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DetlefK

(16,423 posts)
Fri Mar 21, 2014, 03:15 PM Mar 2014

Surprise! FBI-killing of suspect is declared self-defense!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/21/ibragim-todashev-fbi_n_5008115.html

For those who don't remember the original story:
He was questioned by a room full of FBI-agents and cops. Then he gets shot. The agents and cops declare in conflicting initial reports that he attacked them with a metal pole AND with a knife AND bare-handed.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2013/05/31/ibragim_todashev_fbi_officials_offer_a_more_detailed_version_of_what_led.html
http://news.yahoo.com/fbi-changes-story-again-ibragim-todashev-shooting-114132404.html

Let that sink in:
1. A guy attacks a room full of FBI-agents and cops carrying guns.
2. The FBI-agents and cops are so professional that they can't see what kind of weapon lies next to the corpse.
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Surprise! FBI-killing of suspect is declared self-defense! (Original Post) DetlefK Mar 2014 OP
Years ago I heard of a terrorist in a German prison who somehow managed to commit suicide ... spin Mar 2014 #1

spin

(17,493 posts)
1. Years ago I heard of a terrorist in a German prison who somehow managed to commit suicide ...
Fri Mar 21, 2014, 03:53 PM
Mar 2014

with a handgun.

Andreas Baader

Andreas Bernd Baader (6 May 1943 – 18 October 1977) was one of the first leaders of the German left-wing militant organization Red Army Faction, also commonly known as the Baader-Meinhof Gang.

***snip***

Death

According to official accounts of his death, Raspe learned of GSG 9's success on a smuggled transistor radio, and spent the next few hours talking to Baader, Ensslin, and Möller, who agreed to a suicide pact. In the morning, Andreas Baader and Jan-Carl Raspe were found dead in their cells, having died from gunshot wounds, while Gudrun Ensslin was found hanging from a noose made from speaker wire. RAF member Irmgard Möller was found with four stab wounds to her chest, but survived.[10]

All official inquiries on the matter concluded that Baader and his two accomplices committed collective suicide, and Baader-Meinhof biographer Stefan Aust argued in the original edition of his book, The Baader-Meinhof Group (1985), that they almost assuredly did kill themselves.
There are many debatable aspects to the deaths: Baader was supposed to have shot himself in the base of the neck so that the bullet exited through his forehead; repeated tests indicated that it was virtually impossible for a person to hold and fire a gun in such a way. In addition, three bullet holes were found in his cell: one lodged in the wall, one in the mattress, and the fatal bullet itself lodged in the floor, suggesting that Baader had fired twice before killing himself. Finally, Baader had powder burns on his right hand, but he was left-handed. Raspe, however, showed no signs of powder burns.[3]...emphasis added

The theory itself that guns had somehow been smuggled into Stammheim prison depended on the testimony of Hans Joachim Dellwo (brother of prisoner Karl-Heinz Dellwo) and Volker Speitel (husband of Angelika Speitel). Both had been arrested on 2 October 1977, and charged with belonging to a criminal association; under pressure from the police they subsequently admitted to acting as couriers and testified that they were aware of lawyers smuggling items to the prisoners during the trial. Their testimony was, however, tainted because they provided it in order to avoid lengthy prison sentences and received reduced sentences and new identities. In 1979 two defence attorneys were tried and convicted for smuggling weapons. However, as noted above, the lawyers had been unable to meet with their clients after 6 September 1977 due to the Kontaktsperre order.[3]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andreas_Baader
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