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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums‘Chinese government managed to drain contents of four laptops Snowden brought to Hong Kong’
Mr. Snowden has denied giving China classified documents and said he had spoken only to journalists. But his public statements, directly and to reporters, have contained intelligence information of great interest to China.
Two Western intelligence experts, who worked for major government spy agencies, said they believed that the Chinese government had managed to drain the contents of the four laptops that Mr. Snowden said he brought to Hong Kong, and that he said were with him during his stay at a Hong Kong hotel.
If that were the case, they said, China would no longer need or want to have Mr. Snowden remain in Hong Kong.
............
In some instances, the Chinese news media made snide references to what it called the gap between how the United States portrayed itself, and what the United States practiced. Washington must be grinding its teeth because Snowdens revelations have almost overturned the image of the U.S. as the defender of a free Internet, Global Times, which often reflects the official point of view, wrote in an editorial.
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more:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/24/world/asia/china-said-to-have-made-call-to-let-leaker-depart.html?_r=0
Narkos
(1,185 posts)Downwinder
(12,869 posts)Narkos
(1,185 posts)cthulu2016
(10,960 posts)Somehow "Two Western intelligence experts, who worked for major government spy agencies" isn't doing much for me.
Bonus source-confidence points for the past-tense. "Worked."
Could be David Petreus.
Could be some guy with a blog who used to be a janitor at whatever Belgium calls its spy organization.
backscatter712
(26,355 posts)All I see are FAUX Noise style "Some people say..." insinuations.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)it might be true.
RobertEarl
(13,685 posts)Those computers were full of viruses and the Chinese kicked him out because of that. Now Chinese computers have American NSA viruses running wild in their country. Obama sure played that move well. Russia is next!
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)flamingdem
(39,313 posts)I think he's an idiot who got caught up by the likes of Greenwald and Assange.
He was manipulated into this act and was too naive to have an exit plan.
I'm still finding this hard to believe though. That means the whole thing in HK
was a setup.
Greenwald has some 'splainin to do as well as the HK authority.
An incredible web of lies and deceit.
pnwmom
(108,976 posts)Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)The theory being Snowden is actually a CIA plant, giving China and Russia a bunch of bogus information and viruses.
sibelian
(7,804 posts)Not really sure what the assertion deos other than make nasty feelings go away.
HipChick
(25,485 posts)jsr
(7,712 posts)The Chinese just used his password "Edward" to open his laptops and drained all the documents away.
Cali_Democrat
(30,439 posts)Well done, Hong Kong Eddie.
Well. Fucking. Done.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)He didn't have his lovely Wikileaks lawyer then when he was making faustian bargains.
I wonder just what was lost should this be true. It may be Psyops as well to pressure Russia
Monkie
(1,301 posts)really pathetic of the NYT, and quite sad that any "democrat" would be enjoying this.
and your "happy" "funny" jingoism is quite disgusting. hong kong eddie? thats something i would expect to see in a propaganda movie from the 1950's, you know, the "golden age" in the US when races where still segregated?
what next? you want people of asian origin on separate busses?
marions ghost
(19,841 posts)jingoistic movies & serials circa 1950's...(which some people seem stuck in):
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)Snowden, jeez
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)the Chinese drained the hard drives on 4 laptops that belong to Snowden?
Intelligence agents' jobs is to gather facts and evidence. It's absurd that any bona fide agent would go around spouting "beliefs" instead of info backed by factual knowledge.
I'll wait to see if any reliable source provides proof, first of all that Snowden took 4 laptops with him (Why do that instead of storing info on easily carried thumb drives or even removable gigabyte hard drives?), and secondly that China "drained" the laptops (again ridiculous-they would simply copy the files, not drain the drives).
I believe the government is collecting all U.S. citizen's phone call content. No proof, but I believe it, so it must be true.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)the Chinese held his life in their hands, the Chinese gave the word for him to leave.
The Chinese want what's on those laptops and he's a sitting duck.
Same with the Russians.
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)If they have proof, then show it. Otherwise they are behaving like rank amateurs. How embarassing for their agency and them.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)a PsyOp because the US is between a rock and a hard place.
The pressure has to be extreme for Russia > Cuba > Ecuador to not occur.
Snowden has a refugee status visa and he can move anywhere anyway.
Wikileaks does know a thing or two.
I hope this works for them, it's as true as it's not.
We just don't know what happened or who Snowden is for sure
JimDandy
(7,318 posts)or PsyOps, those "western" intelligence agencies are in trouble.
We'll just have to disagree until more info is available.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)but it's a rush job!
Does seem like Snowden took them by surprise by moving quickly.
He had the benefit of lots of pre-planning and Assange's lawyers.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)The unholy alliance
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)Snowden turns into a Hot Potato
China isn't going to respect his rights and they set him up at that hotel.
Was he awake the whole time? Did China know how to intimidate him?
Having worked at the NYT I'd say that this stinks of psy ops against Snowden but it's also
very likely to be true.
quote:
Two Western intelligence experts, who worked for major government spy agencies, said they believed that the Chinese government had managed to drain the contents of the four laptops that Mr. Snowden said he brought to Hong Kong, and that he said were with him during his stay at a Hong Kong hotel.
If that were the case, they said, China would no longer need or want to have Mr. Snowden remain in Hong Kong.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Monkie
(1,301 posts)seriously, how jingoistic can one be?
"you" are neck deep in the swamp, there is NO high ground the US or any citizen of the US can stand on when commenting on the affairs of other nations on any subject.
if "those days" existed they are long gone.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)I lived there for 9 months and had to buy a VPN service and even with that it still was spotty. People could still get around the great firewall of China and many of my students had a good idea what was going on in the world as well as the actions of their own country.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)Not likely.
And two intelligence officers say they believe... How vague can they be? Seems like this is another attempt to make Snowden look like an idiot and discredit him.
IDemo
(16,926 posts)and carefully Xeroxed.
cui bono
(19,926 posts)I xeroxed my face as a teen but I didn't realize it would drain it! Mystery solved.
madville
(7,408 posts)When a few flash drives would fit in one's pocket? Or a couple of external hard drives? Why carry around four laptops?
randome
(34,845 posts)Maybe he simply made off with some NSA equipment he could get his hands on.
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jsr
(7,712 posts)Snowden has perhaps more than 200 sensitive documents, Sen. Dianne Feinstein, chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, said on CBS' "Face the Nation."
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)I don't see why it is so improbable that he has many more documents that Feinstein has said. I imagine he has quite a bit of information packed on those drives.
Pale Blue Dot
(16,831 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)That's obviously, not foolproof, as this demonstrates (it's ultimately not a good strategy to try to limit clients' actions with data they already have), but it can make sneaking big dumps of documents out harder. The fact that Iraq's situation made that level of security impractical made life easier for Manning, for instance.
mhatrw
(10,786 posts)Recursion
(56,582 posts)I see the NYT is always on the job...
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)They aren't being literal y'know
Recursion
(56,582 posts)And not a particularly good one. That makes it sound like the data is now no longer on the four laptops.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)They're not going to do geek speak to keep some people happy
Recursion
(56,582 posts)The media has a bad habit of believing what people claiming to be experts tell them. After misunderstanding it.
flamingdem
(39,313 posts)how conveeenient!
frylock
(34,825 posts)Catherina
(35,568 posts)davidpdx
(22,000 posts)we don't know who has how much of the information nor what it is. If it is on a laptop it is unsecured data.
Babel_17
(5,400 posts)Has it come to this, The New York Times? Intelligence experts don't reveal what they have reason to think, but rather their beliefs?
Ask them what they believe is the future of the USA, what they believe is the future of humanity.
Then ask them about their reasoned opinions thereof.
Guess what, it would be no surprise that these experts think Snowden is a stinking traitor. Thus they believe the worst. But The New York Times has an obligation to ask them for a basis for their belief.
Unless they are just repeating talking points, then they are doing a fine job.
This is regardless of what turns out to be the case. The New York Times, once again, is all too eager to be a partner of whoever is in power in Washington.
Berlum
(7,044 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)NoPasaran
(17,291 posts)So in addition to everything else this fucker had too much carry on luggage?
jberryhill
(62,444 posts)sibelian
(7,804 posts)Did they siphon the information out through their opium pipes?
Skip Intro
(19,768 posts)cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
ConcernedCanuk
(13,509 posts).
.
.
They'll bomb the shit out of any country they feel like.
Hasn't anyone noticed??
CC
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
kentuck
(111,078 posts)Russians think the Chinese got something they did not and Chinese think the Russia might have gotten something they did not???? Americans think both of them got something. It's like liar's poker....
Pale Blue Dot
(16,831 posts)Are the Chinese that stupid?
Marrah_G
(28,581 posts)ProSense
(116,464 posts)http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023083768
DevonRex
(22,541 posts)They probably wiped them clean unless it was to their benefit that he give other content to Russia. If Russia thinks Greenwald has copies he needs to be looking over his shoulder.