General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhat should the NFL do?
1. Suppose someone tweets they saw player x hit his wife. No proof . No arrest. Wife denies. Does the NFL suspend the player?
2. Suppose NFL wife calls police saying "my husband hit me". Police arrive and she has a bruise on her face but recants her phone call saying "it was a misunderstanding" . Hes arrested but she "stands" by her husband and says the bruise was from a fall and not from him. Should the NFL suspend him pending trial?
3. Suppose NFL wife calls police saying "my husband hit me". Police arrive and she has a bruise on her face and she stands by her statement that he hit her. He arrested pending trial. Does the NFL await for verdict , suspend him immediately before the verdict or throw him out of the league immediately?
4. NFL player is found guilty of domestic violence but the wife asks the judge for counseling and no jail time for her NFL husband and the judge agrees. We all agree that he should get a penalty. Should they throw him out of league?
The NFL has some tough decisions.
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TheNutcracker
(2,104 posts)All about the money....
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)The owners and sponsors are the pimps in this crisis.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Right now they are doing far more bad than good.
randome
(34,845 posts)How about:
* Disband
* Convert all stadiums into housing for the homeless .
* Give all their ill-gotten gains back to the municipalities that granted them in the first place.
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yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)It would cause unemployment to go up a point at least. It is not just players, owners, and coaches out of a job. How about those that clean the stadiums or cut the grass or the administrative assistance or receptionists. It is easy to just say cut it all out, but you are talking about real human beings who would have a disaster on their hands.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)Except that we still make landmines.
Times change, and some industries are simply evil.
We are in a constant state of having to retrain as technology and social needs change.
Take the wealth of those who acquired it and put it to work reemploying those impacted to become teachers, groundskeepers, etc., in reading centers, health and fitness clinics, nature centers.
It's totally doable and it would accrue to the benefit of everyone, especially future generations.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Take the wealth? And how do you suppose that is going to happen? You and I will be dead and gone and football will still be here. This is a bump in the road for the NFL. They will survive it and MAYBE be better for it. Time will tell.
Just wow.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)We took away DDT, which has some uses but did more harm than good in the end.
So, good riddance.
I don't expect people to give up the NFL, but I don't expect much change either.
Purrfessor
(1,188 posts)while completely ignoring the many positive impacts players have on their communities. Warwick Dunn is a good example. Including practice squads the NFL has 2,016 players. But the media prefers to report on the few who act in reprehensible ways. Too bad that unless people follow football they rarely hear the other side of the story.
NYC_SKP
(68,644 posts)tutoring kids? working in shelters? speaking out against violence?
Licensing shoes and apparel made under slave conditions in 3rd world countries?
I must be missing all this great work they do.
Purrfessor
(1,188 posts)But you might not want to read it, since it contradicts your view that the NFL and its players contribute very little worthwhile to their communities.
My guess is you didn't bother to read up on one of Warrick Dunn's charitable organizations providing homes to single parents.
And make sure to read this section and the positive work they do:
"Chiefs Women's Organization (CWO)
The CWO is a group comprised of wives, fiancées, and significant others of Chiefs players, coaches and football support staff members."
Based on your logic concerning licensing agreements, virtually every sport should be disbanded and every store that sells such products should be closed down.
By the way, all NFL teams are active in their communities.
http://www.kcchiefs.com/community/programs/player-outreach.html
LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)I'm curious. How would you get people to stop watching sports? How would you get players to stop playing? And how would you get owners to shut down football?
Are you talking about government regulation?
Bjorn Against
(12,041 posts)What they are dealing with is one guy who undeniably beat his wife and another who undeniably beat his son. Not every case is going to be as clear cut as these cases are, but when the case is clear cut we should not pretend it is hard to know what to do.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)99% don't have video evidence.
Bjorn Against
(12,041 posts)No one is demanding anyone be removed from the NFL for cases in which there is no evidence. Your hypothetical cases have nothing to do with the current situation the NFL is in.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Exactly.
Lonusca
(202 posts)The Rice issue will be the tip of the iceberg.
There are a number of current players with DV issues playing in the league right now. I can't recall the number offhand - 56 I believe? 80+ incidents since 2000.
So where will the line be drawn? I don't think the NFL is only going to be looking at the Rice case. I think they are going to be examining the incidents of every single current player. And many of them will will fit the hypothetical situations.
postulater
(5,075 posts)Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)the public probably wouldn't like that idea.
TexasProgresive
(12,157 posts)I know that's not going to happen but I would dance on the grave of football if it ever died. Don't like it and hate the thought of my grandchildren being concussed.
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)They epitomize Citizens United, corporate welfare embedded In the political system, Congress, the billionaire DC lobby of influence, the laws, & SCOTUS. All this costs each of us everyday, they've legalized the formerly illegal, and we taxpayers fund them no matter if you never bought one ticket to a game. Our country is stuck and burdened with these miscreants until the public says enough.
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)1 Fire Goodell
2 tax the NFL, repeal tax exemption
3 Hire woman as commissioner
Or boycott NFL merchandise, boycott the NFL sponsors.
Hurt the NFL in the pocket, you'll get their attention. Otherwise you will have nothing but what there is now, patronizing the issue of abuse, not taking abuse serious, making excuses, continued cover up, and nothing different than more talk, and a bunch of words.
exboyfil
(17,862 posts)for all professional sports.
http://blogs.rollcall.com/wgdb/nfl-news-blumenthal-floats-antitrust-exemption-changes/?dcz=
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)Only the NFL itself is tax exempt as it is a 501c3, the most of the teams apparently are not (the exception is Green Bay). I'm not sure how much more tax would be brought in by exempting them.
Instead of hiring a woman commissioner, how about requiring players to go through training on violence prevention. Then enact a zero tolerance policy.
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)To teams for all those taxpayer subsidized facilities, stadiums and training. We pay that.
As far as the NFL tax exemption that's where Goodell is paid $44million a year. What do you suspect the billionaire NFL owners make a year? A repeal of tax exemption likely would be much more than $44million a year in taxes.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)you are referring to funds to build stadiums which is a separate issue (but important) from taxes.
Someone else recently posted the amount the NFL gets from the teams and other revenues, but I have no idea how much that is.
In terms of Goodell's salary, I think paying anyone that much is ridiculous.
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)The means of subsidies for these corporations, lo al or Federal? Theyre taxpayer dollars, that and the tax exempt status of the NFL, the anti-trust exemption(mentioned previously) and the Citizens United ability to fund campaigns, to say nothing of the extensive lobbying effort with ungodly amounts amount, the billionaires get richer and richer off of taxpayers whether you or I buy a ticket or a jersey. If Goodell makes $44million a year, you can believe the owners reap double even more than he does. Btw for all those stadium subsidies, not one owner has had to submit their books for scrutiny to see their inability(cough cough) to pay for their own damn Stadiums. Remember it takes a lot of lobbying and campaign dollars to politicians to get those arenas built, so again does it matter it's local taxes paying?
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)were poor, tough guys who just happened into large fortunes. The fame, fortune and money often comes too fast for their cultural and individual maturity.
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)Teach morality.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)something that can be taught. It's kind of like the old saying "If you have to ask, you can't afford it." This being "If they don't have it as grownups from childhood, it's too late." Thus, regulation is all they understand. Somebody bigger and stronger telling them what they can and cannot do. Ethical children...getting away with what they can.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)The problem is people are innocent until proven guilty.
randome
(34,845 posts)If, on a case-by-case basis, the NFL determines there is reason to think a player has disgraced his position, they can -and should- kick him off the team until the matter is resolved in court.
The NFL is not a jury. And a multi-millionaire football player is not hurting to skip a few games.
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Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)"disgraced his position"...
by hearsay?
by cops being called even if wife recants?
before being found guilty or not-guilty?
BTW... Ray Rice's wife ASKED that no punishment be given to her husband. And then married him.
Does she have any say considering she's the aggrieved party?
tooeyeten
(1,074 posts)Proven beyond a reasonable doubt, that is not a requirement in firing/suspending an employee by employer.
cali
(114,904 posts)2.- Depends. 3.- suspend. 4.- depends.
In other words, each case should be reviewed independently.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)not sure I agree with you regarding #4 but at least you thought about each possibility.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)Clearly, the organization wasn't ready for the outrage. They thought we'd soon forget and in the meantime keep buying tickets and merchandise, and they acted accordingly.
They aren't police, and they aren't psychiatrists. They are a business worth billions annually, and ought therefore to care about their image...which has suddenly become much more expensive. Let's keep making their bad choices expensive ones, if we want reform.
librechik
(30,674 posts)Is he really innocent? They'll check on that.
None of these anecdotal issues would be important if someone--(hey "dawg"--I think it's YOU!) were actually in favor of women's rights and not a closet misogynist.
I could be wrong--but those are some crazy-ass excuses to blame the woman, right out there for everybody to see. Wanna recant?
Oh, right, those are serious questions. i humbly apologize for my unwarranted assumptions.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)I'm very supportive of women's rights.
whats your deal?
librechik
(30,674 posts)Just look at the examples in your post. From my perspective,( obviously not yours) those all look like ways to blame the woman and let the man off the hook--the implication being the NFL would punish that poor man anyway cuz of that LYIN bitch.
Your examples (which, BTW smell of resentment--did a woman ever hurt you?) are imaginary so I won't argue how likely they are to actually happen. And I don't care about your opinions, keep em. I don't care.
As you note, WTF, you don't get it. I'm so sorry. Please keep working on your determination to support women's rights. That is laudable.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)no blaming of women anywhere. geez. My point (obviously lost on you) is these are difficult decisions.
you know... forget it.
You apparently got some weird chip on your shoulder I don't even want to know about.
Good luck.
you can have the last word if you want.
librechik
(30,674 posts)again, so sorry to point out the obvious.
Oh, and that's not a chip, it's the Chrysler building.
BKH70041
(961 posts)1) tweeter potentially lied as woman confirms it wasn't the truth
2) woman lies
3) no one lies
4) no one lies
Only one claim that woman lied.
At least TRY and make an effort.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)WTF is the problem there ?
she cant read?
this was the weirdest discussion with her ive ever had.
Who is she so angry at that she makes up stuff?
customerserviceguy
(25,183 posts)Just remember, whenever there is the slightest doubt, if you assume that the male in the story is always wrong, and the women in the story are always right (unless they're 'standing by their man') then you'll never get criticized around here.
There are whole threads that I never post on, even though I do read some of them.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)She told a lie about me.
And then says I'm against women? huh?
I wouldn't mind an apology but given her statements and opinions, I doubt I will receive one.
BKH70041
(961 posts)i don't know the specific poster to whom you are addressing, but what you talk about happens often at this site, and I understand why in general. And it happens on all sorts of topics.
Problem is if you try and talk about why such things occur, someone (or a group of someones) starts pounding the hell out of the alert button, so that kills any possibility of talking about it out loud.
I prefer face-to-face discussions on these matters that cause so much angst and accusations of not viewing it the correct way. In real life, there is no alert button. In real life, I end up verbally overwhelming these individuals with facts while using the type of language (yet unacceptable wording here) that is appropriate for both the issue and the individual in such a way that they find themselves curled up in the corner of the room drooling and muttering.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)The poster accused me of hating women ( puleeeze) and then tells a bald face lie about my post.
After that she disappears when called on it.
Its a totally legitimate discussion if she bothered to read it....rather than hurling insanely stupid invectives and accusations .
I would hope she would have enough class to apologize.
thanks for your post.
BKH70041
(961 posts)I swear, why do people even mention scenerios that are never going to happen (Not you, Rhinodawg) as though there's the possibility it could? Talk about a waste of time.....
Here's the question I got, and it may have been mentioned here before by someone and I missed it.
Some of these players make millions of dollars a week. Even those who don't make really good money. Now if there is a policy of suspending and possibly banning a player for life (yes, I know Peterson is still getting paid even though he's not playing), how many wives/girlfriends are going to NOT report abuse knowing there's a possibility their husband/boyfriend might NOT be bringing home the bling-bling anymore?
And don't try to kid yourself, money is a great motivator. Not easy to give up all the goodies that come with those million dollar weekly paychecks.
customerserviceguy
(25,183 posts)And you're right, it's never going to happen. There are way too many people heavily invested in it, but it will change as the times change.
Eventually, most of our institutions adopt the evolving values of the culture that supports them, and the NFL is no different in that respect. There used to be a lot of secrecy in so many areas of life, and with 80% of the public having a movie camera in their pocket, that's going to have an eroding effect on most of the rest of that secrecy.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)Huh?
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)divided by 20 games ( pre season included )
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)for preseason games.
They get bonuses and 16 game checks and playoff money. In order for 'millions of dollars a week' they would need to be paid at least $32 million a year. Of course they are all paid a lot of money. Many players make more on endorsements than their game checks. They make so much money there is no need to exaggerate.
BKH70041
(961 posts)I wrote:
"Some of these players make millions of dollars a week."
Did I say it was only their NFL paycheck? No. Doesn't matter. It's whatever someone wants to imagine it meaning.
You hope those who read it will see for themselves. Some will, most won't.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)They want aggressive people. It's the nature of the beast. And sometimes it leaks out into other areas. I doubt they can do anything except kick them out whenever there is a hint of criminality.
seveneyes
(4,631 posts)the convicted player.
madville
(7,408 posts)For any domestic violence charge or any felony for that matter, lifetime ban, tough shit. Suspend them without pay when arrested and if not convicted they can be reinstated.
There are thousands of other players willing to step up and take their spots, it doesn't have to be this complicated.
SoCalDem
(103,856 posts)1. immediate suspension for 6 games (w/pay)
2. 2nd offense Fired..no pay no contract buy-out
clean & simple
oberliner
(58,724 posts)1. Unactionable. Possibly call the player in and inquire about the claim.
2. If he was arrested, suspend with pay pending trial.
3. Same as #2.
4. Significant suspension, but not thrown out of the league.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)IMHO, you nailed it.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)We can split Goodell's salary.
Rhinodawg
(2,219 posts)Does that include health benefits?
btw...let me ask you... had 3 people tweeted they saw player x hit his wife, would that have changed your opinion?
on edit... the player and wife are called in and denies any knowledge of this.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)If the tweeting players go into the commissioner's office and present evidence to support their claim, then maybe. But if both the player and the wife deny the accusation and there are no charges or legal action being taken, I don't see how the commissioner can do anything about that other than follow up and gather more information.
Rex
(65,616 posts)I have a feeling what we see is only 1% of how bad it is.
