What White People Don't Understand About Rachel Jeantel

[HipChick]

A predominantly white jury is not going to like Rachel Jeantel. Let's just be real here.

The 19-year-old Miami native is an easy target for obvious, yet shallow reasons. But let's not forget why she's actually on the stand in George Zimmerman's second degree murder trial. Rachel was the last person to speak to a living, breathing Trayvon Martin. The guilt, shame and sorrow she must feel is something most of us will never be able to comprehend. You could hear it in her voice, see it in her jittery body language. She is feeling the wrath of this highly publicized case.

Rachel was thrown head first into this murder story, unwillingly. And although she had repeatedly said she did not want to be a witness, did not even want to believe she was the last person Trayvon spoke to, Rachel took the stand for all the right reasons. She was asked to by the family of her deceased friend and feeling part of the burden for his death, she wanted to help.

Rachel was raw, emotional, aggressive and hostile, and she was unapologetically herself.

And if the 5 white jurors (excluding the 1 Latina) are like most white people I know, they are unfortunately not going to like Rachel. They won't understand her, especially not her defensive nature, and this will unfortunately work against her. Even though it shouldn't.

<snip>

Less intelligent and more confused.

Less intelligent because of the "language barrier" and more confused because of the lawyers' failure to understand who Rachel is, where she comes from, what kind of life she lives.

It seems the middle-aged white men on both sides of this case are totally unaware of what Rachel's life is like - a 19-year-old high school student of Haitian descent who knows nothing more than the few block radius she has grown up in. The cultural differences here are exponential.



Read more: http://globalgrind.com/news/what-white-people-dont-understand-about-rachel-jeantel-trayvon-martin-blog#ixzz2XSQAkpOz

[geckosfeet]

1. Jury selection is critical - a 6 woman (5 white) jury is not favorable to Rachel's experience.

[darkangel218]

2. The prosecution had the chance to talk to her.

They made a mistake by calling her as a witness. She did more damage than good, unfortunately.

[appacom]

8. No, she didn't. She came off as authentic, consistent and truthful about

the key issues. Trayvon was stalked, followed, accosted and killed by Zimmerman. Her explanations for her lies were reasonable, and quite understandable under the circumstances. Commentators can twist her words all they want; the defense attorney tried to play "rope a dope" with her (even implied she was on calming drugs or was coached). I wanted to jump through the tv and kick his ass when he asked if she was all right, given the difference in today's demeanor.


Call her a dumb, or unintelligent witness all you want, but she did her job - she established Zimm erman as an aggressive stalker despite the defense attorney's best efforts. He made a classic white boy mistake - he underestimated her ability to think because she wasn't "articulate."

[darkangel218]

13. BS. She impeached herself. She gave inconsistent answers.

I don't think shes "dumb". That's how she grew up, this is the language she's accustomed to. Not her fault.
That being said, the prosecution should not have called her as witness.

[aquart]

16. She gave human answers. She broke my heart.

[flamingdem]

28. me too. I was teary. She was his bestie!! nt

[freshwest]

43. +1

[JDPriestly]

18. The women on the jury may not create to her contradictions in the

same way men would. That is especially true of Southern women. I don't know how Southern the women on that jury are, but traditional women have a different way of communicating than do men.

So while what the prosecutor was trying to achieve is obvious, how that will affect the jury is not.

Some of the women on the jury may see her as someone with whom they have a lot of sympathy. They may judge her demeanor very differently than a man would.

I'd have to see the testimony to be able to judge.
The women on the jury might see her as brave and might think she had good reason to be defensive and hostile. You might be surprised.

The problem with the letter that she did not write is a different matter. Maybe the prosecutor needs to find and call to the stand the person who wrote the letter so that person can testify as to the origin of the letter and the circumstances under which it was written. Depends on the facts.

[appacom]

19. You really don't get it, do you?

Inconsistent answers? She answered, in each case, questions she was specifically asked. She further explained her answers, but she didn't change them.

[darkangel218]

20. She did change them several times.

As you shall see the assholes from defense bringing them up.

[CreekDog]

31. are you for real?

post after post you either self delete here and those that survive are riddled with mistakes.

if you are so convinced that ruins your credibility, why do you keep posting?

furthermore, i find it odd that you consistently make mistakes spelling little words and yet use and spell correctly, the big ones.

what's up with that?

[darkangel218]

38. This is not about me, im not the one on the witness stand.

Keep your personal attacks in the gungeon. This issue is bigger than your adversity towards me.

[NoodleyAppendage]

65. Agreed. Their "wonder" witness has been a flop. n/t

J

[Apophis]

67. Wow.

[pacalo]

30. Granted, she had enunciation issues but I thought overall she was a good witness.

She was genuine; never more so when she meekly, but with emotion, told West, "Don't you understand how I feel?" as he continued to badger her about lying about the reason she didn't attend the funeral. As she said, she learned about Trayvon's death on the news, she had been the last person to talk to him, & she said that she didn't want to see the body, as she shook her head saying, no, no, no. I believed her. Putting those facts together, maybe she felt awkward about her role that night & felt shame that she didn't go to the funeral, &, as an inexperienced young person, thought creating a white lie (she "went to the hospital&quot was the solution for her.

I thought the comments between Trayvon & her about Zimmerman possibly being a rapist helped the prosecution (depending on how insightful the six jurors are). Wasn't that based on the fact that Zimmerman continued to stare at Trayvon? Staring at a person to the extent that Zimmerman was probably doing is an act of aggression, which is why it's considered impolite. It implies that Zimmerman was looking for trouble.

[sad-cafe]

51. yup

she did fine

[pnwmom]

42. I didn't see her inconsistent statements as lying. She told different details to different people

at different times. So what if she didn't tell all the same details to Trayvon's mother that she may have told someone else? Memory tends to come out in fits and starts, and that's what happened to her

[rhett o rick]

72. It would have looked worse if they didnt call her. The defense would have loved that.

They would point out to the jury that the prosecution was afraid of her testimony.

[malaise]

3. Yep

Rec

[Nye Bevan]

4. "The cultural differences here are exponential".

That's not what "exponential" means.

[justiceischeap]

5. Then again, a 6 woman jury may feel sympathetic towards Rachel

because she was being bullied by the defense attorney and they may even admire the way she stood up for herself on the stand.

[hrmjustin]

14. That was my thought as well.

By the way congrats on almost 10000 posts.

[justiceischeap]

24. You got me afraid to make anymore posts after pointing out how close I am

to 10,000! Now, I'm even closer.

[hrmjustin]

25. Sorry! You can do what I did and do a lounge thread on it.

Whatever you do don't waste it on a response to me on this thread.

[justiceischeap]

32. Whew! I posted in the Photography group.

The pressure is now off.

Thanks again for pointing out how close I was.

[hrmjustin]

50. Your welcome!

[Mr.Bill]

22. I see that, too. n/t

[yardwork]

62. This white mom agrees.

[DrDan]

6. this doesn't excuse the conflicting testimony

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. Mebbe it is my multicultural experience

But I felt she was a decent witness.

Mind you, working class Jew, who immigrated (let alone I know the case) has like zero chance to get on that jury.

[IphengeniaBlumgarten]

10. white female 74 year old native-born here

I liked Rachel pretty well. I thought she was believable and felt she stood up well to all the badgering she got from the defense attorney. She may not be real articulate or read cursive, but I thought she was actually a pretty good witness.

[DesertFlower]

15. white 72 year old woman born here too.

i liked rachel too. i felt sorry for her. i understood why she lied about why she didn't go to the wake. i'm old enough and secure enough to say "i wanted to remember him the way he was".

[pacalo]

37. And being an inexperienced young person, she thought telling a white lie would be

more understandable to those who knew Trayvon than saying how she really felt. I think she was able to convey that it was no more than a white lie (something that adults do all the time to spare feelings) & she certainly came across as genuine, so when West continued to badger her on that point, I don't think he succeeded in destroying her credibility.

[DesertFlower]

26. so true. i worked in the legal field

for many years. they don't like having people with too much knowledge on juries.

[pacalo]

41. Were you as unimpressed with the jury pool as I was? From what I heard, I thought

the prosecutor should have insisted that they interview more of the jury pool.

[JI7]

9. there have been some white people who get her, i think it's a race and class thing

i don't know about these jurors. but to me it seemed especially white women were kind of sympathetic and understanding of her.

[The empressof all]

11. I am white like snow (well maybe trampled snow). I totally understood her.

I felt she was sympathetic and I felt so bad for her for both her pain at the loss of her friend and her obvious feelings of guilt and remorse over not having done something else in response to that call. But I also felt she handled herself beautifully with the shameful Defense interrogation. She's a 19 year old girl in a situation that she never expected to be in. I'm honestly not sure I even understand what the problem is that people seem to be having with the way she presents herself. I just don't get it.

[Zoeisright]

71. Me too.

I couldn't be any whiter or blonder. I get it and think she did just fine.

But I am simply appalled at the racism in this country. It's alive and well and thriving, mostly practiced by ignorant old women.

[KT2000]

12. the defense lawyer knows

who she is and how to get her confused.
Yesterday he "did not get" her reference to 48 hours. But he most likely did. He used the opportunity to laugh at her because she had given him a valid reason for not contacting anyone.
She knew the experience in chronological order - he purposely drilled her about events out or order.
He knows well that teens text and made it strange that someone else posed as Rachel to sent a text to Trayvon.
Most of the time when he said he did not understand her, he did - or should have.

The lawyer is doing everything he can to make her look less intelligent so she can't be believed because she is not coming across as a liar.


I wish the prosecutor would point out that her mother was out of the country and Rachel was dealing with all of this alone.

[Maximumnegro]

17. Interesting gender issues

with women vocalizing their empathy and men being like 'she ruined it'. Says a lot.

[LittleBlue]

21. I saw plenty of black folks on twitter bashing her

"Black twitter", as it's known, absolutely destroyed her. Black women, too. I could feel the shame and disappointment through the screen.

Personally I think this is a case where people feel a very important issue rested on one person's shoulders. People will naturally feel disappointed after a performance like that.

[pintobean]

23. As a white male

am I allowed to like her, understand her heartbreak and compassion,understand her reluctance to be there, yet think she was not a good witness for the state? I'm just wondering why race and gender have to play a roll here.

[CreekDog]

46. you're asking us to think that the Zimmerman trial not consider race?

you're seriously asking people to discount or not think that racism exists in this context?

that's what you're asking?

pintobean for the defense.

[pintobean]

49. Where have you been?

You haven't mischaracterized one of my posts in quite some time. Since Meta, I think. I thought that maybe you were trying to be good because you're so close to five.

[LittleBlue]

59. He's pulling a blatant strawman on this one

From your assertion that a reasonable person could think she's a bad witness, to his mischaracterization that you're actually saying race doesn't play a part in this trial.

Typical Creekdog nonsense.

[Hissyspit]

27. Yes, plenty of people here seem to confuse the message with the messenger

deliberately or not, a shallow thing.

[kelliekat44]

29. It's almost like Rachel is on trial for murdering Trayvon by talking on the cell phone. Both sides

are dissing her...but I like that she disses right back. She is criticized for disrespecting the attorneys but little criticism about how horrid and condescending they are to her and her heritage.

[freshwest]

47. Dissing right back at those who are dissing her. They need to learn, but they are incapable of it.

The shallowness of the complaints say a hell of lot more about the ones complaining than anything she is doing.

She's genuine, grieving and within her rights to be angry or defensive surrounded by people whose agendas are not justice or equal treatement under the law.

[AFJROTCcadetEcho]

33. the death penalty should be abolished

Even though she committed a heinous crime the death penalty is an old relic of the past that has no place in the 21st century.

[AtheistCrusader]

39. Whut?

[Captain Stern]

45. Settle down....

...while some folks may not have liked Rachel's testimony, I don't think anyone has gone as far to suggest she be executed.


yeah, i know you probably posted this in the wrong thread. just giving you a hard time.

[H2O Man]

34. Darned white people!

I think this is a loaded diaper.

[antigone382]

68. H2O Man, I honestly don't understand the responses I have seen from you today.

Over the years I have seen you post on DU, you have earned my respect. I have generally known you to be a person both knowledgeable and wise about issues of disparity and racism in the U.S. Yet, in this and another thread you have dismissed issues of race, gender, privilege, and perspective surrounding this young woman, as described in articles that I found very well-written and insightful.

That may sound like a judgment, but I am not stating that you are right or wrong to be responding this way. I simply want to understand more about where you are coming from. I have not closely followed the Trayvon Martin case in the last few weeks, nor did I watch the testimony of Rachel, although I have read several accounts of it. I don't presume to know what your observations of her testimony might have been (assuming you watched it, as I infer from your replies today), and if you have expressed them in more detail on DU I have not seen them. My expectation is that you would have compassion for a nineteen-year-old who has experienced a tremendous trauma and been forced into the national spotlight, and there subject to the sorts of judgments typically assigned to her race and gender. If you have reason to suspend such compassion, I would like to better understand why.

[H2O Man]

70. I have nothing

but respect for the young lady, Rachel, and think she was a powerful witness. But I also think that several of the OPs here are pathetic. Having respect for Rachel does not mandate me to approve of every article that people write that expresses some support of her, but that mixes in the authors' hand-wringing and/or personal biases. I'm not really surprised that a few people encounter great difficulty in making that distinction, though I would think you would have understood the difference.

[DevonRex]

69. I think that was the mindset the defense was going for in jury selection.

Obviously their strategy would play better to a person like that. Someone who can't relate or who is prejudiced for whatever reason. Could just be that ignorance of a culture could cause a person to misinterpret things to mean the other person is dumb.

Hopefully they weren't as successful in jury selection as they think they were. Personally, I was offended as a woman by how he treated her. And I was offended by his racist insinuations and mocking her. She is not dumb by any means. In fact, she has a special talent with days, dates and times that came out quite clearly.

[frazzled]

35. I so disagree with you

I am a white person (and a woman), and I found Rachel's testimony to be compelling, consistent, and strong. I could actually relate to her, or at least to her as a teenager.

Let's not racially profile what all white people think.

Even if they thought she was diffident or defensive, even if they didn't understand her, that doesn't mean they didn't believe what she said.

And let's also remember that she is not the total crux of this trial. There's a dead boy; there was someone with a gun and someone without a gun; there are police tapes; there were three other "ear" witnesses; there are tons of conflicting statements by Zimmerman that have not yet been addressed.

For disclosure's sake: I am a white woman who spent a lot of time tutoring kids, many of whom were a lot like Rachel, in an inner-city public school. So maybe I'm just more familiar with her style and background.

I'm far less familiar with gung-ho vigilante gun culture than I am with the Rachels of the world. I have to admit I am biased against Zimmerman, and have been since the beginning. And not because he is Hispanic.

[pnwmom]

36. People here have criticized her for being "dumb." But I think the dumb one

was the prosecutor who didn't seem to know how to question her. For example, he asked this young woman (for whom English is a second or third language) a question using the word "derogatory." She stared at him blankly -- as if she had no idea what he'd just asked her -- and then said "yes." I think he was probably going for a "no," but maybe I was the one to misunderstand what he was asking.

Anyway, if he wanted better answers from her, he should have worded his questions clearly and simply. If the few minutes I was watching were any example, he could have done better job.

[zentrum]

40. Completely agree with you

This witness will be seen through white jury prejudices, stereotypes and fears.

I don't beleive she helped Trayvon through no fault of her own.
Yes--the DA failed here--failed Trayvon and her.

I predict, sadly--a hung jury: No conviction.

[BronxBoy]

44. I feel bad for her....

Ms Jeantel has obviously been thrust into a time and place that she didn't want and was not prepared to be. Can you imagine if a run of the mill phone call landed you in a situation like this?: A good friend dead and you a thrust into a media shitstorm. How would you react? Would you be coherent? Would you be a good witness? Who knows? I don't know if she has hurt or helped the case....No one really knows except for the folks sitting on that jury. I can only hope that they would see what I would want them to see but that is the case for folks on both sides of this case.

What I find interesting and saddening is that so many people are tearing this young girl apart for her testimony while ignoring an extremely ironic fact. Ms. Jeantel did not want to be here. She probably will always remember that phone call for the rest of her life. She is not "media pretty" or "articulate" as a lot of folks would choose to define it. And unfortunately, "it is what it is" in our system of jurisprudence whether we like it or not.

I just find it sad that the people willing to tear down this young lady, to mock her speech and in some cases to call her stupid will not discuss one salient fact before passing judgement on her: that the man who pulled the trigger on that fateful night that Trayvon Martin lost his life will probably not subject himself to the same public scrutiny that MS Jeantel has undergone. George Zimmerman will probably not take the stand. He will not have to explain under the glare and scrutiny of the public and media why he did what he did. He will probably not have to have his testimony parsed ad infiniteum about what he meant or about inconsistencies in what he said then versus what he is saying now. He will not have his intelligence questioned or asked about racial inferences in his statements.

And under our legal system, he has that right. I get it. But if Mr. Zimmerman felt that he had the absolute justification to take that young man's life then he should be able to go before the microscope of public scrutiny and say why he had the justification. And if we are going to castigate Ms Jeantel for not performing appropriately (at least according to some quarters) under the harsh spotlight of a major media trial, then we damn should ask why Mr. Zimmerman doesn't do the same.

Until then, in my book at least and whether she has been a good witness or not, she has a hell of a lot more courage that Mr. Zimmerman or his family has ever displayed.

[tavernier]

48. When I was sixteen my boyfriend

died in a car accident. I SO badly did NOT want to go to the funeral; I was devastated, an emotional mess. It was not just my first love, but the first death experience of my young life. I can completely sympathize with Rachel and believe her reasons for avoiding the wake and the trial; she was thoroughly traumatized and probably still is. It took me years to get past my trauma.

[riverwalker]

52. "creepy" "pervert" "stalking"

Her most powerful words of how Trayvon described the guy following him.
Doesn't matter if said by Rachel Jeantel or Claire Huxtable or Dame Judith Dench.

CREEPY. STALKING. PERVERT.

[displacedtexan]

63. Totally!

Have you noticed that some people want us to believe that it's perfectly normal for a grown man to chase a kid down dark paths during a rain storm?

I'd think he was a pervert, too!

[elfin]

53. Jury selection doomed the prosecution

Despite the "joke" of defense opening, having Rachel be the so far main witness plays into unwarranted stereotypes to create enough of an atmosphere to manage a not beyond a reasonable doubt conclusion. Given the history of Florida, they may have overreached in the charge.

He is lucky I am not on that jury.

I like Rachel and worry that her worst fears of uncontrolled attention are coming true, given that she tried to duck involvement for very cogent reasons IMO.

[Brigid]

55. Buh bye!

[still_one]

56. Get lost racist

[MineralMan]

57. NO!

[GeorgeGist]

58. Isn't that what racism is all about ...

FEAR BORN OF WILLFUL IGNORANCE.

[mountain grammy]

60. white, female, 65... I believed her and felt nothing but sympathy. I like the girl.

[Jenoch]

61. She seemed genuine on the witness stand.

I did not see a language barrier although I did not see all of her testimony

[NoodleyAppendage]

64. Objectively, she comes off as a bit "slow"...and that has nothing to do with race.

Her presentation, however, might work to the prosecution's favor and help explain way her repeated perjury.

All I can say is if she's the best witness that the prosecution has in this case, then the case might be in serious trouble.

J

[DevonRex]

66. Defense attorney's mistake? Bullying., intimidating and mocking her.

Using blatant trickery to distract and confuse her over 2 days. It was obvious the minute he began to stand up when objecting and remained standing up. The judge had to chide him. Then the long list of phone calls that he read one by one and asked questions about, as if she'd know which 30-second call it was when Trayvon said something or where George was at 6:51:24-6:51:46. Or how to describe the sound of feet on wet grass. And the Jude chided him again.

I'm a woman and a mother. She's a big girl. But I wanted to wrap my arms around her and yell at him to stop it. I felt pride when she stood up to him. As a woman. So I think what he did erased the race issue. I'm white, but I do admit to being sensitive to people being bullied. I hate it. I'm also sensitive to his insinuations about race and intelligence and violence. That really pissed me off.

So, seems to me that George chose a team who thinks like he does. They might have been able to choose jurors just like them, too. I didn't see who their jury consultant was. We need to find that out, find out their statistics.

[mike_c]

73. I'm conflicted about this....

Disclosure: I'm a 58 year old white academic. I have spent the better part of my life either educating myself or educating others. I left a lower middle class family as a teenager, so I've had no help from that quarter, although I certainly acknowledge that cultural privilege allowed me access that is more difficult for some. I have not watched any of the Zimmerman trial-- I don't do TV-- so I haven't seen or listened to Ms. Jeantel. But as I understand the "cultural difference" you're discussing, it expressed itself primarily through uneducated responses to questions, and that's where my conflict arises. There are many reasons that people remain undereducated-- poverty, social inequity, and disrespect for intellectualism are a few-- but all of these are things we need to overcome, not things we should use to excuse ignorance.

I hope that if those white jurors didn't like Ms. Jeantel's bearing and testimony, that they see her as an example of how far short we still fall in our efforts to enlighten the world through education.

[zeeland]

74. I'm a white woman and understood her with little problem.

The defense attorney was condescending and smug. I thought she showed great restraint
and didn't let him intimidate her. Her story remained consistent regardless how many times he asked the same question over and over trying to reword it to confuse her.

Rachel did not appear as if she had been prepped by the prosecution that also
worked in her favor.