Pat Buchanan on War With Iran ...

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

I'm always uncomfortable with having to agree occasionally with Pat Buchanan or Ron Paul, but on issues of reigning in U.S. Military adventurism, sometimes it is unavoidable. In his last column Buchanan warns against letting Israel's Right Wing government drag us into war with Iran. He writes:

Today the Senate is about to vote Israel a virtual blank check — for war on Iran. Reads Senate bill S.1881:
If Israel is "compelled to take military action in legitimate self-defense against Iran's nuclear weapons program," the United States "should stand with Israel and provide ... diplomatic, military and economic support to the Government of Israel in the defense of its territory, people and existence."

[link]http://news.yahoo.com/blank-check-war-iran-080000329.html[/Link]

Clearly, there are many in Congress from both parties who would happily push us into war with Iran under one pretense or another. The country does not want or need another war; but maybe the Congress does. Shameful !!!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

1. Pat Buchanan sides with Obama,Code Pink...and me.

From an email I just got from Code Pink.

If there’s ever a bill that should never come up on the floor for a vote, it’s Senate Bill 1881. This bill calling for tightened sanctions on Iran would blow up the successful nuclear talks– and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid could bring it up for a vote in the Senate any time. President Obama even called it a “march to war”! Tell Senator Reid to STOP THIS BILL!

President Obama has said he will veto this bill if it passes, but because of heavy pressure from the Israel lobby AIPAC, the Senate already has 59 cosponsors, and only needs 8 more votes before the bill can override a presidential veto.

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

2. AIPAC ...

This is madness isn't it? The influence AIPAC has purchased in our Congress is disgusting.

[dionysus]

11. for pat, it's not about being peaceful, it's about hating Jews. nt

[dionysus]

3. OTOH, he's also an antisemetic pile of douche. fuck pat buchanon.

it's not about pat being anti war, it's about pat hating Jews.

[COLGATE4]

9. ^^^ THIS ^^^

. Perfectly put.

[Agnosticsherbet]

4. “compelled to take military action in legitimate self-defense against Iran’s nuclear weapons program

I have serious problems with this. If a nuclear program is an aggressive act of war requiring self defense, then the US, Russia, England, France, China, Pakistan, India, and North Korea (and according to rumor Israel) have been doing this for years.

I would support legitimate self-defense against a nuclear attack, no matter who initiates it. But a program isn't an attack. And this bill undermines the Presidents attempt to negotiate a peaceful solution to the problem.

I wonder which lobbies these chuckle nuts are trying to hit up for money?

Sen. Menendez and his 58 co sponsers

Sen. Kirk, Mark Steven [R-IIL]
Sen. Schumer, Charles E. [D-NY]
Sen. Graham, Lindsey [R-SC]
Sen. Cardin, Benjamin L. [D-MD]
Sen. McCain, John [R-AZ]
Sen. Casey, Robert P., Jr. [D-PA]
Sen. Rubio, Marco [R-FL]
Sen. Coons, Christopher A. [D-DE]
Sen. Cornyn, John [R-TX]
Sen. Blumenthal, Richard [D-CT]
Sen. Ayotte, Kelly [R-NH]
Sen. Begich, Mark [D-AK]
Sen. Corker, Bob [R-TN]
Sen. Pryor, Mark L. [D-AR]
Sen. Collins, Susan M. [R-ME]
Sen. Landrieu, Mary L. [D-LA]
Sen. Moran, Jerry [R-KS]
Sen. Gillibrand, Kirsten E. [D-NY]
Sen. Roberts, Pat [R-KS]
Sen. Warner, Mark R. [D-VA]
Sen. Johanns, Mike [R-NE]
Sen. Hagan, Kay [D-NC]
Sen. Cruz, Ted [R-TX]
Sen. Donnelly, Joe [D-IN]
Sen. Blunt, Roy [R-MO]
Sen. Booker, Cory A. [D-NJ]
Sen. Murkowski, Lisa [R-AK]
Sen. Manchin, Joe, III [D-WV]
Sen. Coats, Daniel [R-IN]
Sen. Vitter, David [R-LA]
Sen. Risch, James E. [R-ID]
Sen. Isakson, Johnny [R-GA]
Sen. Boozman, John [R-AR]
Sen. Fischer, Deb [R-NE]
Sen. Hatch, Orrin G. [R-UT]
Sen. Thune, John [R-SD]
Sen. Coburn, Tom [R-OK]
Sen. Chambliss, Saxby [R-GA]
Sen. Toomey, Pat [R-PA]
Sen. Wicker, Roger F. [R-MS]
Sen. Enzi, Michael B. [R-WY]
Sen. Inhofe, James M. [R-OK]
Sen. Lee, Mike [R-UT]
Sen. Scott, Tim [R-SC]
Sen. Portman, Rob [R-OH]
Sen. Alexander, Lamar [R-TN]
Sen. Grassley, Chuck [R-IA]
Sen. Barrasso, John [R-WY]
Sen. Johnson, Ron [R-WI]
Sen. Hoeven, John [R-ND]
Sen. Burr, Richard [R-NC]
Sen. Bennet, Michael F. [D-CO]
Sen. Heller, Dean [R-NV]
Sen. McConnell, Mitch [R-KY]
Sen. Cochran, Thad [R-MS]
Sen. Crapo, Mike [R-ID]
Sen. Shelby, Richard C. [R-AL]
Sen. Sessions, Jeff [R-AL]

[11 Bravo]

7. If Jeff Sessions is in favor of something it is, ipso facto, really fucking stupid.

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

8. You got that right ...

Right for Sessions = Wrong for America

[spanone]

5. pat who?

[Cali_Democrat]

6. That paragraph is amazing

The US should stand with Israel and provide them with support if THEY DECIDE to unilaterally attack Iran.

So essentially Congress wants Israel to control our foreign policy in the Middle East....at US taxpayer expense of course.

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

10. Support the Aggressor !!!

That's always the moral high ground ... It really is an amazing statement on its own. Then when you realize it is in actual legislation ...

[freshwest]

12. It's reiteration of what a treaty with any ally is. Stirring shit for donations. IRL, it's a fail.

No one is going to war with Iran as long as Obama is in office no matter what the grandstanders do.

[karynnj]

13. No it's not!

A treaty is very likely to bind you to help if the country is attacked. It rarely says that if the country attacks a third country - we are in on the side of the ally.

[freshwest]

14. The assumption of help is when attacked, not paranoia about being attacked, or making first strikes.

And the USA government has given Israel financial, military and other aid for half a century and is not about to stop. Nothing is going to be changeed.

Israeli war hawks have been loudly beating the drum on attacking Iran for decades. There are plenty of skirmishes and what some would call invasions done by Israel over the years.

We have not sent in troops, and this statement is not a declaration of war that binds anyone. I say they are full of shit and trying to make Obama look weak for not being a neo-con and doing their bidding.

The reaction fo the public to war with Syria was overtly negative. Would the voices who objected so much to that suddenly be silent if such a thing were to be done now?

It's political gamesmanship, and pushed by the right, not the policy of the Obama administration.

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

15. The Irony is This ...

For all their rhetoric, Iran has no record of aggressive war since before the Ottoman Empire. That's what I recall anyway.

[kelliekat44]

16. And their elected government was overthrown by the US, and they have been bombed by Israel twice

in the last 5 years. But ...what does that matter? They are on the PNAC hit list.

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

18. Eisenhower's CIA ...

Or perhaps I should say the Dulles CIA. We have done more to the Iranians than they have ever done to us.

[freshwest]

17. Both sides are paranoid. Congress is making a mockery of itself, as usual. They squealed PBO wanted

WW3 and to bomb Syria to bits, or prolong the Afghan conflict, which was never his intent, even as his detractor Gates revealed. But WW3 and the End Times is a long-standing RW theme song.

All the religious wingnuts are trying to bring the fricking second coming with all this stuff. I'madinnerjecket wanted the same thing from his fundamentalist fantasies. That's why all RWNJs must be put out of office.

Obama's pushing Syria to have them to join the CWC, not to change their government. Before those goings on last year, Iran and Syria were not signed on. I posted a lot on this at that time.

Since then, they both signed the agreement, per the most recent Wikipedia entry, but I have both, the old and new pages. Also the Arab League's work to stop these things. The CWC does not just cover Chemical weapons despite the name.

It covers all WMD and they want everyone in the world to sign onto it which is exactly the way for Iran to get out of the arms race and save face at the same time. True, Iran has not invaded in recent history, but there has been a civil war between factions in most of the Middle East since the Ottoman era ended, as they know each other very well. Iran does not have clean hands - most nations don't.

And that is without any outside help, but western powers have made allegiances with different sector for trade and played havoc. There are few innocents in this group of players, only the civilians. That is a part of the world, like Europe, we have neither the years of knowledge or wisdom to get involved with.

But the CWC was set in place to stop proliferation of weapons with lasting effects on life on this planet. It is not just about their use, but ending manufacture and destroying stockpiles.

Russia is almost completely there with a lot of American dollars invested and many countries have eliminated all they had and the USA has eliminated a lot but has more to acccount for since Bush manufactured more.

Iran saw first hand the results of CW on their own people, and are still giving healthcare to those disabled frim the same causes, as we saw in reports out of Syria. I've known a lot of Iranians, since before the Shah was kicked out. they weren't in love with Khomeini either and moved to the USA to have more peaceful and prosperous lives. Most of them union, blue collar, good folks, no different than Democrats with a belief in equality for all.

I've also known people from Pakistan, Kasmir, Lebanon and elsewhere. They too are happy to be here. But the ones from Lebanon blamed Syria and Iran for the bloodshed years ago in Beirut that drove them away. Also, I know Russians and they have their reasons for supporting Iran and Syria; and others have emigrated to the USA and are quite glad to be here. There are so many threads between these people.

AFAIK, Israel is too spooked to sign onto the CWC, along with some other countries. But then we have India, Pakistan, China, NK and the western nations who are nuclear powers. Iranians who do want nukes are just responding to the events around them.

I still say the people in Congress are just making a show to impress their RWNJ voters. And there are plenty in every state who equate support for Israel with their version of Christianity. We also can't forget all the alliances made during WW2 which are not going anywhere.

I was going to post an article of how individual Iranians and Israelis have been making moves without their official governments to find common ground, connecting with each other to create peace. It's not a done deal over there. Congress needs to mind our own business here, instead they make up these spectacles. The only real job they have is our national security, which they are destroying by economic and government sabotage.

JMHO.

[Gordon Alf Shumway]

19. It seems to be true ...

While they may resent the actions of the American government, Iranians rather like the American people. They should be allies.