The E-cig poll thread

[Kurska]

I want to see where DU stands on this.

Personally, I think they should be regulated to ensure the safety of the product.

Feel free to post your reasoning in this thread too, I'd like to know more about the nuances of opinion on DU regrading this issues.

43 votes, 1 pass | Time left: Unlimited
	E-cigs should not be regulated in any way
	4 (9%)
	E-cigs should be regulated to ensure product safety only
	37 (86%)
	E-cigs should be regulated to ensure product safety and sweet flavors like fruit should be banned
	0 (0%)
	E-cigs should be regulated to ensure product safety, sweet flavors should be banned and fines established for vaping in public areas
	2 (5%)
	E-cigs should be regulated to ensure product safety, fines established for vaping in public areas, but sweet flavors should be allowed
	0 (0%)
	E-cigs should be banned outright
	0 (0%)
	i like 2 vote
	0 (0%)
	Do not wish to provide an answer
	0 (0%)
	1 DU member did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[surrealAmerican]

1. How about ...

..."regulated for product safety, and sold only to adults"?

[Kurska]

2. As of current, I know of no one who sells e-cigs to under 18's anyway.

However, that might have been a good option.

I'm 100% sure everyone on DU agrees with that anyways. I've never seen someone opposed to that idea when it has been mentioned.

[Voice for Peace]

3. "nuisances of opinion"

I know what you mean!

[Kurska]

4. Lol nice catch

Fixed

[Warpy]

7. Apparently some people are selling to kids somewhere

which is always somewhere other than where you live but you just know they are.

I say fine, stupid kids are going to do stupid things and when they run out of juice and try the real thing, there is no way they're going to switch to it, it tastes nasty.

[Mariana]

9. So they say.

Of course, kids get regular cigs if they want them, so whatever methods they use to do that (fake ID, older brother, whatever), they can also use to buy e-cigs.

[Warpy]

18. Exactly. Regulations can slow it down but not stop it

and sometimes that's the best you can do and that's not a bad thing.

It's like those apocryphal cyanide laced Halloween candies that have parents throwing out all the apples and home made caramel corn the kids bring home. While some sleaze somewhere might be selling the things to kids without fake IDs, there aren't that many of his brethren.

And it will still turn kids off to the real thing when they try it. That's a good thing.

[yurbud]

80. they still look like toys to me.

[bigwillq]

5. E-cigs should be regulated to ensure product safety only

Gets my vote.

[Ms. Toad]

6. Product safety and advertising.

Nicotine is highly addictive. Advertising of the kind which created generations of people addicted to cigarettes should be regulated. Tobacco companies are already employing the same tactics they used so successfully to create generations of people addicted to cigarette smoking to entice people to use e-cigs. In order to survive, they need a new (addicted) client base - and they know very well how to create one since this is not their first time at the ball.

[Mariana]

8. Should they be permitted to advertise zero-nicotine e-cigs?

Since they're NOT addictive in any way if they have no nicotine.

[Ms. Toad]

26. I have mixed feelings on that.

But I think ultimately I would subject it to the same restrictions - in the way that non-alcoholic beer and wine are often subject to the advertising restrictions placed on alcoholic beverages.

It isn't that the zero nicotine e-cigs are addictive, but that they are indistinguishable in appearance and source from ones which contain nicotine. Nicotine addiction is such a powerful addiction - and the money behind e-cigs is the same money which deliberately targeted minors, and women, and any new audience which it perceived would provide it with a financially lucrative future as long as it hooked them young. I don't trust them.

[Sunlei]

56. no they should not.

In no way should an advertised candy or sweet look like a person is smoking a cigarette.

[jmowreader]

79. How hard is it to convert a zero-nicotine e-cig into a nicotine-containing one?

The disposable ones may pose a problem, but the refillables and the ones where the battery and tank/cartridge separate are pretty easy to switch between nicotine and non-nicotine.

[ZombieHorde]

10. I'm in between the first two. nt

[penultimate]

11. I'm against flavored e-cigs...

particularly those ones Po-210 flavored ones imported from Russia... I don't trust Putin when he say's there safe.

[etherealtruth]

12. add "not sold to those under 18" ....

.... to the product safety choice and it would get my vote.

It has not been illegal in Michigan
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2014/03/06/michigan-senate-says-no-to-sale-of-e-cigarettes-to-minors/

[LadyHawkAZ]

15. You beat me to it

In Utah you have to be 19 to buy, the same as for regular tobacco, and I have no problem with age restrictions.

[McCamy Taylor]

21. I'm 53, I dont smoke and I have an e-cig that I use for my migraines

as aroma therapy. The liquid has no nicotine. One is green apple. The other is lavender. I don't see why someone under 18 can't have no nicotine e-cigs.

[etherealtruth]

22. You are right for the non-nicotine

Nicotine is a particularly tough addiction to beat ... I hate the idea of making it easier for kids to become addicted to anything.

[CreekDog]

53. Why does a lack of nicotine make them safe?

There are chemicals and compounds, you should never assume something's healthy to put deeply into your lungs on purpose, and for the developing lungs of child? Have you thought as deeply as you've inhaled. I don't think so.

[Sunlei]

67. I agree with you. I don't see any reason to have kids inhale 'scents' or 'flavors' other than they

'copy' adults smoking.

I do understand the use of (NON- tobacco) e-cig nicotine to get off regular 'cancer stick' smoking. e-cigs are a huge aid to quit cigarettes.

I don't understand why adults would want to inhale flavors or scents either

[CreekDog]

75. agree 100%

[energumen]

77. I can't imagine why

Adults would want to inhale scents either. The people using those Glade/Febreeze air freshener things are insane

[Prophet 451]

13. For product safety and age restriction

My SO keeps trying to get me to try e-cigs as I'm one of those people who actually enjoy smoking.

[bigwillq]

14. I enjoy smoking as well, as bad as that sounds

and is. I quit several times. I even tried the e-cig for a bit; it was pretty good. But still nothing better than a real cigarette.

[Logical]

28. Why is enjoyable about smoking? I understand the addiction. But cannot understand how.....

breathing in smoke is fun.

[bigwillq]

30. I find the process of smoking enjoyable and relaxing

It starts with opening up the pack, the smell, pulling a fresh smoke out of the pack.

Then, getting a lighter out, clicking the spring a few times (I like that sound). Moving on, I find the act of lighting a cigarette kind of hypnotic.

I like the feel of a cigarette in my hand. I also enjoy inhaling and exhaling the smoke out of my lungs and mouth. You get used to the taste and the burn of the smoke.

I guess I just really enjoy the whole process of smoking.

I've tried other methods (lollipops, E-Cigs) when I quit, but nothing satisfied my oral fixation like smoking an actual cigarette.

[Logical]

31. Hmmm.... one of those things I guess I will never understand. Like people snorting coke, etc. n-t

[bigwillq]

32. Cool. I won't bore you with another story then......

I enjoy rolling the dollar bill.......



Have a good one.

[Logical]

44. I appreciate your story though. Thanks!! nt

[LuvNewcastle]

63. Same with me. I think it's the whole ritual and the anticipation as much as

the act itself. Sort of like sex, I guess. I have a bit of a fire fetish, too, so I'm sure that's part of it as well. It's very hard for those of us who genuinely like smoking to quit. I did quit with e-cigs for 3 weeks, and that is by far the longest I've gone without smoking since I started at age 15. I plan to try again, but I can only do it when I'm determined. I'm pretty fed up with the cost (again), so I think I might be quitting soon.

[Prophet 451]

42. It's an acquired taste

As bigwillq said, it's the whole process. The idea with e-cigs is that they replace the nicotine we're hooked on without all the nasty chemicals in tobacco and also replace the action of smoking.

[sibelian]

61. That's a little difficult to answer.

I know it smells awful, but the taste isn't the same as the smell. It becomes an acquired taste, like whiskey. People end up with favourite brands for this reason.

[Mariana]

64. Since people have been smoking

various kinds of plant matter for centuries or perhaps millennia, there must be something they all liked about it.

[meow2u3]

16. I second the product safety and age restriction

I nix the "sin tax" on an activity that's not a sin.

[CTyankee]

17. Since I'm not sure what "sin" means, except contextually, I can't vote in this poll...

I really don't have enough information to make an informed vote...

[meow2u3]

19. Vaping is not a sin

[CTyankee]

23. OK, I am really talking about the science attached to this...

I know next to nothing about vaping but I do have an aquaintance who uses an e-cig device. I don't condemn her at all...I consider her a very concerned person who wants to quit smoking and I am supportive.

But I don't know anything about the science about this. I can't vote as a consequence...

[bigwillq]

20. I hate the sin tax on cigs in CT

I get it:
They tax a product that is known to be unhealthy and they tax a product that most folks choose not to use. If you don't want to pay the tax, don't smoke.

Following this logic, though, I feel they should tax other unhealthy products like soda, fast food, etc.
We know these items can lead to disease, and folks can choose not to consume those items.
So why not include those items as part of the sin tax?
Government is being discriminatory towards smokers.

Taxes are so high in CT. Even with all the tax money, the state never seems to have enough money. They are wasting our money if you ask me.

[Prophet 451]

43. I don't understand a tobacco tax when you have no health system

I get why the government taxes smokes here (UK). We have the NHS, smoking costs the NHS around £6.8 million a year so we're taxed to make up the funds. That makes sense to me (although we actually pay more in taxes than we cost in treatment). But I don't understand it when you don't have a healthcare system to support.

[CTyankee]

50. Not sure about soda but isn't fast food taxed?

I don't buy/consume either one except very occasionally...so what do I know. But I know restaurant meals are taxed, no matter how healthy they may be...

[bigwillq]

57. They are taxed

I just feel they should be taxed more heavily than non-fast food. Just like how they add additional taxes on to cigarettes.

[CTyankee]

58. Healthy food should be taxed MORE than bad food? Can you clarify that?

Sorry if I misinterpreted what you said...

[bigwillq]

59. Fast food should be taxed more than healthy food (nt)

[CTyankee]

60. that's what I thought...

[bigwillq]

62. This time change messes with me

I might of misspoke in a previous post.

[CTyankee]

73. I probably misread...I don't think I could really claim the time change cuz I've been this way for

a while now.

[rucky]

27. Me too, but I got a really good e-cig for Christmas and haven't smoked since.

I enjoyed smoking, but this is even better. Get one that uses the drops, a glass chamber and has a good battery. Then the trick is to find a flavor that gives you that same "hit" feel when you inhale. I sway between a cinnamon one and a mint-based mix, but had to try a lot of formulas before I found some that I liked better than smoking.

[Prophet 451]

40. They sound tempting

What I think I'm going to do is try a bunch of disposables until I find a brand I like.

[krawhitham]

24. What do you want to regulate?

99% of the people here want regulation

Do you want to regulate the batteries?
Do you want to regulate The Mods (what the batteries go in)?
Do you want to regulate the tanks?
Do you want to regulate the atomizers?
Do you want to regulate the cartridges?
Do you want to regulate all in one units?
Do you want to regulate the flavors?
Do you want to regulate the Nicotine?

Do you want to stop users from making their own e-juice?

Regulation = taxation plain and simple and in order for the FDA to regulate E-Cigs they will have to classify them as a tobacco product. Last time I checked my vaper has ZERO tobacco in it. Nicotine can be sourced from other plants besides tobacco.


What do you want to regulate?

[The Straight Story]

25. I think some folks just want to control others and their choices

Which seems counter to liberalism in general imho.

[gollygee]

34. It's counter to libertarianism

but liberalism is not opposed to government regulation.

[The Straight Story]

37. not opposed to regulation but choice limitation in things

like abortion (though some do like to push for more regulation in the name of health) would be a little over the line don't you think?

Just because some regulation makes sense does not mean all of it does.

The government can know what is best for people but that does not mean it has the right to limit your freedom to do it.

[gollygee]

38. The government regulates cigarettes because they don't want children to use them

and I think e-cigs should be regulated like them, but I don't understand why people shouldn't be allowed to use them outside or whatever one of the choices was. Can you even tell if someone around you is using one?

I wouldn't want kids to have them available, I'd rather they not be advertised on TV or to kids, but otherwise I don't care and don't see why people shouldn't be able to use them. Or marijuana for that matter. I don't see why society at large is affected or would be affected much by either one. It really just affects the individuals using them. Alcohol has a worse effect on society than either e-cigs or marijuana IMO.

[Mariana]

69. You can't tell if someone around you is using one

unless they're blowing huge clouds of vapor around. It's very easy not to do that. People vape all the time in all kinds of places, discreetly, and no one notices.

[TheBlackAdder]

39. The control are the major tobacco firm's stranglehold on those who smoke.

Besides that, one of those firms was the co-founder of the Tea Party.

That's where your money is going. Fighting health care, the environment, and the many laws that protect Americans.

===

Even it you get those cigs from an American Tribe, thinking you're not funding them... you are, as they're owned by the big tobacco firms.

[Ghost in the Machine]

74. +1,000,000,000!!!

I always thought that "Live and let Live" was one of the founding principles of being a Liberal. Let people live their lives as they see fit, as long as they aren't hurting anyone else in the process, and keep the Government out of our *personal* lives so they could stay focused on keeping the corporations in check, making sure they weren't mistreating their workers, were paying a fair wage for labor/services provided, providing safe workplaces, providing proper breaks per hours worked, making sure our air, waterways and groundwater weren't being polluted intentionally or unintentionally.. and many other things to protect our freedoms and rights to "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness".

We wanted the Government out of our bedrooms, out of our homes and taking care of the Country first and foremost! What's they difference between a woman saying "my body, my choice" in regards to abortion and *me* saying the same thing about hitting a joint, or hitting a nicotine-free E-Cigarette?? The Federal Government has more, and bigger, things to worry about right now. Things like creating jobs, fixing our infrastructure, helping the homeless, needy and poor fixing Health CARE, not friggin, Health Insurance Companies! I could keep going, but I think you get the gist of what I'm saying...

Peace,


Ghost

[Curmudgeoness]

35. Most of the voters here want to regulate product safety,

which is not an FDA issue. And since we have (and should have) agencies to regulate consumer product safety, taxation is not necessarily a result. I don't see many people advocating regulation of anything but product safety.

[krawhitham]

47. Question remains, what do you want to regulate? What do you believe is currently unsafe?

An e-cig is a simple object. A case/mod holds a battery, it has a switch that supplies power to a metal coil that when heated vaporizes a liquid

Do you want to regulate the batteries?
Do you want to regulate The Mods (what the batteries go in)?
Do you want to regulate the tanks?
Do you want to regulate the atomizers?
Do you want to regulate the cartridges?
Do you want to regulate all in one units?
Do you want to regulate the flavors?
Do you want to regulate the Nicotine?

[Curmudgeoness]

49. It really is simple.

All of the components should be safe to use. No fires, no explosions, etc. I am not saying that any parts or units are unsafe right now, since I do not know. But I think that there should be some regulation that says these problems, if they do occur, are not acceptable to be sold.

A lamp is a simple object as well, but I do not want to worry whether it will start a fire when I plug it in.

[Prophet 451]

41. I want to regulate the nicotine

Neat nicotine is a drug and phenomenally poisonous. I want to see that part regulated in the same way as we age restrict alcohol. If your personal mix doesn't include nicotine, good luck and more power to you.

[Sunlei]

51. safety only. make sure the product doesn't have fungus/bacteria in the liquids, small parts that

could be inhaled into the lungs. The nicotine part is toxic in high doses if say a child gets ahold of it and drinks it all, decent child proof packaging on nicotine part of the products.

[Tikki]

29. It's not about the flavor it is about the nicotine.

Tikki

[TheBlackAdder]

33. If you use an E-Cig... Just admit the nicotine dependence and oral fixation needs. nt

[phleshdef]

45. I'll admit it and I'm not a damn bit ashamed of it.

[Mariana]

65. I admit it - although I use zero nicotine fluid now.

So now that I've admitted it, what, exactly, has that accomplished?

[Curmudgeoness]

36. Why would anyone want to ban vaping in public places?

What is the problem? I really don't understand.

[Eleanors38]

46. Some folks have problems with mouths; the things going in them...

and coming out.

[Douglas Carpenter]

48. Why should people be allowed to use a tobacco product in a way that doesn't smell or bother anybody

or hurt any bystanders? That's cheating.

[Curmudgeoness]

72. It seems that those who are opposed to public vaping

have no reasons as to why they are opposed. Talk about cheating.

[Sunlei]

52. design one that looks like an "asthma inhaler" could solve the in public problem.

[Revanchist]

54. I'll give you one better

[Sunlei]

55. That's pretty noticeable too :) who wants to carry a coke can around.

what I meant is a way for nicotine addicts to take their oral dose without the 'public regulators' freaking out. There is always gum like President O uses or used to use People seem to like inhaling their dose.

People could always hold their 'hit' until no vapor comes out or exhale into their sleeve lol.

[Mariana]

66. People already do that.

Stealth vaping is very easy to do. A rig that doesn't resemble a cigarette, and that has no glowing LED on it, helps a lot, as does not holding the same way a smoker holds a cigarette. If someone doesn't look like they're smoking, and they don't blow huge clouds of vapor around, no one pays any attention.

[Curmudgeoness]

68. I have thought the same thing, but not an asthma inhaler

(although that is excellent, since who would confront someone with an asthma inhaler). I am at a loss as to why it has to look just like a cigarette, and light up like a cigarette. A pen shape was what I was thinking. When I went looking for e-cigs, I at least wanted one that was black or had a color to it and did not have a red light. I only found one type like that and when I ordered it online, it was out of stock....and after a few months of "out of stock", I just gave up. But I still want something that does not look like a cigarette. For years, before patches or gum or e-cigs, I have said that all I want is a nicotine delivery device....meaning I did not need to have a cigarette with all the other chemicals and the dangerous smoke. Someone was listening to me, I guess, but these cigarette replicas make no sense---they still draw attention.

[Mariana]

70. Most of the kits come with batteries that have LED's on them.

That's a fact. But you can buy compatible batteries separately that don't have them. You can also buy black replacement LED covers (very inexpensive) that hide the light, for some types of batteries. You can even cover the LED with a bit of electrical tape and it won't interfere with the operation of the device.

I don't know how long it's been since you looked, but black e-cig kits are very popular and they shouldn't be hard to find.

[spin]

78. If people stop smoking cigarettes and instead smoke ecigs, isn't that am improvement? ...

Ecigs for one thing do not endanger others.

Even better is that ecigs allow some people to totally quit smoking who might have been unable to do so.

One big advantage of ecigs is that they don't contain 3000 different chemicals like cigarettes and another advantage is that the buyer can step down the level of nicotine in his ecig to zero and be only inhaling water vapor.

[ohheckyeah]

71. Sure - let's get the government to regulate them like they do

food. They can allow the juice to have rat feces in it, just like hamburger. The juice can be made from GMO products, just like our food. The juice can be sold past it's expiration date, just like our food. Hell, they can even declare some of the juices as vegetables, just like they did catsup.

[Mojo Electro]

76. I say reglulate for product safety.

I bought a vape setup to quit smoking cigs. I'm very happy with the results so far. Even though sometimes I still feel like I want a real cig, I have not bought a pack. I'm starting to feel the benefits of not smoking anymore, not being winded, having more energy, and I no longer worry about my clothes smelling like smoke. So far so good.

[jmowreader]

81. How about this:

1) No sales to under-18.

2) The part of the charger that plugs into the wall must meet electrical safety standards published by an organization like Underwriters Laboratory. (There are UL-approved USB chargers on the market that aren't expensive.)

3) E-liquid can contain only purified water, propylene glycol, vegetable glycerin, food-grade flavors, and nicotine. (I've seen reports that Chinese liquid contains metals like tin.) E-liquid may not contain controlled substances.

4) Liquid must be labeled with nicotine content, and the labeling must be accurate. (IIRC someone was selling shop-made liquid with insanely high levels of nicotine and it was making people sick.) Liquid must also be labeled with the name and physical address of the producer.

5) Anyone may mix their own liquid for personal use. Nicotine liquid sold to individuals must be labeled with an accurate statement of nicotine concentration. Crystalline nicotine, due to its hazardous nature, may not be sold to individuals. Individuals who prepare e-liquid for sale as a "cottage" business must have the capability to meet the composition and labeling requirements listed herein.

6) Retail establishments that produce e-liquid for sale on the premises must have appropriate weighing and measuring equipment, personal protective equipment for the employee performing the mixing operation, and a sink to clean equipment before and after mixing.

7) Any container of bulk e-liquid holding one ounce or less will be taxed at the rate of twenty-five cents per container. Any container of e-liquid holding more than one ounce will be taxed at the rate of twenty-five cents per ounce. Any pre-filled cartridge, cartomizer or tank will be taxed at the rate of five cents per unit. Containers of nicotine liquid will be taxed as e-liquid, and the tax will be calculated as follows: determine the number of ounces of 24ml e-liquid that can be produced from the contents of the bottle, subtract three ounces to compensate for nicotine liquid clinging to the walls of the bottle, and apply a 25 cent per ounce tax to the bottle.

[Kurska]

82. A very thoughtful post

I think you covered most of the major bases.

[jmowreader]

83. I can only think of one thing I missed

Bottles of liquid nicotine would be required to come with an MSDS and instructions telling you how much nicotine to add to your e-liquid to get various nicotine levels in the final product.

[Michigan-Arizona]

84. Where I buy mine locally here in Tucson, AZ

You can not even enter the building with a minor. You can't even bring a new born baby into the store. No kid's period....


The charger that come's with any e-cig I've bought I can use part of my cell phone charger with it....


My bottles of juice are labeled with the nicotine level, stated on the bottle if I get extra flavor, their company name , address & phone number....

I pay 8 1/2 percent tax on my total bill. I was paying over 9 percent till they lowered the rate down to over 8...

[nadinbrzezinski]

85. I will follow what local authorities decide to do in the matter

and will not bother people with their decisions. Suffice it to say, regulations are coming.

[Vidi]

86. Almost 4 years without a cigarette thanks to Vaping

Four years ago, I was a mess.

I had tried everything to quit smoking over the years and failed miserably. I couldnt laugh without it descending into a coughing fit. I couldnt climb a flight of stairs without being forced to sit and catch my breath when I reached the top. In the winter, when I went outside, I couldnt breathe and would end up coughing so badly I would vomit.

I had tried everything to quit and failed. I had resigned myself to the idea that cigarettes were going to kill me and kill me very soon.

Then I heard about electronic cigarettes. I tried one...it was ok...but I was still smoking. So I went to a forum ( the biggest e cig forum in the world ) and asked a few questions. The answers came quickly...yeah...the e cig I bought was not very good..try this one here.

And I did.

And since that day four years ago, I havent had a single cigarette. I can climb stairs again, I can laugh again, I can walk out into -30 weather without ending up doubled over coughing my brains out.

Electronic cigarettes changed the quality of my life...and gave my my life back...all without the horrible effects of the 4,000 plus chemical tobacco companies have pushed into cigarettes to make then even more addicting.

If you are a smoker, I strongly urge you to make the switch and get back your life.