Regarding Phelps.

[MarianJack]

Before I say anything else. let me say that I consider Phelps to be a completely detestable human being as lacking in any human decency or redeeming quality as most members of the George w Shithead administration and quite possibly worse than some. It amazes me how he could have taken his merry band of pea brained and soft headed congregants to the funerals of deceased service people to make the point to the families that their loved one deserved to die because "Omuraca tolerates dem hummasechuls"!

That being said, it has bothered me to see so many here hoping that he has a great deal of pain and suffering in his last hours and rejoicing at the prospect of his death. Please understand that I have no pity or sympathy for him, but aren't WE better people than the teabaggers? Isn't one of the things that make us better than the teabaggers the fact that we DON'T rejoice over the suffering of others?

Don't get me wrong. I fully expect that there is a special corner of Hell for Phelps and those like him, but I don't believe that it's right for us to act the same way that the teabaggers do in the reverse circumstance. There are too many other ways that we can counter them for us to act lie them.

That's my 2 cents, and quite possibly overpriced at that!

PEACE!

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. I don't wish suffering on him, and I don't think he will go to Hell

because I don't believe in Hell (although sometimes I wish I did). However, when he's gone there will be a little less evil in the universe, and I won't be even slightly sorry he's dead.

[eShirl]

2. having to be Fred Phelps was miserable enough, imo

[Lint Head]

3. Suffering? No. Protest of this despicable person's funeral? Hell yeah.

I will carry a sign saying God Hates Bigots. You always hear, "You shouldn't speak badly of the dead." But he ain't dead yet.

[Luminous Animal]

13. I think a better protest would be a silent one with a rainbow flag or banner. Zero expressions of

hate.

[Lint Head]

28. For one to deny hate is to deny humanity.

[Lancero]

67. And to embrace hate is to become a monster.

You embrace that hatred, your no better then Fred himself.

[Lint Head]

75. There are gray areas of hate which is the

opposite of love. I do not love stepping on dog excrement. I actually hate it. Hating hate does not make one a monster. You have the right to your opinion. To say only monsters hate, you must navigate monsters throughout your day. Hate is an emotion which does not necessarily result in monstrous damage. It can actually save a person's life.

[Lancero]

78. There is a diffrence between feeling hatred and embracing hatred...

You can hate Fred for his actions. This is human.

You can feel hatred for events. This is human.

What isn't human is to use that hatred as justification for the death of a group of people. What isn't human is to attack someone, or the family of that person, in a time of emotional turmoil. To do either of these things is to become a monster - To do either of these things is to become no better then Fred Phelps is.

[Lint Head]

86. Good. No one is doing any of these things so there are no "monsters" on DU.

[calimary]

14. Well, then remember what Bette Davis said about speaking ill of the dead.

Paraphrasing -

"My mother told me never to speak ill of the dead. Joan Crawford is dead. Good."

[Mojo Electro]

4. I hope he goes peacefully.

And then the world will be rid of him, and that whole bad chapter will be over.

[Hekate]

5. He created the monster that is now hurting him. That's punishment enough for his dying days....

Let God/dess deal with his soul in the hereafter. Or as the Pagans sometimes say: It's your Hell; you go there.

[Lost_Count]

6. Well...

1) Wishing suffering upon him won't make it happen one way or the other... Might as well pray for it...

2) This is the only chance we are going to have for the sick fuck to get a hint of the pain that he has put onto others. Once he croaks, it is out of our hands.

[MarianJack]

84. I don't frankly care what it does to HIM!

What does it do to you?

PEACE!

[PowerToThePeople]

7. I understand what you are getting at.

But, I still can't wait to



Hey Phelps, this message is for you...

[Luminous Animal]

15. May I ask a personal question? (And totally understand if you don't answer.) Do you believe in God?

[PowerToThePeople]

21. Agnostic.

If there is, I doubt Hate is an emotion it has. The second pick was pulled from a Phelps protest, I felt it was fitting to toss it back at him.

[Luminous Animal]

24. I'm an atheist and if I were to protest, I'd toss love back at him.

[PowerToThePeople]

31. That was good

Can't believe the lady at the end trashing Karen's beautiful song with her hate. Sad. Honestly, I am still a work in progress. I still have my struggles with controlling anger. 8 years of * lies and evils hurt my soul (or whatever part of the brain function we equate with a soul.) There was a period during/after '08 when I started healing. That got stomped. I realize happiness comes from within, but it is not always an easy path to navigate...

[Luminous Animal]

35. Hugs. I really appreciate your lovely heartfelt response.

[dflprincess]

8. To quote Clarence Darrow

'I've never wished a man dead, but I have read some obituaries with great pleasure.' (sometimes attributed to Mark Twain as well.)

I just wish Jesus would break precedent and interrupt regular programming (especially and Fox) to show us the chat he and Fred have when then meet fact to face.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

12. I will read Fred's obituary with great pleasure.

[dflprincess]

19. For sure.

back at ya!

[backscatter712]

22. Mark Twain's quote is good.

“I did not attend his funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it.”

[UTUSN]

9. That's a very old premise, we're BETTER. No, we're not. We are all just human. n/t

[Luminous Animal]

16. Perhaps you are not but I am. It was a very important part of my liberal upbringing.

[840high]

29. Thank you. No

grave dancing for me.

[UTUSN]

69. Well, add me to your list of who you're better than. I can never be more than "all too human." n/t

[Cha]

10. Well said.. thank you.

There is a vast difference between teabaggers and progressives.. and this is one them.

[babylonsister]

11. Love ya, I feel the same way. xoxox nt

[blkmusclmachine]

17. The man deserves at least a little of the misery he helped dish out. No sympathy whatsoever.

[Autumn]

18. I don't want him to suffer, I just want him to be with his god as soon as possible.

Personally IMO his god sounds like a real asshole and I'm sure old Phelps will have a rough enough time with him.

[GoCubsGo]

20. That's pretty much how I feel about it.

Besides, it won't be long before God is telling him that he actually really loves "fags", just like everyone else, and to me, that's enough.

[maindawg]

23. God rest his soul

[eShirl]

25. according to Topeka Capital-Journal, he's in hospice

http://cjonline.com/news/2014-03-16/wbc-spokesman-said-fred-phelps-sr-was-healthy-month-he-entered-hospice

After Phelps was voted out of Westboro Baptist Church this past summer, he was moved out of the church and into a house, where he was watched to ensure he wouldn’t harm himself, a son estranged from the church said Sunday.

Phelps eventually stopped eating and drinking, and on Sunday, he was near death, son Nate Phelps said in a Facebook posting. The information also is based on an email sent by Nate Phelps to a Topeka Capital-Journal reporter.

&quot Fred) is at Midland Hospice House where, as of yesterday (Friday), he is comfortable without the respiratory difficulty that he was having the day before and is unresponsive," Nate Phelps wrote, quoting a message sent to him.

[DesertDiamond]

26. In Buddhism, hell is not a place, it's a condition of life we experience. Someone as full of hatred

as Phelps is already in hell. I don't hate him, I'm sorry for him. But, and this may or may not seem to make sense, but the fact that he's among us also reflects our own collective karma. Until we change our collective karma, more Fred Phelpses will appear to take his place.

[jmowreader]

27. This man had to be bribed with radio airtime to keep him from protesting a 9-year-old's funeral

This is no shit: That worthless fuck was going to protest the funeral of Christina Green, the child who was murdered by Jared Loughner during the attack on Gabby Giffords. A local radio station gave them airtime if they wouldn't carry out their threat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church

Matthew 7.21 says it all: "Not everyone who says to Me, "Lord, Lord," shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in Heaven."

?itok=ALwVLedt

If this is the will of God in Heaven, Christians are more screwed than they thought.

I hope he dies in the kind of agony only Dr. Kevorkian could have ended. He's caused enough for everyone else.

[rpannier]

30. Sorry. I hope he is pain and suffers

He is a despicable creature and has brought nothing but misery to so many people.
This is not about being better than someone else or another group.
I was glad when Falwell died, Pinochet and others.
It doesn't make me or anyone who shares my view lesser for wishing as much ill-will on the man as possible.
He is reaping what he sowed.
No apologies, no remorse.
If I were in the area, I'd show up at his funeral in a white tux, with top hat and cane and dance all over grave

[MarianJack]

82. What you want him to go through won't effect HIM at all.

My concern is that so many of our people are giving themselves heartburn over this old bigot bastard. He's not worth it!

PEACE!

[zappaman]

32. Fuck that guy.

Big time.

[Vashta Nerada]

33. I hope he's suffering, both mentally and physically.

He's a detestable human being.

[3catwoman3]

58. You could have ...

...saved youself a few key strokes and just gone with - "He's detestable."

[Vashta Nerada]

60. Why?

He's a piece of garbage and he doesn't deserve my respect.

Why do we have to be "nice" to despicable, dying people?

[3catwoman3]

62. I'm sorry I didn't make my point more clearly, as I ...

...quite agree with you. I was taking a shortcut to saying that I think he does not deserve to be called a human being.

[flvegan]

34. For some, the ego wants/needs revenge.

It's about *them* and how *they feel* about something. It's a human emotion. We're all guilty of it from time to time.

[LostOne4Ever]

36. There is no better weapon to fight against hate, than compassion

Hate begets hate and anger begets rage. The only way to break free from the broken circle of hate and violence is not to take part in it.

I oppose the man and all he ever stood for, but I hope that his passing is as painless as possible and that his family is comforted...and hopefully one day enlightened to their bigoted behaviour so that they can change and make amends.

[babylonsister]

52. Thank you. Yes. nt

[LiberalAndProud]

37. Our moment.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/fred-phelps-founder-of-anti-gay-westboro-baptist-church-stopped-eating-and-drinking-says-son-1.7409563

Equality Kansas:
"This is our moment as a community to rise above the sorrow, anger, and strife he sowed, and to show the world we are caring and compassionate people who respect the privacy and dignity of all."

[catrose]

38. I wish the rainbow-painted house across the street

would hold a prayer vigil in their front yard.

[ReRe]

39. Birth isn't easy...

... and death isn't either. Phelps isn't going to suffer any more than anyone else on his way out, but it will be very difficult for his family to be present throughout the process. However, I think he's going to get a big surprise when he gets to the Pearly Gates. One of two things will happen: God will turn him around and send him straight to Hell, or all there is is lights out, game over. Personally, I think it's lights out, game over, but I live each day trying to be more like Jesus.

[AtheistCrusader]

40. That... man... made a career out of hurting humans that were already grieving loss.

And he's at the finish line. He's going to get away with all that pain and suffering he caused.

People he attacked with no regard for political affiliation, race, creed, gender, nothing. Any death would do for him to trot out his soapbox and spew his poison at the humans gathered to grieve a loss. He took away the peace and solace they had gathered to find.


I'm not going to enumerate the ways in which I hope he is suffering mightily, but I don't feel a shred of hypocrisy leveling the same sort of hate at him. He started it. He's slowly getting away with it. He'll never be held to account.

You could power a city with my hatred toward that man.

[babylonsister]

59. "He'll never be held to account." But he is.

We all know who he is; to kill him with kindness, when he could never find any? That would piss him off! But we are all better than he will ever be: I take lots of comfort in that.

[AtheistCrusader]

72. I have a regret.

That he didn't live long enough to see Same-Sex Marriage legalized in all 50 states.

[awoke_in_2003]

41. I do not wish suffering on anyone

but the world will be a better place once his sorry ass croaks.

[deafskeptic]

42. He won't be missed.

However, I find little joy in his suffering and I won't dance on his grave. It is enough for me that he won't be around to spread hate anymore.

[pipoman]

47. If that were only true. .

It is enough for me that he won't be around to spread hate anymore.

[pipoman]

43. It isn't just what he did to strangers

It is the hate that he nurtured for so many years, to so many people. ..children. .His own and other weak minded people's children. ..then his grandchildren. He is a pariah and should always be regarded and remembered as the abuser he was. Now that he is dead we get to live with his legacy for generations to come. No, what ever people feel toward him is just fine, and however those feelings manifest themselves is just fine too...there are times when God is fine with hate imo..

[Samantha]

44. It took some courage to post this thread

So I am going to have to recommend it and let you know I totally agree.

Sam

[MarianJack]

81. Thank you, Samantha!

PEACE!

[itsrobert]

45. Sorry there is no Hell

in my opinion. And no heaven either.

[DeSwiss]

46. Thank you.

- This is the kind of class that's been missing around here.

K&R

''Now, to balance the scale, I'd like to talk about some things that bring us together, things that point out our similarities instead of our differences. 'Cause that's all you ever hear about in this country. It's our differences. That's all the media and the politicians are ever talking about--the things that separate us, things that make us different from one another. That's the way the ruling class operates in any society. They try to divide the rest of the people.

They keep the lower and the middle classes fighting with each other so that they, the rich, can run off with all the fucking money! Fairly simple thing. Happens to work. You know? Anything different--that's what they're gonna talk about--race, religion, ethnic and national background, jobs, income, education, social status, sexuality, anything they can do to keep us fighting with each other, so that they can keep going to the bank!

You know how I define the economic and social classes in this country? The upper class keeps all of the money, pays none of the taxes. The middle class pays all of the taxes, does all of the work. The poor are there just to scare the shit out of the middle class. Keep 'em showing up at those 'jobs'.''

~George Carlin

[mountain grammy]

54. George got that right!

[DeSwiss]

68. Yes he did.

- Quite a few as a matter of fact:

The main reason Santa is so jolly is because he knows where all the bad girls live.

'I am' is reportedly the shortest sentence in the English language. Could it be that 'I do' is the longest sentence?

Electricity is really just organized lightning.

Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

I have as much authority as the Pope, I just don't have as many people who believe it.

“Shit, piss, fuck, cunt, cocksucker, motherfucker, and tits. Those are the heavy seven. Those are the ones that'll infect your soul, curve your spine and keep the country from winning the war.”

[closeupready]

48. Was Fred Phelps really worth the time and energy it took you

to post that, hon? Bless your heart, but I can't muster the bother to care about him or his fate, or how DU reacts.

[Jamastiene]

65. If only all of the people who want everyone to send love to Phelps

would instead send that love to more GLBT organizations that help gay youth and possibly try to talk even one gay kid from committing suicide, it would do a lot more good.

But, for some odd reason, they'd rather wag their fingers at those who have been hurt by Phelps and feel animosity toward him for all the harm he has caused, then send love to Phelps while he is dying.

That is very strange to me.

[Daemonaquila]

49. Oh please.

Let's not play "more genteel than thou." If we are going to be as judgmental of him as any Teabagger is of us, AND A READING OF ANY POST ABOUT FREDDIE SHOWS WE ARE, let's cut the crap and feel free to honestly and joyfully dance on the dickwad's grave.

[Fearless]

50. As a gay man and an atheist

I hope he recovers and lives a long long time. Why? Because I want him to see the world slipping further and further from his ideals, every second being further than the last. I want to see him ignored. I want to see him see the world that is accepting of LGBT people. I want him to see the US be a nation that encourages marriage equality. And most of all, I want him to see that hatred and bigotry do not win.

I'll happily stand as bulwark to his bullshit in the meantime.

[babylonsister]

53. Perfect!

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

55. We like to think we're better than they are...

Here's our chance to prove it. When Fred Phelps passes, resist the urge to say things that make you sound like one of them.

[tomm2thumbs]

56. "Addicted to Hate" - link

For those that haven't read it, link to the story... from court records

Found it many years ago, and it resurfaces every now and again -- basically a writer who was about to have an article about Phelps and his clan published, found out Phelps' group was trying to block the story from going to print as it was unflattering to their church. Afraid of potential lawsuits, it seems the publisher, Topeka Capital-Journal, apparently felt the heat and agreed to make sure the story would not see the light of day.

The author, being much more clever than those who were trying to block the story, sued the publisher about the incident and attached the entire story as evidence, thus turning it immediately into public record....

....yes, for all to see.

[3catwoman3]

61. I tried to read that but...

..it is just too disgusting. If there is any sort of Hell, Phelps has earned his place in it.

[Jamastiene]

66. Brilliant idea.

I'm glad that author did that.

[Oakenshield]

57. I want to try to be the better man.

Just can't manage it in this case. He's as rotten as they come, and richly deserves any misfortune that comes his way.

[Jamastiene]

63. In all honesty, to me, whether he lives or dies, is a moot point.

His daughters have taken over the church and run it now. The hatred will still be there with or without him. A lot of people think cutting off the head of that church will end the hate. It will not. The daughters have been running the show for the past 10 years or so anyhow. So, that part will not change. He is just the figurehead of the church nowadays anyhow.

To me, the real story is why he was excommunicated back in August 2013. I'm really interested in why that happened. No one has told why yet. I wish some journalists would dig into why that happened and get the story, because that is something I want to see.

I don't begrudge people who feel pleasure over him dying though. As a gay woman, I understand the feeling and would never begrudge anyone that pleasure. He has caused irreparable harm to the GLBT community for decades now. I say more power to those who are able to feel any animosity at all at the thought of his passing.

Me? I feel nothing at the thought of his passing. The reason I stated above is why I feel nothing. His legacy of hate lives on with his daughters who now run the church and will continue to be a thorn in the sides of the GLBT community for the foreseeable future. Whether he lives or dies doesn't amount to a hill of beans in my life, one way or the other. I refuse to waste an emotion on such a horrid, wretched man anyhow.

I do have a problem, however, with those who want to go to his funeral and stand out there sending love to him. I don't see having some kind of lovey dovey religious love-a-thon for him at his funeral like some are proposing. Whether they agreed with his anti-gay, anti-everything beliefs, or not, the idea of sending him love is preposterous. The man never responded to love in his entire life. He only had hatred. Sending him love is a waste of resources and a waste of love.

Send that love and resources (in the form of donations) to some group of people who deserve it. Make donations to gay youth organizations or other GLBT charities instead. It would actually help people who need it instead of wasting the resources to get to Topeka and fawn over him to try to "take the high road."

That "take the high road" mentality, in this case, is bullshit. Trying to pretend that you are better than him seems kind of ridiculous. Think about it. Do you really need to try to prove you are better than a man who poisoned himself with that kind of seething, lifelong, obsessive hatred? If so, what is wrong in your life than you think you need to do that? It should be a given that most people are less hateful than he is/was, already. So trying to prove you are somehow better than him is a waste of time, effort, and energy. Get down off the cross. We need the wood to try to build houses and help people who need it.

Let the man live or die and ignore his ass. Do something positive and productive instead of wasting love, piety, and self aggrandizing "we are better than that" grandstanding on someone who definitely does not deserve it. It's bullshit.

[Behind the Aegis]

64. A thousand times "YES!!!"

I BEG you! PLEASE, for everything that is holy and unholy, POST THIS AS AN OP!!!!

PLEASE!

I have to be able to recommend it properly!!!

[snooper2]

70. there is no heaven or hell, so the the only suffering the asshole would get for his crimes

would be while he is still here breathing our air..gross...we share air with his family

[AtheistCrusader]

73. Maybe his family will start to move on, or sunder into part that does, and does not move on.

Hope springs eternal.

[Shankapotomus]

71. You're, of course, right

But with some people you just can't help it. They push all your buttons.

[Marrah_G]

74. I would be dishonest to say I don't want him to suffer

I do want him to suffer.

I don't particularly like that fact about myself and I stop myself and think from a less emotional place and remind myself that suffering is not good, even when it's someone I hate, someone who has done horrible things.

[stopbush]

76. Some of us don't believe in Hell. Apparently. you do, which gives you the easy out

of not wanting him to suffer in his final HOURS, believing that god - not you - will punish him for an ETERNITY. That makes god responsible for his suffering, not you. Convenient, is it not?

My feelings - there's no Hell, and the only justice is in this world, not some make believe afterlife. Anyone wishing any pain on Phelps better be wishing for that small dose of "justice" to be handed out in THIS life, because once he croaks, he's out of his misery, even though the misery he's inflicted on others will persist for years.

You're right, we shouldn't necessarily act like tea baggers and wish the worst on someone, but we also shouldn't act like most tea baggers who are Xians, and who firmly believe in a hell of eternal suffering, and in a god who holds us in higher esteem than other human beings, so much so that he will toss our personal enemies into a special corner of Hell, as a favor to us, if nothing else.

[MarianJack]

80. What does the hatred and bile that so many have for Phelps do to HIM?

I care about people on my side not giving themselves ulcers. I don't give 3/10 of a rat fuck for Phelpsor his merry band of pea brains!

PEACE!

[stopbush]

83. For some people, venting their anger keeps them from having ulcers.

For some, saying the negative things you just wrote in your post are just as bad as wishing someone to suffer.

If people wish to vent at Phelps they should be free to do so without the finger wagging BS.

[MarianJack]

85. Oh please!

There was nothing in my post that was finger wagging!

[stopbush]

87. No finger wagging? Here's your post:

"What does the hatred and bile that so many have for Phelps do to HIM?

I care about people on my side not giving themselves ulcers. I don't give 3/10 of a rat fuck for Phelps or his merry band of pea brains!"

Let's start with "hatred and bile." That's not finger wagging? How about the thrust of your post: that hatred and bile do nothing to hurt Phelps (so, stop it!)?

The remainder of your post is finger wagging at Phelps & Co.

[MarianJack]

88. Baloney!

[Kelvin Mace]

77. The greatest curse I could wish upon him

would be that he be judged as he judged others.

But even I am not that vicious.

Folks, you do not have to forgive him, you just have to be better than him, and that is NOT a high bar.

[Zorra]

79. I believe that anyone who carries as much ignorance and hate in their consciousness

as Phelps does is already way deep in one of the nastiest hells imaginable.

I don't pretend to know what happens to human energy after we die, but if death is the end of existence, then Fred is probably far better off dead than in the awful hell of hatred that is, and has been, his sad, miserable life.