HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » There Were Too Many Deer ...

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 07:43 PM

There Were Too Many Deer In The Forest So They Unleashed The Wolves Without Any Idea What Would...

Last edited Thu Jan 8, 2015, 08:21 PM - Edit history (1)


There Were Too Many Deer In The Forest. So They Unleashed The Wolves Without Any Idea What Would Happen.

http://www.upworthy.com/there-were-too-many-deer-in-the-forest-so-they-unleashed-the-wolves-without-any-idea-what-would-happen?c=upw1

Curator: Matt Orr

When the deer killed off the forest, they decided to let the wolves loose to fix it. We had no idea what exactly we had done.

One of the most exciting scientific findings of the last 50 years is called a trophic cascade.

A trophic cascade starts at the top of the food chain and tumbles to the bottom. One of the best examples of this happened in Yellowstone National Park in 1995 when wolves were reintroduced.



Wolves are really good at eating deer. But as it turns out, because of their deer diet, they also help lots of other animals survive.

Basically, wolves see deer/elk like this:



Humans killed all the wolves in Yellowstone National Park 70 years ago. And the deer population exploded.

Humans, being the controlling type in our relationship with Earth, tried to control the deer population. But deer are super-good at showing each other lots of love ... so the population grew and grew. In 1995, we reintroduced wolves to the park, and they immediately started killing the deer. But that's the least remarkable part. The wolves actually started changing the behavior of the deer.




EDIT to add the video I left out by accident:

Check out "How Wolves Change Rivers" on Vimeo


FULL story at link.

23 replies, 4876 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 23 replies Author Time Post
Reply There Were Too Many Deer In The Forest So They Unleashed The Wolves Without Any Idea What Would... (Original post)
Omaha Steve Jan 2015 OP
ms liberty Jan 2015 #1
Warpy Jan 2015 #2
Dont call me Shirley Jan 2015 #5
Warpy Jan 2015 #9
Dont call me Shirley Jan 2015 #21
jmowreader Jan 2015 #22
Dont call me Shirley Jan 2015 #23
saltpepperdoor Jan 2015 #12
Warpy Jan 2015 #14
saltpepperdoor Jan 2015 #16
Warpy Jan 2015 #20
Brigid Jan 2015 #3
MicaelS Jan 2015 #4
VScott Jan 2015 #15
Omaha Steve Jan 2015 #18
VScott Jan 2015 #19
Delmette Jan 2015 #6
japple Jan 2015 #7
zipplewrath Jan 2015 #8
NewJeffCT Jan 2015 #10
zipplewrath Jan 2015 #11
mountain grammy Jan 2015 #13
Blanks Jan 2015 #17

Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 07:59 PM

1. k&r for later. n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 08:05 PM

2. I keep explaining to people out here that the only thing that will keep the coyote population down

is a healthy, thriving wolf population. The great assistance to other species reintroducing a main predator gives is just gravy to that basic fact.

Killing coyotes doesn't work, they just step up their breeding and make more coyotes. Only competition with wolves keeps them hungry enough to limit their breeding.

I'm not surprised the deer have changed their behavior. Dumb deer would be the first to go.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 08:25 PM

5. We could host a coyote killing contest

Extreme

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Dont call me Shirley (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 09:28 PM

9. You don't think they haven't thought of that?

They've tried that. Next year, more coyotes than ever were at their sheep.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Warpy (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 9, 2015, 04:51 PM

21. Yep, I watch the local news. These gun shop owners and participants are blood thirsty maniacs.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Dont call me Shirley (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 9, 2015, 07:08 PM

22. It's been done

This is the second year of the Idaho Predator Derby - shoot all the wolves and coyotes you can eat!

Problem is, in the two years of its running no wolves have been killed. Last year 25 coyotes were killed, and this year 30 coyotes were killed. HUNDREDS of "sportsmen" went down there to try to shoot these things, and almost none did.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to jmowreader (Reply #22)

Fri Jan 9, 2015, 07:15 PM

23. It's been happening in NM, advertised, for about 3 years. It's disgusting.

I was being sarcastic when I wrote my original post.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Warpy (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:16 PM

12. sounds good in theory

But in reality we get the coywolf http://m.livescience.com/39184-what-is-a-coywolf.html

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to saltpepperdoor (Reply #12)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:22 PM

14. Until they run the DNA, I call bullshit

because it doesn't seem to have happened in the past, when the west was well supplied with both.

I think what they're looking at is the coydog, the hybrid of coyotes and domestic dogs which are so well known in the east.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Warpy (Reply #14)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:27 PM

16. here you go

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/11/111107-hybrids-coyotes-wolf-virginia-dna-animals-science/
"Scientists already knew that some coyotes, which have been gradually expanding their range eastward, mated with wolves in the Great Lakes (map) region. The pairings created viable hybrid offspring—identified by their DNA and skulls—that have been found in mid-Atlantic states such as New York and Pennsylvania.

Now, new DNA analysis of coyote poop shows for the first time that some coyotes in the state of Virginia are also part wolf. Scientists think these animals are coyote-wolf hybrids that traveled south from New England along the Appalachian Mountains."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to saltpepperdoor (Reply #16)

Fri Jan 9, 2015, 03:37 AM

20. Interesting that they don't seem anxious to mate with western wolves

who remain one of their predators as well as competitors for food.

However, thanks for the info. It was always assumed they were coyote/domestic dog hybrids while I was in New England, shepherds from the look of them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 08:12 PM

3. At first I thought maybe the humans had caused something bad to happen.

That's what usually happens when humans interfere with nature. Instead, the wolves set things right. Go wolves!

PS: I want one of those wolf pups!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 08:17 PM

4. Despite the fact that many humans (especially city dwellers) ...

Look at all deer as cute "wittle" Bambi, because of their big eyes, they really are just giant, hooved rats, IMO. Tasty rats, for human and wolves, but still rats the way they eat everything and reproduce.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MicaelS (Reply #4)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:24 PM

15. What about these pants I have on.

 

You think they're okay?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to VScott (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 11:01 PM

18. My daughter was in high school and won 2 tickets for Vinny on the radio


She took ME with her to see it!

It was in the $5 Blu-ray bin before Christmas and I picked it up.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Reply #18)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 11:17 PM

19. It's a flawless comedy...

 

with great quotes ("Two youts"?), and acting, and Marisa Tomei was hot!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 08:47 PM

6. Nature is wonderful.

It shouldn't be so amazing when humans let nature happen. I love that video!!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 09:00 PM

7. In the same vein: this program shows how beavers have brought life back

to areas that were void of water, nature. It is amazing what can happen when humans are not in charge.

http://www.amazon.com/Nature-Leave-It-Beavers/dp/B00JJRLG2Q/ref=pd_cp_mov_0#customerReviews

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink



Response to zipplewrath (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 09:49 PM

10. I kind of figured it was too good to be true

though, it's clear that the wolves certainly have helped.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NewJeffCT (Reply #10)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:06 PM

11. Necessary but not sufficient

Probably a case of being part of a much larger solution. Can't happen without them, but need way more than just them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to zipplewrath (Reply #8)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:20 PM

13. I think it's going to take a lot longer for a full recovery..

but, hopefully they are on the right track.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Omaha Steve (Original post)

Thu Jan 8, 2015, 10:46 PM

17. The degree or amount of improvement that can be attributed to the wolves may be debated...

There are plenty of examples to demonstrate how introducing a species into an ecosystem without natural predators will result in a disaster.

The bunnies in Australia is my favorite example. It should be obvious that eliminating a predator is going to cause problems. Just as it should be obvious that reintroducing that predator will be beneficial, but alas I am from Idaho and the wailing and gnashing of teeth that resulted from the reintroduction of wolves is deafening. Try explaining to a red-state subculture that places guns higher on its list of loved things than it's children that the introduction of wolves actually makes the elk herd stronger.

The wailing and gnashing of teeth becomes deafening.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread