Dear Congress and Mr. President, You seem confused. Here, let me help you.

[Scuba]

[Little Star]

1. k&r

[bigwillq]

2. SOS!!

Stay outta Syria!

K and R

[Ohio Joe]

3. heh, that is pretty funny - nt

[warrant46]

4. Wow

[FirstLight]

5. Fuckin-A!

that's quite perfect actually...

who's the GAPC though? hafta look them up

[Puzzledtraveller]

6. So simple, yet sooo hard, for them

[WillyT]

7. K & R !!!

[FiveGoodMen]

8. Amen!

[Junkdrawer]

9. K&R

[forestpath]

10. K&R

[zeemike]

11. Sometimes simple teaching aids like that are effective.

I wish they would take that to the flore of the house and senate.

[Phlem]

12. K&R!

[cash__whatiwant]

13. yes!! but...

Great american patriot coalition?

[whatchamacallit]

14. Considering their real constituents are the MIC and investors

they think Syria is their job.

[DeSwiss]

15. This is why I love the internets....

- K&R

[grahamhgreen]

16. Shouldn't that say "Little 'Merica" on the right? ;)

[Akoto]

17. Okay, I'll be the one to go against the grain a lil bit.

Stay out of Syria? Yes, if you mean a 'boots on the ground, guns in our hands' type of situation.

If you mean stay out of Syria as in 'let's turn a blind eye to innocents being killed en masse with chemical weapons,' then I can't agree. There can be no hope of ever becoming a nation that's good and just if we would look away from the circumstance of people dying such horrific deaths. I don't know who fired the missiles, but somebody did, and I think we should find out and throw international law at them. Yes, even if it was us, as some conspiracy theorists surmise.

[truedelphi]

18. As far as looking into evil situations and having

An accounting being made, "even if it is us," you need to stop and think about it really hard.

Who was behind My Lai?

Who was behind blowing up the dikes that enabled the Vietnamese rural peasants to survive? Who was in charge of seeing that millions of tons of Agent Orange were drenching the countryside of Vietnam so that the rain forest of that country was defoliated. And why was so much white phosphorous and napalm used against the Vietnamese people?

When the war in Vietnam ended, which nation stood firmly with Pol Pot of Cambodia, and against the nations who went to the UN and tried to have him stopped?

And who set up the School of the Americas, to help teach the Death Squads of Central America how to act as death squads?

Whose military went into Panama, killing two to five thousand civilians, simply because the Bush Crime Family was angry at their partner in crime, Noriega?

Who decided to use depleted uranium in the NATO action in Serbia? And then allowed for depleted uranium to be used in the war against the people of Iraq and Afghanistan?

The murder and atrocities committed by our nation since 1960 have affected millions of people. In Vietnam alone, the count was six million killed outright, wounded or left homeless.

If you think maybe we should try and have the UN get Assad and the leaders of the rebels to sit down and broker peace, I am all for it.

But our nation should be the last nation on earth that attempts to "set the record straight" and cause even more carnage in order to avenge the original carnage.

[Akoto]

21. Do you believe that, due to those past atrocities, we should not try to do the right thing here?

I do not believe, nor have I ever, that the mistakes of the past should forever bind us. What was the past doesn't have to be the future.

Like or not, we're still one of the most influential powers on the planet. We're also dealing with international laws some of Earth's craziest rulers haven't dared to challenge. We are involved when laws we adhere to in modern times are violated.

I don't support troops on the ground, nor do I support any other kind of attack. It's my belief that this will further inflame the situation. I'll reiterate my belief that we should instead do everything in our power to find solid proof on who fired those missiles, and then hold them accountable according to the international laws on use of chemical weapons of mass destruction. Yes, again, even if we had some hand in it (which I don't believe we did; I lack the conspiracy theory gene).

PS: If it was Assad who fired those missiles, then I believe the idea of him sitting down with the rebels under UN mediation is a dream. He'd have committed a blatant violation of international law, inflicting horrific deaths upon over a thousand of his own citizens, without even bothering to cover it up. I think diplomacy mode is way behind him in that scenario, favoring instead survival mode.

[truedelphi]

26. My response to yoou is this one: Do you want our nation to remain

Committed to being an oligarchy, with only the military, Big Bankers, Big Agriculture, Big Insurance and Big Privatization interests to continue to flourish while the middle class remains imperiled?

You can't have it both ways. The time is now to choose empire or democracy.

One reason that so many here are for us "setting the record straight" on Assad is two fold.

One is the massive psychological compulsion of people who are soft from all the crap food they are eating, and the lack of exercise and real meaning in their lives to project the "evil" that is inside each one of us outward to Assad. This need to be "heroic" at the expense of some other "foreign" group has been well documented by master human psychological analyst Carl Jung. The need is further fueled by the fact that most people in the USA have never seen the results of war. We were not bombed on the mainland during World War II. You have to go back to the days of the Civil War, to have any Americans affected by war's ravages. And of course, no survivors of that era are alive now.

Like radio show host, Caroline Casey, I find I can be a "pro-war convert" after one visit to McDonald's. That crap feeds nothing except the negative aspect of our biological machinery.

The second reason is that few here on DU have spent time looking, I mean really looking at the remains of the casualties of our wars. Do you really think the little kiddies who were burned by our napalm in Vietnam, or blown to smithereens by our missile s in Iraq, look all that much more pleasant than the civilians killed allegedly by Assad?

Death is death, and it seems very strange to me that everyone supporting this new military adventure can support it knowing that we sold chemical weapons to Saddam Hussein and had him use them on the Kurds, as we thought that action would help in the conflict of Iraq vs. Iran. I am also rather sure that some twenty years from now, we will find out that our CIA was plenty involve with this sarin massacre.

[noiretextatique]

22. we have our own problems

that congress has repeatedly failed to address, and innocents are suffering here because of their failure/inaction/disregard/indifference. we also have people who violated international law walking around free and collecting government pensions.

[B Calm]

19. We have bridges falling down and they want to blow our tax dollars

on more war.

[Enthusiast]

20. K&R!....nt

[bvar22]

23. times a million!

[Blanks]

24. If we are so concerned about children...

How many american children have died from gun accidents just since this Syria debate started? Somebody has probably been keeping track.

We are so worried about people dying some horrific death in some other country, but what about our own people - who think its safe to go to the movie theater or go to high school, or kindergarten or middle school - and are shot down because the very same people who are enraged by innocent people dying far far away: don't have the balls to pass meaningful gun control legislation - here at home.

I'll believe they care about innocent people being gassed when they've demonstrated a reasoned response to small children being gunned down at school. If they could adequately address an issue like this at home, I might believe that they are competent to handle foreign issues involving the death of innocents.

[maxsolomon]

30. Syria aside, it is possible to walk and chew gum simultaneously.

And you know quite well that the problem you want solved (senseless gun violence) is not going to get solved anytime soon, particularly in this Congress. If Newtown didn't move the pile, the pile isn't moving.

I'm weary of this "fix America 1st" line of reasoning. Our problems will never be completely solved.

[Nevernose]

38. Twenty thousand people starved to death TODAY

As they did yesterday, as they will tomorrow.

That's not a "fix America first" line of reasoning, it's a "this war is bullshit because we obviously don't care about dead children because if we did, then we would have done something about it and no one had to die, no missiles had to be shot, no children had to be orphaned" line of reasoning.

How come so many Americans think that the only problems in the world that need fixing are the ones that we can shoot at?

[maxsolomon]

65. Because that is easy to grasp. Hulk SMASH.

Complex problems male Hulk head hurt.

[Blanks]

43. Senseless gun deaths in this country is just an example...

Of how congress could really give a shit less about what some people claim the issue is.

If the issue is intervening in a situation where innocent lives are lost. The lack of gun control legislation pretty well establishes that our elected representatives could care less about these Syrian civilians. Thats not what they're about.

It isn't: 'fix America 1st' - it's more like 'seriously fix something' rather than line your pockets with cash from MIC donors while trying to manipulate people into thinking that you're doing the right thing.

I'm not overly passionate about gun control - it's just a recent example of how congress took donor cash and did nothing legislatively when 'the people' wanted action. Now they want to do something completely different than what 'the people' want. The similarity is loss of life: in one instance - they could care less about loss of life (when they should care) and in the other instance they act like this loss of life is just terrible. I'm not buying it.

[sabrina 1]

25. That's short and succinct. I hope they get the message and pay attention to it.

[maxsolomon]

27. Isolationist Humor is the best

Particularly as the world gets smaller and smaller.

[xchrom]

28. du rec.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

29. OK, smart guy, so then how'd all our oil get over there in Not America?

...Hm?

[Aerows]

31. Couldn't have created a better illustration.

I love my neighbors much more than I love the Syrian people, and I'm not inclined to bomb them out of "love".

[brooklynite]

32. So, cut off all the foreign aid (including the humanitarian)?

I believe the phrase was "not your job"?

[CakeGrrl]

33. How Republican-ish.

Almost in the NIMBY vein.

[Ocelot]

45. Dumbest comment I've seen all week by anyone (n/t)

[great white snark]

48. See post #36.

If you want to be educated.

[Ocelot]

49. Who's Eric Reed?

And why should I care?

[fascisthunter]

53. extremely dumb

[great white snark]

47. Yup, straight from a Freeper's Facebook. No source is a bad source if they slam Obama.

And no barrel is too bottomless to scrape.

[Ocelot]

51. That's so rich

You want to start another war based on fake, phony, doctored evidence, with KARL ROVE, DICK CHENEY, JOE LIEBERMAN, JOHN McCAIN as your moral guiding lights? HA.

[fascisthunter]

54. I guess so

[Cha]

61. Maybe because it's from an asshole teabagger's Facebook page.

Fucking Propaganda gets a big Howdy Do on DU.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3612473

[1awake]

34. Awesome! ... and borrowed (hope that's okay) n/t

[99th_Monkey]

35. I can kick that! and rec too. From your lips to O's ears. eom

[SunSeeker]

36. Good God. It's a freeper's facebook post.

I Googled GAPC. Eric Reed is the founder and president of “Gun Rights Across America” and the “Great American Patriot Coalition.” - See more at: http://freepatriot.org/2013/09/01/conservative-social-media-giants-unite-stop-syrian-war/#sthash.t4fgJzhZ.dpuf

You know, it's one thing to be promoting isolationism, but when you approvingly plaster the “Great American Patriot Coalition” name on DU, that is just stupid.

That explains the gratuitous shot at Obama.

I am sure the President is not confused about what his job is.

[Raine1967]

50. I didn't see your post as I was googling myself, that said:

I found the same information as you did.

I hope the OP deletes this post. This is crazy stuff.

[Number23]

57. I knew this would come from a Freeper or a Paul fan. And this wouldn't make a damn bit of differenc

to the Amen chorus.

And damn if I wasn't right on all counts.

[SunSeeker]

58. Yup. All the hallmarks: 1. oversimplistic 2. Obama bashing. nt

[JohnnyRingo]

59. It's absolutely a Tea Party group

It's incredible how DU has devolved into a Ron Paul wet dream over Syria.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3613222

[dgibby]

37. 'Nuff said! n/t

[Paper Roses]

39. K & R

[leftstreet]

40. DURec

[Motown_Johnny]

41. All that is necessary for evil to triumph....

[Pleidianfriend723]

42. is for people to forget to take care of their own country?

Last edited Sat Sep 7, 2013, 08:53 PM - Edit history (1)

[Motown_Johnny]

63. yep, that must be it

[Raine1967]

44. Isolationism?

I'm not an isolationist. I don't see how this is going to help.

I'd like to know the source of this graphic. This looks like a tea party message -- it looks like a PAC message.

This is an image that was put on FB to promote a 9/11 event. It is supported by a group called 'Say no to Gun Bans'

A: This is from a TEA PARTY GROUP.

Eric Reed is the founder and president of “Gun Rights Across America” and the “Great American Patriot Coalition.”

https://Facebook.com/EricReedGRAA

- See more at: http://freepatriot.org/2013/09/01/conservative-social-media-giants-unite-stop-syrian-war/#sthash.tVccXYwe.dpuf

[Ocelot]

46. Not only that, but our Mr. President shouldn't be FABRICATING BULLSHIT FAKE ''EVIDENCE''

Great article at Truthout about how Obama/Kerry's "evidence" is every bit as fake/phony/doctored as Bush's aluminum tubes:

The clumsy attempt to pass off intelligence claimed dubiously by the Israelis as a U.S. intercept raises a major question about the integrity of the entire document. The Israelis have an interest in promoting a U.S. attack on Syria, and the authenticity of the alleged intercept cannot be assumed. Murray believes that it is fraudulent.

[link:http://truth-out.org/news/item/18559-how-intelligence-was-twisted-to-support-an-attack-on-syria|
http://truth-out.org/news/item/18559-how-intelligence-was-twisted-to-support-an-attack-on-syria]

[MotherPetrie]

52. K&R

[JohnnyRingo]

55. I see your point...

but I don't think that applies in general. Perhaps those who oppose any kind of foreign intervention would feel otherwise about humanitarian efforts.

Should we "mind our own business" on the global AIDS epidemic? How about hunger? Does the Congress' responsibility end at the Atlantic Seaboard? I know the Paulites feel we should take care of America first, second, and last, but it's always been a common trait of the left and the right to help emerging nations stay nourished and healthy.

[JohnnyRingo]

56. I believe GAPC is a Tea Party organization.

They endorse a host of Republican candidates. Is that what DU has become in our disdain for Obama over the Syrian conflict? This is a bit embarassing:

http://greatamericanpatriot.com/

It's easy to link from there to conservative greats like Michael Savage, World Nut Daily, the Heritage Foundation, and yes... Free Republic:

http://greatamericanpatriot.com/media-links/

This is who you're quoting:



I have never legitimately asked this question on DU:
Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Tea Party, Free Republic, or the American Republican Party? Are you a subversive plant, a consevative mole, who found an opportunity to post right wing propaganda here?

This is getting ridiculous.The Syrian conflict and unified hatred for president Obama has turned DU into a fucking three ring circus.

[KittyWampus]

60. Isolationism isn't a good reason to oppose intervention. Blowback is, IMO.

[alcibiades_mystery]

62. From the GAPC's Facebook page

About
(GAPC) is an organization of 2A and Conservative FB page owners who see beyond their page numbers and recognize that the size of their individual FB page is not nearly as important as the breadth of their reach.
Mission
The Great American Patriot Coalition was organized to UNIFY Gun Rights and Conservative FB pages together, creating strength in numbers into ONE BODY which creates original movements and campaigns that are well organized, strong and powerful, reaching the most people possible. Alone we are small, TOGETHER WE ARE A FORCE TO BE RECKONED WITH!!!
Description
The Great American Patriot Coalition (GAPC) is an organization of 2A and Conservative FB page owners who see beyond their page numbers and recognize that the size of their individual FB page is not nearly as important as the breadth of their reach. This is not a coalition of page sharing and building (although that WILL happen organically), but of being proactively involved as a group towards one shared goal…. stopping the tyranny in our country and educating for a better future. This is done by co-creating original, GAPC sanctioned messages, events and activities.

https://www.facebook.com/GreatAmericanPatriotCoalition/info

Nice bedfellows, Scuba.

[Avalux]

66. This place sure is strange these days.

If something from a rw group had been posted years ago when I moderated, it would have been taken down immediately.

[orenbus]

64. Good Pic, Here is a sample letter for those that have not yet contacted their reps.

I'm new to the forum and wanted to share with anyone that has yet not contact their Congressman/Senator regarding the upcoming vote and may want some ideas on what to say to them to help them vote no. I've marked the areas where you would replace their name or state with XXXXX. Hope this helps:

###############################################################

Senator XXXXXX,

First I would like to thank you for currently serving as our Senator from XXXXXXXXX and taking on the responsibility of what will sure to be a tough and very important up and coming vote in the Senate.

In regards to the Syrian strikes you will be voting on, I have to ask that you vote no to the authorization. This attack plan presented by the White House only has options that are bad and worse for the world. The attack proposed will not deter, neutralize, suppress or destroy the enemy capability. It is just going to provoke a larger response in middle east region and the victims of that response will be the United States and Israel. I recommend against this course of action as this is not good war making and further will most likely suck us into yet another conflict in the middle east that will have no end in sight. I understand the arguments being presented for it, but I do not think defending the President's red line is worth one drop of American blood.

One thing to consider is that recently Carla del Ponte, a member of the UN Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria during an interview with Swiss TV was discussing a chemical attack that happened in March and attributed that attack to the rebels. Also Turkey news sources had made reports back in June of this year that rebels had been caught by local authorities trying to cross the border with Sarin gas. In light of Iraq "curveball" reports dealing with WMD evidence on the run up to war in Iraq this unfortunately leads me to question the validity of the evidence regarding the chemical attack in Syria. I do not hold that Assad's regime did not carry out the attack only that I think a decision as important as this should be made with caution (especially as U.S. national interests are not directly involved) we should consider carefully and garner support from as many of the countries in the world if any punitive action is to be made. This strike as presented by the President in my opinion does not have a clear main goal, specific objectives and it is not clear to me that we are prepared and committed to the repercussions or "blowback" that will certainly follow this action, such as say Syria's chemical weapons fall in the hands of Al-Queda backed rebels.

Finally I strongly believe that the United States should not have to shoulder responsibility for any action alone. In light of the recent parliament vote by one of our closest allies England to not support military action and the response from some of our other allies to not be directly involved in the attack I think that should send us a signal for a moment of pause. We need to not be rushed on any decision regarding action against a country that has not attacked us directly or any of our allies, and at this time I sense that the pace this is going is very fast in comparison to other military actions we have been involved in, in the past. One thing we need to consider is that if we go it alone, by definition we will be breaking International Law regarding an attack on a sovereign country against UN charter. There is much more that needs to be considered than what I will be able to include in this email, and probably the most important details come not from things we know, but from things we don't. Suffice to say at this time it does not make any sense to support military action in regards to a Syria strike and I urge you join the rest of the representatives from around our the country that will be voting no on the authorization to be voted on.

Thank you.

Sources regarding chemical attacks on March 2013 attributed to Rebels and Rebels caught crossing the Turkey border with Sarin:
http://p.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/6/syrian-rebels-used-sarin-nerve-gas-not-assads-regi/

http://www.turkishweekly.net/news/151261/russia-asks-turkey-for-info-on-sarin-terrorists.html