Seriously, WTF has happened to our country?

[al_liberal]

Nixon passed the clean water act in 1972, the clean air act was passed in 1963, the voting rights act was passed in 1965, not to mention so many other decided laws that have existed for decades.

Now we have to entertain a political party that has as its goals undoing all of these laws and returning our country to a place where anything goes? Pollute the air, water, ground and that's great because you're the job providers? I actually work with a guy that thinks clean air and water had nothing to do with Gov't regulations, and he's older than my 45 yo ass.

Now there are many groups of people that actually believe science and logic are wrong and having an education is bad. Seriously?

I can't tell you how many times I've heard from my co-workers, all of whom work for the federal gov't, say that now that the majority of voters can vote themselves "free stuff" our country has ended. What about the very few billionaires that have paid for all of their "free stuff" what about all of the corporate welfare that our country spends in the name of defense?

This used to be the country of great men and great ideas. Henry Ford, love him or hate him, more than doubled the prevailing wage of the day. We built the Hoover Dam, created the world standard for traffic lights and signs, same for airports and air travel, put Neil on the moon, built the Sears Tower, flew the space shuttle, the list goes on and on.

But now we can't do anything big, we go to war without paying for it or asking the country to sacrifice. Our infrastructure is a joke, and getting worse. We can't do anything that might benefit "we the people" less it be called socialism. Health care? Education? Promote the general welfare? Anything that might allow us to "form a more perfect union"?

It's all BS and only getting worse by the day.

When did it stop being E pluribus Unum and become Bellum omnium contra omnes?

[bigwillq]

1. $$$$$$

This happened.

[City Lights]

73. Yup.

Money trumps everything.

[Cleita]

2. We had a coup in 2000 leading to the installation of an illegitimate administration in

Jan of 2001. The damage they have done in weakening how our government operates is having repercussions to this day. That's what happened.

[RobertEarl]

4. Exactly, Cleita

The immoral leaders have only increased the immorality of the country's other leaders. And Fox news.

There are many leaders who should be in jail. To make room let out all the minor criminals. Many thought that is what Obama would do once in office; jail the big time criminals.

[CherokeeDem]

7. Couldn't agree more..

While the Regan Administration did great harm to this country, the illegitimate Bush regime and the havoc they have wreaked has damaged this country to the point I fear we can never recover.

[sabrina 1]

16. It was allowing them to go free that caused the real damage, that validated their crimes.

We can expect to have some leaders who are corrupt from time to time, but our democracy would survive if the rule of law was applied when that happens.

When crimes of such massive proportions as we witnessed during the illegitimate Bush/Cheney years go unpunished, worse they are treated like icons, asked for advice, teaching our young people in colleges, THAT is what destroyed our democracy.

Making an example of people who do so much harm to this country, and others, would let others know they better be careful. They are brazen now, knowing they have lowered the bar to the point where lying about war, violating their oaths of office, breaking International law to degrees that should be unthinkable means nothing. Things can only get worse now that the rule of law has been abandoned.

[CherokeeDem]

19. Absolutely....

There seems to be a belief that as a nation we could not survive holding Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, et all responsible for their crimes. I feel if our Constitution is as strong as we believe it to be, we would survive and be stronger as a nation for bringing these warmongers to justice. Every time I see another soldier lost, another homeless person, another job lost, all I can think of is Bush and company are to blame.

I keep hoping some day to see Bush, Cheney and the rest of these bastards hauled into the Hague to face punishment for their crimes against humanity.

You are so correct... they have now become brazen because they have faced no accountability for their crimes. Just look what happened today, Issa should have been removed from the chairmanship, but he just apologized and all is well. The rule of law has been abandoned.

[sabrina 1]

24. I am not sure if it is a belief that our nation couldn't survive applying the rule of law to

those who commit crimes like this. I think it is more that our foreign policies, until they are changed, if ever, require that kind of behavior, and no one is willing to prosecute leaders for doing what they are now supposed to do.

The country survived Nixon, and what he did pales compared to this gang. The only way we will ever see Bush et al prosecuted, is if we can replace every member of Congress with people who are not beholden to Giant Corporations who profit greatly from all of our wars. It appears to be our major export.

Even if we did replace the entire Congress, I'm not sure that would be enough. It has gone on for so long, they are entrenched and half the country buys the propaganda. So I guess it would take telling the people the truth about our foreign policy and it's hard to penetrate minds that have an almost cult like attachment to believing we are the 'good guys' no matter what instead of recognizing that we CAN still be the good guys but not if we have leaders who are not. That would be a very difficult task. Maybe impossible at this point.

[Scuba]

38. Nailed it. Thanks sabrina.

[malthaussen]

52. Damned right. And damned good, too.

In a nutshell, Sabrina.

-- Mal

[deutsey]

42. I remember telling people leading up to the 2000 election

that if Bush won, we'd be digging out of the rubble he'd leave behind for decades.

As pessimistic as I was about a Bush presidency back then, however, he far exceeded my worst expectations: stealing the election, 9/11, Iraq, tax cuts for the rich, the disaster of Katrina's aftermath, etc., etc., etc.

I hope I'm wrong, but I don't believe this country will recover from Bush in my lifetime. With global capitalism gone wild, I wonder if it can ever hope to.

[olegramps]

70. When is enough enough. Time for a revolt against the tyranny.

[Dawson Leery]

109. Much of Reagan's damage could be undone. Shrub and the Neo-cons

have caused damage that can never be undone.

[SomethingFishy]

10. And we let them get away with it...

And they have gotten away with so much since then I sit and wonder when someone is going to say enough...

It apparently wasn't yesterday when the Republicans said fuck you to our veterans. Sending a kid off to get his limbs blown off to secure money and oil wasn't enough, now we have to deny them proper care too.

Why? What is the Republican excuse for telling veterans to go fuck themselves? Can't afford it. We can borrow money to pay for the war, that's all well and good, but taking care of the cannon fodder? Too expensive.

[Arugula Latte]

12. I think it goes farther back, to Reagan.

I remember when Reagan was elected (I was all of 14) I was thinking that it felt like we'd gone through the looking glass, where all of a sudden up was down and and black was white and environmental protection was bad and women were back to second class citizens and so on and so forth.

[Cleita]

15. The difference was that Reagan won his election and so did George H. W. Bush.

The last Bush was swept into office by a group of PNAC backed operatives and the Supreme Court illegally blocking the installation of the legitimate President Al Gore. It wasn't much different than a junta of special interests and generals taking power by occupying the seat of government in a banana republic, removing the president and installing their own leader.

[Enthusiast]

44. Before the 1980 election the future Reagan Administration had

a secret agreement with Iran that they would not release the hostages until after the election.

So, no, the 1980 election was also tarnished by Iran-Contra.

[Cleita]

50. True, but the electorate, although deceived, did vote for him.

Bush was not elected but essentially seized power from under the nose of whom we now know was the elected President.

[former9thward]

60. Iran-Contra happened in 1986 after both Reagan elections.

The 'secret agreement' theory was debunked by both Senate and House investigations in 1992 and 1993 (both committees had Democrats in charge).

[Cleita]

61. Thom Hartmann has said, and I trust him to check his facts, that Reagan

made a deal with the Iranians to keep the American hostages until after the election and if he unseated Jimmy Carter and became President he would sell them the military hardware they wanted. The hostages were released almost immediately after the election. The media made it appear that it was tough talk by Reagan that scared the Iranians into releasing the hostages after the election, not a back room deal.

[former9thward]

62. It is beyond our power to do any investigations.

So we must rely on others. I don't know where Hartmann is getting his information - he certainly did not do any investigation himself.

From the Senate in 1992: by any standard, the credible evidence now known falls far short of supporting the allegation of an agreement between the Reagan campaign and Iran to delay the release of the hostages.

From the House in 1993: there is no credible evidence supporting any attempt by the Reagan presidential campaign—or persons associated with the campaign—to delay the release of the American hostages in Iran”. The task force Chairman Lee H. Hamilton also added that the vast majority of the sources and material reviewed by the committee were "wholesale fabricators or were impeached by documentary evidence". The report also expressed the belief that several witnesses had committed perjury during their sworn statements to the committee, among them Richard Brenneke, who claimed to be a CIA agent.

Wiki has a good summary of all the theories and investigations. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_Surprise_conspiracy_theory

[Cleita]

63. I'll email his show and ask him. I think there have been documents

released since those investigations.

[bvar22]

72. The Iran Hostages were released and returned to the US on the same day Reagan was inagurated.

You can check all you want tom but I was in Washington DC that day,
and I remember.

Reagan Inauguration = Jan 20, 1981
Iran Hostages released = Jan 20, 1981

Gee. What a coincidence!!!

[former9thward]

74. I suspect the Senate and House were aware of that fact.

[woodsprite]

77. I thought the plane took off once he was sworn in, even before his first speech was over.

But my 50 yo brain might be a bit blurry on that. I was a high school Sr. and was not into politics at all back then.

I was thinking this morning: Reagan. The Manchurian Candidate

[lunatica]

90. His inauguration was a split screen showing the hostages being flown home and arriving in the US

There was a lot of half transparent slow motion American flags superimposed on the ongoing inauguration and the hostages. It's was absolutely obvious that it was all staged and practiced. Reagan set the tone that would ultimately bring out the teabaggerratti after Sarah Palin was unleashed on the country.

[pangaia]

84. Exactly right. I knew it then. Anyone with half a brain knew it.

The hell with some congressional committee.

[elzenmahn]

111. I wouldn't trust Wikipedia...

...as far as I can throw it. Nearly anybody can edit it, and it's not as though false information or distortions never find their way into those pages - especially with as topics as sensitive as this.

I'm sorry, but I'll trust Hartmann over Wikipedia.

[former9thward]

112. Fine, did he do a personal investigation?

What were his specific findings?

[elzenmahn]

116. Ask him...

...I'm sure he can provide you with the background information you seek -unless (as your question seems to imply), that Mr. Hartmann is talking out of his derriere with no reference to facts.

I've listened to Thom Hartmann for many years (since his days in Portland), and have read many of his books (which are well-annotated, sourced, and researched.) I can attest to his commitment to fact-based information and a willingness to correct himself if he errs. No, he's not perfect - but he's not a blowhard, either.

[newfie11]

117. I believe this was released through the freedom of information act. Nt

[NewJeffCT]

102. Iran hostage crisis started in 1979

Iran Contra came out of that down the road. However, the hostage crisis and the failed rescue attempt made Carter look weak and ineffectual, which played right into Reagan's hands. Plus, with the secret deal that kept the hostages prisoner until Reagan took office, it really tainted the election in 1980. Who knows how differently it would have turned out if the special forces had managed a daring rescue?

[former9thward]

113. Well Desert One was a disaster.

But once the forces had been committed Carter should have gone in with everything. No retreat. That cost him the election.

[Cleita]

101. Still he was legally elected. He should have been impeached and thrown out of office

by those who knew about this.

[NewJeffCT]

99. Imagine the difference

even four years of Gore would have made? Almost makes me sick to think about it.

[Cleita]

100. Me too, in so many ways.

[raccoon]

35. Well said! nt

[Enthusiast]

43. They did not steal the election with good intentions in mind.

Now the nation is clear off the rails and they are directly responsible. They meaning Jeb Bush, Katherine Harris, the supreme court and G W Bush and his various operatives.

[pangaia]

85. JAMES BAKER the THIRD !

Biggest piece of shit of them all.

[ladjf]

79. It is a fact that we had a coup in 2000 and the perpetrators have continued to

solidify their control since then. nt

[rhett o rick]

86. While I agree that we've had a coup, I dont think it happened in 2000.

I think it happened before that time and those that really hold power (the PTB) orchestrated the 2000 appointment of George Bush the Dim-Son. I think the PTB are still in power. They have control of the intelligence agencies and therefore the country.
Wasnt it suspicious that Georgie and Dickhead, both very egoistically outspoken, simultaneously changed behavior and slithered out of Washington the DC without hardly a word. As if they had been smacked with a newspaper and told to be good dogs.

[kairos12]

96. That decision will come to be seen as first step to the undoing of the Republic.

[silvershadow]

98. You betcha. Same group responsible for the coup of 63 very well might have been behind it.

Insert any relevant actors who might be alive and a common thread between the two. Poppy's sure are lovely this time of year, aren't they?

[Doctor_J]

103. When the Felonious Five weren't dragged from their offices and guillotined, the fascists

realized we would never fight back. And thus they've gotten more rotten with each passing year.

[Cleita]

105. I know and I don't think anything will stop them any time soon. eom

[Octafish]

3. Nov. 22, 1963

Like Baby Doc Bush observed, it's been "Money trumps peace" ever since.

Papa Doc Bush was there on the ground floor.

Long, long line of warmongers, didn't appreciate JFK making peace break out and interfering with their agenda.

[Enthusiast]

45. Precisely.

Right wing criminal fucks.

[Trailrider1951]

54. You nailed it, Octafish

I'm old enough to remember what this country was like before my 12th birthday in November of 1963. It was a slow slide toward fascism since then, until Ronnie Raygun was elected. Then it accelerated like a runaway train, ending in the wreckage we see today.

[Raksha]

114. Exactly...and it's been downhill ever since. n/t

[BlueCaliDem]

5. 2010 elections, and the desire to punish Democrats. Well, it succeeded. Boy did it.

A wave of deep red right-wing, white supremacists came out, en masse, to vote, backed by Corporatists. They swarmed State governorships and legislatures that immediately began gerrymandering districts to keep seats safe for Republicans, and here we are, four years later, still being punished each and every day, with the biggest whuppin' in 2012 when 1.5 million more people voted for Democrats than Republicans in the People's House, and we still didn't win it back.

[freshwest]

11. Will it continue this election year? n/t

[BlueCaliDem]

49. If it's up to the ODSers on DU, yes. Definitely.

But I'm hoping that they won't succeed this mid-term election.

[jtuck004]

14. Note: They didn't just come out. They were exorted to come out by organizers who

were part of a deliberate campaign, and they were a part of those targeted.

(Just btw, it was announced (here, on the front page in the past day or so, iirc) that they are going to enlarge their effort.)

Not magic. Work. Home meetings, DVDs. Doughnuts. Contact. Simple messages of hate spread with effective organizing at a local level. They added to that with a lot of $ and effort into media, social campaigns, etc., though they were very effective without those They didn't ignore the top, but they sure didn't mount very effective campaigns, missed many opportunities to capitalize, etc. And lost the top. Twice.

But the core was getting like-minded haters to run for offices that were up for grabs because people had other things to concern themselves with. And they won enough of those to have an impact, and to have an impact on future elections.

Their opposition worked more from the top outward. Twice, successfully. Which has worked out quite well for a number of people, as long as they weren't in the bottom fifth or so of the population economically (their numbers have increased and they have pretty much been screwed for years). Didn't completely ignore that segment, but didn't work it like the haters, and still don't (think they took food stamps away from people making $100K a year?). This was partly because that wasn't who they were courting, and partly because of those unique variables in the country and its mood that change from time to time.

However, while those two groups will probably continue doing what they are doing, because of their conditions over the past few years that bottom fifth to about a third of the country might be ripe for a populist organizing. Could be a break away from the other two, or...? That could put that top down strategy over the top, or in the tank for a few years, as well as combat the hate-organizers. Which depends on their condition, I think, but most especially the quality of the organizers.

We will see what happens going forward.

[joshcryer]

32. This. The Democrats won my 1.5 million more votes, but still lost the House.

In what society is this representation?

[Earth_First]

6. Follow the $

It will lead you into some dark corners wherein lie the answers...

[ReRe]

8. When?

The minute Ronald Reagan was voted into office.

But it took 34 years for us to wake up and say "Where the fuck are we?"

[merrily]

20. A lot of the bad stuff started with Nixon and continued, escalating

and accelerating through Ford, Carter, Reagan, etc. And now we're looking at double secret, double speedy TPP

I don't know who has been pushing so hard on the idea that it was all about Reagan, but it's "merely false." And even if it were true, in 2008, we witnessed an extended primary battle between two Democrats who put Reagan on their respective lists of top ten U.S. Presidents ever.

[ReRe]

21. Yeah, Nixon was the one who...

... who put the brakes on raises, in 1973, if my memory serves me correctly.

As for your 2nd paragraph there, I'm not sure I follow you. It most definitely WAS Reagan. Not false at all. And do you posit PO and HRC to prove in some way that Reagan was indeed one of the top 10 President's of all time?

Excuse me, I feel sick all of a sudden....

[merrily]

22. I never said Reagan was not a part of it.

I said it was not ALL Reagan. And no, I did not mention Hillary and Obama's admiration for Reagan to bolster Reagan's reputation. Can you think of no other point to be made by mentioning that? Hint: I care a lot more about the 99% vs. the 1% than I do about Republican v. Democrat.

Sorry, but your reading comprehension and analysis regarding my post is off the wall. Maybe that's what's making you sick.

[ReRe]

23. What we have here...

... is a failure to communicate. OK? So let's not try it anymore. Peace.

[merrily]

26. Peace to you as well, but

that is not an agreement by me never to reply to a post of yours. You get to control your own posts, but not mine.

[ReRe]

28. You know...

... I felt bad and went back and reread everything we wrote in the entire exchange. I stand by everything I said, including the fact that we have a failure to communicate.
You post whatever you want, wherever you want, whenever you want, however you want.

[valerief]

9. The race to become the first trillionaire is serious business and the very wealthy

must pinch our pennies.

[DallasNE]

13. What Unregulated Capitalism Looks Like

And what this country would look like after a few short years should deregulation be "successful".

https://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images;_ylt=A0LEV00iUBlTNHkAPVpXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTByaHEyNGMxBHNlYwNzYwRjb2xvA2JmMQR2dGlkA1VJQzFfMQ--?_adv_prop=image&fr=ytff1-yff27&va=smog+pictures+in+china

[malthaussen]

53. Haiti's better. China just looks like Pittsburgh when I was a boy. n/t

[DeadLetterOffice]

88. I remember the grey snow

that my mom wouldn't let us eat.

[quinnox]

17. Its been all downhill ever since Bush was elected

The next president may be critical to stop this nose dive, hopefully we will get a really good, strong, and bold president.

[merrily]

18. Ask rather, What can we do to make things better?

Why is it that every time Democrats get unhappy with the status quo, they start praising POS Republicans like Nixon, Eisenhower and Goldwater?

Nixon didn't pass shit. His Democratic Congress was the only part of the government passing bills.

Helping the Congress and the President to do better were very active liberals in the population. And, on top of that, the entire Republican caucus was not batshit spiteful and totally indifferent to their fellow USians.

As for what happened, the one word answer is greed.

More specifically, lobbyists got changes in the laws that had been working well for the majority, some of them dating back (conceptually) to Teddy Roosevelt. Antitrust laws, regulatory schemes, New Deal securities laws, New Deal bankruptcy laws, tax laws, Glass Steagall and so on.

As a result, companies were able to get massive, no longer caring much about human safety or their communities. They screwed unions and workers and took jobs overseas.

And, if you think that was all Republicans or all Reagan, you need to clear your head.

Of course, things are more complicated than the above, but answering the OP question completely would take a several volume book collection.

But, what can we do about it? And, if we knew, would we do act?

[DavidDvorkin]

25. The 1980 election happened

The media did its part by gushing adoringly about Reagan, during the campaign and then during his presidency. That election was the turning point.

[merrily]

30. I disagree.

I don't think there was a single turning point. However, if one election has to be a turning point, I would say Nixon, not Reagan.

[unblock]

55. the forces of greed have a long, strong history here. progress punches through only occasionally

our time will come again, but it is always an uphill battle.

[merrily]

56. Yes. Soon. Please. nt

[DavidDvorkin]

58. In 1968, I would have agreed with you

Humphrey's loss felt like a disaster to me at the time.

But in 2000, I felt that it was Reagan.

[merrily]

59. I don't understand. How could you have

assessed whether his administration would be a turning point or not?

In any event, I think it was Nixon, Ford Carter that began the trend that has been accelerating ever since. If you think it was Reagan, we differ, which is fine.

[YoungDemCA]

27. Backlash to the political, cultural, economic, and social upheavals of the 1960s and 1970s

That's what happened.

[struggle4progress]

29. The actual history teaches us it's always been an uphill fight

... Let me give you a word of the philosophy of reform. The whole history of the progress of human liberty shows that all concessions yet made to her august claims have been born of earnest struggle. The conflict has been exciting, agitating, all-absorbing, and for the time being, putting all other tumults to silence. It must do this or it does nothing. If there is no struggle there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom and yet deprecate agitation are men who want crops without plowing up the ground; they want rain without thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the awful roar of its many waters. This struggle may be a moral one, or it may be a physical one, and it may be both moral and physical, but it must be a struggle. Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or with both ... Frederick Douglass (1857)

When we have no coherent and well-organized action demanding specific changes, we don't get change. And posting opinions online simply doesn't count as coherent well-organized action for change

[merrily]

31. I agree with Douglass, but he died a long time before the Security State.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

33. I once heard Studs Terkel speak, and someone ask him why Reagan got elected

and was popular with so many people.

Terkel's answer: "He made it OK to be stupid. Stupid people recognized him as one of their own."

In the ensuing years, politicians and the media have made it OK to be stupid AND mean.

[Enthusiast]

46. What an excellent quote!

And a perfectly accurate observation by Studs Terkel as far as I can determine.

[lunasun]

115. +1 !! exactly

[Junkdrawer]

34. Challenging authority involves a lot more than picking the right clothes...

Getting angry and expressing the anger is one thing, actually doing the work and educating yourself to where you challenge authority effectively is different,

Blame the victim? No, determined "victims" are the only way out.

[corkhead]

36. we've reached the point where one player has all the good properties with hotels on all of them

The game is actually over; we are just playing it out while the lucky one drains all the other players of their remaining funds.

[marions ghost]

41. Ouch

Good Analogy

[OnionPatch]

71. That's it in a nutshell.

I tried to explain to my right wing brother in law why we needed to tax the rich and raise the minimum wage and this was the only analogy that seemed to sink in. A little. For about a minute. Then he went and turned on the O'Reilly Factor.

[The_Commonist]

92. I used a similar analogy recently.

It might not be totally accurate, but it painted the picture that the person I was talking to could understand:

Imagine you are playing Monopoly.
One player owns half the board.
There are another 41,176,471 players.
They own the other half of the board.
Does that sound like a fun game you want to play?

[Scuba]

37. Terrific OP with many great replies. Kick.

[marions ghost]

39. Well said. We need to keep asking this fundamental question

What we are witnessing today is IMO truly worse than in the past. Many reasons have been offered in this thread, all valid, all part of the puzzle. The way things operate now--the greed, the corruption, the deep divisions, the control and exploitation by narcissist thieves--is weakening and sickening this country. I see it all around me--the negative effects of Corporatocracy--the collateral damage of this crass and cynical period in US history. No country can progress under these conditions. No country succeeds when its citizens are beaten down.

All the rhetoric about the common good, investing in the people, having the best interests of the public at heart, etc etc --amounts to a Big Lie in America today. With very few exceptions, our leaders are not working for the majority of us anymore. It is a profound betrayal of public trust.

The only thing we can do is come together and demand reforms at all levels of government. Together. As isolated individuals we have no clout. Yes, these are dark times. To stop being victimized we have to fight back on every front possible. Devise a plan of action, no matter how small. Envision a different future and make it happen.

[corkhead]

40. the conversion from Bedford Falls to Pottersville is nearly complete

George Bailey actually drowned

[TheKentuckian]

47. Our economic system returned to form and in the process trashed or dented the shit out of much

of many hard fought gains.

[Enthusiast]

48. Seriously, people, this thread should have hundreds of recommendations.

Don't we all agree that this nation has passed into a state of crisis?

[malthaussen]

51. Well, for one thing, the counter-revolution wasn't televised.

The people who didn't want all those good things then (and their descendents) feel the same way now. They've been working for years to undo all legislation since, say, 1902.

How did they do it? A fear-and-guilt ridden rising generation drank deeply of the "Morning in America" soporific and decided to party like it was 1952.

-- Mal

[meanit]

57. As a nation, we have let the hard right Republicans and Conservatives take over.

There has never really been any mystery over what these guys are about. They looted the country into the ground in the 1920's and early 30's and then got their asses booted out of any lasting power for about 50 years. They have since fought tooth and nail to screw up or eliminate EVERY program that has helped anyone other than the super rich since FDR's New Deal, and their seething hatred has not wained over the years.

The "go along to get along" politics, the bi-partisan "efforts", the reaching out to the other side, the caving in to demands, have all proven to be a waste of time and repeated attempts at these tactics are bordering on delusional. You can't negotiate and talk with these types of people, you can only defeat them and try and keep them from raising their ugly heads again.

It's way past time that we as an opposition party realize this and acquire the leadership needed to stop these neo-fascist bastards.

[rickyhall]

64. And they want to hire a foreign company,

an Israeli company, to build a "Berlin" wall to keep poor brown people out!

http://www.alternet.org/civil-liberties/apartheid-wall-arizona-israeli-company-contracted-build-us-mexico-border-fence

Show me the logic. . .

[WillyT]

65. HUGE K & R !!! - THANK YOU !!!

[SleeplessinSoCal]

66. great questions. obama's promise denied by real thugs

I think it's a disease.

[grahamhgreen]

67. IN A NUTSHELL: We stopped taxing excessive wealth, and they took that money and ruined our country.

[seabeckind]

68. The stage was set by Reagan.

Upthread there were many references to his actions but I lay it all at his altar.

He gutted the Sherman Anti-trust enforcement.

He instituted a policy that any gov't regulations could not impose undue hardship on businesses.

He laid the groundwork for the elimination of the Fairness Doctrine

He destroyed the power of labor even on top of the travesty of the Taft-Hartley.

He made it fashionable to be stupid and un-American to be educated.

Etc.

He ought to be dug up and reburied face down.

If he hadn't been elected, there wouldn't have been a Bush anywhere near the white house.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

69. See what happens when white men feel their power slip?

[Blue_In_AK]

75. Two words...

Ronald fucking Reagan. Oh, wait, that's three.



And I agree with Octafish. The assassinations certainly didn't help anything.

[mstinamotorcity2]

76. Well al_liberal,

Welcome to the and Welcome to DU. I don't know if I am happy for you or sad. Happy because you are aware of your true surroundings. Or Sad because you are aware of your true surroundings. It can do one of two things. The First is to stand up find your voice and do something about it. The Second is to sit back and complain. Though you are here at DU, you will not agree with all things. But you will learn that you are not alone. You will not be fighting a battle alone. And your battle is with people who have enough money to buy elections, Supreme court Justices, Newspapers, College and University departments, and just when you think okay I can DIE and I won't have to worry, there is this thing called Dead Peasant Policies that lets them benefit off that!!!

[moondust]

78. Financialization and unbridled greed.

In the 1980s the post-war "broad prosperity" economy was transformed by Republicans into a "wealth concentration" economy of unrepentant greed addiction and selfishness based on the corporate/Wall Street model.

According to Pat Buchanan ( ): Thanks to the Republican Party, Corporate America got it all.

[factsarenotfair]

80. "The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity."

The CPAC meeting brought this to mind:

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.

Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.
The Second Coming! Hardly are those words out
When a vast image out of Spiritus Mundi
Troubles my sight: somewhere in sands of the desert
A shape with lion body and the head of a man,
A gaze blank and pitiless as the sun,
Is moving its slow thighs, while all about it
Reel shadows of the indignant desert birds.
The darkness drops again; but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

The Second Coming, W.B. Yeats

[liberalmuse]

81. My answer?

Reagan and the 1980's. Americans bought into the bullshit. I remember watching Reagan during his campaign pretty much belittle Jimmy Carter's campaign of conserving energy. We're AMERICANS! The GREATEST COUNTRY ON EARTH! We don't have to conserve energy. We are entitled. There is a reason why I felt a deep sense of doom as we were going into the 1980's. This is where the worm turned, and we're still paying for the Reagan-led national vanity, arrogance and greed.

[secondvariety]

83. I agree.

Some may say Nixon, but I don't think Nixon's main objective was to destroy the working class. Reagan's disdain for anyone not rich and powerful was obvious.

[n2doc]

82. Propaganda works

Next time they go with the 'free stuff' crap, remind them that politicians used to promise things like "two chickens in every pot" to voters. The US survived. Now, they promise to take things like medicare away from voters, but also promise to give their tax dollars to military contractors and banks. Those are the real 'takers'.

[BlueJac]

87. Tell it how it is!!!!!!

[DeadLetterOffice]

89. The 60's and early 70's were an aberration.

Take a good long look at the history of this country. Read Howard Zinn. It's always been about the people with the money winning. We as a society have despised the 'undeserving poor' since the colonial era, have bought into the 'we could get rich too' mythology from the beginning, have let industry trump pretty much everything all the way along.
The good stuff was a statistical anomaly.

[yawnmaster]

91. Circa 1995...

About the time where we became able to complain about situations and be heard by many more people, and worldwide. The time where we could read others similar ( and divergent) thoughts, reinforcing ours.
The time where news could be viewed immediately and on a more global basis.
Diverse data started to become more available.
The birth of the the World Wide Web.

Good and bad changes have always been happening, but now one can have a bigger window on the world.
Perception has changed.

[DeSwiss]

93. ''Chaos is required for the veils to fall down.''

- K&R

[awoke_in_2003]

94. One of my co-workers...

was rambling on about global warming being a hoax today. Another one jumped in and said he could be right, but then said that the clear cutting of rainforests was bad because trees create oxygen. First coworker stated that cutting down the rainforests wasn't that bad, as trees are horribly inefficient oxygen producers. I left the room before I throttled somebody.

[blkmusclmachine]

95. Faux propaganda works. Hate radio works. Underfunding schools and poor curricula works.

The U.S. is EXCELLING at putting the finishing touches on George W. Bush's Total Information Awareness Program, including the use of 30,000 aerial Drones to watch you in your neighborhoods, surveillance cameras at every intersection and along highways and toll roads, recording devices implanted into your automobile to snitch on you, roving license plate scanners, and implementing cameras and audio recording devices into new digital televisions. The Police State has arrived, and the Bill of Rights has been gutted with the (un)Patriot Act I and II, etc.

Question is, which US citizens are the Feds gonna go after first??? There are lots of empty prisons to fill up.






9/11: A BEGINNING, OR AN END???

[mountain grammy]

97. Yes, I think it started with Reagan.. he made it ok to be stupid.

[Doctor_J]

104. Because we don't fight back

IMO if a few hundred hate radio hosts were to disappear over the next couple months, things would begin to change

[Doctor_J]

107. 4 replies before the DINOs/BOG blamed it on Dems

Guess what. Your Messiah's appeasement and Republican policies are going to get us another whipping this year. Why don't you try acting like Dems for a change and see if that helps.

[BarbaRosa]

108. The conservative revolution.

[spin]

110. I suspect the rich are running our nation and those we elect are simply puppets ...

that pass whatever legislation the rich want as they are largely dependent on donations from the wealthy to insure that they stay in office. If they don't deliver on what the rich want, the donations flow to their opponent.