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Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:34 AM

This is, more or less, what we're up against:



130 replies, 10438 views

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Reply This is, more or less, what we're up against: (Original post)
CaliforniaPeggy Mar 2014 OP
NYC_SKP Mar 2014 #1
CaliforniaPeggy Mar 2014 #3
lastlib Mar 2014 #115
Warpy Mar 2014 #112
1000words Mar 2014 #2
CaliforniaPeggy Mar 2014 #4
joshcryer Mar 2014 #7
Scootaloo Mar 2014 #11
daleanime Mar 2014 #22
joshcryer Mar 2014 #23
JI7 Mar 2014 #24
joshcryer Mar 2014 #25
hobbit709 Mar 2014 #40
joshcryer Mar 2014 #42
hobbit709 Mar 2014 #45
joshcryer Mar 2014 #48
Chathamization Mar 2014 #65
hobbit709 Mar 2014 #69
Chathamization Mar 2014 #71
Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #41
joshcryer Mar 2014 #43
Bobbie Jo Mar 2014 #47
joshcryer Mar 2014 #50
Bernie2016 Mar 2014 #117
Chathamization Mar 2014 #56
grahamhgreen Mar 2014 #84
bullwinkle428 Mar 2014 #96
Enthusiast Mar 2014 #38
upaloopa Mar 2014 #58
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #109
LondonReign2 Mar 2014 #70
swilton Mar 2014 #89
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #104
1000words Mar 2014 #12
treestar Mar 2014 #49
cui bono Mar 2014 #108
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #110
Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #119
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #128
Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #129
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #130
upaloopa Mar 2014 #57
Adrahil Mar 2014 #62
JaneyVee Mar 2014 #67
grahamhgreen Mar 2014 #83
Puzzledtraveller Mar 2014 #92
Auntie Bush Mar 2014 #93
1000words Mar 2014 #95
1StrongBlackMan Mar 2014 #102
Kilgore Mar 2014 #126
flamingdem Mar 2014 #5
Terra Alta Mar 2014 #6
1000words Mar 2014 #14
CFLDem Mar 2014 #27
ErikJ Mar 2014 #20
grahamhgreen Mar 2014 #82
hfojvt Mar 2014 #8
adirondacker Mar 2014 #17
Enthusiast Mar 2014 #39
ctsnowman Mar 2014 #87
Kablooie Mar 2014 #9
WillyT Mar 2014 #10
rhett o rick Mar 2014 #13
Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #120
rhett o rick Mar 2014 #123
WhaTHellsgoingonhere Mar 2014 #15
JI7 Mar 2014 #16
DrDan Mar 2014 #32
JI7 Mar 2014 #34
DrDan Mar 2014 #36
blkmusclmachine Mar 2014 #18
newfie11 Mar 2014 #33
treestar Mar 2014 #53
Andy823 Mar 2014 #66
treestar Mar 2014 #72
Chathamization Mar 2014 #75
Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #121
Beartracks Mar 2014 #19
madfloridian Mar 2014 #21
ZombieHorde Mar 2014 #26
SleeplessinSoCal Mar 2014 #28
JI7 Mar 2014 #29
SleeplessinSoCal Mar 2014 #101
tabbycat31 Mar 2014 #113
Name removed Mar 2014 #30
RandiFan1290 Mar 2014 #31
JI7 Mar 2014 #35
Maedhros Mar 2014 #118
Enthusiast Mar 2014 #37
Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #54
upaloopa Mar 2014 #59
Enthusiast Mar 2014 #68
sendero Mar 2014 #44
Shankapotomus Mar 2014 #46
TBF Mar 2014 #51
treestar Mar 2014 #52
Bluenorthwest Mar 2014 #55
llmart Mar 2014 #60
Adrahil Mar 2014 #61
NM_Birder Mar 2014 #63
MineralMan Mar 2014 #64
greatauntoftriplets Mar 2014 #74
MineralMan Mar 2014 #76
greatauntoftriplets Mar 2014 #77
MineralMan Mar 2014 #78
greatauntoftriplets Mar 2014 #79
JI7 Mar 2014 #103
MineralMan Mar 2014 #107
Iggo Mar 2014 #73
Zorra Mar 2014 #80
grahamhgreen Mar 2014 #81
SomethingFishy Mar 2014 #85
johnlucas Mar 2014 #100
Lydia Leftcoast Mar 2014 #122
TheKentuckian Mar 2014 #91
grahamhgreen Mar 2014 #97
Orsino Mar 2014 #86
Demo_Chris Mar 2014 #88
Puzzledtraveller Mar 2014 #90
cry baby Mar 2014 #94
Phlem Mar 2014 #98
chompers Mar 2014 #99
cui bono Mar 2014 #105
Kilgore Mar 2014 #125
cui bono Mar 2014 #127
Sancho Mar 2014 #106
Berlum Mar 2014 #111
yuiyoshida Mar 2014 #114
Bernie2016 Mar 2014 #116
Kilgore Mar 2014 #124

Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:37 AM

1. Sad, but very true, Peggy.

 

Sometimes it's hard to Get Out The Vote for those of us who are less angry.

But we have to try.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:40 AM

3. We do have to try, my dear NYC_SKP...

So much rests on our succeeding...

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:44 PM

115. EVERYTHING WE LIVE FOR rests on our succeeding!!

PLEEEAZE, people realize that fact!! The life you save by voting this year may be your own--or that of someone near and dear to you. If Repubs continue to gain power, we as a nation, and as human beings living on planet Earth, face a long, severe decline.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 04:46 PM

112. Well, the Facebook bird is terrified on some level

of Republicans who are going to try to take her pills or ring or IUD away from her. Whether that will translate into a vote is unknown at this point.

Other than that, it's tough to vote for the business as usual that's killing you. Tbat's really what the party is up against.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:39 AM

2. Give folks a reason to be excited to vote

 

It's really very simple.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:40 AM

4. That's it.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:46 AM

7. If there wasn't so much ratfucking it'd probably be easier.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ratfucking

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ratfucking

"Ratfucking" was a term used by Richard Nixon's campaign insiders to describe electoral fraud and dirty tricks they used against their opponents. The term was coined by political operative Don Segretti, who claimed it had come from his college days when he stuffed ballot boxes for student government candidates. Segretti was hired by the Committee to Re-elect the President (CRP) to work his ratfucking magic for Nixon in the 1972 elections and funded by laundered money coming in through CREEP slush funds. Segretti and a number of other ratfuckers worked from CREEP to destroy the campaigns of Democratic opponents.

Their methods included distributing faked letter and press releases, astroturfing "activists" and "protestors," disrupting political conferences using the old "order a hundred pizzas in someone else's name" trick, vote contracting (literally paying people for votes), espionage tactics, and general dickery. One of the ratfuckers happened to be Karl Rove, who was the head of the College Republicans at the time (they teach 'em early).

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:06 AM

11. Let me explain the way it works to you.

 

If a Democrat sells himself or herself as, essentially, a moderate republican... they're not going to motivate the base. Because the Democratic base, contrary to Rahm Emmanuel and other right-wing Democrats, actually is the left, often several shades more left than the standard Democrat. They're not going to be enthused to vote for someone who's more like a Republican from the 80's than what they want, and the Republicans sure as fuck aren't going to, since they're in a conservative death-spiral.

"But Scootaloo," you might say, "It's better to have a bunch of Democrats in congress than a bunch of Republicans!"

Generally I'd agree with that. The trouble is, that's just not how voting even WORKS.

People really do not go vote with their minds full of how many seats total nationwide are at stake in congress. it's not Fantasy Football. People aren't fans, voting for a team. People are individuals voting for other individuals.

What I mean is that, sure, it might be a tight contest between the parties on a given cycle, it could come down to one or two seats... But Debby Schuss of Hoboken still isn't going to vote for a center-right Blue dog, just to fill a seat with a Democrat. She wants a representative who represents her interests, not a representative who is against those interests but can serve as a useful cog at a federal level.

Democrats need to give people reasons to vote for them, rather than just begging for votes against Republicans.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:38 AM

22. +1

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:50 AM

23. Yeah, that's exactly why Grayson and Feigngold lost in 2010...

They just didn't motivate the base enough.

Now let's look at how politicians work. Wendy Davis, for example, lauded on DU, few would criticize her, has a very high conservative rating, and even omitted the liberal stuff on her website and in campaign rhetoric.

Today it's about copy testing and polling. Setting up an image that sells really damn well, and pushing that image.

I'm not disagreeing that some in the base aren't feeling represented by the candidates, but they can run if they feel that way, it damn sure beats posting on forums about how their interests aren't represented. And even if they lose at least they won't be doing the job of the Nixon-esque ratfuckers out there. And if you don't think they exist or even have a substantial impact, one need only look at every damn election year scam they pull. It's 99% of the time the Republicans fucking with the vote.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #23)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:57 AM

24. how about those who are going to primary the people who endorsed Christie ?

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Response to JI7 (Reply #24)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:59 AM

25. Oh yeah, I've seen a few on DU.

Hell, Cristie is himself an example of ratfucking, since the bridge closing was pure political recrimination.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #23)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:28 AM

40. It's getting increasingly more difficult to vote D

while carrying a barf bag and holding my nose. I want to see a REAL choice between R and D rather than "I'm not as bad as the other one."
I haven't missed an election since I was old enough to vote but it's hard to get excited when there is no clear distinction.
I vote Democrat because there is no viable Socialist option but at one time the Democrats were closer to Socialists in philosophy than to the Republicans.

Lately it's become more of a case of which party is going to fuck me over the worst. I can remember a time when no Democrat running for office would have even considered putting SS cuts on the table.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #40)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:29 AM

42. So run.

I'll give $500 to your campaign. Run.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #42)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:35 AM

45. What are the chances of a broke hippie ex-pot dealer living on SS?

$500 won't even pay for what it would take to file. And so far at least all the gerrymandering engineered by Tom DeLay has still left me with Lloyd Doggett as my Congresscritter.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #45)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:44 AM

48. 0.001 percent.

Possibly less. The problem with the party is people are running who have huge coffers and just want power. They don't actually give a damn about civics.

You exaggerate the requirements, it's $5k to be recognized by the FEC. This is purely for reporting purposes. You can run without a dime in your pocket. Knock on doors, raise the $5k. This is the United States, any civilian can run. Welcome to democracy.

Shit one of these days I might change my name and run, because too much shit is posted under my name and I'd lose, handily. I might be able to get around it if I changed my name and Google didn't dump 99% of my socialist / anarchist opinions to be easily used against me by the fascists in this country. We got a lot of good progressives on DU. They should run. There's no reason they shouldn't. Some of us are more radical than others. Some of us can't because we've said stuff that would damage us politically (being against the government sort of rules me out). But many of us, many of us can run.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #45)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:20 AM

65. To become a precinct committee officer? Might be pretty easy.

Governor, probably harder. But it’s going to be difficult for progressives to win the higher offices if there isn’t a strong foundation at the lower level.

Also, where I am there are a number of good primary candidates that get overlooked because people assume that they’re all the same. Not sure if that’s the case where you are, but it’s possible.

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Response to Chathamization (Reply #65)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:29 AM

69. My precinct is solid D. 79 and 74% Obama in 08 and 12.

The primary turnout two weeks ago was piss poor. Almost all the R's in the precinct voted and only about 24% of the D's

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #69)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:17 AM

71. 24%-so if you convince a small fraction of Democratic voters to come out and vote for a progressive

the progressive will win. Of course, doing so is difficult, because most people just don’t care, and those that do often care for the wrong reasons (personal connection, the feeling they get about the candidate, etc.).

Which goes to show that the problem isn’t just that the candidates aren’t progressive. When progressive candidates do run, a lot of the time no one cares enough to notice, and when they do people don’t actually care enough to support them (opinion leaders on the left supporting Norquist supporters over progressives, supporting Weiner or Quinn over Deblasio, supporting Booker over Holt).

Being progressive in theory doesn’t mean much when in actuality it means no support for progressive candidates and paying attention to opinion leaders on the left that would rather recreate Sunday morning talk shows than inform voters about progressives. Don’t get me wrong, there are huge failures here, but they are failures across the board.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #23)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:28 AM

41. Exactly.

This is the way it "works" in reality.

Good post.

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Response to Bobbie Jo (Reply #41)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:32 AM

43. Mind you, it sucks.

But that's American politics for you. People with the most money pushing their way into office. Even in the latest special election the Democrat outspent 2:1 and yet they still lost. Why is that? Because the Democrats are infiltrated, heavily, by ratfucking sabatogers. We're fucked for the time being. We don't have the number to overcome this demoralization effect. But once we do? Holy shit. We're so golden.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #43)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:39 AM

47. Well

You know what they say....

When voters turn out - Democrats win.

The GOP has known this for years.

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Response to Bobbie Jo (Reply #47)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:46 AM

50. Definitely.

There are more Democrats than Republicans and that is more true every day. It's the damn off-election years where we bemoan our own party and shut down the vote and bitch and complain about every trivial bullshit thing our democratically elected President, as not a dictator, can't do. No shit, the President can't magically introduce wide ranging reforms, he's not a fucking dictator!

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #50)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:29 PM

117. I think 2014 will be better.

Many stayed home in 2010, saw the result, and will not do that again.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #23)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:16 AM

56. A lot of truth in this

A lot of the time when I talk to voters, including high-information voters, they're relatively clueless about their candidates policy positions and tend to vote based upon their sense of that person. When people do pay attention to the policy positions, it's often only on a couple of issues. This becomes even more evident in local elections where you have turnouts in the teens with the people who have bothered to turn out often Googling the candidates the morning of the vote.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #23)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:57 PM

84. They lost cuz the billionaires went after them tooth and nail.

 

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #23)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 02:11 PM

96. REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS is the issue that propelled Wendy Davis into the white-hot

political spotlight!!

I love how certain people are now trying to spin her image into some kind of hard-core pseudo-Dixiecrat that we all have to get behind if we're ever going to make any kind of political headway in red states.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:17 AM

38. Why is it

that you can figure this out while so many cannot?

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:42 AM

58. Keep going you have about 5 or six reasons not to

vote there. Can't you think of a few more?
You think the opposite is being said on the right?
No they will vote and work to restrict our vote but you help because you restrict yourself. I have no respect for that.
There are down ticket reasons to vote. The action is also local.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #58)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:56 PM

109. Yes ...

 

we need to energize unenthusiastic Democratic voters ... by repeatedly telling them that Democrats suckz and/or the same as republicans!

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:06 AM

70. +1,000 Scootaloo

Well said

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:41 PM

89. +2

 

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:42 PM

104. That ...

 

Democrats need to give people reasons to vote for them, rather than just begging for votes against Republicans.


is not what the academic research says.

And who is Debby Schuss of Hoboken?

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:08 AM

12. Same as it ever was ...

 

Classical Roman Senate makes us look like pikers.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:45 AM

49. BS

Just tell them to vote; it's their civic duty. Why all the drama? Why don't the Republicans have to be "excited?" People who don't vote are contemptible and stupid, not people we are responsible for coddling more. Jesus. This meme is sickening. Are you making excuses for them?

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Response to treestar (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:54 PM

108. The R's *are* excited.

They get excited by all the propaganda.

They're afraid their guns are going to be taken away.
They're afraid the socialists are taking over.
They're afraid their marriages are going to be ruined.
They're afraid of everything they're being told to be afraid of and they come out to vote to stop what they fear.

Those are the messages the R's put out and that's what their uninformed base responds to. It's emotional politics. It's about messaging and the Dems suck at it.

Dems need to put out something positive for the people to vote for. As it is all they do is react and play defense and play not to lose. They need to play to win! Of course we need to get money out of elections so we can be certain they're playing for the right team.


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Response to cui bono (Reply #108)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 04:09 PM

110. Question ...

 

Which do you believe is the more compelling call to action (i.e., voting):

They're afraid their guns are going to be taken away.
They're afraid the socialists are taking over.
They're afraid their marriages are going to be ruined.
They're afraid of everything they're being told to be afraid of and they come out to vote to stop what they fear.


Or,

Job Creation

• Infrastructure – substantially increases infrastructure investment to the level the American Society of Civil Engineers says is necessary to close our infrastructure needs gap

• Education – funds school modernizations and rehiring laid-off teachers

• Aid to States – closes the recession-caused gap in state budgets for two years, allowing the rehiring of cops, firefighters, and other public employees

• Making Work Pay – boosts consumer demand by reinstating an expanded tax credit for three years

• Emergency Unemployment Compensation – allows beneficiaries to claim up to 99 weeks of unemployment benefits in high-unemployment states for two years

• Public Works Job Programs and Aid to Distressed Communities – includes job programs such as a Park Improvement Corps, Student Jobs Corps, and Child Care Corps

Fair Individual Tax

• Immediately allows Bush tax cuts to expire for families earning over $250K

• Higher tax rates for millionaires and billionaires (from 45% to 49%)

• Taxes income from investments the same as income from wages

Fair Corporate Tax

• Ends corporate tax bias toward moving jobs and profits overseas

• Enacts a financial transactions tax

• Reduces deductions for corporate jets, meals, and entertainment

Defense

• Returns Pentagon spending to 2006 levels, focusing on modern security needs

Health Care

• No benefit cuts to Medicare, Medicaid, or Social Security

• Reduces health care costs by adopting a public option, negotiating drug prices, and reducing fraud

Environment

• Prices carbon pollution with a rebate to hold low income households harmless

• Eliminates corporate tax subsidies for oil, gas, and coal companies GETTING AMERICANS BACK TO WORK


One creates an emotional excited voter ... the other creates a wishful maybe voter.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #110)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 11:50 PM

119. None of those are "gut" issues

Democrats send to sound too vague and bureaucratic.

They need a few "gut" issues stated in simple terms: "Raise the minimum wage! No one who works full time should need food stamps!" or
"Create jobs by repairing and expanding our roads, bridges, railroads, and utilities." "Take care of our own needs before trying to fix other countries."

That was my complaint about Kerry's website in 2004. He sounded as if he were a Congressional aide who had researched a policy for his boss, not as if he were trying to win the votes of ordinary Americans.

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Response to Lydia Leftcoast (Reply #119)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 09:25 AM

128. My point was to demonstrate ...

 

why the republican base is "excited." It has everything to do with human nature ... people are far more moved to act to protect against a loss than to achieve a gain.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #128)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 10:30 AM

129. And I was talking about your list, which sounds like Al Gore or John Kerry talking

Too complicated, no emotional appeal at all.

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Response to Lydia Leftcoast (Reply #129)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 10:35 AM

130. Agreed ...

 

I pulled that list from a DU post suggesting that all Democrats needed to do is run on the list.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:36 AM

57. If not getting fucked over by right wing tea baggers

doesn't motivate you, you're a lost cause!
But when they do don't come on this board and complain.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:51 AM

62. What do you mean by a "reason"

 

You mean keeping those rat-fuck Repugnicans out of power isn't important enough to "be excited?"

If not, then people need their heads fucking examined.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:26 AM

67. Voting doesn't need to be "exciting".

 

It's a civic duty to stop the theocratic fascists from gaining power.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:57 PM

83. 100%

 

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:47 PM

92. Or to even take notice of who the candidate is

Part of my job is asking people if they are registered to vote and if they are not assisting them in registering. Among both registered voters and those who are not and express an interest in registering my most common question is "what party is Barack Obama in?" I am not kidding about this. I do SNAP and Medicaid and voter reg is part of our duties.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:53 PM

93. Or give them something to be scared about if ReTugs win.

But right now those with the winning meme seem to be hateful, racists Republicans. The ones with a hateful message always arouse others who are hateful.

We don't want to win on hate, but we can win on fear of what will happen if a ReThugs took the Senate.

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Response to Auntie Bush (Reply #93)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 02:02 PM

95. I disagree

 

Personally, I won't support yet another offering of fear from our "leaders." Folks respond much more enthusiastically (and predictably) if they feel they are a part of something positive.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:38 PM

102. Or better, by pointing out what they have to lose ...

 

Academic research indicates that people are far more moved to take action to protect against a loss; than to achieve a gain. That's why negative campaigns work so well.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #2)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:28 AM

126. Nailed it!!

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:41 AM

5. So true Peggy

We've gotta get.. fired up, so easy to procrastinate!

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:44 AM

6. We have to get the Millennials fired up

They would vote overwhelmingly Democratic, but are often apathetic. We need to make them aware of the issues and let them know their vote can make a difference.

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Response to Terra Alta (Reply #6)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:12 AM

14. I wouldn't count on them this turn

 

Still brooding over the Obama break-up.

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Response to 1000words (Reply #14)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:04 AM

27. And the the other transgressions

 

out current gov't is widely perceived to do like student loans, failing to fix the economy, and in general just being 'The Man'.

Meanwhile other issues that should motivate our base (marijuana, marriage equality, end Afghanistan) may be perceived as taking care of themselves, hence no hurry to go and vote.

Of course all of that is moot if the Administration continues to be perceived as emasculated against the Russians.

If we want to win this November, the Cold War card is our Ace in the hole since it reframes domestic issues and can be used to ramp up our manufacturing sector.

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Response to Terra Alta (Reply #6)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:33 AM

20. Minimum wage is one

 

I told a right-of-center 18 year old girl that the Republicans are trying to get rid of minimum wage and she suddenly became enraged.

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Response to ErikJ (Reply #20)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:56 PM

82. But 10.10 over 4 years is WEAK SAUCE:(

 

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:51 AM

8. it's less

the other big part is that we are out numbered and out-gunned.

Republicans kept control of the House in 2012 in spite of a large Presidential year turnout.

Also, as incumbents they have much larger war chests and name recognition and they have a rightwing media advancing their talking points to the point where the public takes them in like they are air.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #8)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:25 AM

17. Redistricting didn't help either. nt

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #8)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:20 AM

39. Gerrymandering.

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Response to Enthusiast (Reply #39)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:21 PM

87. For the win.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:53 AM

9. This is what I keep hearing on the news too.

That Republicans have a good chance to take the Senate as well as the House this fall.

Shutting down the government did absolutely nothing to damage the Republicans.
Cruz might be cleverer than we give him credit for.
He realizes that his people are immune from suffering consequences of their actions.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:55 AM

10. THAT... Is Perfect !!!

 

And straight on.



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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:10 AM

13. Maybe if more Democrats spoke out against the crap that's going on,

 

like Sen Warren, Sen Sanders, and Rep Grayson, it would encourage the Democratic base. But it seems many Democratic incumbents are afraid to take a hard stand against the statue quo. Hell, there are a lot of posters here in DU that love the status quo, and they sure as hell aint on the left.

The lame-ass corporate-conservative-centrists are happy with the status quo and probably will stay home like they did in 2010. And then turn around and blame the left. In 2010 when I was working the GOTV phone lines and looked around, I didnt see any centrists. The left that I know are active in local politics, and are very active in GOTV. I was just at a panel discussion where they discussed backing a Constitutional Amendment to turn around Citizens United. Those attending were from the left.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #13)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 11:55 PM

120. Yes, I worked on the local Kucinich campaign in 2004, and when the time came to GOTV for Kerry

every single one of the people I knew from DK's campaign turned up on Election Day to get their canvassing assignments and spent all of a 20° day going door to door.

Then Kerry conceded before the polls were closed in Ohio, while it was clear that there were irregularities. While my feet were still sore from walking around in the cold from 10:00AM to 8:00PM with only a quick stop back at headquarters for a hot dog for lunch.

It felt as if we cared about the election more than Kerry did.

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Response to Lydia Leftcoast (Reply #120)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:23 AM

123. My experience is similar but w/o the cold. It's always the left that shows up

 

to go door to door, to cover the phone banks, to stand in the rain protesting corps that dont pay their taxes. It's usually the same group and none are Third Way Centrists.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:15 AM

15. very good, and very true!

 

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:22 AM

16. it doesn't help that Obama will not be on the Ballot this time around as he is the reason

so many young people and others came out to vote in 2008 and 2012. and why they didn't in 2010 when he was not on the ballot.

but one can look at McAuliffe's race in Virginia and while turnout was lower compared to 2012 on group that was about the same was the black voters.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #16)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 06:12 AM

32. a bit of disillusionment set in from 2008 to 2012 with the 18-29's

2008 - 66% vs 32%
2012 - 60% vs 37%

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Response to DrDan (Reply #32)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 06:18 AM

34. too small

More likely those conservatives turned off by Palin. Same reason he won north Carolina on 2008 but not 2012.

The point is a large number of young voters turned out because he was on the ballot.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #34)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 06:29 AM

36. the changes were smaller with other age groups

...................2008..............2012
30-44........52%-46%......52%-45%

45-64........50%-49%......47%-51%

65-over.....45%-53%......44%-56%

Considerably bigger change with the 18-29's - less voted for Obama. 60% is nothing to sneeze at, but to drop from 66% is significant.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:30 AM

18. DEMS stay home cuz they've been stabbed in the back too many times by the people they sent to DC.

 

And the DEM politicos blame their voters for being "thin skinned."

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Response to blkmusclmachine (Reply #18)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 06:15 AM

33. +1

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Response to blkmusclmachine (Reply #18)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:49 AM

53. And the Republican Congress is going to do what?

Get them all they want?

Stabbed in the back is a bit much for just not getting all they want. And if they didn't bother to vote in the midterms, they are responsible for who is there.

Whining assholes. If that's the reason people don't vote, they deserve Republicans. They think it's so easy to get legislation passed? That's ignorance.

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Response to treestar (Reply #53)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:25 AM

66. +100,000,000,000

I fail to understand how anyone in their right mind could think that letting republicans win could possibly be a good idea! While I don't agree with all the democrats running, I sure as hell know what it would be like to let republicans win at any level of governing. I would think that after 2010 and so many states being taken over by republicans, not to mention the U.S. House, it would be pretty obvious just how bad things would be with republicans winning "any" race!

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Response to Andy823 (Reply #66)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:36 AM

72. Exactly!

Republicans are "excited" and enthused by their zeal to take us all backwards, which is getting desperate. Yet people who wanted change and didn't get a complete revolution in two years are so "discouraged" they will sit back and give up in the face of that. And then cry that they don't want the lesser of two evils. That's all they can get when they see everything as an evil, so why are they crying to people who at least are positively trying to do something? It's ridiculous!

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Response to treestar (Reply #72)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 11:08 AM

75. And a revolution where someone else does all the work.

Progressive candidates aren’t manna from heaven, they’re the result of a lot of people spending their time and money working to get them elected.

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Response to treestar (Reply #53)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 11:58 PM

121. Oh, the old "You have to vote for them because they suck less" line

It doesn't work with people who are not politically savvy.

Hey, I'm going to vote. I'm lucky in having good people to vote for, especially Keith Ellison and Al Franken.

But if you live in a district where the alleged Democrat votes with the Republicans or keep trying to water down Democratic proposals, it's hard to work up any enthusiasm.

The R's know how to throw red meat to their base.

The D's just say, "We're not the R's, and they're worse."

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:31 AM

19. That is so it. n/t

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:33 AM

21. Dems should stand up and holler about the idiocy.

Wouldn't be politically correct, but it sure would put them on the defensive about their idiotic views.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 02:28 AM

26. Is this true?

Have there been studies that say the GOP base is more likely to vote than the Democratic base?

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:51 AM

28. My theory is that the GOP voter is easily riled and that's what the think tanks know.

Last edited Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:52 PM - Edit history (1)

And I wonder how many Dems get discouraged by the inevitable long lines in the poorer districts during the General election. The DNC would have been wise to get as many Dems as possible to vote by mail.

I confess to not voting in 1994 and didn't bother to get an absentee ballot for while I was out of the state for 5 weeks. I'd no idea of the magnitude of that election and have never forgiven myself. Or made that mistake again.

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Response to SleeplessinSoCal (Reply #28)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:55 AM

29. it's easy when it's the other party that has the white house, in this case a black Pres

has made the right wing very angry, even more so after he got re-elected. these people were convinced he was the worst president ever and were convinced most people felt that way.

they could not believe he got re-elected.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #29)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:32 PM

101. you're right. recalling 2006. felt the same way exactly.

but then, so did just about every voter.

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Response to SleeplessinSoCal (Reply #28)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:08 PM

113. I'll confess to not voting in 1994 either

I do have a valid excuse for that though, I was 14.

I will confess to not voting in my first eligible federal election (1998). I was away at college and registered at home (I voted in a school board election when I was still in HS) and did not get an absentee ballot.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)


Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 06:06 AM

31. The "Democratic Party" hates their base

That is the big difference



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Response to RandiFan1290 (Reply #31)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 06:19 AM

35. are you talking about Wendy Davis?

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Response to RandiFan1290 (Reply #31)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 11:40 PM

118. Pretty much.

 

Millennials are much more Liberal than the Democrats, and much more jaded about politics than most of us were when we were their age. They're smart enough to realize when they've been had. To quote the irrepressible Henry Rollins, "Just because someone is handing you a pile of shit, doesn't mean you have to take it."

Democrats need to learn to stop trying to motivate their voters by handing them a pile of shit.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:15 AM

37. It's a good toon. But, one problem with the toon.

That redneck knuckle dragger idiot will never have to stand in long lines or have his voting rights challenged.

That only happens in Democratic precincts.

Voting Democratic has become quite inconvenient.

Check out voting conditions for students in North Carolina for example.

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Response to Enthusiast (Reply #37)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:53 AM

54. Not on the West Coast. Voting is easy here, not a single line in the State, no 'challenge' to

 

any voter. It's wildly and ultimately convenient. Other States refuse to do this, apparently they like to line up then whine about it for years rather than win elections.
We get large turn out. 2010 broke midterm records here. We elect Democrats and pass liberal legislation, our minimum wage is 9.30 and automatically rises with inflation, for example.
If you want examples, you should look to the entire West Coast, then you should follow those examples.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #54)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:47 AM

59. I live in CA and vote by mail. My ballot comes weeks before the election.

We have a Dem government because we vote nothing more to be said. No whimpy "I don't like this and I don't like that!"

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #54)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:27 AM

68. See, that's the point. We can't all live in California.

States like Ohio, North Carolina and others have enacted barriers to voting, making it less convenient.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:35 AM

44. Bland wimpy passionless Democratic politicians..

... cannot fire up the base or the independents. By design? I think so.

When they do manage to get elected they implement milque-toast half-measure "reforms" that barely scratch the surface.

And then everyone wonders why are stuck when clearly we have the majority of public policy sentiment on our side.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:38 AM

46. We have to be able to tell them "Yeah, sure." Nt

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:47 AM

51. You nailed it

with this graphic.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:47 AM

52. Or the figure on the right could be saying

They didn't earn my vote! I'm going to let the Republicans win! I'm not excited or inspired, so the Republicans deserve to win! I'm disappointed! The Democrats are no better than the Republicans, so I'll let the Republicans win! No single payer and no public option? I'll just go without coverage then!

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 07:56 AM

55. Low turn out is a regional issue that could be solved, but it is easier to whine than make

 

change to election laws. It needs to be understood that this low turn out shit is not a West Coast problem at all. The 6 Democratic Senators from CA, OR and WA can tell you that.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:47 AM

60. The Democratic Party and Dem candidates.....

need to take a page out of the Republican playbook. Anyone who knows anything about effective advertising knows that using fear is the best motivator. The Republicans feed their base with constant fearmongering about what Democratic policies will do to ruin their lives. I'm trying to think of examples where the Democrats consistently used fearmongering to show how Republican policies have ruined theirs.

Many on DU have said before that we have to stop "playing nice" and thinking that will get us the votes. No, we have to beat them at their own game. And yes, sometimes the ends justify the means.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:49 AM

61. Thanks for ruining my day!

 

That is so true.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:06 AM

63. lol,

 

If elected politicians would simply do what they promise during the campaign, there would be no problem "getting people to vote".

the rub,..... is promising a bunch of crap, .....never following thru with it, then "re-convincing" people to vote again.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 09:16 AM

64. The person on the right side of that toon

is NOT the Democratic base. Not in any way.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #64)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:54 AM

74. I agree.

The message seems to be that Democrats are clueless.

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Response to greatauntoftriplets (Reply #74)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 11:59 AM

76. The Democratic base is eager to vote,

and doesn't treat voting as a chore. The Democratic base is dedicated to helping people like the one in the toon get to the polls and vote. The Democratic base is made up of election activists, not bored people who don't care and don't understand why voting is so important.

It seems like some people misunderstand who makes up the base of the Democratic Party. The Democratic base does this:

GOTV 2014 and Beyond!

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #76)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:04 PM

77. And I voted on Tuesday!

Illinois primary. Fairly good turnout in my precinct. Town went 80 percent for President Obama in 2012.

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Response to greatauntoftriplets (Reply #77)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:18 PM

78. Thank you for voting!

You are the base of the Democratic Party. Those who do not vote are not the base.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #78)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:21 PM

79. No problem. I always vote.

My mother used to take me into the voting booth when I was very young. I got the message.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #64)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:41 PM

103. i find much of the GOTV involves just getting people like that out to vote

even simple things like just letting them know which day to vote and making sure they did vote. and if they need any help like a ride to the polls.

early voting helps but a lot of times the races which are competitive and close will not have early voting and other things to make it easier because republicans usually oppose those things because they know it helps democrats more.

i actually find voting itself boring. but i don't need to be excited to do it because i am aware of how important it is.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #103)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:47 PM

107. Absolutely. I kept a tally in the 2012 election of people

I talked to while doing precinct walking. If someone said they weren't really planning to vote, I'd try to convince them of how important it was to vote. If I got them to say they'd go to the polls, I marked them in my tally as a GOTV success. By election day, I had tallied 97. Now, not all of them probably did vote, but I have a high confidence level that most did.

Hanging around the polling place, I actually recognized some of those folks.

I can't say I talked to anyone who looked like that person in the toon, but I talked to an awful lot of people who needed to hear a reason to bother going to the polls.

Governor Dayton (DFL) won his election in a recount, by only a few hundred votes. I like to think my precinct walking played a role in his victory. We turned out almost 70% of registered voters in my precinct.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:38 AM

73. A little less, but not by much. (n/t)

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:24 PM

80. I don't do Facebook. Never have, never will.

Maybe the "CIA Facebook Project" is more deviously clever than we knew, if it helps neutralize the "Democratic Base".

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 12:55 PM

81. I'm so tired of this BS. If the Dems would push popular policy positions, we'd win hands down.

 

Instead we more ourselves with national Romneycare, and every god damned war of the week we can get our hands on - yeah, like the Ukraine war for gas, austerity, and big ag.

Want to respond? List the policy positions we stand for!

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Response to grahamhgreen (Reply #81)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:05 PM

85. I mostly agree... However there is a segment of the US that doesn't vote

The comic says "Vote again". It's not previous voters we need it's the people who never have and don't want to. And they don't want to because of exactly what you said. No one to vote for.

The truth is Conservatives are a serious minority in this country. Most of the country wants health care, decent wages, income equality, cheaper college, Social Security.. Problem is they see neither party as doing anything to help them so they don't vote. I know. I was one of those people for a long time... And I still battle with myself over voting for the guy who should win over the guy who actually has a chance to win. I don't think I have ever cast a vote where I wasn't voting against someone as opposed to voting for someone.
Well OK, I did actually like voting for Obama the first time, but he's been kind of a disappointment..

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Response to SomethingFishy (Reply #85)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:21 PM

100. Thank you for saying it. The TRUE majority is disenchanted NON-voters

 

I have said it many times in posts of mine here at Democratic Underground.
People keep talking about Democratic voters vs. Republican voters.

NO!!

It's the NON-voter who is the real majority in this country.
WHY they are non-voters vary but you can bet a significant reason is disenchantment with the promise vs. the reality of the political process.
They can no longer suspend their disbelief. They see it all as fake & phony.
It looks to be a game of good cop/bad cop with milquetoast Democrats vs. malevolent Republicans.
They can't trust that ANYBODY in a position of power will REALLY give a damn about the people at the bottom of pyramid.

If the Democratic Party truly stood for what they proclaim themselves to be AND actually followed through with their proclamations, they would convert many of that non-voter majority into Democratic voters.

It's not just a segment that doesn't vote, it's a majority that doesn't vote.
And some don't feel like playing the political game where they don't see any benefits.
They just roll with the punches trying to survive.

Those non-voters WOULD NATURALLY be under a Progressive banner that the Democratic Party is supposed to house.
You're not gonna have any real folks working for a living complaining about wage increases or better conditions for workers.
When the Democratic Party stops being ashamed of its Progressive base, they will thrive.

Until Utopia is reached, the only natural direction for a society IS Progress.
If it's only Utopia for some, it's a Dystopia.
Who wants to Conserve a Dystopia?
John Lucas

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Response to SomethingFishy (Reply #85)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:00 AM

122. I voted FOR McGovern and FOR Carter, but since then it's been mostly

AGAINST the Republican candidate.

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Response to grahamhgreen (Reply #81)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:45 PM

91. It is way easier to whine about voter apathy than actually do anything to earn votes.

They especially don't want to talk about how their "Centrist" ways are failing in their asserted purpose of drawing independents, they just keep doubling down in phony pursuit of a "middle" they have passed over and now are in Reagan territory in a struggling country, push austerity, saber rattling, and privatization.

Add that to being all mealy mouthed about what the bloody TeaPubliKlans are up to and playing the lame "bipartisan" angle and the case is willfully weak and muddy.

TeaPubliKlans tell the electorate that we are evil, godless, lazy, hate America, are purposefully destroying all opportunity, wish to Institute mind control, are going to force them into gay marriage, put them before death panels, that we are helping (insert boogieman here) destroy America, and anything else they can hurl at us while Democrats tell anyone that will listen that the TeaPubliKlans are right about a lot of things but their is a few little honest disagreements that we are willing to compromise on.

What messages do you think people are getting on average? Who is going to be more driven, the voter told life and death are at stake or the one sold seemingly on more professional management of the same general policy bearings?

What are we a low self esteem teen that has to have everyone like us? Think how often that desperate sort turns out to be even less popular than they would be if they weren't trying to be?

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #91)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 02:27 PM

97. You're right. The popular kids are the ones who give their freinds value, not the ones who try to

 

make themselves popular.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:16 PM

86. I don't see any money in your post.

That is what we are up against. The caricatures you posted are just symptoms.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:30 PM

88. We elected Obama with a majority in the House and a super in the Senate....

 

It simply doesn't get better than that and it will not happen again. Right now the only thing we are voting on is which millionaires get to represent the Billionaires pillaging the country. The economy is circling the drain and the big White House proposals are to pass MORE job destroying free trade, trash Social Security, and raise the minimum wage a little. That's it.

I am not urging anyone stay home, but let's not pretend it's some defect in liberal voters and young people that has caused this apathy. If you are excited to vote for either of these two parties you're delusional.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:44 PM

90. True for 2014, and possibly in 2016

2008 was monumental, 2012 was an affirmation of the choice we made in 2008. Many people who never voted before came out to vote. Will 2016 be monumental?

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 01:54 PM

94. That about covers it, CP!

We have GOT to find a way to inspire dem voters in mid-terms...they are so important!

The cartoon is funny and sad at the same time.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 02:37 PM

98. You know what's interesting.

Last edited Thu Mar 20, 2014, 04:34 PM - Edit history (1)

BTW I see the fear card still works beautifully. Vote "D" else don't come complaining here when the "R's" take over.

Yeah whatever. I've been voting "D" for a long ass time so give me a fucking break, and yes I will do it again.*

*this is not directed at the OP.

What happens when "R's" decide they want to switch parties and become a Democrat, yet they still vote "R". We have a lot of Dino's in the party and voting "D" doesn't fix that.

For example, here in Washington State, newly minted Democratic Governor Jay Inslee (who is a supposed to be a well respected D) decided to crap on MMJ patients and sided with the State Liqueur Board on the new Marijuana laws which basically gutted patients rights.

Thanks Jay.

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Response to Phlem (Reply #98)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:15 PM

99. R's feel the same way.

 

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:44 PM

105. Well part of the reason is that R's fire up their base while Dems neglect theirs.

And R's know how to message, Dems fail miserably at that.

If Dems would fight for expanding SS, single-payer, eliminating corporate welfare, etc... and really get fired up and talk about it all the time the base and the independents who are looking for something to believe in might get excited to come out and vote.

Dems aren't playing offense, they are continually playing defense. They don't play to win, they play not to lose. People need to have a positive to go after, not a negative to avoid.



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Response to cui bono (Reply #105)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:26 AM

125. Well said!!

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Response to Kilgore (Reply #125)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:47 AM

127. Why thank you.

And welcome to DU!

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 03:45 PM

106. that's my neighbors and my students

a great cartoon.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 04:12 PM

111. LOL

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 08:36 PM

114. I vote by mail and thats about as easy as

going to some website like face book. The thing is,now you probably can vote on line.. I have been given some invitations to do that, but I would rather have something in my hand, that I can give to the UNITED STATES POSTAL SERVICE and know its fairly safe from tampering.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Thu Mar 20, 2014, 10:23 PM

116. I think Bernie will excite people again.

The progressive base can really get fired up for Bernie.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Original post)

Fri Mar 21, 2014, 12:24 AM

124. Sadly True

If there is no fire in the belly, it's game over.

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