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MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 02:41 PM Jul 2014

Popular Tests to Assign People to Groups are Generally Bogus

From the Political Compass to the Meyers-Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI) these tests attempt to categorize people by their answers to a list of questions. In the case of the Political Compass, the number of questions is too few, and the questions are too binary to allow for a good assessment. The questions use too many words that lead those who read them to answer in a certain way. Words like "always" and "best" are superlatives and any thinking person will find themselves led to answer in a way that the test designer more or less wishes. They lead the responses. In the Political Compass, the bias is to lead thinking people toward the Libertarian/Left quadrant, through the use of superlatives in the questions.

Further, in both tests, and other similar tests, intelligent people can successfully predict how the the answers will affect the results. For the MBTI, for example, an intelligent person can often predict the results the test-giver is looking for and answer the questions in a way that will produce a result that produces a better fit. A salesperson, for example, will be expected to be an extrovert with high levels of self-confidence. So, by answering the questions in a way that presents the test-taker as such will naturally lead to a better result in terms of getting a job, the most used reason for taking an MBTI.

In some cases, attempts have been made to include prominent people in the results, even though they have never actually answered the questions. In those cases, someone will answer the questions as they think the prominent person would answer. The problem is that the biases of the person answering for another person will skew the results, since it is easy to manipulate the outcome for anyone with test-taking experience or knowledge of how the test works.

These tests are questionable, even when taken by a person who tries to answer questions honestly, but are completely useless if someone other than the person answers the questions for a person, based on whatever knowledge they may have. Such results are completely useless. For the individual who answers honestly about themselves, the tests can provide some interesting information about that person, who can reflect on why the results turned out as they did, based on the questions asked.

Psychological testing is a complex business, and designing tests is a very difficult thing to do. However, if one understands testing, it is relatively easy to write the questions in a way that will lead test-takers in the directions you want them to go, if that is your goal. Sadly, there's a lot of crappy testing out there, full of badly-written questions that expose the biases of the test designer more than it exposes the personality of the test-taker.

On a personal level, I have taken both the MBTI and Political Compass tests a number of times, both on a required and voluntary basis for the MBTI. I can position myself however I wish by answering the questions as I choose. A little thought is all that is required. I first got interested in this kind of testing while taking upper division courses in psychological testing to expand my knowledge of psychology. That is when I learned how easy it is for test-takers to manipulate these tests as they choose, and when I learned that their value is limited because of the transparency of the test designs.

Since it is so easy for an individual to manipulate the results, it's clear that someone taking the test for someone else can position that person as they choose. Only an individual answering honestly can get worthwhile results from any personality assessment test. Anything else is fraudulent and should be discarded as useless.

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MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
3. That's fine. And such tests can be useful for the
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:00 PM
Jul 2014

individual. In other cases, such tests sometimes pretend to present the results of people who have not actually taken the tests. The Political Compass test is often used in that way, displaying results for politicians or others. When that happens, the results are bogus on their face, since those people did not answer the questions. Someone else did.

All such tests are easily manipulated to produce the desired results. So, unless the actual person took the test and answered the questions honestly, such results are useless. Confirmation bias makes some people nod their heads when they agree with such bogus results. That has nothing to do with whether the results are accurate or not.

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
8. Sadly, if you're a job-seeker, you'll probably take the MBTI
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:25 PM
Jul 2014

and the hiring decision may be based on that when it comes down to choosing finalists for the position. I don't find that entertaining at all, and the person who gets the job may just be smart enough to give the HR Department just what they're looking for.

Too many people DO put credence in this testing.

valerief

(53,235 posts)
13. Oh, I've taken it on the job. We had a day-long "team outing" after taking it.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:34 PM
Jul 2014

Just more bullshit and time-wasting, but it was important that the Wharton graduates felt like they were "contributing" by having the test administered.

Same old shit.

BTW, I'm INTP. My I is close to the E on the range. Is it accurate? Of course not! It's all bullshit.

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
14. I'm not fond of the HR Department mentality, really.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:37 PM
Jul 2014

It's a wonder anyone gets hired who will perform as desired.

GoCubsGo

(32,080 posts)
16. I have never had to take the MBTI for a job.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:51 PM
Jul 2014

And, I've been through dozens of interviews. I only had one where somebody even asked about it. And, that was just whether or not I'd ever taken it. It might be used in the business world, but not elsewhere.

FWIW, I think the MBTI is a joke. I constantly found myself saying, "It depends on the circumstances..." It's just more black and white thinking.

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
6. Note: Such tests can be useful to the individual who takes them.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:22 PM
Jul 2014

They can provide some self-knowledge and can lead to growth and thoughtful change in some cases. When used for other purposes, however, they're most often of more use to the test-giver than the test-taker, unless the test-taker manipulates the results deliberately to match the perceived desires of the test-giver.

If you're an employer looking for a self-starting, results-driven, sales powerhouse who will follow your script, I can give you an MBTI result that will knock your socks off. Of course, they'll also be bullshit, but hey, I need the work! You'll probably hire me, and I interview really well, too.

Behind the Aegis

(53,955 posts)
9. Just about any test can be manipulated.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:30 PM
Jul 2014

The MBTI, however, can provide insight if the test taker is honest. I don't think it should be used for employment because it is mistakenly seen as a "personality" test, and though it has some of those aspects, it is not. MBTI can be useful in helping people find ways to alleviate stress and how to better manage their time.

MineralMan

(146,288 posts)
11. Absolutely. Results from the MBTI, if taken honestly,
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:33 PM
Jul 2014

can be very useful, especially when working through changes or with a therapist. It's used that way, for sure. Sadly, it is misused more often than properly used, especially when making hiring decisions. I will never regret making the decision to be an independent contract writer and journalist in 1974.

Behind the Aegis

(53,955 posts)
15. That's why I am against it being used as an employment tool.
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 03:37 PM
Jul 2014

As someone who used to do counseling, I found it could be quite useful, even when people cheated (and there are ways to tell that too). But, the idea of it being used to discern the employment of a person is just wrong. When I would do training sessions, I would look at the results of the MBTI of participants to tweak my presentations or training. I almost always had the best trained staff.

Jamaal510

(10,893 posts)
17. Those tests
Wed Jul 23, 2014, 05:15 PM
Jul 2014

don't leave much room for any grey area. For example, a person moves upward on the chart (towards authoritarian) as they vote for more government intervention on questions like the minimum wage and the safety net. The problem I see with this is that the test creator's perspective of libertarianism probably differs from someone who is poor. While the maker of that test may see one factor of freedom as not having to pay as much taxes (or none at all), a poor person may view freedom as the government lending them a helping hand so they can have more money in their pocket towards necessities.
Another point I have is that I'm not sure if authoritarian and libertarian are real opposites like the test makes those labels out to be. When searching the word "authoritarian" on thesaurus.com, the words that appear under "antonym" include "democratic" and "liberal". And not only do authoritarian governments have excessive control and are notorious for discrimination, but they also don't believe in democracy, where the people get to decide who runs the government. Meanwhile, one of the main traits of a liberal/progressive is supporting democracy and prioritizing the common man.

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