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redgreenandblue

(2,088 posts)
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 01:41 PM Jun 2013

I find it beyond a reasonable doubt that Trayvon Martin was simply walking down the road...

...minding his own business and not looking to start a confrontation with a stranger. From this it follows that the blame for the events that lead to his death rests fully with George Zimmermann. IMO the only open question is whether Zimmermann is guilty of voluntary manslaughter, second degree murder or first degree murder.

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I find it beyond a reasonable doubt that Trayvon Martin was simply walking down the road... (Original Post) redgreenandblue Jun 2013 OP
Zimmerman is guilty of one of those things, imho. Do we know the exact charges/lesser charges?... Little Star Jun 2013 #1
I've said time and time again that I think he should go down for voluntary manslaughter. LAGC Jun 2013 #2
I could just as easily believe first degree murder as manslaughter. yardwork Jun 2013 #7
kick burnodo Jun 2013 #3
as I understand it KT2000 Jun 2013 #4
Or M found and attacked Z, which is what Z claims Recursion Jun 2013 #9
according to Rachel n/t KT2000 Jun 2013 #14
when i was younger MFM008 Jun 2013 #5
I agree. yardwork Jun 2013 #6
Well, then, you would be an awful juror (nt) Recursion Jun 2013 #8
If you find that scenario unbelievable, how about this. cheyanne Jun 2013 #10
Exactly -- and the prosecution should be hammering home that point. AngryOldDem Jun 2013 #11
Maybe Z beat himself up like this guy chowder66 Jun 2013 #12
What did Treyvon do wrong? He was on the phone. vanlassie Jun 2013 #13

Little Star

(17,055 posts)
1. Zimmerman is guilty of one of those things, imho. Do we know the exact charges/lesser charges?...
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 01:48 PM
Jun 2013

He needs to do some time for his actions. If he gets off scott-free Trayvon/Trayvon's family get no justice.

LAGC

(5,330 posts)
2. I've said time and time again that I think he should go down for voluntary manslaughter.
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 01:55 PM
Jun 2013

Second-degree murder I think is a stretch -- I don't think he intended to kill Trayvon that night, but he definitely went out of his way to provoke a confrontation. And I certainly don't blame Trayvon for fighting back once cornered.

You can't provoke someone into a fight and then claim self-defense when they react accordingly.

That much is certain.

yardwork

(61,418 posts)
7. I could just as easily believe first degree murder as manslaughter.
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:09 PM
Jun 2013

Zimmerman stalked the kid. He got out of his vehicle, armed with a gun, and ended up shooting a teenager he had profiled as a "punk." Sounds premeditated to me.

I could go with second degree murder. Gives Zimmerman all the benefit of the doubt that he deserves.

KT2000

(20,544 posts)
4. as I understand it
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:00 PM
Jun 2013

Trayvon tried to lose Zimmerman but Z found him again. What is Trayvon supposed to think? He was being stalked by a weirdo.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
9. Or M found and attacked Z, which is what Z claims
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:12 PM
Jun 2013

If these DU crystal balls people claim to have really worked, there are much more profitable purposes they could be turned to.

MFM008

(19,782 posts)
5. when i was younger
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:06 PM
Jun 2013

I would leave the house and walk to the local 711 sometimes midnight about 20 minutes away, I do see what Martin did as possible.

cheyanne

(733 posts)
10. If you find that scenario unbelievable, how about this.
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:13 PM
Jun 2013

Let's turn your version around; it's the same on the defense's side: Martin does not go home and then circles back to where he saw Zimmerman.

I think that raises a reasonable doubt.

There is other evidence that will be weighed in the balance.

The charge is murder 2 and defense is self-defense, both of which have very particular definitions.

lDon't ask the law to do what it can not do: solve social problems.

AngryOldDem

(14,061 posts)
11. Exactly -- and the prosecution should be hammering home that point.
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 02:25 PM
Jun 2013

Zimmerman was clearly looking for a fight that night, and his actions up to that point (what with calling the cops for all sorts of "suspicious" -- but unfounded -- activity all the time, and looking to be the big hero man) show a pattern of this. Wannabe Cop Syndrome.

People need to ask themselves what would a reasonable person do in Trayvon's situation? You're walking at a place where you have EVERY right to be, at night, and all of a sudden you are being menaced by a total stranger. He defended himself, and wound up dead because Zimmerman escalated the situation.

The 911 tape of the dispatcher telling Zimmerman to back off should be played on a fucking, endless loop. If he had only listened, most likely Travyon would still be alive. Backing off is what a reasonable and prudent person should/would have done.

He's guilty of whatever charge fits this crime but I'm afraid that the way this seems to be going he'll get off virtually scot-free.

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