Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
109 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Me on Fox News yesterday discussion ACA/Obamacare and President Obama's Leadership (Original Post) stevenleser Oct 2013 OP
You made them choke up on their own words! Rex Oct 2013 #1
Yah, "never heard someone talk like that" it's lonely in his bubble. Tigress DEM Oct 2013 #106
If the President is going to be "negotiating with two parties", rather than just one.... kentuck Oct 2013 #2
Exactly, some form of that will have to happen. Which is why I said the President faces a tough time stevenleser Oct 2013 #11
let's hope the establishment has seen the light and bluemarkers Oct 2013 #44
I believe that Mitch McConnell will run against the Tea Party... kentuck Oct 2013 #55
thx 4 the info librechik Oct 2013 #86
I think the establishment Republicans are at the end of their rope with the teabaggers pacalo Oct 2013 #68
Did they threaten you with physical harm ? orpupilofnature57 Oct 2013 #3
LOL. Nah. stevenleser Oct 2013 #12
great to see a DUer trying to keep it sane on Fox BelgianMadCow Oct 2013 #4
Thank you! As to why... stevenleser Oct 2013 #14
even if people here don't agree with you, and you know those that I'm referring to Divine Discontent Oct 2013 #20
* librechik Oct 2013 #87
Beauty. They really start to lose bladder control when someone isn't speaking the talking points Paulie Oct 2013 #5
GOP: "The biggest policy debacle of our time since chamberlain...." Southside Oct 2013 #6
And it ended with the Fox Host saying riversedge Oct 2013 #82
Hello fellow new member riversedge Southside Oct 2013 #97
Thank you, steven.. going into the Lion's Den Cha Oct 2013 #7
k&r... spanone Oct 2013 #8
What a bunch of crap. Why would the President try to appease either branch of the R's? Scuba Oct 2013 #9
I think it says a lot about you that you parsed it that way. stevenleser Oct 2013 #10
But but but..... the President can make anything happen can't he? groundloop Oct 2013 #18
It's amazing that some people seem to think so, isn't it? stevenleser Oct 2013 #53
Nice try, but still a fail. Scuba Oct 2013 #21
LOL, yes, by all means, lets assume folks willing to destroy our economy to get their way will do stevenleser Oct 2013 #23
Yes, I carefully monitor what I say and write. Did I say the the Teabaggers would do what we say? Scuba Oct 2013 #25
No, you don't. There is a huge gulf between reality and where you think things are. nt stevenleser Oct 2013 #26
My reality isn't defined by Fox. That seems to ber where we diverge. Scuba Oct 2013 #29
I'm glad to see you have given up and gone ad-hominem. Its your admission of failure. stevenleser Oct 2013 #33
I commend you for your ability to remain calm... Blanks Oct 2013 #95
Agree 1000%. 99Forever Oct 2013 #74
If this is the best our side has, we're screwed. Scuba Oct 2013 #77
Thank you so much. Dawgs Oct 2013 #80
I agree with you, Scuba. Vashta Nerada Oct 2013 #39
I agree also DJ13 Oct 2013 #41
Who has passed bills that "hurt our side"? And why would anyone do that? reACTIONary Oct 2013 #62
My point exactly. Why appease the Republicans? The President's hand has never been stronger. Scuba Oct 2013 #66
You seem to believe that Steve was advocating... reACTIONary Oct 2013 #67
What Mr. Leser said was the President "now has two negotiating partners instead of one .... Scuba Oct 2013 #71
LOL - It has to be acceptable to one of those groups because of how that voting thing works stevenleser Oct 2013 #72
Again, you're arguing that passing something "acceptable to the Tea Party" is better than .... Scuba Oct 2013 #75
No, you were wrong as soon as you typed "tea party" and "better than" in your subject line. stevenleser Oct 2013 #78
Now you're reduced to word salad. Please don't go on Fox to "represent" the Democratic Party again. Scuba Oct 2013 #79
LOL, and with that, I'll simply thank you for keeping my OP kicked. nt stevenleser Oct 2013 #81
RE: "Hardly a liberal progressive statement" reACTIONary Oct 2013 #85
Giving credibility to the teabillies by referring to them as a "negotiating partner" ... Scuba Oct 2013 #88
"Now is ze time on Sprockets ... reACTIONary Oct 2013 #89
Motives and loyalties are important indicators when determining whether or not to trust someone. Scuba Oct 2013 #90
If, he's wrong on the analysis.... reACTIONary Oct 2013 #96
The easy answer is, No guest gets paid on political TV or Radio shows. stevenleser Oct 2013 #102
You're arguing with someone who thinks Boehner and the GOP controlled House will pass progressive stevenleser Oct 2013 #73
No he doesn't and he has repeatedly said so tkmorris Oct 2013 #92
Yes he does and it is apparent with every reply. That person's position involves magical thinking. stevenleser Oct 2013 #103
+10 (nt) reACTIONary Oct 2013 #30
This message was self-deleted by its author HangOnKids Oct 2013 #107
This must be your admission of failure, eh? Scuba Oct 2013 #34
If you thought so, you wouldn't have continued the thread, would you? LMAO! nt stevenleser Oct 2013 #36
Keep grasping at those straws; it's good exercise. Scuba Oct 2013 #42
In the alternate reality you live in, I am sure it seems like that. nt stevenleser Oct 2013 #47
Ad hominem. Scuba Oct 2013 #49
Oh the shame of being called unserious by a Very Serious Person Fumesucker Oct 2013 #54
It really amuses me when all someone can do is throw the "Fox News" bogeyman at me. stevenleser Oct 2013 #57
Message auto-removed Name removed Oct 2013 #64
LOL, just got to DU and embroil yourself in this stuff right away, eh? Enjoy your stay... stevenleser Oct 2013 #65
K&R sheshe2 Oct 2013 #13
kick samsingh Oct 2013 #15
K&R Playinghardball Oct 2013 #16
You looked like Ninja in there. Smooth, smart, sophisticated and on message. Quixote1818 Oct 2013 #17
You astutely chose the better and maybe the best of Faux Noise talking heads' show to appear mazzarro Oct 2013 #19
They don't shut you up when you're stumping for their side. Scuba Oct 2013 #22
Our DU'er was less fiesty than I would have liked mazzarro Oct 2013 #27
He's there to show that our side has no argument. Scuba Oct 2013 #31
It's a living I guess tkmorris Oct 2013 #93
Perfect analogy. Scuba Oct 2013 #94
As I have said many times, guests on talk shows do not get paid. I am a guest. nt stevenleser Oct 2013 #105
It's free advertising for what you DO get paid for tkmorris Oct 2013 #108
So your contention is disproved and now you happily move the goalposts. Gotcha. nt stevenleser Oct 2013 #109
You're arguing with someone who exists in an alternate reality, one where Progressive legislation stevenleser Oct 2013 #35
What you did was great in my opinion Chiquitita Oct 2013 #83
Thanks for jumping in there and getting the message out! nt Nay Oct 2013 #24
Another K&R ChazII Oct 2013 #28
You had them stumbling Botany Oct 2013 #32
Love that movie, love that scene. stevenleser Oct 2013 #37
Good analysis on being "primaried" - they are scared of their own shadow underpants Oct 2013 #38
Very well done. If there were more discussions like that on Faux, I might even watch BlueStreak Oct 2013 #40
You so outclassed them that to make it even you should suggest that they get grantcart Oct 2013 #43
"...that or get rid of it." UGH barnabas63 Oct 2013 #45
This is the exact reason I started my own radio show. stevenleser Oct 2013 #51
Where can I listen to it? nt barnabas63 Oct 2013 #52
Right here... stevenleser Oct 2013 #58
Looks like they made sure you were surrounded! Turbineguy Oct 2013 #46
Super job Steven! ucrdem Oct 2013 #76
More democrats need to go on Fox News and try to teach these people how the government works. bravenak Oct 2013 #48
Oh my goodness -- AWESOME! IdaBriggs Oct 2013 #50
K & R blue14u Oct 2013 #56
Excellent. Another GOP mouthpiece full of soundbites and a Dem one articulating okaawhatever Oct 2013 #59
Good work. Hoyt Oct 2013 #60
you`re a better man than i...steve leser! madrchsod Oct 2013 #61
GOOD JOB!!! Rosa Luxemburg Oct 2013 #63
K&R - Bill Hemmer: Talking Head... dchill Oct 2013 #69
Good job Steven! K&R B Calm Oct 2013 #70
Calm, cool, and informative. Very well done, Steve! K&R! eom BlueCaliDem Oct 2013 #84
Nice! My 2 cents: grahamhgreen Oct 2013 #91
Why do Republicans always go out of their way to sound like complete jerks? MrScorpio Oct 2013 #98
I feel like screaming and throwing things Proud Liberal Dem Oct 2013 #99
great job! Whisp Oct 2013 #100
Thanks so much to everyone who responded to offer support, it means a lot! stevenleser Oct 2013 #101
thanks for going into the lions' den renate Oct 2013 #104
 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
1. You made them choke up on their own words!
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 04:43 PM
Oct 2013

"Never heard anyone talk like that!?" Maybe you should tell them to get out more often and read up on current events! Nice to see you not fall for any of their obvious trolling.

Funny at the end, the commentator cannot stay unbiased.

kentuck

(111,056 posts)
2. If the President is going to be "negotiating with two parties", rather than just one....
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 04:57 PM
Oct 2013

I assume that you think the Republican Party and the Tea Party are not going to unite??

Basically, if anything is to get done, the establishment Republicans will have to join with Democrats to pass stuff or to keep stuff from being passed, otherwise the Tea Party will continue to put them into these uncomfortable and unpredictable situations.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
11. Exactly, some form of that will have to happen. Which is why I said the President faces a tough time
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 05:41 PM
Oct 2013

If you are an establishment Republican, you have already caused yourself problems for voting to end the shutdown. Any additional perceived help you give to the President is going to be tantamount to more nails in your coffin and more ammunition you give to your eventual tea party primary opponent.

bluemarkers

(536 posts)
44. let's hope the establishment has seen the light and
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:24 PM
Oct 2013

is willing to 'turn the page' on the tea partiers. They could gain some points by being the sane (less crazy) part of their party. All depends on where the money flows.

you are right - it's easier for 2 to agree than 3. Even though the rancor in dc is all Obama's fault (yawn, boring)

kentuck

(111,056 posts)
55. I believe that Mitch McConnell will run against the Tea Party...
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 08:25 PM
Oct 2013

and will defeat the Tea Partier in the primary. In my opinion, the Tea Party has lost a lot of credibility with a lot of establishment Republicans. Mitch McConnell is a most disagreeable fellow. He cannot get along with the Democratic Party and he can't get along with the Tea Party.

I think we should be careful and not give the Tea Party too much credit.

librechik

(30,674 posts)
86. thx 4 the info
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 10:07 AM
Oct 2013

i'm curious about the outcome--it will reveal which Repub party has control of the illegal voting machines in KY.

pacalo

(24,721 posts)
68. I think the establishment Republicans are at the end of their rope with the teabaggers
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 10:24 PM
Oct 2013

&, like Sen. Schumer said the night of the vote, "the brinkmanship coming from the right has reached its peak". I would hope that the establishment Republicans recognize that working with Obama would be a good way to marginalize the teabaggers. Ignore them altogether, which will goad Ted Cruz, Louie Gohmert, & other loonies into making further spectacles of themselves. Let them self-destruct whatever relevance they might have left.

BelgianMadCow

(5,379 posts)
4. great to see a DUer trying to keep it sane on Fox
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 04:59 PM
Oct 2013

and you managed that real well. Rather weird that you don't get a lot of recs

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
14. Thank you! As to why...
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 05:53 PM
Oct 2013

... I don't get a lot of Rec's, I have very little patience dealing with folks like reply #9 and I end up making those folks here mad at me and of course they don't Rec my OPs.

That's OK. I'm not about pretending things are better than they are. I'm about making sense (hence the name of my radio show) and I give people the brutal truth. As Harry Truman said, (paraphrased) some people think the truth is hell. It is hell, actually, that the Republicans control the House. But pretending it isnt so is no way to be.

Divine Discontent

(21,056 posts)
20. even if people here don't agree with you, and you know those that I'm referring to
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:41 PM
Oct 2013

they should support your going on Faux Noise and speaking some rational discussion, something they don't get very often on that wart of a station. I would guess that every single one of those who say you should say this or that would have a horrible time getting their thoughts out without blowing up at the idiots who stand in the way of progress. good job!

here's what the president needs from the voters:


http://www.zazzle.com/shutdown_the_gop_by_voting_in_2014_government-128195183613839642?rf=238107662556833486

Paulie

(8,462 posts)
5. Beauty. They really start to lose bladder control when someone isn't speaking the talking points
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 05:06 PM
Oct 2013

Of the day script.

Southside

(338 posts)
6. GOP: "The biggest policy debacle of our time since chamberlain...."
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 05:18 PM
Oct 2013

GOP: "Carrot Top's fan page is more sophisticated than the health insurance Website"

Do they get paid per one liner ?

The topic was coming together and moving forward. You spoke about common ground to work together, the other side was fixed on attacks and division, no answers. These 5 minutes were no different from the dysfunction of the shut down. One side trying to answer the problem, the other side bent on attacking and the moderator decides to punt the ball.

Great job maintaining the civility. Hopefully, Republicans will work with Obama to fine tune the ACA and help more working families.

Thanks for the post.

riversedge

(70,093 posts)
82. And it ended with the Fox Host saying
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 09:22 AM
Oct 2013

=get rid of it! Guess that is to be expected but still a jolt.

Southside

(338 posts)
97. Hello fellow new member riversedge
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 01:28 PM
Oct 2013

The host tried to hide his contempt for the ACA, but still got in that partisan dig. Fox News and Rush Limbaugh continually contribute to the hostility in Washington.

All the best to you riversedge

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
9. What a bunch of crap. Why would the President try to appease either branch of the R's?
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 05:31 PM
Oct 2013

It would have been great if you had said he should now push for a more progressive agenda, but you essentially conceded that he must somehow appease the Republicans. Why, why, why?

Oh yeah, Fox doesn't allow real liberals to speak on their network.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
10. I think it says a lot about you that you parsed it that way.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 05:39 PM
Oct 2013

We would all like to imagine that in getting an agenda passed, the President could ignore the fact that Republicans control the House by a large margin.

The only bills he can pass are ones that will get a fair amount of Republican votes in the House.

I've spent long periods with you on ignore precisely because I prefer not to engage on DU with people who ignore inconvenient realities. If we pretend we control both Houses by large margins, we can imagine all kinds of progressive legislation passing.

I can't afford to spend my time on unproductive fantasies like that. I have to deal with the facts as they are.

groundloop

(11,514 posts)
18. But but but..... the President can make anything happen can't he?
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:34 PM
Oct 2013



Steve, I appreciate a voice speaking truth and sanity. It would be great if we could control both houses with comfortable margins, but unfortunately that's not the case. Hell, as effective as republicans have been using the filibuster we'd need 65 or 70 seats in the Senate to get any really liberal agenda passed there.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
53. It's amazing that some people seem to think so, isn't it?
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:39 PM
Oct 2013

We just had a pretty jolting example of exactly the lengths Republicans will go to in order to get their way.

I have no idea what allows some people to think the President can simply pass some kind of progressive agenda and get it through the current House of Representatives.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
21. Nice try, but still a fail.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:44 PM
Oct 2013

Why pass bills that hurt our cause just because they are "passable" with the R's in control of the House? Better to show them for the obstructionists they are - roll out some progressive legislation and let them further hurt their credibility by standing in the way of progress.

Capitulation never achieved anything for the American People. Pretending that the President has to cow-tow to the Tea Party is hardly a progressive/liberal stance, but then that's why Fox keeps inviting you back.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
23. LOL, yes, by all means, lets assume folks willing to destroy our economy to get their way will do
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:46 PM
Oct 2013

what we say if we really scream loudly enough.

Do you ever listen to yourself?

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
25. Yes, I carefully monitor what I say and write. Did I say the the Teabaggers would do what we say?
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:49 PM
Oct 2013

No, I didn't. I said let them continue to obstruct progressive legislation and further erode their support.

Do you read what I write? Do you really think you're representing progressive/liberal ideals when you go on Fox and state that the President needs to mollify the Republicans?

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
33. I'm glad to see you have given up and gone ad-hominem. Its your admission of failure.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:02 PM
Oct 2013

I accept your admission of failure.

Blanks

(4,835 posts)
95. I commend you for your ability to remain calm...
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 01:06 PM
Oct 2013

When dealing with a bunch of dicks.

Whether at Fox News or here.

99Forever

(14,524 posts)
74. Agree 1000%.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:11 AM
Oct 2013

Capitulators like this self-promoting ummmm ... "journalist," are the problem, NOT the solution.

 

Dawgs

(14,755 posts)
80. Thank you so much.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:27 AM
Oct 2013

Bragging about being a token liberal on Fox News is all I need to know about them.

reACTIONary

(5,768 posts)
62. Who has passed bills that "hurt our side"? And why would anyone do that?
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 09:20 PM
Oct 2013

None of the legislation passed by Obama has "hurt our side".

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
66. My point exactly. Why appease the Republicans? The President's hand has never been stronger.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 09:38 PM
Oct 2013

I could argue that continued tax breaks for the wealthiest and renewal of the Patriot Act have hurt our side, but my post related to the future, not the past.

reACTIONary

(5,768 posts)
67. You seem to believe that Steve was advocating...
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 10:19 PM
Oct 2013

... passing anything just to pass something, even if it would be detrimental to our side. In fact, I had the impression that you thought this was what was done in the past, since in the (recent) past Obama has not had as strong a position as he now has. I had the impression that you were advocating attempting to pass legislation that was bound to fail in the house in order to expose the Republicans as "obstructionists".

Now I get the impression that you believe it is possible to pass progressive legislation, and get it through the house, that would advance our cause. This would seem to be a different goal from proposing something that is very progressive but bound to fail in order to make a point.

What is it that you are advocating?

I didn't get the impression that Steve was advocating passing anything at all just to pass something, regardless of whether it would or would not hurt our cause. I think he was giving his honest assessment of what it would take to pass legislation that would help our side. He may be wrong about that, it may be easier than he thinks, but I don't think he was saying "pass something !!! anything !!!".

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
71. What Mr. Leser said was the President "now has two negotiating partners instead of one ....
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 06:55 AM
Oct 2013

... he's got to think 'is this policy, this thing I'm going to propose, acceptable to the Tea Party Wing, is it more acceptable to the centric establishment wing of the Republican Party' ...".

Hardly a liberal progressive statement, in fact, quite the opposite.

The teabillies are without any support except for their nutters back home, and the "centric establishment" Republicans have the lowest approval rating in history. Why should the President's proposals have to be acceptable to these losers? Only on Fox.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
72. LOL - It has to be acceptable to one of those groups because of how that voting thing works
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:04 AM
Oct 2013

Remember that whole voting thing that congress does to pass laws? Specifically the House of Representatives which has more Republican members than Democratic ones?

That's if Boehner and whatever committee heads we are talking about even allow a vote on whatever law you are talking about. They don't even have to allow it to come to a vote.


But you clearly don't understand all of that, so here is some help:


 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
75. Again, you're arguing that passing something "acceptable to the Tea Party" is better than ....
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:18 AM
Oct 2013

... not passing anything.

Your condescending suggestion that I don't understand how bills are passed is pathetic. If you're going to go on Fox and pretend to be a "Democratic strategist" why call the teabillies "a negotiating partner"? You really think they are a) willing to negotiate, or b) a partner?

But then you're the same guy who said he has "no opinion" on an article that states "absent any reforms in the social safety net to arrest cost growth - something President Obama has taken insane hits from liberals for suggesting - the deficit will begin to grow again" totally ignoring options like cutting defense spending or raising taxes on the wealthiest. Really? Cutting the social safety net is an issue on which you have "no opinion"??? As I said, no wonder Fox invites you on so often.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3707872

If you are indeed helping the Democratic Party prepare strategy on an official basis, then the Party must have totally abandoned the traditional ideals that once made it strong.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
78. No, you were wrong as soon as you typed "tea party" and "better than" in your subject line.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:20 AM
Oct 2013

What is "better than" is if the House was in Democratic control.

There is no "better than" with Republicans in control of the House.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
79. Now you're reduced to word salad. Please don't go on Fox to "represent" the Democratic Party again.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:23 AM
Oct 2013

You're making things worse by giving credibility to the teabillies.

reACTIONary

(5,768 posts)
85. RE: "Hardly a liberal progressive statement"
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 10:06 AM
Oct 2013

The statement is an observation concerning legislative tactics and strategy given a certain circumstance, not a statement concerning correct policy or ideological fidelity. Assessing the facts correctly and proceeding in accordance with the reality that exits certainly IS in accordance with liberal / progressive ideas and, in general, is the only way to achieve liberal / progressive goals. Basing legislative tactics and strategy on wishful thinking isn't viable. That's what the tea baggers did in this show down and they lost big time. I don't consider them to be an example worth considering.

Now, it may be true that Steve's analysis is not correct - but that doesn't make it any more or any less liberal / progressive. It may not point to as aggressive a strategy as you would like, but it is perfectly compatible with progressive / liberal goals and policy objectives.

You seem to believe a more aggressive strategy could be viable, and you may be right. However, it seems the teabilly caucus in the house has an effective veto on any legislative effort. If the goal is to pass liberal / progressive legislation, the President's proposals have to both lean liberal / progressive and (in some sense) be acceptable to the teabillies.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
88. Giving credibility to the teabillies by referring to them as a "negotiating partner" ...
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 10:12 AM
Oct 2013

... will certainly get Mr. Leser invited back on Fox News.

I wonder if he's paid by Fox to do that? His "Democratic Strategist" introduction suggest that he's being paid by the Democratic Party. If that's the case, the Party is wasting its money.

Perhaps Mr. Leser will let us know who pays him.

reACTIONary

(5,768 posts)
89. "Now is ze time on Sprockets ...
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 10:25 AM
Oct 2013

...vhen ve dance."

That is, now is the time on DU where we start questioning the "hidden motives" of those we disagree with rather than assessing their judgment against the facts.

I personally don't care who is paying Mr. Leser, as opposed to whether or not his analysis is correct and useful.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
90. Motives and loyalties are important indicators when determining whether or not to trust someone.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 10:28 AM
Oct 2013

Besides, he's wrong on the analysis.

reACTIONary

(5,768 posts)
96. If, he's wrong on the analysis....
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 01:19 PM
Oct 2013

... you don't have to worry about his motives, just point out how he is wrong. If he is right on the analysis, you don't have to worry about his motives either. In other words, his motives aren't very relevant.

As far as whether or not the teabillies have been weakened by their recent defeat, it depends on the circumstances and the issue. Strength in a negotiation is your best alternative to what is being offered. In the recent case, the teabillies best alternative was being blamed for the total destruction of the US and world economy. Verses the status quo.

Given their best alternative, they were in a pretty weak position. And they did damage themselves. But that doesn't mean they are weak given other issues and alternatives.

For instance, take comprehensive immigration reform. The house teabillies best alternative to accepting a liberal/progressive policy would be the status quo. For them, that's not too bad. Accepting a liberal/progressive reform, however, would hurt them in their districts. So any policy proposal that would overcome their "veto" would have to be very attractive to "establishment republicans" who are more worried about business interests being able to hire cheap labor. So liberal/progressive policy gains are not out of the question, but won't be possible without some creative legislative craft-work.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
102. The easy answer is, No guest gets paid on political TV or Radio shows.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 03:22 PM
Oct 2013

My only politically related income is from my radio show.

If you are watching/listening to any political show, you can tell if someone is a guest, and therefore unpaid, or a paid person. A paid person is an employee of that network. They will rarely appear elsewhere as they are essentially owned by that network. They are introduced at the beginning of each segment as either a host/cohost or analyst or contributor of that network.

You are absolutely right to say though that the person you are arguing with is ignoring various facts and realities while grasping at straws and dancing as fast as they can in order to hurl crazy accusations at me.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
73. You're arguing with someone who thinks Boehner and the GOP controlled House will pass progressive
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:07 AM
Oct 2013

legislation despite the lesson in just how unreasonable they can be that we were all just given where they nearly crashed the economy to get their way.

You're trying valiantly but when the person you are discussing things with doesn't acknowledge some pretty obvious realities it's tough to get through to them.

tkmorris

(11,138 posts)
92. No he doesn't and he has repeatedly said so
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 11:48 AM
Oct 2013

I am finding your army of strawmen debate tactics to be quite distasteful.

What he said was that any legislation that results from negotiating with the Tea Party is bound to be legislation that is worse than doing nothing. I am paraphrasing and simplifying of course. If you wish to debate the point then address that directly. Or don't.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
103. Yes he does and it is apparent with every reply. That person's position involves magical thinking.
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 03:24 PM
Oct 2013

They expect progressive legislation to be put forth by the Democratic senate and the White House and they expect it to pass the House of Representatives.

Response to reACTIONary (Reply #30)

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
54. Oh the shame of being called unserious by a Very Serious Person
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:45 PM
Oct 2013

A Very Serious Person on Fox News in fact.



 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
57. It really amuses me when all someone can do is throw the "Fox News" bogeyman at me.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 08:37 PM
Oct 2013

Virtually every elected Democrat and most Democratic pundits have been on Fox News at least once.

Do you really intend to throw them all under the bus because you can't find anything else to attack me with?

Response to stevenleser (Reply #10)

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
65. LOL, just got to DU and embroil yourself in this stuff right away, eh? Enjoy your stay...
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 09:30 PM
Oct 2013

... as long as it lasts.

Quixote1818

(28,921 posts)
17. You looked like Ninja in there. Smooth, smart, sophisticated and on message.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:30 PM
Oct 2013

These kind of extremely well articulated appearances slowly chip away at Fox viewers and start bringing them over to our side. Great job!

mazzarro

(3,450 posts)
19. You astutely chose the better and maybe the best of Faux Noise talking heads' show to appear
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:37 PM
Oct 2013

He was far more reasonable than I had expected and your co-guest was reasonable as well. I was surprised neither of them tried to shut you down nor talk over you. Congratulations for the "edjumacation" that you imparted to the Faux Noise audience.

mazzarro

(3,450 posts)
27. Our DU'er was less fiesty than I would have liked
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 06:53 PM
Oct 2013

But presume that his intention was more to educate and engage them in matured and reasonable discussion - that I will never discourage. And I will never concede to surrender any ground to them when they are wrong - which he did not do in this case.

tkmorris

(11,138 posts)
108. It's free advertising for what you DO get paid for
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 11:18 PM
Oct 2013

Which is why you do it. Let's not pretend we don't know why you do these appearances.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
35. You're arguing with someone who exists in an alternate reality, one where Progressive legislation
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:04 PM
Oct 2013

passes this Republican House of Representatives.

I doubt you are going to make much headway.

Chiquitita

(752 posts)
83. What you did was great in my opinion
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 09:40 AM
Oct 2013

You hammered in the fact that the Republicans are divided and weak. That they are fractured. It made the host upset, and I was glad to see that.

underpants

(182,632 posts)
38. Good analysis on being "primaried" - they are scared of their own shadow
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:11 PM
Oct 2013

They went away from their playbook (a running team throwing the ball - a folk band going electric) of no internal strife and getting their "product" to market first. It backfired on them because their angry mob, which was just supposed to initiate a fear of change, won't go away. They used the tea party to shine the light on themselves after a disasterous 2 year election span (2006-2008 elections) and they created a shadow. The only way to get rid of a shadow is to stay out of the light. In today's instant media you have to keep yourself in the light.

Now the shadow (an empty representation of reality) can actually beat the host by making reality out of the empty representations of the host. They actually embody the representations and the viewers could "primary" out the host in favor of the shadow. The best way to prevent that is to step out of the light....which the host can't do.

Nominating shadows vs. real people tends not to bode well but the gerrymandering since the 2010 census could hold things off. Only 17 House seats need to flip to change the majority. Banking on a shadow is shadowy business. Creating the shadow starts the process though.

Good luck battling your own shadow.


Well done Steve

 

BlueStreak

(8,377 posts)
40. Very well done. If there were more discussions like that on Faux, I might even watch
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:16 PM
Oct 2013

Last edited Sat Oct 19, 2013, 08:10 PM - Edit history (1)

I applaud you for having the stones to do that, and for presenting a very solid set of arguments. The host even said he was in favor of making improvements to the ACA by the end of that segment. Of course, what you didn't say is that one of the most beneficial improvements would be to require Medicare to list a bronze plan in all the exchanges -- at their actual cost of providing that coverage. I would even be OK with having Medicare list their public option at 8% HIGHER than their actual cost, with the extra 8% going into the Medicare trust fund. That would give the insurance companies an opportunity for 8% profit margin, which is very good money in most industries. That would offer a MUCH better deal for everybody, including the Federal government (which would have smaller subsidies to pay) and those those folks over 400% of the poverty level you mentioned.

And maybe we only introduce that at first for people over 50 who are the ones struggling the most to get jobs. Or maybe we introduce it only in states where there is little real competition in the exchanges today. However we do it, that is the one thing that can have the biggest positive impact on the most Americans, while simultaneously reducing the Federal deficit.

Keep it up man. By about April, 2014, maybe these improvements will be openly discussed an Faux and all the other national networks. I think you are absolutely right to portray this as a program that is open to improvement. We welcome improvement. We won't have any discussions about delaying or de-funding it. But if somebody wants to make it work better, bring it on. The gauntlet is down now. Republicans need to come to the table with something besides "No".

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
43. You so outclassed them that to make it even you should suggest that they get
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:23 PM
Oct 2013

two more Republicans to balance it out.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
51. This is the exact reason I started my own radio show.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:38 PM
Oct 2013

No matter what network I was on, or what show I was on, if its not your show, someone else controls the discussion and adds their spin and gets the last word.

I needed a place where I got to do that. It's worked out pretty well!

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
58. Right here...
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 08:47 PM
Oct 2013

This link will always have the most recent 6-8 shows. If you live in the Los Angeles Basin, you can also listen to it on 1050am Mondays at 2pm Pacific time.

http://steveleser.blogspot.com/p/latest-radio-show.html

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
76. Super job Steven!
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 08:18 AM
Oct 2013

You had 'em both agreeing with you and you did it in a pleasant way so they won't blackball you, lol. Also thanks for the ACA update which sounds reasonable. Thanks for posting it too!

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
48. More democrats need to go on Fox News and try to teach these people how the government works.
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:34 PM
Oct 2013

If we get the house back, we will not have to give them anything and can replace whatever we give them now. As of now , we have no way to pass anything without their help. It's a tired, miserable hell we live in. It's nice that you're trying to explain reality to them.

 

IdaBriggs

(10,559 posts)
50. Oh my goodness -- AWESOME!
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 07:37 PM
Oct 2013

You had everyone acknowledging the civil war in the GOP, pointed out he has to "negotiate" with "two factions" while threatening everyone who isn't a lunatic with getting "primarried", had the GOP guy agreeing with you, got the $60K figure out there (ROFL!), and had the Fox guy stuttering in shock ---

WOW! GREAT JOB!!!

okaawhatever

(9,457 posts)
59. Excellent. Another GOP mouthpiece full of soundbites and a Dem one articulating
Sat Oct 19, 2013, 08:51 PM
Oct 2013

policy and position. Good lord. I have to say, the GOP guy did come around in the end after he realized the interview wasn't going to be the usual soundbite fest and he looked like a moron. I'd love to see you opposite Palin.

 

grahamhgreen

(15,741 posts)
91. Nice! My 2 cents:
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 11:33 AM
Oct 2013

As a TV pro, watch your hands, and try to get return in your monitor so you can see when they are being effective.

Also, I'm hoping all you guys read 'conservatives without a conscience' so you can understand that the minds of right wing authoritarians are simply unable to process compromise; they see compromise as admission of defeat. They simply want to be told what to do by the President. And punished when they fail to do it. They know they are being bad, like children pushing boundaries.

Nice job though, I could never be on that side of the camera, lol

MrScorpio

(73,630 posts)
98. Why do Republicans always go out of their way to sound like complete jerks?
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 02:26 PM
Oct 2013

It's as if the guy was trying to incite an argument instead of having a frank discussion.

Do they believe even half the crap that comes out of their mouths?

Proud Liberal Dem

(24,396 posts)
99. I feel like screaming and throwing things
Sun Oct 20, 2013, 02:27 PM
Oct 2013

every time I hear the Republicans (or any number of mindless pundits) start in on the "President Obama isn't leading" meme and somebody really needs to call them on it IMHO. I know that you have only limited time to respond during interviews but can you try to call them out next time they start in on it? The truth of the matter is that President Obama can lead, has lead, and will keep on leading this country but he can't do anything with the Republican Tea Party when they consciously decide to be obstinate and obstructionist. Nobody can make a**holes decide to stop being a**holes and you can't "lead" them anywhere if they are bound and determined to fight you every inch of the way on EVERYTHING. There is so much evidence out there now that Republicans weren't going to give President Obama so much as the time of day from the beginning. I wish that the people pushing this "lack of leadership" meme were required to give an example or two of concrete things that President Obama could do differently to get the Republicans to listen to him though they probably couldn't actually come up with anything if pressed. Also, anybody whom seriously believes that President Obama hasn't done enough to bring everybody together and hasn't been "post-partisan" enough hasn't been paying enough attention during his Presidency to what he's been doing and/or saying.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Me on Fox News yesterday ...