Dawn Zimmer is being discussed as if she's alleging molestation

[cthulu2016]

Last edited Mon Jan 20, 2014, 03:39 PM - Edit history (1)

Watching Candy "Aleister" Crowley interview Dawn Zmmer, it's the same as the Christie talking points...

"But you tweeted something positive about Christie in August."

"If this happened when you say, why didn't you come out with it then?"

These are the top veracity questions being asked (at Christie's behest), yet really have nothing to do with this case.

Why not ask what she was wearing? Maybe she had on an outfit that practically asked for a political shakedown.



I suggest that the Christie defense is different than it would be if Zimmer were a man. Not worse or better... different.

[Squinch]

1. You had me at "Candy 'Aleister' Crowley"

[arthritisR_US]

23. I don't get the Aleister reference? nt

[anti partisan]

32. Aleister Crowley, famous Satanist

Oh, Mr. Crowley

[arthritisR_US]

35. I had never heard of that, thanks! :) nt

[qazplm]

2. I believe zimmer

but those are fair questions, and questions we'd be asking if the shoes were reversed.

[cthulu2016]

3. No, skepticism is in order, but not along those lines

Her emotional state is not what the case is about, and my statement is that the 1500 words of Christie deflection points (that media folks are parroting as if they were probitive) are taylored to Dawn Zimmer being a woman, because Christie's people calculated (correctly, I think) that these are the best deflections to cast doubt on the veracity of a reasonably young, reasonably attractive woman.

Had she been a 70 year old man the Christie deflection points would have been different in tone.

Why are people not suggesting that Gates made up his claims about Clinton or Obama because he said good things about them at other times, or didn't resign on the spot?

Because everyone knows that those are not sensible questions about politics.


Harry Reid says that some Republican said crummy thing X in negotiations six months ago.

Nobody cites Reid saying something positive about the person on a later date, and nobody says, "Why didn't you come out with this then?"

Those are not sensible questions in politics. She is a MAYOR. The mayor of a large city doesn't call a press conference every time something that seems shady happens, and people in politics say stuff that is not entirely emotionally authentic.

[qazplm]

11. but those aren't emotional questions

"But you tweeted something positive about Christie in August."

"If this happened when you say, why didn't you come out with it then?"

Those are basic veracity and credibility questions anyone would ask.
People ARE suggesting that Gates made up his claims, others are saying his credibility is enhanced because he also said nice things.

It works both ways.

When you wait a long time to report something, you are going to be asked why you waited so long, and why you praised someone (while remaining silent) in between the occurrence of what you said happened and the time you reported it.

It's basic cross-exam 101.

[Bandit]

37. While they may be fair questions, they really are not relevent.

It really does not matter when she made the allegations, what matters is if the allegations are true, and since she went directly to the US attorney, I suspect she would not have done so had they been false.

[Demo_Chris]

4. These are reasonable questions...

Dawn is making some very serious accusations. If you were aware that your Governor was engaged in potentially criminal and definitely immoral behavior, would you not have a duty to come forward as soon as you knew?

[cthulu2016]

7. No. They are ridiculous questions in the real world of politicians.

If you were aware that your Governor was engaged in potentially criminal and definitely immoral behavior, would you not have a duty to come forward as soon as you knew?

No, not on this planet.

You are adding criminal. The allegation is not criminal.

A US Senator says he might support unemployment extension if his state got some bridge project.

Is Harry Reid obliged to announce that to the press that day?

Maybe he SHOULD, but in the real world there is no such expectation.

Was Gates duty-bound to call a press conference to report that Hillary was influenced by politics in decision X?

No. Of course not.

People are thinking about this issue in a weird and confused way. This is a corrupt style, not a specific crime to report.

[FarCenter]

9. I'd bet that someone in Hudson County is involved

Realistically, the scenario is that Christie's team applies pressure on Zimmer in order to get something from the Democratic organization in Hudson County -- probably someone involved in the project back before Zimmer became mayor and stalled it.

[qazplm]

12. it isn't??

Sure seems like it to me if true, and if true, someone should be charged with something.

Not sure the evidence will be there to the level of guilt beyond reasonable doubt, but that's a different story.

[Bandit]

38. "You are adding criminal. The allegation is not criminal"

I think you might be wrong or why the US Attorney? Extortion is Criminal and that is what this is. Not just some political power play....If it was just Ethics, then it would go to an Ethics panal and not a US Attorney.

[Auntie Bush]

15. Maybe...

Maybe you should wait till you have more evidence or someone else agrees with you. Well, I guess I mean wait till the boat is rocking or someone else rocks the boat.

[Blue_Roses]

20. In a perfect world maybe...but, this is far from

the "perfect" situation. First, you have an over-bearing governor who seems to snap at the drop of a hat, especially if he doesn't get his way. Second, you have a mayor who is in dire need of funding help for her city. She has to walk a tight rope as it is. Oh, and she is a Democrat and a woman (which shouldn't matter, but we all know it does).

The bottom line: She's dammed any way she decides to move on this. She picked the best option for her and her city. I think she is VERY credible and is handling this in the best way she can--under the circumstances.

[Demo_Chris]

27. I did not say she was not credible, I said these were reasonable questions...

She damn well should be capable of explaining herself. We aren't talking Sarah Palin here after all.

[Blue_Roses]

36. I see and I agree that these are important questions

My beef about the questions ( and it's not aimed at you) is the accusatory tone from the media, who are trying to pull an "agenda" out of her admission.

[Gothmog]

5. Christie is on offense

Christie is on the attack. Who cares about the facts when you can attack the source and the media

[Boom Sound 416]

6. Drama much

[Baitball Blogger]

8. This is why nobody wants to stick their neck out.

[JoePhilly]

26. Good point.

The store owner rarely admits that the mob is demanding protection money.

[libdem4life]

10. This is the "Why didn't she just leave him" excuse for domestic violence. And no, it wouldn't be

the same for a man. Notice that Christie fired his closest aide...a female...through another staffer...without one word. He allowed the men to "resign". He called her a liar, and deceitful, and pretty much blamed her for his woes right away.

[qazplm]

13. are you comparing

a victim of domestic violence to this situation?

Are you kidding me? Not remotely the same thing at all.

[CTyankee]

14. But I do think that she was afraid of Christie. I know he scares me.

He is large, snarling, angry and intimidating. I think lots of women have a wise fear around such men.

[qazplm]

16. I doubt she was physically afraid of him

but she undoubtedly feared the political backlash at the time it happened.

He was very popular, seen as somewhat bipartisan, a presidential candidate, and I have no doubt she thought he could make her life really rough if he wanted to.

[CTyankee]

17. Yes, but such men are scary looking and use it to their advantage psychologically.

It's a tactic that Christie used to his advantage.

[qazplm]

24. he doesnt strike me

as "Scary-looking" to be honest, I mean he looks like he'd be rather easy to evade.

[CTyankee]

25. The persona he chooses to put forward, as often shown in his still pics, shows a snarling, angry

guy. Plus he's large. That's not a comforting mix of "attributes" for a woman to encounter. Plus, we've seen him go after women and old people who dare question him. Typical bully: pick on women and older, weak people. Not the first time in history this type has come before us...

[libdem4life]

18. It's the same process...equal pay, as well. So yes, sacrificing and demonizing the females

occurs and the process of blaming the victim proceeds. Dawn Zimmer was a victim, thus her town. She stood up to him. Seems she didn't get the memo.

Mayor Sokolich, OTOH, had a friendly conversation with Christie after his initial unfriendly Christie information to the press (which now seems like smoke and mirrors), and hasn't been seen or heard of since.

Same with Pulof...he backed right off like a good boy.

And other than calling Mayor Sokolich "a little Serbian" and an "idiot" and lower than Pulof, none of these folks or his aides or PA employees got fired (with no notice, conversation and by one of his aides) as did Ms Kelly...accused of lying and deceit...profusely and dramatically in the first speech. She has even taken the steps of assuring (don't have a link) behind the scenes that she is still loyal. I also noted the attorney "given" to her is closely tied in with NJ politics. Of course she, as a single mother of 4, does not have the means for a high-level attorney. So figure that out.

The men were allowed to resign.

Is it so hard to believe that being a lifetime bully would not also heavily include sexism. My question back...is it equal opportunity?

[Blue_Roses]

21. It may not be the same domestic abuse situation

that a spouse or partner feels, but it is abuse. Abuse of power. Abuse emotionally. Abuse verbally. AND, we really don't know, but I would fear physical "abuse" if I hit the wrong nerve.

Either way you look at it, it is still abuse.

[bluestate10]

19. Now you see why she kept her mouth shut earlier. With Chistie at 70% approval,

Zimmer would have been ripped apart if she had come out earlier.

[Blue_Roses]

22. Exactly!

It left her with few options...actually, none if she wanted to get the help needed for her city. And she still didn't get it.

[markpkessinger]

34. Another very obvious possible reason for not coming forward sooner . . .

. . . is that her city was still in desperate need of the Sandy relief funds, and she was probably still oping to convince the Christie administration to release them.

[Justice]

28. My Hoboken resident sibling says the mayor is good but naive

[KaryninMiami]

29. And it's only going to get worse for her- hope she is prepared

The wrath of Christie and all of his pals will soon be bombarding her and the media with more of the Crowly type questions and accusations. If she's telling the truth- and I hope she is- and she has some way to back it up with evidence, then she should be ok. But she should expect to get get roughed up by the Christie bullies for sure. Hopefully she's ready for this- it will not be pleasant.

[riqster]

30. Crowley is also the one who was all full of sympathy for the Steubenville rapists

When they were convicted and sentenced, and did not care about their victim.

Stopped watching CNN on that very day.

[riverwalker]

31. my gut says she has a tape

Her husband, Stanley Grossbard, was taped last year by an opponent of hers. She is quite familiar with how it is done.

"Sadly, the fact is, Mr. Garcia invited my husband to lunch, taped him, and tried to trick him into saying something that he could then use to try and extort me in my capacity as mayor,” Zimmer said in a statement. “Since my husband is an honest and honorable man, and Mr. Garcia is not, the only person incriminated on the tape is Mr. Garcia.”

Read more at http://www.politickernj.com/67763/assembly-candidate-charges-hoboken-mayor-zimmer-ethnic-cleansing-lawsuit#ixzz2qtJVW4X5

[CTyankee]

33. wow. that's nasty...