you, Marr.

[Uncle Joe]

85. There is more, virtually all of the U.S. corporate media is headquartered in

New York, Pennslyvania or California, that includes News Corp. which owns FOX, Disney which owns ABC, the AP, CBS Corp, Time Warner, Comcast which has significant holdings of NBC and the Hearst Corporation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concentration_of_media_ownership

[ChairmanAgnostic]

106. Reagan was born in Dixon Illinois.

[ajk2821]

110. Fine

Still a northern state.

[brewens]

78. NBA basketball? I'll take the Stanley Cup anyday. If they played an NBA final in my backyard, I'd

pull the shade!

[HooptieWagon]

79. Bush Family Fascists....oh wait, they're from Connecticut.

But lets not forget the contributions of the South in WW1 and 2. South supplied most of the Allies oil, Southern shipyards built a lot of ships, and a lot of soldiers from the South fought and died. Mny of the training facilities were in the south. Southern citizens bought war bonds, worked in factories and farms to supply the nation. If Allies only had the help from northern states, they'd probably have lost.

[Rex]

84. I don't care about this argument, it is futile.

It is for people that constantly dwell in the past.

[liberal_at_heart]

91. oh, Texas pecans are the best. I would also like to add Stevie Ray Vaughan.

And yes Tex-Mex is so good. Oh, my god I miss eating Tex-Mex.

[Gravitycollapse]

94. Lynyrd Skynyrd and Tom Petty are both terrible. Elvis stole his music from black artists.

Mike Malloy is raging douchebag. Football is a game where brainless idiots beat the shit out each other for obscene amounts of money.

LBJ sent tens of thousands of Americans to their death in Vietnam with the help of his war criminal buddy Robert S. McNamara.

I can continue if you'd like.

[ajk2821]

105. Let me summarize your posts

If I don't like it, it is crap.

[byeya]

125. Disagree with you about Elvis. He was greatly influenced by Dean Martin and his early Sun material

was as much C&W as it was R&B.
Agree with the rest and continue with my concurrence.

[Jamastiene]

96. southern DUers

or should we be hated too?

K&R. Thanks for trying, but most here would be fine if southern DUers left DU too, except they don't always know who we are.

[Tanuki]

97. To name a few:

(in no particular order and off the top of my head) Martin Luther King, Flannery O'Brien, Eudora Welty, John Lewis, James Clyburn, Bill Moyers, Melissa Harris Perry, Morris Dees, Julian Bond, Barbara Jordan, Michael Jordan, Woody Guthrie, Leadbelly, Levon Helm, Tennessee Williams, Natasha Trethewey, Sun Records, Patrick Henry, James Madison, James Monroe, Bill Monroe, Ralph Stanley, Muscle Shoals, Stax...
Jack Daniels...

[davidpdx]

99. I only make fun of Californians

Whoops, wrong thread.

[pinboy3niner]

108. And you're on our list...

[davidpdx]

111. The funny thing is I was born there

Right across the bay in fact.

[pinboy3niner]

112. I was born in Chicago, but rolled here when they tilted everything...

[davidpdx]

113. Well better a Niner fan than a Bears fan

[pinboy3niner]

114. Not a fan, actually (and besides, I'm in SoCal)

When we moved, my dad still followed the Sox but began following the Dodgers, too.

I followed for a while, but then lost interest.

Even when I attended USC I only went to one Trojan football game. And that was only because we had a student program for inner-city kids and we took them to see a game.

I do like the Buckeyes, though.

[Kolesar]

102. Rock phosphate for organic gardeners

I think they still mine phosphates in Florida.

[HooptieWagon]

138. Yes, they do. Its pretty destructive to the enviroment.

Originally, phosphate was mined in N Florida by hand using ex-slaves and rented prisoners under deplorable conditions. Then mechanization came in about 100 years ago, and they followed the phosphate vein south through Polk Co down into Charlotte Co. Port of Tampa was established for shipping phosphate. A much smaller phosphate port operated in Boca Grande, but its been closed for many years...a lot of ruins still there, though, along with remnants of old railway trestle bridge across Charlotte Harbor. These are strip mines, and the waste is just piled up in giant mountains. Run-off from rains goes into streams and rivers. Enviromental agencies try to keep runoff prevented, with mixed results. Its generally thought that much of the red tide algae blooms are do to phosphate runoff. .Its been better recently, at least compared to 60s and 70s.

[Chan790]

109. I could do without about 90% of those things.

About 50% are things I'd give good money to be purged of the existence of.

That's not an anti-south comment...that list largely consists of things I dislike.

[d_r]

117. a lot of great American literature

http://www.ageefilms.org/southern_books.html

Books, barbecue and bourbon.

[kentauros]

119. I support your thread, and your fine attempt at educating our fellow Liberals.

However (there's always one, right?)

I've learned from experience here that the haters are a highly irrational bunch, yet that's to be expected as hate is a highly irrational emotion.

We can, and should, attempt to educate them at every opportunity. It's just that for some the hate is so entrenched that we'll never make a dent, much less sway them to forgiveness or compassion. That aspect alone is the most perplexing to me as I always thought "bleeding heart liberal" was practically genetic for all Liberals. I've learned through DU that's no longer the case.

This Bleeding Heart Liberal still approves and recs your thread!

[Bonx]

126. Appreciate the effort, but I ignore the threads from small-minded people who hate the south. -nt

[ryan_cats]

127. Ann Richards? She was supposed to be a mean SOB.

Ann Richards? She was supposed to be a mean SOB. Not that there's anything wrong with that in the cage match that is politics but remember, she got beaten by George W Bush, R-Columbia.

[deathrind]

128. Hmmm.

We would have missed out on the whole civil war thing...

[LanternWaste]

134. Without the south, I'd sorely miss my friends and family.

Without the south, I'd sorely miss my friends and family... and that's enough for me. However, as we have posters who pretend to know who the nation is better off without, I'd better not give any names.


Many people would also have to find brand new regions to trivialize, brand new people to minimize, and brand new justifications to rationalize. That would be difficult work for simplistic minds.

[DainBramaged]

135. Right

Tell us how to get rid of Confederate flags and I'll listen......


Most of your list is stuff that is unimportant to our lives, and a speech does not make the South important.


When you can convince the citizens of the South to stop voting against their best interests, we'll also sit here and listen all day long, but the Old White GOP has a stranglehold on the South, and until they die off, I'd rather stay here in Sopranos' land any day...

[Proud Public Servant]

136. You can enjoy another country's culture

I'd have no problem with not having William Faulkner or zydeco be party of my country; I'd enjoy them anyway, just as I enjoy Gabriel Garcia Marquez or bossa nova.

But if I could have lived my life in a country that wasn't unduly controlled by Southern politicians? A place where George W. Bush, Newt Gingrich, Trent Lott, Tom Delay, Mitch McConnell, Ted Cruz, and a host of lesser (in every respect) lights never had any influence on the life of my body politic? I'd trade that for the loss of bragging rights over Elvis in a heartbeat. (And, no, I'd have no problem ceding the Clintons and the rest of the disproportionately-Southern DLC with them -- even founding DLCer Al Gore.)

[Lint Head]

140. I was born and raised in South Carolina the first State to secede from the Union. I left and stayed

away as a young man because I felt I was drowning in the racism and bigotry around me. I was afraid I would become just like the racists I hated. The only hope is for the youth to change things. The land is beautiful and there are some who are progressive. But they are marginalized and painted as socialists, communists and anti religious.

Carl Sandburg lived in N.C.
Zach Galifianakis is from N.C.
Jimmie Carter, Georgia
Little Richard, Macon GA.
Tennesse Williams
Harper Lee

Many good things come from the south.

[Bake]

141. Screw the teabaggers. We are ONE NATION.

East West North South. ONE NATION. With good people in every region.

Time to stop hatin'.



Bake

[arcane1]

144. You left out the best thing:

Me!!

[kentauros]

146. Well, then, there ya go!

Let's end the thread on that nice note

[LittleBlue]

145. Most of what you list, I wouldn't miss at all

- OutKast
- Lynyrd Skynyrd
- Pantera
- SEC football
- Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers

Really?

I could have gone my whole life without any of those.

[pinboy3niner]

157. The list barely scratches the surface

We'd lose things that are treasured--possibly even things that you treasure.

The point is that the notion of ridding ourselves of the troglodytes geographically is ludicrous because the geographic area is not limited to them. It's a good example of throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

[MrSlayer]

154. I like Tom Petty, Johnny Cash and pancakes.

I couldn't care less about any of the other stuff really. Wouldn't miss any of it.

[redqueen]

156. Thanks.

[opiate69]

168. Alton Brown.

Born in California, but set down roots in Georgia as a result of going to college there. And anyone with the kind of mind that could dream up a TV show consisting of Julia Childs meets Mr Wizard meets Monty Python is a treasure in my book.